Define "contact", because if by contact you mean through clothing, armor, etc. then we can not even carry one around, seeing as a scratch would use it up.

If it is only through cloth, then a metal container could be made to keep on on hand at all times.

If flesh, then a simple bag would suffice.

>>348196
The crystals will work through any cloth or armor someone may be wearing, unless it resists magic.

Also, the crystals will only heal an injury which would require the full energy of the crystal. So it won't heal small wounds unless Evie purposefully makes a smaller than normal crystal.

>>348197
So, in essence, she could carry a crystal around, and if wounded to a degree in which the crystals full energy would be depleted, the crystal would activate?

While perhaps not as useful as a grenade belt full of crystals while hauling a backpack also laden with the precious, healing goods, that still seems pretty useful. A final lifeline after all the mana shield have been used up.

Yea, for now, carrying one crystal wouldn't be that bad. We don't really have anything other than a staff, so we don't have to worry about carrying capacity. It's only if we decide we want to work our way into alchemy (mercury bombs, and the like) that we should run into issues. But we'll worry about that should it come up, and if we decide that's how we want to spend our time learning.

Also, I'll repost my suggestion here, since we have a discussion thread now!

"Hmm... a suggested improvement. With Evie's new talent in force magic, would it be possible to imbue our mana shields with force magic? In other words: Have them explode outwards when destroyed. It won't prevent us from getting hurt, but it might give us some space if we're getting swarmed."

Hmm, we'll need a magic-shielded enchanted bag/pouch to contain the crystals. How big will a crystal be to heal a near-death state? And how long will she take to make one?

>>348205
Well, when we leveled up, we didnt take any points in enchantment, so we can't do it ourselves.

Our mana shield will protect our belongings to some degree, but it won't insulate the crystals, as I'm sure that's what you intended.

If we continue to boost healing, we might get a more powerful healing spell, one that may work over range, or not require our own health to work. But I don't think we should boost life any more for the moment. I personally am a fan of getting Light magic and [Flying Sparrow], as it is in Vindictus now. It would improve survivability, and enforce our current trend into force magic.

we could just spend a day or two filling up a backpack full of crystals, either wear it into combat and be healed as we get hurt or drop it while fighting to have healing close at hand.

>>348210
Read the first post. "Evie can only create a single crystal at the moment, a number that may or may not increase as healing magic is upgraded. I haven't though out the upgrade system substantially yet. "

Actually, I was thinking of the bag having an anti-magic effect on anything contained inside, but not strong enough to make whatever magical artifact explode, just enough to suppress the magic effects while they're inside.

i thought silverfayte meant one crystal per casting. strange though. unless the crystal has some direct connection to us we should be able to have any number made.

>>348224
Point, I hadn't thought about it that way. Still, I would think that the crystals should not lend themselves to 'stockpiling' well. If we want to heal someone immediately, we can donate some of our life, we have our mana shield to rely on usually. Since we don't wear anything more than cloth armor (at least right now) we need to consider our mana shields to be about half of our 'life'. So once those are gone, we have issues.

>>Number of Crystals
One crystal total, not per casting. Why? Magic!

>>would it be possible to imbue our mana shields with force magic?
I'm thinking of adding [Reactive Shields] or [Elemental Shields] or something to that effect as one of the mana shield upgrade perks.

>>348226
Sounds cool. I look forward to where you're taking this. As long as you keep the power scale under control. Power is like candy. It's good in frequent, small, controlled quantities.

>>348206
We didn't take any wnchanting this level, but it is just our first level up.

If someone is knocked unconscious by a head blow, will being healed wake them up?

>>348393
It won't wake them directly, but it'll stop whatever damage the head blow did from keeping them from waking. So basically healing them would probably make them easier to wake. Might not, though, depending on if the damage from the blow is keeping them from waking or if they're just really heavy sleepers.

>>348231
>Power is like candy. It's good in frequent, small, controlled quantities.
Thus, I propose meeting Brynn and having him develop an Aperture Science Handheld Magical Candy Dispenser. Which is a glorified title for a submachine gun that, um, dispenses Force (or any other, depending on construction) Magic blasts at high speeds. It may be powered either by the test subject user themselves or by siphoning off power from the mana shields.

Also, how does Evie's mana storage capacity grow? Is it a continous process or level-up-based? Actually, is there such a thing as mana bar in this world, and how does it work? (It should be obvious by now that I'm not familiar with Vindictus at all; moreover, SF said that he'll change things, so I don't even bother.)

Also. Are we gonna ship Evie/Tieve? Just asking...

>>348408
"Also. Are we gonna ship Evie/Tieve? Just asking..."

I am okay with this.

Anonymous 2011/06/25(Sat)16:07 No. 38627 ID: 5f55fe
File 130904326088.png - (94.18KB , 264x408 , Shayla_(NPC).png )

>>348413
But we haven't even met Shayla (see pic), or any of the women from Rocheste.

>>348408
>(It should be obvious by now that I'm not familiar with Vindictus at all; moreover, SF said that he'll change things, so I don't even bother.)

Don't worry about it, I play Vindictus, but I'm only pulling ideas from it. I'm very interested in this quest since Wenshardt wasn't killed. (For those who do not play Vindictus, in the game, during that scene Wenshardt gets speared by a number of ballistae, climbs the tower, falls, and the bell from the tower falls on him. He dies.)

But since that didn't happen, I wonder what else is going to happen. Besides, who says we have to follow the normal Vindictus plot? SilverFayte might come up with something completely different. Who knows?

>>348408
In the game, all characters had a stamina bar. Evie's was depleted through running, and both physical and magical attacks, she didn't have a dedicated magic bar. The system is similar in the quest: using magic tires her out, she can't really run out of mana.

>>348427
I'm attempting to follow the general structure of Vindictus' quests for the moment, but I'm attempting to keep the situations as open-ended as possible. The differences between the two universes will accumulate fairly rapidly though, I feel.

>>348436
> using magic tires her out, she can't really run out of mana
So does that mean that a constant drain on her magic will improve her stamina? Because if that is the case, then acquisition of some useful trinket leeching off her magic is in order.

(I understand that I'm not suggesting anything terribly original, but from my POV there should be something along the lines of Evie Overlord's List with standard contingencies in case of undeveloped characters falling under our control.)

>>348444
Stamina is generally very hard to increase. There's a few enchantments that can help, (very little). There's a skill you can raise that raises the max (with diminishing returns). And there's some activated skills/spells/enchantments that can temporarily give unlimited stamina or increased stamina regeneration.

This is of course, what is from the game. I don't know how this translates to this quest. But my guess is that Stamina represents the character's psysical condition in general. A psysical fighter would have more stamina than a mage, for example. And Evie is already in pretty good psysical condition, for a mage.

SilverFayte, I have a question, how long have you been here reading quests, or have you run another quest?

I say this, just because the last update was kind of... short. Not to say a update can't be, but you should give the players things to talk about or suggest. I was kind of expecting it to go to Aodhan and get his orders or whatever, but instead it was just wrapping up loose ends, and then... nothing.

>>348484
I'm going to do another update later today, I just wanted to get the wrapping things up part out of the way and have a moment for suggesters to ask questions of Evie.

I've been here a few months now, I attempted to run one other quest which failed after I realized that I had no clue where I wanted to go with it and that keeping it under control would be a major hassle. I've learned a bit from that but I'm still fairly new at this and learning the ropes. I promise that I'll see this to completion, though, as long as people are interested.

>>348445
Do spells of the same power cost less wen you have more skill? If not, than your normal frail book wizard seems the equivalent of a sniper rifle (high damage but horrible rate of fire).

>>348487
Correct me if I'm wrong Silver.

The way I see it, no spell (that's standard from Vindictus, not that we couldn't make one this way) uses all of your stamina in one shot. Or even a large portion. Stamina recovers in a matter of seconds as long as you get a chance to breath. Running around, dodging, and casting spells is not resting, and will drain you after a couple good spells. But likewise, only a couple moments of rest, and you're back to full. It's just a matter of getting this rest in the middle of battle.

>>348492
yeah, that's about how it's going to be. Health will also factor into it; being injured means you get tired out more quickly, can't focus, etc.

Hmm, I just thought of something.

Would a container enchanted to be magic resistant sever any connection Evie would have with the contents inside it? This would mean that the restriction of one healing crystal would be negated. Now, the other side of this might mean that the crystal inside the container would either lose its ability to heal while the connection is broken or it might just disintegrate.
I am going to guess that the result would be one of the following:
A) The crystal in the container would disintegrate(or become permanently inert) due to losing the sustaining connection, which I presume the restriction is.
B) The crystal inside would become inert as long as it is in the container, allowing Evie to create another, active one, which would function. This would be a good, as it would allow for one crystal to always be on hand and another as a spare, to be taken out of the container and used if time is of the essence.
C) The connection is not severed(by some weird magic that is even more magicky than magic) and we are, yet again, stuck with one crystal. Even though it would not be instantly used upon contact, due to being in a magic resistant container.

Umm, anyway, which one of the above is correct, if any?

>>348622
A., in the flavor of disintegration.

>>348627
Aw, bugger, that makes even the magic resistant container idea useless.

I'm a little annoyed at all these attempts to artificially advance human technology. Being creative is one thing, but just dropping higher tech into their laps is another thing.

Yes, if we wanted, we could probably work out a way to give them railguns, and combustion engines, and tanks, but WHY? Do you not like the setting as it is?

>>348636
I think a magic resistant container might still have its uses, given the mind controlling shards floating around. What we really need are some magic resistant gloves.

Are magic resisting gloves a thing in this world, and do they impede casting? (And if they do, can we get away with having one magic resisting glove and casting with the other hand?)

>>348639
Chronic Munchkin Disorder. It is like Chronic Backstabbing Disorder, except with exploiting vulnerable worlds instead of vulnerable people.

>>348652
Makes me wonder if it is possible to create a magic amplifying glove, to go with a magic resistant glove.

>>348639
Seconding this. Really, smuggling ready hi-tech solutions across worlds never ends well. We should create something new, maybe (and likely) an amalgamation of previously known and tried ideas combined in creative and deliciously destructive ways.

Also I'm setting up ground in the main thread for an info-dump here about this world. A big list of questions is bound to appear either here or there in not-so-distant future.

>>348652
Magic resisting wear is certainly a thing, and they do impede casting. How much depends on the strength and type of spell. Spells can be full-body or just over the clothing, full body magic resiting impedes magic no matter how it is cast, and the stronger the spell the more magic is impeded.

Also, if you want an infodump on something, here would be the place to ask for it. I'd rather not clutter the quest thread with it.

>>348668
What I am thinking of is not a glove that grants magic resistance, but rather a glove that itself blocks magic (similar to how lead shields against radiation). What I want it to do is to let us handle cursed items without activating them and perhaps to allow us to disrupt spells/enchantments by shoving our gloved hand into the middle of them (if larger spells/enchantments take up physical space {such as how in some systems spells manifest as a series of glowing glyphs while being cast or maintained}).

What I was asking about the casting is whether we can effectively cast with only one hand while the other hand is wearing this glove.

>>348670
Now that's the kind of idea I can appreciate. We would end up like that guy from Toaru Majutsu no Index, on the extreme end. And if it's only a little bit of resistance, we could probably still handle stuff like those cursed runes a little safer.

Ok, now that things are progressing, we need to decide our primary development vector. I suggest stealth-type warrior, leaning into assassin, and a heavy accent on magic, both spells and artifacts. Actually, magic probably should be our primary focus, with martial prowess complementing the arcane. Not having exceptional power, we'll have to overcome with exceptional skill.

We'll probably get our first levels of Enchantment with Brynn's help. That will immediately open to us a new type of attack: grenades. Even if we don't know fire magic, just enchanting a stone or wood block with, for example, enough life magic to make it glow, and then tossing it towards the enemy and sending a fast force magic blast after it will provide a BOOM, if I'm correct in vaguely recalling that mixing magics yields explosive results.

Shadow magic is a thing to look after too, stealth and mind-fuckery are too valuable skills to ignore. We are not likely to find tutors on that in any foreseeable future, though, so we'll have to improvise. Enchantment - and light magic, now that I think of it, with the nifty magic-sensing skill - might be helpful in figuring out the power of Shadows.

And we definitely need to upgrade mana shields. Having advanced both those and enchantment, we'll be able to incorporate magic-shield-like designs in our armor, getting one or more of (in order of increasing difficulty and needed skill level): passive defence system; extra battery for our spells; ambient-mana-sapping construct that will combine both battery (at low levels) and defensive (at high levels: absorbing enemy spells) aspects, and might even be turned into a weapon.

We also need creative ways of using our current low-level magics. Especially force magic looks promising.

Yea, don't try to push too much physical stuff onto Evie, she's not cut out for it. In the game, after a bit of leveling, she can begin to use Battle Scythes. But even then, most of her attacks rely on magical power to enhance the attack.

I'm not too fond of shadow magic, I'd prefer to not have the negative connotations connected to Evie. I like the light magic, for magic sense, and for illusions. I think if we go into light magic, that will be enough subtlety we'll need. Enchanting is versatile, and probably worth the investment, but may require us to invest money into it as well, depending on what enchantment requires. Electric magic may also be useful for large, armored opponents. Force magic is good, and we can probably do a lot with it, but armored foes could probably shrug off much of the force. Fire or ice magic would make good substitutes as well, if those suited you better. Earth is not as good, since we already have Force magic for all our bashing needs.

If you wanted grenades, why don't we just invest into learning Ball or Blast magic. We can also come up with our own, if we wanted.

[Blast Magic Unlearned -> Learned]
Blast attacks are close-range area-of-effect spells that do high damage.

[Ball Magic Unlearned -> Learned]
Ball magic are low-to-medium range balls of elemental magic that explode upon hitting a target. They deal high damage but are slow moving and easy to dodge.

[Suggested Attack? Unlearned -> Learned]


So my personal suggestions for growth are as follows, in no particular order.
Light Magic
Mana shields
Blast Magic
Enchantment
Electric Magic

I think we have enough life magic for now, and we should probably only upgrade force to level 3 once we've expanded our breadth.

>>348755
> If you wanted grenades, why don't we just invest into learning Ball or Blast magic. We can also come up with our own, if we wanted.
Yes, that's good too. But... Question to SilverFayte: just HOW explosive are results of mixing magic? Because if we can pump a grenade with LOTS of magic, that might trump anything we'll be able to do with ball magic. (I think of it as a magic equvalent of matter-antimatter reactions, and not many things are more explosive than that.)

I still think we should specialize in mostly
Force (Versatile, works very well with enchanting {if my ideas in the questions below work out})
Life (We can't be everywhere at once when defending people, but healing greatly increases the extent to which we can help people. The life crystals also seem like a good defensive ability as they heal us automatically.)
Enchantment (Seems to me like it would be good for our money in the long run; we wouldn't have to buy neat stuff if we can make it.)

with a few points in Light for the magic detect and maybe an illusion or two

For dealing with large, armored enemies, a combination of Force and Enchanting should be able to get us a weapon enchanted for piercing that we can fling around using our force magic.

Two questions that this general plan depends on:
1. With higher ranks in Force magic (and with some practice), can you tele-wield one or more weapons?
2. Am I correct in thinking that having more points in a magic makes it cheaper in terms of energy (allowing us to do the above extremely often during combat?)

>>348770
I still don't think using force in that manner is the most effective use. It depends how dexterous the force TK is. From what I imagined, it was more useful for just picking up things and smashing, or else force attacks (like the magic arrows she already has)

>>348670
>>What I was asking about the casting is whether we can effectively cast with only one hand while the other hand is wearing this glove.

It would prevent you from creating crystals, which requires both hands to be unimpeded. It would weaken blast and ball spells, which must be channeled through the staff by both hands. Any other techniques that require both hands or are channeled through the staff would similarly be unable to be used or weakened.

>>348759
Magic reactions are not so much 'explosive' as 'inherently destructive'. Every time Evie fires a force bolt at a gnoll, for example, the reason damage is caused is not so much due to the force exerted by the magic, but the interaction of force and life magics. And, because I spent time thinking this out, a minor infodump on the nature of magic and their interactions:

Force magic is the most stable of the magics, thus its low damage to having smaller reactions with light magic.

Fire Magic is the most unstable of the magics, and tends to cause small-scale explosions even in bolt form.

Ice magic is moderately reactive, except with fire magic. When fire and ice magic react, the effects are cancelled.

Electric magic is moderately reactive, but has the interesting property of creating physical electricity as long as the magic electricity is present. As mages cannot control the physical plasma, it is one of the more difficult to control magics. However, the benefit of this is that even if a target is protected by a total-anti-magic field, the physical plasma may still strike the target.

Earth magic is perhaps the strangest of the five main elements. It is attracted to physical earth, and when drawn out immediately attempts to form physical earth itself. In magic reactions, it cancels out all magic much like the reaction between fire and ice. However, since it tends to turn itself into earth, these reaction tend only to happen when items have been enchanted with the earth element.

For the secondary elements:
Life is stable, but will react with other elements.
Light magic is almost entirely nonreactive, except with itself. Light-light reactions cause the creation of light, sounds, and small traces of physical matter. Its nonreactivity allows mages to find and identify magic by, in simple terms, 'bouncing' it off other magic and observing how it 'bounces' back.
Shadow magic, due to the hesitance of mages to use it, has not been studied under much scrutiny. The exact nature of its reactions, or how it produces its effects, are unknown to the general public and most researchers.

...oh geeze did I just create a fictional magic-physics system? Ah well.

Also, no one commented on that gnoll turning to stone in the first fight, but oh well. I'll probably throw out another minor infodump as to why that happened next time I post in discussion.

>>348777
Formor's are evil. All evil things either turn to stone, burst into flame, disintegrate, melt, or fade away upon death. This is the natural order of things.

Also, very nice with the magic system. I'm glad you have things thought out, at least partially.

>>348777
Oh well, there goes my idea. ... Actually, it might still be salvageable, after some research on magic containment and storage. Question: is it possible to store large amount of magic in compact physical objects, and if it is, how difficult?

Also,
> even light magic creates detectable traces of matter
What about conjuration? As in, creation of arbitrary objects/substances? Does it exist, is it permanent, how power- and skill-intensive is it?

> mages cannot control the physical plasma
> magic electricity is present
Magnetic trap. Shouldn't be very difficult for an experienced electromancer, moreso a resourceful enchanter.

Also, how difficult and setting-breaking would it be for us to suggest to (and develop with) Brynn an equivalent of laser-guided rocket? (Light magic for laser + fire magic as the propellant.)

>>348783
Why does it always have to be a tech solution? Why can't we just develop a long range magic attack, and shoot fireballs? Making it into a rocket just seems unnecessary, since you'd still use magic to power it.

>>348783
>>how difficult and setting-breaking would it be for us to suggest to (and develop with) Brynn an equivalent of laser-guided rocket?

One would have to gather the necessary ores and metals,and have them shaped to specifications by a blacksmith, first of all. Second, you would have to think of a way to create an enchantment or series of enchantments that allowed the missile to first of all track the light magic and second to steer the missile toward the intended target. That's for a single one of these.

For a mage, you can achieve the same level of power with significantly less effort with a higher-level fireball spell. I can see it as an effective weapon for non-mage infantry, as a one-shot powerful magic attack, except that being guided by light magic means that it requires a mage to operate anyway.

Difficulty: Very High. Setting-Breaking: Somewhat. Game-Breaking: Not at all.

>>is it possible to store large amount of magic in compact physical objects, and if it is, how difficult?
The basis of enchanting is essentially storing magic in a physical object. It's difficulty scales with one's skill at enchanting and skill at manipulating the selected element.

>>What about conjuration? As in, creation of arbitrary objects/substances? Does it exist, is it permanent, how power- and skill-intensive is it?
Earth magic spontaneously forms matter. Those skilled at it can modify the kind of matter created, the default is a hard earth substance. It is moderately difficult to create stone rather than earth, and nearly impossible to form metals. Gold seems to be the most difficult known metal to create in any notable amount, and so far Silver, the most magic-attuned substance, has proved impossible to create. Life magic has also been known to spontaneously cause plant matter to appear and grow in soil where it is of extremely high quantity, but research into this is ongoing. The trace amounts of material created by light magic is usually used by skilled illusionists to create an odor to further an illusion.

And because I said I would last time:
An excerpt of "Magic Research and Findings, Vol. I":

...experiments have shown that the tendency for a body to turn to stone, the 'Rigor Mortis' as some of my colleagues call it, is linked to the emotional state of the subject at the time of death. It appears that those who experience an extreme amount of fear, and especially those who believe strongly that they are going to die, have a nearly one-hundred percent chance of turning to stone upon death... ...after much study, the mechanism for this reaction was discovered: total expulsion of all life magic from the body. Current evidence suggests that once the mind has given up hope of living, some force- be it an instinctual manipulation of magic, one's soul in a final act of self defense, or the will of the Goddess herself- pushes the life energy to the extremities of the body, creating a weak barrier out of the body's own sustaining life magic. Upon death, this force shortly intensifies, forcing the magic out of the body completely, thus returning living flesh to inanimate stone.

>corpses turning to stone
Do humans do that as well (when the conditions are met)?
And do effects like the petrification death mean that we won't be seeing any necromancer undead in this world?

(And I really want to know the answer to the Force magic / weapon use question. My plans for our specialization path hinge on that.)

>>348787
>>348795
> For a mage, you can achieve the same level of power with significantly less effort with a higher-level fireball spell. I can see it as an effective weapon for non-mage infantry, as a one-shot powerful magic attack, except that being guided by light magic means that it requires a mage to operate anyway.
Non-mage troops will benefit from those most of all, yes. As for fireballs, that's cool and stuff, but a fireball's power will only go so high before the spell becomes unstable and dangerous to the caster. Moreover, I suspect that fireballs of any kind require line of sight and cannot change the flight direction set at the moment of casting, correct? A guided missile could be launched from far away, pack a lot more punch (up to the equivalents of magical ICBMs), and a target designator could be made for non-mage operators.
But whatever, this is not something we'll be able to even attempt in foreseeable future.

How about rituals? Is collective magic practiced, how wide, for what purposes? How epic?

> conjuration
Can only mundane objects be created, or some magical properties can be imbued during the conjuration? For example, is creating intrinsically magical objects possible? I'm thinking mostly of Emiya Shirou-style tracing here.
In fact, when conjuring, is any shaping possible at all? For example, if Evie was (hypothetically speaking, of course) trying to conjure copper and shape it into small disks with a profile of... You get my drift.

That actually brings me to another topic. I request an info-dump on social structure of this world. Geopolitical situation, basic info on current ruling regimes, all that rot. We do have to know whose face to put on our coins, don't we?
(At least initially; later on we'll be able to just stamp our Evie's pretty profile. He-he.)

Also, how does runic magic work? Are runes purely physical, their configuration shaping and guiding magic in some way, or the process of inscribing them involves mystical components, like 'charging' them with magic? If so, must it be done simultaneously, or a pre-inscribed rune may be charged at a later time by another person? Do runes' charges dwindle (significantly) with time, or only while doing their function?

> one's soul in a final act of self defense
> creating a weak barrier out of the body's own sustaining life magic
AT Field anyone? Should we expect angels? Or maybe try to use it somehow? Like, for example, apply life magic to mana shields?

Also, on the topic of personal weapons, I support the idea of dagger specialization. Though not exclusive, if we have the time.

>>348798
Humans turning to stone: Yes
However, petrification upon death is still somewhat rare. In battles with the Fomorians, record keepers have noted that the bodies of the 'properly' dead often far outnumber those of the petrified.
As for necromancers: who knows? Popular stories speak of a mage who grasped life magic well enough to resurrect the recently dead, though those same stories say that even he could not return life to those who had been turned to stone. And there are always whispers of half-glimpsed monsters, skeletons walking of their own will, and Shadow Mages unleashing the tortured souls of the dead, but whether these claims are fact or fantasy is unclear. The world is a large, dark place, and as much as they try to delude themselves, humans understand little of it.

As for your two earlier questions (which I apologize for missing):
1.Yes
2.Slightly

Heading to sleep now. I'll try to update tomorrow, but due to stuff I might not have time.

>>348802
Gah, I'll respond to this and then sleep, seeing as it was posted as I was writing.

Multi-person magic is practiced mainly by researchers for very specific circumstances, and even then under extreme caution. Most attempts to use such magic on the battlefield have ended in tragedy.

Items created using Earth magic cannot be magical in nature. Shaping of created objects is nearly impossible at low levels of earth magic, and moderately difficult at higher levels.

Runes are typically carved or painted into objects. As for the rest of your questions regarding runes: Nobody knows except the Fomorians, and they're not telling.

I might do an infodump on politics later. You're kind of asking a lot from me.

>>348806
> Nobody knows except the Fomorians, and they're not telling.
Oh, so rune magic is unknown to the societies accessible to us? That's sad.
Actually, I stand corrected. That's not so much 'sad' as 'another thing to experiment with'.

> Multi-person magic
What about complex magical setups? Enchanted and/or runed?

> You're kind of asking a lot from me.
Well, that's what you get for being Evie's mind ;-P

Anyway, when you'll be writing that infodump, please touch on the following subjects:
- known sapient and semi-sapient species/races/whatever you call them, both natural and crafted, alive and extinct
- briefly their history and alignment, social structure
- their general appearance and capabilities
- countries: currently existing, recently destroyed or assimilated, as well as ones long dead but notorious (knowledge of them kept in interesting legends or something); their relations
- perhaps a bit more on local politics in Evie's neighborhood.
That's what interests me most at the time. Perhaps after getting this we'll be able to target our requests finer.

>You can tele-wield weapons
Yesssss. I am already making plans for a weapon to use with this. I will post them when I have a picture.

>>348808
As it so happens, we have an NPC friend who is working on the runes. We obviously need to collect more runes, for SCIENCE!

>>348810
I would like to remind you that tele-wielding will likely be attention-intensive, which will limit its utility in close combat. Therefore, besides your main idea, which I'm expecting to be awesome, you might wish to think about something simple, instantaneous and lethal (like accelerating and returning sharp projectiles). Or about something that won't be very hard to implement in enchantments (maybe something like spinning saw-blades orbiting Evie, Mordre-style). Or about ways to dramatically increase Evie's processing abilities.
Actually, we need to think of those things regardless.

>>348811
Evie is not a golem. As cool as it would be to have another Mordre, she is not.

I don't know, the sawblade idea, DOES sound really hard, even with enchantments.

>>348815
Well, I don't expect her to [easily] reach Mordre's levels of multitasking and magic manipulation. But some steps in that direction would be a major advantage in any case.

Also, SF, would it help in enchantment if we post mathematical models of what we're trying to accomplish?

EveryZig 2011/07/01(Fri)18:50 No. 39023 ID: ce98ff
File 130957143280.jpg - (3.01KB , 111x254 , BladePic.jpg )

Here is the general idea I had for tele-weapon.
Features:
* Main body is a short sword (The relative closeness to a sword should make it easier to produce than a sawblade or such)
* No handle (A handle are a liability for a tele-weapon as an enemy could grab it.)
* It is primarily a stabbing weapon, but the sword body lets it cut or parry to some extent
* Instead of a handle, there is a spear like end that is more solid than the sword-point and is made for puncturing armor.
* As we don't have to hold it physically (and it never gets thicker than a sword blade, which can already run enemies through), with enough force we should be able to run it all the way through smaller enemies

It may be some time between when we can make one and when we can enchant it, but when we do enchant it it should be with something to increase its armor penetration.

>>348823
i really like this idea, a lot!

>>348823
I still think it's a waste, but we can try it I guess. Make sure to have some way to carry it normally without magic. We don't have to tax Evie's stamina all the time. That would just be exhausting. A regular sheath would do fine, since it's just a sword blade.

>>348830
You can hold a knife by the blade, its just not a good idea.
To carry it at rest all she needs is a scabbard; although working out her magical stamina by trying to carry it drawn at all times is potentially good idea.
Having actual safe handle-holds is a bad idea. Any place where you can safely hold it with bare hands is a place an enemy can grab so avoid it, the design as is is perfect. Just make sure the scabbard is deep enough to fully contain the sword and has a cap to prevent it from flying out by accident.

>>348830
Yes, I think a regular sheathe would work fine for carrying it.

I argue that this is not a waste of resources because with work it should be a more efficient damage dealer than fireballs and such due to the fact that this makes full use of both our strength with force magic and (when we learn it) our strength with enchanting, by allowing us to force-wield an enchanted weapon at a range.

>>348823
>>348844
This design reminds me strongly of a handle-less file. That was sharpened.
An idea: would it be worth the effort to make a detachable handle for this thing? That way we can use the weapon both as a regular shortsword and a mid-range gut piercer/slasher. Also surprise factor.

Anyway, what about concentration? A tele-wielded weapon is useful only if you can split your attention safely between controlling it and killing people that get too close to you. Otherwise, you either focus only on protecting your own hide from being cut into ribbons, or provide ranged support, for which regular spells are likely to be more efficient.

>>348848
this is only an issue if you are trying to fight people both close and far simultanously. If you focus on the people near you then its you with your teleweapon that does not follow normal attack vectors vs whatever they have.

Actually, why have just one tele weapon?
1. Shuriken, sharpened disk, or sawblade. Spin and kill.

2. Needleblades in various sizes with the propotions of a needle but sharpened sides. It can be used to poke eyes or pierce through to vital organs and if someone tries to catch it the bladed sides cut their hand. For a human even a tiny needly would be horrifying if went through the eye and into the brain. You can use the giant needles to do the same to a giant monster or to go through the heart of a human or between weak spots in armor. Plate armor? thread through the visor and into the eyes. Chain armor? Thread between the links and into the heart.

3. A steel wire with loops and several barbed fishing hooks on each tip (connected to each other so they point in different directions. I am thinking 6 should be great, 3 or 4 is enough, only 1 will require careful manipulation). Severing a brain blood vessel or choking someone by constricting only the 2 blood vessels in their neck is normally not allowed with TK (but if it is allowed the yay awesome and we don't even need these weapons)... Anyways, an alternative to TK blood vessel constriction is the steel wire with barbs. Just wrap it around and one or two of the flared barbs will lodge it in place and begin the choking process for you. If it has fur or chitin that prevents the hooks from finding good perch then pull hard to tighten it and then put it in one of the loops to hold it.

Just to clarify. "Choking" typically cuts off the flow of air into the lungs, this can take minutes to knock them out. Constricting the blood-vessels that lead to the brain (one on each side of the neck) is very difficult but causes a person to pass out in ~3 seconds. If garroting someone with piano wire you are not just constricting the airflow to lungs but also the blood vessels, and heck, it can actually cut both.

>>348859
A weapon that does not follow normal attack vectors by flying out of your hands. Which leaves you without a weapon. Which in turn will encourage you to separate from your foe, because in the heat of battle your weapon that you are trying to slip behind the enemy might not be fast enough to stop an opportunity attack up front. Which, in turn, will mark you as a clearly mage type target for the enemy's friends, thus prompting them to attack you en-masse, with your weapon engaged in suddenly ranged combat - too ranged for comfort. Do you see my point?

Other than that, I actually support your ideas.

Anonymous 2011/07/02(Sat)18:05 No. 39067 ID: 28e94e
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>>348859
>needle blades
Pic related.

>>348859
>Multiple weapons in general
While having a few extra options is a good idea, there is a definite advantage in having one or two main weapons, as we can pump lots of enchantment into those. (Which is a large part of the point of this.)

>Shiruken
Spinning weapons seem relatively inefficient compared to stabbing weapons.

>Needleblades
For this, we could use the two or three daggers we should be carrying around anyway.

>Cord
Does knocking people unconscious with that blood-flow thing kill or permanently damage them? As a method of killing, just sticking a blade in them seems quicker, but if we can use this to safely incapacitate people than it is quite useful to have.

>Being attacked in melee
Having problems from your weapon being far away depends on how fast it can travel. (Which should increase as we get more force magic. More force = more acceleration.
Also, if we are being approached by a melee attacker, we could throw our weapon upwards, knock back the enemy with an Eagle Talon, then catch our weapon before it finishes falling. (If we can't just bring our weapon over to where we are.)

Now that you mention it, though...
Author question:
How much would wearing a physical shield (they strap onto your arm, so they encumber your hand but don't take up your fingers) effect spell-casting?

MrTT 2011/07/02(Sat)19:31 No. 39073 ID: b1f0e2
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>>348867
this isn't it actually. It has a hilt, I mean literally a needle whose sides have been sharpened.

>Which leaves you without a weapon. Which in turn will encourage you to separate from your foe, because in the heat of battle your weapon that you are trying to slip behind the enemy might not be fast enough to stop an opportunity attack up front. Which, in turn, will mark you as a clearly mage type target for the enemy's friends, thus prompting them to attack you en-masse, with your weapon engaged in suddenly ranged combat - too ranged for comfort. Do you see my point?
I do, but I completely disagree with it. You do not send your weapon out on long range forays when engaged in close combat, you also can hold a weapon and a shield in your hands which you do not "send" anywhere while your EXTRA floating weapons take the person facing you in the back.

Or lets say someone charges you, send your weapon at him, he is five feet away, can't reach you to stab you but your weapon is now in front of it... your weapon is STILL capable of parrying blocks, and can dodge past their defenses and into their body.

Lets say they are closer yet... you will have to parry with the teleblade, you just have the advantage that your actual arm is not connected to it so it can do some crazy moves.

>For this, we could use the two or three daggers we should be carrying around anyway.
No we can't, that have a handle which gets in the way.

>Does knocking people unconscious with that blood-flow thing kill or permanently damage them? As a method of killing, just sticking a blade in them seems quicker, but if we can use this to safely incapacitate people than it is quite useful to have.
It only permanently harms them if you keep blocking it after they pass out. But the cords I described are VICIOUS and will definitely be deadly. The idea behind them is that they are very light, hard to see, and will not tax our stamina. Do the most amount of death with the least amount of magic kinda thing.

to clarify my reasoning for those weapons. I am assuming that TK is easier, and can go faster and more precisely the lighter the object is that you try to move. If that doesn't matter and the magic works equally well for any one single object up to a selected size then many of these are not as useful. (Although it will be very very hard to see a needle flying across the battlefield so they wouldn't understand why people are just dropping dead).

to clarify the blood-flow thing, if you want to harmlessly knock someone out you would need something less vicious. but its doable. You can use pretty much anything as long as you press the exact locations on both sides of their neck.

http://video.about.com/prowrestling/How-to-Do-the-Sleeper-Hold.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chokehold#Blood_choke

I had it done on me once (not that one, a different move). Very impressive, in 2 I started to black out and then the instructor let go before I passed out. Notice that they aren't even touching the trachea, which is what people usually go for on a choke.

Anyways, if we are allowed to then it can just be done with TK applied to right spot. If not we can get a silk scarf or some such and use it instead to avoid cutting the neck.

>holding other weapon
I am going to guess it would be rather hard (magic has concentration needs and maybe hand movement needs) to hold and use another weapon while tele-wielding. We might manage a shield though (particularly if we can enchant it to be lightweight).

>cord
Yes, I was thinking more about a reinforced rope than a barbed cord. (I still think for actual killing, a blade is more efficient because it is easier to keep track of than a wire you attach and un-attach.

In general, I see us using the larger blade mostly not as a fencing weapon but as a large and deadly projectile that can quickly change directions. (For example, if an enemy has a shield, darting past them, turning around, and stabbing them before they can turn around.)

>>348892
well, the point of the cord is that it is swift, silent, very hard to see, and doesn't cause bleeding.
You could actually simply slice the coratoid artery. Or if you can reach it the femoral artery. Either being sliced open is a death sentence but will involve a whole mess of blood everywhere.

>No we can't, that have a handle which gets in the way.
With a smaller blade, a handle would be useful to keep the blade from getting lodged entirely inside the enemy's body, and therefore being hard to remove. (With a larger blade, that is not a problem because there is always some part sticking out.)

All this talk of cords and teleswords...

I'm a fan of lightning bolts, or whatever element we feel like.

>>348900
We could specialize in throwing lightning bolts around or throwing a sword around.
The thing is, you can't enchant a lightning bolt.

>>348911
Why not? Then you aren't trying hard enough!

Besides, you don't need enchanted things to make yourself powerful/useful/whatever. This just seems to be the plague spreading throughout our (gaming) culture. It's because of all our ramapant minmaxing, we usually have a limit on our character's advancement, so we have to max out our equipment to continue advancement.

But this is a Quest, and that is not the case. Skills have no limit, only what limits the Author sets, but even those (usually) steadily increase.

So do not feel like you have to have enchanted this or that for everything. (such as TKing a sword as primary method of attack, just so you can enchant it)

My lighting is enchanted, it's enchanted with stun, and haste, and death. What now?

>>348916
Unless you are saying to enchant an individual bolt of lightning, what you are referring to is a lightning bolt spell with additions, which cost energy to cast.

The reason why I favor enchanting is that it combines both active energy (the TK) with stored energy (the enchantment), and therefore takes less energy for a comparable amount of damage.

Or, in other words, it is the difference between
*pulling out a dagger and throwing it
and
*magically creating a dagger on the spot and throwing it

It would be a bit ridiculous if both of those cost the same amount of energy.

>>348918
Would you like an example?

You could have staves specifically made to help channel lightning. You could say, have a pouch with magic dust that you could throw to better enhance a magic attack, since it would conduct magic better than air.

Like I said, you aren't thinking hard enough.

>>348921
Both of the listed examples qualify as "enchanted this or that".

And in any case; dust is inconvenient to use as you can run out at inopportune moments. If we are going to use a staff or such to focus our magic I don't see why we can't use a staff or wand to enhance our TK which is holding the sword.

>>348927
Yes, but that's different than enchanting a sword that we are TKing around.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not entirely opposed to the whole TK thing, I just feel it's a bit... bland. And I feel we could do more with other methods.

Anyway, you are missing my point. You don't have to go around enchanting things to be powerful. My main point was choosing TKing a sword as your main method of attack, just because you could enchant the sword.

As it is, it seems like I'm being outvoted, so not much I can do, but maybe I can convince some people. I'm willing to compromise when it seems I am a lone voice here.

The one thing that I think TK-sword will not have, as opposed to a wide repertoire of spells, is application diversity.

A TK-sword is good at stabbing. It might be good at slashing. It's not very good at stunning, unless you have some space to build momentum before it strikes your opponent's head, or whatever it needs to strike to stun, and that place is not protected against blunt trauma.

Well, try incapacitating a bunch of people at the same moment. Even if they are conveniently standing in a puddle and are deeply engrossed in a bitchfest about who forgot to close the bathroom taps. Or try fighting a stone golem the size of a tower, with no operator in sight. Or an undead abomination that ignores physical wounds. Or BEEEEEES. Or neurotoxin.

Moreover, try wrestling such a sword out of a particularly slash-resistant foe's grasp and/or body. Or attempt to use it with any finesse when concussed/drunk. Just parrying a particularly powerful strike might be enough to dislodge our incorporeal grasp on it, and I'm not talking about magic dampening environments yet.

And yes, I'm still prattling about additional attention costs incurred by simultaneous casting and keeping track of the enemy's movements. Though this might be worked around, we're still far from that point.

The point is, a TK sword (even an enchanted one) must not become our primary weapon. In the immediate future I propose concentrating on mastering daggers (maybe dual-wielding) and precision training with magically throwing nails into trees.

And anyway, where's SilverFayte?

I'm still here, just a little busier than usual, now. Expect an update later today or tomorrow. Sorry for the wait.

Nah, it's cool. Take your time.

>>349033
TK is nice because it has more applications than just weapons.
>Group of people, bees
Ball magic of direct TK
>Incapacitating
We could toss people into a wall with direct TK, or bring a rope for that neat sleeper-hold trick mentioned earlier.
>Poision gas
Is it is outside, we can use ball/force to blow it away. If in an enclose area, I guess we just rely on healing
>Undead
Decapitate/dismember with the sword (daggers would not help much against it)
>Golem
Neither sword or dagger works (unless you have a really good piercing enchant, in which case a sword is better).

>Dagger pinning in general
The thing about dagger pinning is that it is astoundingly situational, as you need to have a nearby wooden surface to stick them to (and then you need to maneuver or throw them right next to it to effectively pin).

Overall, I doubt there will be any shortage of beings made of meat who need holes put in them.

>Concentrating
Not all that much more of an issue than with regular spells; we aren't fencing with the TK sword, we are launching it at people like a ballista bolt.

>>349372
You've proven your point that TK is effective.

I still find it a bit bland. As long as we at least get SOME other magics (healing doesn't count) then I'll be happy.

>>349418
If it helps, I think it is in our interests to get some earth shaping magic too. (Hopefully to deal with inconvenient walls and such.) {And because I suspect our weapon might get stuck in petrified enemies}

Wow, that took significantly longer than it should have for a four-line update.

Man, what is up with me, it's almost like I'm a lazy bastard or something.

>>349997
It's fine. I still don't have the guts to run my own Quest. It's mostly cause I can't draw, so I would have to find pictures for it.

Not that I haven't seen amazing quests that have done that, but it would make things more difficult.

I'm annoyed because I can't argue back, because it would be out of character. The gods have very understandable motivations because they were written by regular people.

A real god could break all those things being argued and be beyond understanding.

New guy, if you read this, could you please not title your posts? Since about half of my posts are picture-less, the titles tend to be what makes them stand out, and having someone else doing that could cause confusion.

And yeah, thread's getting a tad discussiony, bring the discussion about the nature of the goddess over here, try to keep the quest thread mainly suggestions.

>>350078
At least it is over, heh.

To be honest, I doubt our arguing would have changed the opinions of any involved.

Wants to trust will remain wants to trust and does not want to trust will remain the same. Lets see what happens in the next update.

Whelp, spoke too soon, heh.

>>350081
Exactly. I'm glad we agree. :3

I am leaving my real life beliefs out of this, of course I would be more skeptic in real life, but I am staying in setting.

I took my position in game as if we had been in setting for all of human history, and assume humankind has worshiped her the entire time.

I can't say anything about the oracles because we don't know enough about them and what the Goddess has spoken to them about.

I feel that people are far too untrusting, particularly in quests. You should be trusting until proven otherwise, not the other way around. Especially for someone who has done nothing wrong.

Also, being mistrustful of the goddess could have potentially harmful ramifications for us. If you don't remember all of humanity worships the goddess, and the Formors hate her. This is blasphemy. The Pontiff's Court would love to screw us over for that.

>>350083
Given that this goddess presumably exists, (with the consistent appearances to different people and all), I would think that the church would only be all "BURN THE HERETIC!" if their god was ok with that. (Being an active god, you would think she would object to behavior she considers psychotic.) If the goddess was (is?) into offing people for questioning her, she would be someone we would likely want to get rid of eventually.