[Burichan] [Futaba] [Nice] [Pony]  -  [WT]  [Home] [Manage]
[Catalog View] :: [Archive] :: [Graveyard] :: [Rules] :: [Quests] :: [Wiki]

[Return] [Entire Thread] [Last 50 posts] [Last 100 posts]
Posting mode: Reply
Name (optional)
Email (optional, will be displayed)
Subject    (optional, usually best left blank)
Message
File []
Embed (advanced)   Help
Password  (for deleting posts, automatically generated)
  • How to format text
  • Supported file types are: GIF, JPG, MP3, MP4, PNG, SWF, WEBM, ZIP
  • Maximum file size allowed is 25600 KB.
  • Images greater than 250x250 pixels will be thumbnailed.

File 150647530353.png - (37.39KB , 900x220 , First Fragment of the Frontier by strngy.png )
116125 No. 116125 ID: d36af7

And the underground stuff, too. Drawing laughably inaccurate yet strategically indispensable maps is a big part of the old-school dungeon-crawling experience.

Wiki: http://tgchan.org/wiki/Please_do_not_Take_these_Organs
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/user?u=4587981
home team: https://tgchan.org/kusaba/quest/res/829557.html
away team: https://tgchan.org/kusaba/quest/res/807859.html
discussion: https://tgchan.org/kusaba/questdis/res/116125
Expand all images
>>
No. 116134 ID: 3abd97

>>116128
I might agree he's too dangerous to keep around, except for a few points.

First, this is probably our last stop before Overmire, at which point we can declare success in escorting Esmeraude and minion out of dodge and part ways (since sticking with us means sailing back towards where they're wanted). The risk won't endure much longer.

Second, even if we kill him, between communication magic and magic bindings, it's likely Esmeraude will know when he dies, and she should still have most her spells for the day. If she decides to strafe our merchant ship with acid, fire, or an Aqueous Orb for payback, I don't see us being able to prevent that before she gets her shot off.

So yeah, we have lots in terms of rep and money we stand to lose, and while the diplomacy may be annoying now, I feel like the road to success if we kill him is narrower.

Plus, Daviste's got a more professional view on this. We're technically being paid to transport him. Choosing to fail at that job because he makes the job more difficult isn't attractive to her.

Working on getting some dialog up, Viste's voice is harder. >>116127 is not entirely a joke.
>>
No. 116138 ID: af6e04

>Choosing to fail at that job because he makes the job more difficult isn't attractive to her.
Running into obstacles isn't the same thing as our clients literally working against us. Remember, she is in the process of trying to backstab us right now. I'd say all deals are off at this point.
>>
No. 116139 ID: af6e04

Also, is she even actually paying us? I thought she was just offering her skills as a sorcerer in exchange for passage.
>>
No. 116147 ID: 094652

>>/quest/833089
I... I just... I can't believe he'd... he... be... be that...

stereotypical.

I don't get it. Should Hore tell the others or stay silent to prevent Captain from doing anything?
>>
No. 116148 ID: d36af7

>>116147
>stereotypical
How do you mean?
>>
No. 116152 ID: 3abd97

>>116138
Personally, I'd categorize her as the client, and him as the dependent / prisoner she's paying to have transported with her. He never agreed to any of this- so him resisting isn't the client breaching contract.

It's also pretty hard to tell if she's actively backstabbing us right now, or just problem solving with lies, manipulation and inciting some violence (while blithely overlooking how bad this looks). (Or she's attempting both, and will go with whichever one works). And our evidence of betrayal is the word of the bugs... who are prone to misunderstanding things outside their specialty.

>Also, is she even actually paying us? I thought she was just offering her skills as a sorcerer in exchange for passage.
>>/quest/816778
Bullet D. Information, on the construction of a... fairly specific magic item.

One of the downsides of making someone self-interested your negotiator is she will look after her interests. (I was a little surprised, at the time, no one objected to my accepting a payment that so blatantly favored myself. Esmeraude knows how to tailor an offer).

>I don't get it. Should Hore tell the others or stay silent to prevent Captain from doing anything?
I don't think what Cap knows is the issue. He already knows- else he wouldn't have been heading towards the protestors in order to talk them into rioting.

The question is whether we cooperate with Esmeraude's and Cap's plans to make allies with the catfolk by inciting a riot, or not. It would arguably solve the underlying issue, could have longer term uses, and would probably work as the distraction we needed to get the ship loaded (so long as the people we need to do the loading aren't in the riot at the time).

Hore staying silent means she's making the call for the group. (And effectively turning down Esmeraude's offer, I think). Which, to be fair, you could do.

...it might do to remind Esmeraude that "helpful surprises" that on the surface look like "selling you out to other interests" might not be the best idea.
>>
No. 116154 ID: 094652

>>116148
Royalty looking down at the common worker and underpaying them because he can make their other options (like the guild) into bitter enemies with a few misplaced troops and a healthy dose of nepotism.

Why isn't the prince solidifying the loyalty of the Nyancompany? All it takes is two conversations to realize both the union and the Nyancompany have a beef with the Prince! Now the Fire Hawks can band them together or something!
>>
No. 116165 ID: a771ff

Just to make it clear, Maru was expressing that she was unhappy, but willing to do what Viste said- sort of a "okay, I'm behind you, but this better have a good explanation when we're through." Her statement was meant to indicate that she doesn't consider getting paid a good explanation, and would likely be unhappy if that was the sole reasoning for their plan of action. That's not really why she's upset though- she just wants to kill "cap" because she has developed a vehenoment hatred of him suddenly, for reasons that are probably understandable. She wasn't complaining much about the risk he posed before he embarrassed her and talked about being chummy with her dad. In the same way the Davina has a more personal stake in the reward, Maru, known for her fiery temper and perchant for vengeance, has a personal reason to want him maimed and regretful, and is choosing to paint her interests in the best light to others. I think if someone implicated with the rise of discontent with the noble familys in Davinas home providence, or a powerful cleric of tsogtha, the enemy of Tittyvalla, was our dangerous cargo instead of the demon swordsman, there might be different reactions from certain crew members.
>>
No. 116166 ID: af6e04

This Warzone Clause thing has come up a few times, but I'm not exactly sure what it entails.

Inciting a riot seems like it's straying out of 'enlightened self-interest' territory into 'might be a villain' territory.
>>
No. 116167 ID: 3d2d5f

>she just wants to kill "cap" because she has developed a vehenoment hatred of him suddenly, for reasons that are probably understandable
Hey, he didn't show you up in your field of mastery, down a lung, and one arm held behind his back. :v

>good explanation
Maru had three complaints, two of which were addressed as "that's right, we won't be doing that" and "that will be addressed" respectively, because they were fair concerns.

The third was "stop insulting me as if I'm an idiot". Because, well, it's insulting. (And you didn't roll great on a touchy issue that's been handed badly before).

If Maru, whose whole role is supposed to be about provoking (and understanding) aggression, thinks a direct challenge and dredging up an old argument is supportive? And won't get a reaction? I don't know what she's smoking.

If Maru didn't want her concerns addressed, she shouldn't have raised them. If she wanted an explanation later, she should have said that, and/or waited (Not expected she should be able to mouth off and have the response politely delayed for her benefit).

I framed the current problem as at worst inconveniencing or harming a group of people Maru has in the past shown apathy to contempt for deliberately, by the way. And the pointing out that she was insulting what her teammates stand for was supposed to get through to Maru's strong team / family attachment, past her inconveint, persistent (and annoyingly selective) risk aversion.

I think I have to admit I have no ability to predict which part of her personality Maru will latch onto when she reacts to things. (Which isn't really something I'm objecting to, or angry about, but is sorta frustrating to work around. She's a powder keg who will irregularly find reasons to not cooperate and I can't see them coming).

>tell us what to do
Um, she kinda did? Right before Maru complained. Granted, it depends on Hore responding to Esmeraude.

>lecture
Aaaaaa this is basically everything that frustrates me writing argument for Viste.

She's barely capable of lecturing. She responded to your points as you raised them. The last part wasn't even dialog, it was narration for OOC benefit.
>>
No. 116183 ID: 3abd97

>>116167
Geeze. This is entirely too long to say "what character tried to say sure isn't how it came across."


Okay, the IC arguing is frustrating, not going very quickly, and frankly puts us at a disadvantage in front of 'Cap'. Can we try and sort out what we want OOC, then worry about how we get there IC? We have a few options:

1) The Riot. I don't think any of us actually want this? "Messy" and "workable" are probably overly generous, and if we're talking expected risk versus reward, it doesn't seem worth it. It makes the immediate security situation worse for uncertain gains. And too much of the party wouldn't be down for it morally.

2) Bribe the Dock Workers. Probably the simplest solution, and Hore's already done the groundwork. Biggest complicating factor is dealing with an Esmeraude who has been caught in the act of betrayal / disappointing we didn't trust her and overruled her plan, without making the situation worse.

3) Kome's compromise. Surprisingly, if the prince is ripping off the dock workers and nyanco, striking some sort of agreement between them against the local prince becomes a lot more workable. Tricky bit is it still requires some diplomatic legwork. Need to smooth over the situation with Esmeraude, and get her to repurpose what she's already set up with the cats, and use Hore's connection to the dock workers to get them to talk to, then hash the arrangement out. I'd be willing to give this a try.

4) Hard Break. Ditch and/or kill our troublesome client pair. Frankly, I wouldn't favor this. I see it causing us fairly immediate problems for the questionable gain of being spared the risk they present for the next few days, and likely denies payment on a job.


I think I'd favoring attempting 3, resorting to 2 if we can't strike a deal. ...or doing 2 at the same time the negations are ongoing for 3.
>>
No. 116190 ID: fc3fc0

>>116167
>didn't show Maru up very badly compared to Viste.

True. Doesnt make her feel a whole lot better- she specifically feels like she failed To uphold the shared responsibility of ensuring their cargo is secure. She talked to him, she escalated, she's at fault. Doesn't like feeling that way, and so she's redirecting shame into anger at cap.

>three complaints
>don't need more boat room
Acknowledged. That's why she's deferring- davina and viste are obviously much better at sorting those things out.

>we're going to adjust behaviors appropriately
Maru is skeptical, given that keeping the sorceress happy seems to be pretty high up on the list of priorities. Not fair to Daviste, but emotions rarely are.

>someone is being insulted?
Not sure who this is addressed to? It wasn't something Maru was complaining about, but I'm also not sure what she did to insult anyone but cap? So that point is unclear

>thought Maru would want to incite a riot
She would. Her objection has nothing to do with the riot, and everything to do with cap. She's more than happy to carry out the riot portion of the plan.

>Maru is unpredictable
I think that comes from A) us having different playstyles and ways of seeing things and B) my flaws in roleplaying. You're much better at remembering things and logicing your way around a system. I just miss stuff you see, and so it makes sense that we're sometimes surprising to eachother in our gameplay choices. Ultimately Maru is an extension of me, and I'm somewhat inconsistent- I don't have a rules sheet, and I forget a lot of stuff. I just play off what I think is right, which is think is in line with Maru's spontaneous and flighty personality. I'm also very forgetful, so if I forget anything I'm just saying it's cannon that she also forgot, mainly because she's disinterested or absentminded. So, chalk any inconsistencies to me being forgetful and in the moment.

Her yelling at Viste is intentionally disproportionate to viste's calm, levelheaded responses. Maru is just being angry and unreasonable. She's being verbally defiant, but she's still looking to Viste for directions; if she was planning on actually challenging vistes authority she would have gone ahead and done something more drastic than shout- yelling abrasive things at people is kinda what she does. She's just upset with how things are going, and deciding to be a brat about it.
>>
No. 116191 ID: ecca3c

>>116183
Obviously Maru is in favor of option 4; she'll listen when Viste says heel though. If Daviste backs 2/3 Maru will be unhappy, but helpful.
>>
No. 116193 ID: 3abd97

>Not sure who [is being insulted]?
Viste.

Specifically, with the way Maru derisively dismisses taking risks for "dosh". (Again).

In one go that's Maru saying she has no faith in Viste's judgement or ability to assess risk, and you're belittling her choice to work. That Maru refuses to accept that her companions might have a use for the money they're working for is insulting. That she seems to think they're greedy idiots, pursuing needless money in unreasonably dangerous ways for its own sake, is insulting.

More simply, for Davina, Maru's flat out telling someone who chose to work as a mercenary commander that being a mercenary is wrong. More than that, that it's laughably wrongheaded.

It sorta feels like... patronizing anti-capitalist rhetoric? How dare you try to profit to as a means to an end!

...and it's a little frustrating if Maru missed that entirely, because that was by far the most important thing Viste had to say.
>>
No. 116196 ID: d22dc0
File 150655653547.jpg - (196.06KB , 1536x1457 , o-ASHAMEDANIMALS-facebook.jpg )
116196

>>116193
Hm. If I'm honest, I don't really understand how that's the take away, so I'm not sure how to bridge the gap. Maru doesn't really have a problem working for money- she'd rather be doing something like tomb raiding or dungeon crawling, but obviously she was scared after they hit the labyrinth the first time- doing somewhat unsavory work of being some asshole merchant's watchdogs is acceptable if it means she can get tooled up and better equipped. She doesn't really like doing other people's dirty work when it doesn't benefit her- a somewhat skewed perception, given that getting paid does benefit her, but she doesn't see money the same way. For example, Vos suggests they raid and loot an opposing temple, and deal harshly with people who get in their way: Sounds, great, glad to help a friend, let's go burn a church down. Philistra puts out an ad for mercenaries to terrorize an opposing operation, located in a nearby church? Disgruntled acceptance if Davina brought it to the table. It's not what the work is, more so the motivations.

>Dismissive
I didn't feel like she was being derisively dismissive- from my perspective, she was saying "hey, I'll do what you say, but I'm upset, and if we do this, you know it's going to upset me more."

>Belittling Viste's skill
Her saying "hey, if it were me, I wouldn't make this call, but I think you're better suited for the job than I am, so I'm going to defer to you because you have better judgement." feels like the opposite to me? I really tried to emphasize that she was expressing anger, but not going to peel off from the group.

>Belittling her choice to work
Again, that wasn't the intention, nor how I see the comments? I guess the place Maru is coming from is that she doesn't think people will die when they go on missions. She's more confident in everyone than they assume; she doesn't advocate for things she thinks will result in death without luck on their side. She's pretty black and white on that issue- either they can do it and will be successful and gain rewards, or they won't and they risk death. In this circumstance, to her, transporting cap doesn't fall into either category- she thinks he's dangerous enough to kill them sure, but really he implied an association with her father, attacked her, etc etc, and she just wants to kill him. Conversely, the ship job? She figured they wouldn't get the extra pay, but they'd be fine. No major risk to life. The village assault? A bad idea. Little to gain, large risk of massive casualties. Jumping down the trap hole? Suicidal. They didn't even consider other options. She's still mad about that, even if they could buy back Ji's life. So many things could have gone wrong, and it feels as though there was nothing in place in case misfortune struck. If she weren't externally motivated, she'd rate this circumstance as a category 2. Bad idea, a lot of risk, a small reward. She's not saying mercenary work is bad, or that people are stupid for pursuing it, she's saying that in this circumstance she feels that it's a dumb risk to take and the reward isn't worth it. I'm not exactly sure why people feel like her saying "this is a dumb idea, don't do it" is the same as "I think mercenary work is stupid, and you all are stupid for doing it, but not me, even though I'm also doing it." For me there's a pretty big disconnect for Viste to jump from "I think this is too risky" to "I think you're stupid and incapable"

>Anti-capitalist
Maru doesn't really care for society. She's not specifically against money, or like, any economic idea, but she's pretty anti-establishment; capitalism is a part of the establishment usually. She's not a huge fan to be honest. She won't claim to have better ideas or a way to implement or dismantle the system in any way, she'll just mostly say that bankers are pigs, the rich deserve to be beaten and robbed, and religions people are assholes who are getting led around by other assholes with fancy hats. The legal system is a joke, bosses steal from their employees and only care about themselves, and the world fucked you over the moment you step foot in it, so it's not worth your time to give a shit about other people who don't give a shit about you. Fuck everyone else, protect what's yours, and look out for #1.

I'm sorry though, I did miss that point entirely. Like I said, this is coming out of left field for me, even though we had a big in character fight about it last time. It's just so alien from my intentions and stuff that like, I still really had no idea or expectation that it could be taken that way. I don't mean to make a big fuss over nothing yet again, I know it's not really fun and it bogs everything down. I'm havin trouble like, seeing where everyone else is coming from but I promise I'm not like, trying to be intentionally confrontational or aggravating; when Maru made her statement about "You know how I feel about that" I thought it would boil down to Viste tersely saying "Acknowledged" and then moving on, I didn't realize it would lead to us hashing stuff out IC and OOC. Maru thought she could let everyone know how she was feeling, and they could move on so they wouldn't be surprised later, but it seems to have backfired. *ashamed dog face*
>>
No. 116197 ID: d36af7

>>116154
Anyone rich enough to have their own team of accountants is going to put at least a little bit of thought into how to get more for less. If the prince was telling the truth to the unions about this being a one-time deal, that means no future dealings with the Nyaraku Nyanco, so parting on good terms with them loses it's main cold-blooded argument in favor. If the prince simply can't afford to pay standard union rates for the new palace until extramuros tax revenue starts pouring in, which would require that the palace already be up and running and some other things besides, that's a deadlock situation, resolution of which requires either taking some shortcuts, or outside help, or basically robbing somebody. http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/stellarcolony.php#id--Growing_a_Colony--Infrastructure "Greedy, backstabbing politician" became a stereotype because realistic limited-resource politics is chock full of ugly compromises. Every penny squeezed out of the catgirls is a penny for some other project which the prince would otherwise need to be borrowing at literally draconian interest rates, leading to bigger problems down the road. The drakocracy is very willing to open opportunities for the heroic ambitions of youth, but markedly less willing to forgive lack of foresight on the part of established professionals. Can't clean up your own administrative-infrastructure mess? Looks like this prince is defective, time to install a new one, thus spake Aguinbreke.
>>
No. 116200 ID: 3abd97

>>116196
>I don't really understand how that's the take away
Okay, I've officially driven myself crazy trying to, but I can't think of a simpler way to break down my existing explanation, sorry.

All I can really say is whatever you intended to convey, I heard "we shouldn't take risks for money". If you consider that in light of what Dav's been doing, and what her high ambition is, the way she took offense at that claim, and why, should follow.


>Still thinks Ji taking a risk with his ability was unacceptable
I've been wondering. Why doesn't Maru react the same why every time I portal into danger, or a precarious situation?

>last paragraph
And yeah, I feel pretty much the same way. It's pretty disheartening to be so completely misreading each other's intentions. (Communication can be hard, and sometimes trying to make dialog that's concise, and works IC, comes at the expense of clarity).
>>
No. 116220 ID: d22dc0
File 150661045163.jpg - (1.16MB , 3264x2448 , IMG_3577.jpg )
116220

>>116200
Yeah, I get what you're trying to convey, and it makes sense how "we shouldn't take risks for money" is insulting; my confusion was in how that was the message I sent. If I know where the disconnect is, maybe I can work harder to prevent chasms of understanding in the future.

That being said, communication goes two ways, and clearly, no matter my intentions, I haven't been adequately expressing them, so I'd like to apologize for my part in this small mess. I've been insulting and inflammatory, and whether I meant to be or not doesn't change what actually happened. Attached in a picture of my cat to mend the gap. I hope it helps (^・ェ・^)

>Why are her reactions inconsistent?
Again, it seems to be a difference of motivations pair with what she expected the outcome to be. Let's take a few different examples

1) portaling up the tall shaft in the bloodmist labrynth
So in this circumstance, you were portaling somewhere unknown, which could be dangerous. However, Maru expected everyone would be able to follow you soon enough, so there was relatively little risk. Just up, and to the side. In turn, it was motivated by progressing the interests of the group; fleeing an encroaching monster and progressing closer to the surface. Motivation: Group. Perceived Danger: Low. Reaction: Good.

2) Portaling into the village to fight the swordsman
In this circumstance, you were portaling into direct danger, against a foe that COULD be overwhelmingly strong, with half the crew following you. Likelyhood of extreme casualties? Very high. Maru thought there was a very real possibility most of them wouldn't come back. On the flip side though, the motivations were different; Vos was going to charge in anyway, which was a pretty suicidal idea, no matter what we did. So Maru thought our decision was motivated by saving a friend. They had a better chance of no one dying by going together than they did by going alone. Motivation: Group. Perceived Danger: High. Reaction: Disgruntled but accepting.

3) Portaling to the Waterwheel
In This circumstance, you were going to the waterwheel after it caught fire, to assess if there were threats to the city. They could have been dangerous individuals, but truth be told I knew they weren't, and that influenced Maru. She was unconcerned, and didn't think the danger was high. Alternately, the motivation was not really for the group at all, it was more for profit or the city or what have you. Motivation: Outside benefits. Perceived Danger: Low Reaction: Disinterest. Viste can go do what she wants to build up her reputation. It doesn't really concern Maru.

I'm having trouble thinking of many other examples where Maru saw viste portal into danger, but I think I've illustrated my general point which is that Maru doesn't object solely based on motivations or how dangerous something is, but on a reactive scale. I don't really like have a list of rules for her, I just go off what I think makes sense in that situation. In the circumstance with Ji, Maru felt like A) the danger was suicidal. There was no way Ji would survive short of a miracle. I personally doubted JamesLeng would kill the good doctor off with on roll, but I figured there was the potential for things to go south pretty easily. Maru was in a state of heightened emotion, and thought that tunnel was certain death for Ji. Viste could portal pat the danger- she assumed that would bypass any triggering mechanisms, but she was betting that there would be traps in there that would get you even if you floated gently by. Combined with the motivation, which was wholey based on profit, Maru was obviously unhappy. She doesn't see acquiring capital as beneficial to the group, so to have Viste suggest Ji jump to his death so they had a chance of getting a magic item? Especially when it might get broken, or stuck, or otherwise lost in the process? When that was the first suggestion, without much exploration of other ideas? It was a betrayal of everything she stood for. When might it be her turn to be thrown into a meat grinder for the sake of other people getting money? Obviously her other friends wouldn't stand up for her, or care at all- thats apparently just what you do. You throw away your life at a chance for money. To her, these situations feel similar. Really she's extrinsically motivated, but if that weren't the case, she still thinks cap could hold a grudge, and represents a deadly threat, and that the plan is basically to hope he walks back to the ship calmly without trying anything. To me personally, it seems like a lot could go wrong, and we're better off if he's dead. I don't personally see the risks as proportional to the reward. I can understand why Davina really wants that info though, so even though it's not how I feel, that makes sense to me and I can see where it's coming from. Hopefully this all makes sense and helps clear up why Maru does the things that she does.
>>
No. 116250 ID: d36af7

It's today. Just thought you should know. Got some good news about a strategic thing, too, though I'd rather not get into the details on a public forum.
>>
No. 116266 ID: af6e04

>Attached in a picture of my cat to mend the gap
Davina's mom??

>>116250
Happy birthday! We probably don't say it enough, but we all appreciate our DM

>strategic thing
>rather not get into the details on a public forum.
I have no idea what this implies haha

Oh also. Hopefully I've talked Valeno's player into making another post soon (they're all caught up on the thread but haven't replied cause they're scared of dying)
>>
No. 116267 ID: 094652

>>116250
Happy birfday!
>>
No. 116272 ID: 3d2d5f

>>116250
Happy birthday, and congrats on your unspecified good fortune. I'll put the gobo on making a cake.

>>116266
Pfff. Catmom was the best silly background tidbit I included, by far.

That brings a question I had to mind. What does the reincarnation spell do to bloodline succession? If an heir is revived, even as the same species, they're still essentially random rolling new genetics, aren't they?

>haven't replied cause they're scared of dying
Hey, we've all been there, I think.

I haven't replied cause I'm kinda torn on if Rhea should take the language lessons (on the one hand, useful, team inclusion, and she's already a bit of a polyglot. On the other hand, it would mess up the limited language barrier with the party quirk, and I'm not sure if she could reasonably focus on anything for every waking hour with the sun out).
>>
No. 116273 ID: d22dc0

>>116250
Congrats on making it thus far! I know that my world is certainly made more enjoyable for having you in it. Hopefully you can enjoy this day, and celebrate it in some way if that is your custom.

>>116272
If you're really not sure, you could always roll for it. It's a pretty beefy commitment, and somewhat unreasonable, but Kent is a lifelong student, so it makes sense for me. Isaiah might learn a new language with time, but certainly wouldn't devote that kind of effort; he'd prefer to learn something through natural cultural osmosis than forced studying. Maybe Rhea is an incredibly studious and hard worker? Or maybe she's simply devoted to the advancement of group goals? They need every learned hand they can get, although this crash course certainly isn't the only way to learn; maybe the rest of the educated crew can come together and teach everyone else at a slower pace. Personally though, I imagined she would rather spend some time per day doing other stuff, like cooking, or going blind from looking at the sun, or finding someone's eye for Mode to eat, etc. than spend almost every waking moment devoted to learning to read ancient drill manuals.
>>
No. 116297 ID: d36af7

I'd like to thank Santova for becoming my first patron at the $50 level.
>>
No. 116301 ID: d22dc0

>>116297
Unfortunately I can't sustain that level after this month, but I wanted to have a way to say happy birthday. I do not intend to use any of the offered incentives, as this is meant to be a birthday gift, not a purchase of perks. Here's to many more rotations around the sun 🍻🎉
>>
No. 116309 ID: d22dc0

Oof. That wasn't a very good repair roll. Isaiah seems to have good recovery rolls and bad repair rolls.
>>
No. 116384 ID: 3abd97

Brainstorming stuff, trying to figure out what Rhea's spell list should be.

https://pastebin.com/RmGhxgzy

Certainly seems like there's enough spells / abilities to avoid much overlap, if Isaiah goes cleric too (channel energy and healing probably).
>>
No. 116385 ID: af6e04

>spell list
Not sure what class Nistamatsin's gonna end up being, but as far as spells...

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/alarm
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/peacebond
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/blood-money
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/mage-armor
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/w/wave-shield but perhaps with blood instead of water
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/protection-from-good
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/i/infernal-healing
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/g/grease

all seem good
>>
No. 116399 ID: d22dc0

On the topic of spells, I'm still not certain what I'd like for Isaiah. Cleric isn't really feeling right to me. I'm most familiar with pathfinder, so building off those class archetypes, Warpriest, Oracle, and Shaman are all clicking with me most, although I'm always open to a more free-flow class creation. Haven't looked at the inquisitor class really, but that might be worth checking out as well. The cleric spells and domains just aren't really sticking out to me, so maybe instead of choosing a whole new class I just need to see about tailoring some of those parts more thematically? Anyway, here's my take on the classes previously mentioned:

For Warpriest, I'd be looking at the Travel and Liberation Blessings.

Oracle would probably be waves mystery and deep one curse. Curse could easily be explained as deviations from the original armor's designs during the repairs.

Shaman I'm almost entirely new to, and too tired currently to do a proper job reading up on the mechanics. It seems a bit odd to suddenly get a spirit animal, but I like the spell list and features from what I've seen. It would probably be the waves spirit, maybe something Raven-esque in design to fit with the Death aspect of Hanspur.

Overall though, all those classes have access to 3, 0th circle spells, which would be Bleed, Create Water, and Mending.

The three things I'd like sort of associated with Isaiah are water, trade/travel and fear. In combat, I'd like Isaiah to be particularly geared towards scaring enemies and moving water around, but outside of combat I'd like to develop the ability to sort of facilitate long distance travel and trade and commerce and stuff, which water also obviously plays into. To no one's surprise, magic seems like the best way to do this, but none of the classes immediately jump out at me as "the right one". So I'm just throwing concepts out there to see what sort of stands out as the important archetypal points to me.

One thing I was thinking of was the ability to channel a traveling ritual for a group of people, where the ritual actually takes just as long as it would take to travel there regularly, but after the ritual is complete it wrinkle in time style allows them to basically step from one location to another, provided they're connected up with good roads. This wouldn't be good for cutting travel time's really, but it helps to avoid the dangers and hardships of road travel, potentially circumventing a lot bad of bad stuff, like red bears, and weather, and gug blockades. Nothing seems to fit in anywhere close in the spells and features of various classes, so I was thinking maybe down the line it could be some sort of line of tweaked teleport spells, with increased transport capacity to make up for the extremely long casting time involved. The inability to take a whole lot with you always bugged me with teleport spells, but there's not really a good substitution for them other than getting higher level and getting better spells. Not married to this exact idea, but it's something I was mulling over while I was killing time today.

I also like to picture Isaiah water bending, appearing as a grim specter of death to those he wants to scare, and putting favorable winds in the sails of trading ships, but you can't do everything at level 1.
>>
No. 116402 ID: d36af7

>>116399
>waves mystery and deep one curse
How about the aboleth curse, instead? Gives you some handy powers right off the bat, intimidation rather than diplomacy fits the fear angle, and in-setting it represents the tesseract squid design elements trying to repair themselves.
>>
No. 116411 ID: d22dc0

>>116402
Sure, sounds good.

I think for spells then I'll go with inflict spells, and I'll take the following:

Oth:
Bleed
Create water
Detect Magic
Mending

1st:
Ant Haul
Fear

For my level 1 revelation, I'll go with fluid travel; Magey if you want me to post a description of anything or do formatting stuff to make it easier on you, just tell me how you'd like it done.

Also, I know we don't normally talk feats until we need some sort of pre-requisite, but if Isaiah has one free I would absolutely like the extra revelation feat. If I can, I'll take water sight as my extra revelation.
>>
No. 116422 ID: 3abd97

>>116411
Thanks for the consideration, but it's pretty easy to document, so long as it's all standard stuff I can link to. I really only need added descriptions if it's houseruled or customized, or if the names are ambiguous. (Speaking of, Create Water becomes Condense Water in this game).

You can double check me, but I should have Isaiah in the doc right, now.

I'll update Nin after class and such is actually sorted, and Rhea after I've gotten feedback.

>appearing as a grim specter of death to those he wants to scare
...Rhea might have already classified him as "adorable monster-boy" which might cause some difficulty in maintaining his desired image.
>>
No. 116423 ID: d22dc0

>>116422
Lucky for him, she's not someone he wants to scare! And yeah, that looks good for Isaiah, thanks for going in and pulling out the extra tidbits I forgot to specifically outline.
>>
No. 116449 ID: 094652

So, do I still get to control Azure and Pog while she's taking classes and he's chopping wood?
>>
No. 116469 ID: d36af7

>>116449
Yes. Pog can uproot and mutilate a tree in just two hours that it would take a normal lumberjack all day to chop down, so he can take time off whenever, but Azure's stuck with a much stricter schedule if she wants to get full benefit from the training.
>>
No. 116470 ID: d36af7

Recapping a bit and throwing in some OOC knowledge, the Fire Hawks have at least four reasonable options for wrapping up their resupply problem, which are not mutually exclusive, though using too many at once may be foolish and redundant.

The first, and almost certainly simplest, is to give the union some cold hard cash (and figure out how to provide either concealment or a distraction) to get the supplies loaded without any further meddling in local affairs.

There's the riot => contract default => catgirl allies plan which Esmeraude came up with and her "cap" is advocating for.

Option three, Yisheng Ji could wave around supposedly-extinct life-extension herbs to get a quick audience with the Prince, then have Tchalcedo eat the Prince's brain and assume his identity. At that point she could simply sort out the political situation by fiat, as payment to Yisheng Ji for services rendered.

Option four is the only one which doesn't involve any risky deception, senseless violence, or out-of-pocket expenses. It hinges on a somewhat subtle inconsistency between different accounts of what the Nyaraku Nyanco ultimately want or need. I'll let you figure the rest out for yourselves.
>>
No. 116474 ID: fc3fc0

Unrelated to the boat problem, but I'm reading back over the language learning contract with a bit more care since I've been less than attentive for the past month or two after the hurricane But Kent totally has a language book. In the back of my mind I was thinking about it, because, well, Kent has a langue book in their starting inventory, this is clearly a priority for this character, language crash course sounds great. 4 hours of sleep a night is kind of a shit deal, but if it's only for a week it's doable. Wasn't at all thinking about trying to squeeze any useful bonuses out of that thing, but it seems like with kents book on automation and factory machinery, their book on linguistics, their experience with engineering and their notes which should be easy enough to share and help other people, at least as easy as borrowing a book from the sage, figuring out how this machine works plays to pretty much all of Kents strengths and I haven't really been capitalizing on that. I'm excited to get the language lessons unpacked and have a crack at operating it, should prove both fun and exciting.

Also not sure if Elves need to sleep less than humans, is that a feature in this setting?
>>
No. 116479 ID: d36af7

>>116474
Full elves do not need to sleep - or, by some accounts, are always asleep, walking and talking and loving and fighting in a dream that precisely resembles the waking world. Green and White elves both traditionally spend several hours per day in quiet solitary contemplation, but this need not occur on a regular schedule, and can be postponed for months or years when necessary. Elven brains simply do not become fatigued by prolonged alertness, any more than their bodies shrivel in old age. As a result, they are immune to magically induced sleep, and also the toxins of the weakest variety of ghoul, which hijack the mechanism of sleep paralysis.
>>
No. 116505 ID: 542e93

>>116479
That should make things markedly easier for Kent then. And I'm amazed at Nistamatsin, the terrifiying crit rolling face demon who is pretty much single handedly behind the progress and success of magic sword. That, and our very helpful DM.
>>
No. 116511 ID: af6e04

>>116505
How many crits can one demon roll? I am flying too close to the sun.
>>
No. 116517 ID: 3abd97

>2 fours in a row.
Dang, Nin is on a roll.

>>116166
I've been justifying it so far with the logic that Dav's background makes her a lot more sympathetic to cat-people with adorable bugs than common laborers. And staging a riot-in-name-only as an excuse to put the legal screws on someone else and maneuver? That's just politics.

>>116470
Huh, three did not occur to me. Would be internally messy to pull off, since Ji would be obligated to conceal what he was doing, and some of us are pretending we don't know about Tchalcedo and cause Tunic hasn't posted in a bit, I hope he's still around.

>Option four is the only one which doesn't involve any risky deception, senseless violence, or out-of-pocket expenses. It hinges on a somewhat subtle inconsistency between different accounts of what the Nyaraku Nyanco ultimately want or need. I'll let you figure the rest out for yourselves.
Hmmmm. That implies there's something we can do or say, that doesn't burn consumables. Something we know, or are capable of, would be valuable to the cats.

>a family of seven catfolk (possibly some obscure tribe of elvenoid, certainly from very far away
>I don't want to take away jobs, or hurt anybozdy. I just want to do my own job.
>It can produce almost ten pounds of resin in an hour, and claims to be able to maintain that rate of production more than 20 hours per day. The whole hive, two dozen beetles at full strength, only eats as much as three humans. Where's all that extra mass coming from?
>Long story short, the "Nyaraku Nyanco" aren't interested in most of the benefits guild members get (already have skills and aren't planning to stick around and raise kids here so they don't need apprenticeships
>She might be able to pay us with Immovable Rods, which is really cool
>Cat architects shortchanged by prince. Riot will trigger warzone clause, they become our friends

Well, once thing is they aren't from anywhere near here- the cats aren't a race anyone local recognizes, and they bring a building technique / tool no one else has, either. Couple that with their non-desire to stick around and the raising of funds, and they're trying to travel somewhere. Might be trying to get home (lost or exiled?) or trying to get somewhere specific.

Another possibility is there's some hidden cost or complication for the extra mass the bugs produce.

Interest in being paid in immovable rods could be a red herring (I mean, it is a useful building supply, and valuable) or it could tie into their wants or needs (they want a home in the sky / different plane?).

Assuming Esmeraude actually discussed / bargained her idea with the cats (and isn't hoping to surprise them too), they have an interest in triggering this "warzone clause". Which, as strngy pointed out, we really don't know that much about. Their real goal might tie into whatever secondary effects that triggers, more than just making money off of it.
>>
No. 116520 ID: d36af7

>>116517
Of those two contradictory points which option 4 hinges on, you included one but just barely missed the other.
>>
No. 116523 ID: 3abd97

>>116520
If anyone else wants to take a crack at it, here's those quotes expanded and highlighted.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1j9jwh7pNpD5zrGWpkbmSyJzGJb6atokIOrXuooq0hqY/edit?usp=sharing

Biggest possible condition I'm seeing right now: Assuming Esmeraude discussed her plan with the cats, they're apparently willing to betray a client for money, when they should want more than just money for that.
>>
No. 116528 ID: 36105e

>>116523
Nothing jumps out at me really- I'm not 100% sure on the money to betray a client thing either, because it sounds like their client already breached their trust, which is enough in my books to count as more than "just money" for the motivating factor, although professionally that might not be a smart move.

The giant one seems a weird detail- most elvenoids don't vary so widely in shape and build. Could be someone outside the normal curve, or something else is not as it seems. My take? The cat folk are some kind of demon or something similar. Doesn't really shed any light on the 5 Ws of the situation but I just think there's more to them than what we see on the surface

This also doesn't seem super relevant but I'm not sure why the stevedore are striking in solidarity with the masons- dock work and masonry seem pretty far removed from eachother. I wonder what the deal is with that situation.
>>
No. 116529 ID: d36af7

>>116523
The beetle mentioned Esmeraude dangling the carrot of Immovable Rods, which were established way back at the start of this tungsten-run mission as being unusually valuable to ambitious architects. Presumably her family secret recipes, spellcasting, and the considerable martial prowess of her bodyguard would also be on the table, since the Fire Hawks never expressly demanded exclusivity.

As far as client betrayal and other violations of professional ethics, there's a lot more slack for 'exact words' shenanigans when the client turns out to be acting in bad faith, or asking you to do something that turns out to be illegal or unethical in some other way. http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2009-02-22
https://web.archive.org/web/20150428205944/http://www.airshipentertainment.com/buckcomic.php?date=20071009
>>
No. 116534 ID: d36af7

>>116528
>dock work and masonry seem pretty far removed from eachother
Both involve a certain amount of shuffling around items heavy enough to benefit from cranes and other mechanical advantage, so they'd be suffering a lot of the same kinds of industrial accidents. Some degree of alliance would tend to improve their collective-bargaining leverage with doctors and insurance agents and whoever else might be affected by such risks. Making the most of that sort of advantage is one of the main reasons for having a trade union in the first place.

As for other common interests, well, this city is on a broad grassy plain. Do you think stone and timber for construction came from nearby? Alluvial terrain doesn't tend to produce the best structural rocks, nor grassland the best load-bearing logs. Or did they perhaps import most of the material? Presumably through the docks, rather than dragging it agonizingly overland one oxcart-load of bricks at a time. If builder bugs need no raw material to work with, well, that'd be a bit of a potential threat to the shipping industry too, now, wouldn't it? At least in the short-to-medium term, until new industries pop up... but also in the short-to-medium term, those potentially unemployed longshoremen have families to feed. Maybe they decided to seize an excuse to 'go on strike' now, disrupting the commercial traffic while they're still in demand, in order to pay out union accounts into personal savings and shake down shipping magnates for bribes, so they'll have full larders when the anticipated crisis properly arrives. Maybe.

I think about economics kind of a lot.

>The cat folk are some kind of demon or something similar.
Good guess! Not going to confirm or deny the exact details at this point (unless somebody spends a weekly question on it), apart from mentioning that in this context the word "Nyaraku" is actually derived from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naraka_(Buddhism) modified by a stereotypical cat voice, rather than, say, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyaruko:_Crawling_with_Love
>>
No. 116536 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/835144
If we're going to be talking about Rook's Vineyard, I might as well drop some reference links:
>>/questarch/773353
>Consider who built the wall of poison near there, and why.
>This is similar enough that we may yet have much to discuss.
http://combineoverwiki.net/wiki/Ravenholm
http://avatar.wikia.com/wiki/Lake_Laogai
>>
No. 116537 ID: 3abd97

>unless somebody spends a weekly question on it
Sudo explain option four.
>>
No. 116538 ID: af6e04

>>116536
As soon as I read 'We don't go there anymore.' I thought of Ravenholm, but now with the second link too I'm thinking we're going to find some sort of dark drakocracy secret down there.

Either way, a subterrene should be almost as good as a submarine for finding a structure on the bottom of a lake. Not sure how we'd justify the field trip to Lt.Cmdr. Jalkaren Blessed-Is-The-Light though.
>>
No. 116559 ID: d36af7

>>116537
The catgirls thought they wouldn't need an expert in local law because they were working direct for the Prince, who assured them the project's timely completion was more than valuable enough to justify the revision of building codes or neighborhood noise ordinances or whatnot for their convenience. Where they're from, amoral dictatorship is the default, so they're not properly accustomed to the dynamics of a drakocratic multipolar environment where people actually take rule-of-law seriously.

The Prince knows local contract law better than they do, and used it against them. This took them by surprise, because a ruler with absolute power behaving in such a way would be bizarrely self-defeating. They figured if he didn't want to pay them as much, he'd just alter the deal, and possibly instruct them to "pray it not be altered any further," under threat of violence. In fact, the numbers given in their initial estimate had more to do with how much damage they figured they could plausibly inflict (while retreating from the prince's guards during such a contingency) and corresponding Schelling points for extortion during a Mexican standoff at the cusp of such unpleasantness, than with the complexity of construction itself. Hardly any material costs, beetles do almost all the work and don't need pay, so it's mainly a matter of drawing up blueprints, a bit of calculus to figure the structure's total mass, and trivial dimensional analysis to translate that into build time. Grab some food, secure the perimeter, sit back and take a nap. Then one day you wake up to find that while the Prince could've changed the relevant ordinances... instead, some penalty clause was invoked. http://www.atomic-robo.com/atomicrobo/v12ch2-page-10 Repeatedly. http://www.atomic-robo.com/atomicrobo/v12ch1-page-17

The masons and bricklayers union retains lawyers whose entire job description is pushing back when the prince (or any other client) tries that kind of fine-print dickery. Option four is this: tell the Nyaraku Nyanco to go to the union, swallow their pride, and cough up whatever the best legal advice costs, 'cause it's likely to be cheaper than the alternative.

No more non-union big-ticket construction, even if the negotiations for tidying it up retroactively have just started? No more reason for a strike. Cargo gets loaded at standard rates, no sneaky stuff, and even if negotiations break down again the very next day, that's not your problem anymore.
>>
No. 116560 ID: 3abd97

>>116559
>A way the union and cats both benefit by working together or at least with one paying the others off
Kome was right all along!
>>
No. 116607 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/835181
>spell-proofed doors
>What kind of warding does this imply, and could I replicate it?
It's a tavern rumor, not a case study from an engineering textbook. First circle abjurations could add the equivalent of a sturdy deadbolt to a door, or watch an area with the equivalent of a short-range motion sensor (linked to either a noisemaker or a telepathic 'ping' sufficient to wake the caster up from normal sleep), both on a scale of hours, or polarize someone's aura to deflect immaterial stuff and strongly opposed creatures (spirits, half-spirits, and priests, mostly, though it's particularly effective against temporary summoned creatures) on a scale of minutes.

Broad-spectrum countermagic starts at 3rd circle, but perfect reliability against all but the most extreme counter-countermeasures has to wait until 7th or 8th, depending on what you're willing to put up with in terms of side effects.

Might also refer to a door built from the wood of some naturally magic-resistant tree, lined with lead, sealed up airtight (presumably in concert with some magical or alchemical method to keep the air inside breathable), festooned with certain amulets, glyphs, herbs, or otherwise incorporating relatively mundane precautions against supernatural intrusion. http://www.webtoons.com/en/fantasy/sword-interval/ep-5-bachelor-pad/viewer?title_no=486&episode_no=5
>>
No. 116610 ID: 094652

Is there a way to convince one of the beetles to smuggle onto the ship for adventure? Lack of a hive mind might be too dangerous to consider this, but... Catbug. I mean, come on, you dangled a pathfinder version of Catbug in front of us, who else wants one of them as the mascot?
>>
No. 116611 ID: 3d2d5f

>rolled 17
Daaaaang, Dav struck out. No catgirls for her. Too bad Comfort for the Lonely kicks in *after*.

>>116610
I don't really think there's a good way to take a bug with us. Maybe we could hire the company to build something in the future though. (Strategically placed transparent walls in a structure could be used to give a line of sight teleporter an unfair advantage).


Hey, JamesLeng, could I ask what I supposed to be picking to finish Rhea's level up? I'm not entirely sure how many spells she's supposed to get (do these tables distinguish between per day casting capability and number of different spells you can memorize?), or how these clerical domains are supposed to work. I'd also be interested to hear if you had any cool ideas for a prestidigitation variant.

What circle would "create q-ration" be anyways? (Probably higher up there, as it creates a persistent trade commodity).
>>
No. 116621 ID: af6e04

>Might also refer to a door built from the wood of some naturally magic-resistant tree, lined with lead, sealed up airtight (presumably in concert with some magical or alchemical method to keep the air inside breathable), festooned with certain amulets, glyphs, herbs, or otherwise incorporating relatively mundane precautions against supernatural intrusion.
I suppose that knowledge wouldn't fall under the abjuration specialty then?
>>
No. 116629 ID: d36af7

>>116611
Cleric's chart shows spells-per-day. In Pathfinder (and Exalted), priests don't usually have a hard cap for how many different effects they can know how to pray for, only how much total power they can throw around before recharging with some sort of divine quid-pro-quo: prayers, sacrifices, that sort of thing. More is better, obviously, but most gods also tend to appreciate a steady diet of small daily devotions over feast-or-famine faith that plays havoc with their budgets. So, successful clerics tend to pray at consistent times, letting their patron know which specific miracles they're expecting to need before the next check-in. Preparation allows divine energies to be gathered and set in motion at a harmonious, leisurely pace. If you asked for something complicated and unusual but end up not needing it, the power can be crumpled up and swapped at the last minute for a domain spell of equal or lower circle, representing the miraculous effects a given god 'always has in stock.' If you need something that you didn't ask for in advance, or which is beyond what you could normally ask for at all, well, that's risky. You're annoying the divine patron, interrupting whatever they were in the middle of, asking for a favor which involves them doing more work, and relatively messy, strenuous work at that. The vast majority of gods, like other powerful privileged people, tend to respond to petty inconveniences with disproportionate resentment and hostility even when you're otherwise on good terms and have a truly excellent justification. To improve the odds of a useful result, pray at a shrine, ideally one which you just finished either building with your own hands or capturing and reconsecrating from an opposed power. Valuable offerings, more voices joining in the prayer, and various other factors can also help.

>What circle would "create q-ration" be anyways? 3rd. Many tribes of White Elves know a ritual that anyone can learn and use, though, with as little as one trained celebrant supervising a hundred unskilled workers to produce a meal per worker per hour. That's what keeps the price down to $5 per meal.

>>116621
Somebody who mostly worked magical wards would probably recognize mundane protective materials at a glance, particularly with the context clues of them being in active use, and could assess strengths and weaknesses or discuss technical details with someone who specialized in that kind of thing, but wouldn't necessarily be able to exactly replicate the effects. Sorta like how a good computer programmer needs to understand something about the hardware those programs run on, but isn't necessarily someone you'd trust with a soldering iron. Has Nistamatsin studied or practiced carpentry, metallurgy, herb-lore, any sort of craft and trade skills like that?
>>
No. 116633 ID: 3d2d5f

>>116629
Ah. That's... confusing. By which I mean, I can see the logic behind that arrangement now that you've pointed it out, but that's going to make conceptualizing the resources / options I have more difficult.

My options are then anything on the cleric list within level, minus anything anathetical, plus domain spells / powers?

How do we want to handle actually implementing that? Should I be announcing a list of what I prepared every in-game day? (Cause I've been enjoying... not having to do that). Should I prepare a default list and just announce deviations when they crop up? Handwave it and assume anything thematically appropriate (fire, food, diplomacy, standard healing stuff) can be called upon, but outside that make sure to pray for it in-game in advance?

If domain spells are supposed to be the only ones I can always be sure are available, I'm also less certain what to choose there. I was thinking fire and community thematically, but mechanically, it looks to me like some of the stuff from domain fire is redundant with her existing mutation / power combo. (She already has fire resistance, and it sure seems like she should already be able to duplicate fire bolt or produce flame, though I don't know how the damage compares).
>>
No. 116637 ID: 049931

>Has Nistamatsin studied or practiced carpentry, metallurgy, herb-lore, any sort of craft and trade skills like that?
Well, I figured the abjuration specialty made sense partly because as a demon wardings are something that often would affect him in particular.

>Should I prepare a default list and just announce deviations when they crop up?
That's what I do whenever I play cleric in D&D. Though pathfinder has a much bigger spell list so I can see how it would be easier to get lost in the possibilities.

I'm actually kinda looking forward to doing the wizard bookkeeping. They made things a lot simpler in 5e but IIRC in pathfinder you need to assign a spell slot to a certain spell. So if you think you might need Magic Mouth you gotta dedicate one of your second level spell slots to magic mouth and if no opportunity for hilarious party member pranking comes up (what else would you use magic mouth for?) then that slot is wasted. Which is interesting.
>>
No. 116640 ID: fc3fc0

>>116633
The upside is that, while it takes more to manage, it also makes you much more flexible than other spell casters. You can prepare a diplomacy spell list, baking spell list, combat spell list, etc, and given enough prep time you can then just use whatever spells you need. The cool thing is that you can just take a day to pray and prepare, and the next day you have custom spells tailored to whatever challenges you're going to face given enough intel before hand. If we assume level 1 with a +3 ability modifier in your relevant casting stat, you should be able to cast a 2 spells + one domain spell per day. If the fire domain is too redundant, the Sun Domain might be appropriate; I don't know how relevant the bonuses to smiting undead are, but thematically it seems to fit. Another route could be a reskinned or modified version of the good domain, letting you invoke mom's power to smite her foes and such. You'll already get healing at your fingertips just by being a cleric, as well as having the community domain, so there's very little reason to slot slot one of those spells up regularly. Something that might make sense is a summon monster spell, with something like a beetle or eagle being your go to animal, and just re-skinning them or modifying them to be sun based. Mom grants you a small portion of her power, animated and ready to do your biding, that sort of thing. Read Weather and comprehend languages would be useful everyday spells, and then spells like know thy enemy, touch of blindness, or ray of sickness could be good for combat utility if you don't really want a lot of spells that deal fire damage. Touch of blindness could be reskinned as a blinding light rather than magical darkness, and ray of sickness could be call something like food poisoning, or Delilahs Rotten Meal or something else food themed to fit Rhea's character better.
>>
No. 116647 ID: d36af7

>>116633
Well, that's a typical arrangement rather than an absolute metaphysical necessity, and Rhea has an unusually good position from which to negotiate. What are you looking for?
>>
No. 116654 ID: 3abd97

>>116637
>you need to assign a spell slot to a certain spell
Yeah, I was doing that with Marijke in the first session, but I noticed I was the only person doing it and was kinda getting frustrated with it, and I didn't resume when Davina got Moon-Tiara-Magic-ed.

So is Nin going wizard for class then?

>>116640
>something like food poisoning
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hospitium
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenia_%28Greek%29

I was thinking something similar to the classical hospitality traditions would apply in this faith, which would make deliberately serving a guest poisoned or bad food a hard no.

>>116647
Hmm. I'll get back to you on that. I'm gonna think on the advice offered and look over the lists on d20pfsrd some more. I might try fudging / customizing a domain.
>>
No. 116655 ID: d10e29

>>116654
I would say there's a difference between purposefully poisoning a guest you've extended hospitality to, and sickening an assailant or creature which is actively trying to do one bodily harm. Once someone tries to stick you with the pointy end of a blade, most responsibilities as a host are no longer binding.

Still though a custom domain would be cool. Wishing you luck!
>>
No. 116663 ID: d36af7

I was just looking over the wiki, noticed a couple of little things. First one's the sort of typo a spellchecker would miss. Dragons have 'pronounced,' or alternatively 'extreme,' sexual dimorphism, not 'pounced.' Second, Vishkanya are probably troll-kin, like most other sapient mortals with non-draconic ophidian characteristics.

Third was only up for about eleven hours back in the middle of last month, but I completely missed it at the time, and it bears repeating:
>>115914
>Kome, for future reference, that document is meant to be a reference for known capabilities and inventories.
>Good rule of thumb is if you can't copy paste it from a thread, it probably doesn't belong there.
I check the game and discussion threads frequently, often several times a day even if I haven't posted (usually 'cause I'm stalled on some unexpected and computationally intensive development, either something in-game I didn't specifically plan for, or various IRL problems that don't seem significant enough to require an explanation here or apology for delay). I don't check the wiki or google docs nearly as often. Ask your questions here, I will see them and respond.

Actual questions, preferably, rather than lumbering walls of febrile exposition for me to pick through and incrementally realign with my own understanding of the setting. The easiest questions, in general, are points where I've clearly worked out lots of the surrounding details but not yet gotten around to explaining the specific item, since it hasn't been directly relevant, even though you'd probably know in-character. Examples would be the names and tactical roles of the other missing-presumed-dead original-recipe Fire Hawks, and Pickled Locust's official responsibilities in Passholdt's government.

I'd also like people to ask lots of general-knowledge questions about Overmire, before the New Fire Hawks arrive there and start taking in-character action during three days of shore leave. It's a bigger city than Passholdt, further from real-world precedents in both layout and economic basis (which are deeply entwined), and not as thoroughly mapped out or playtested, so if the worldbuilding has soft spots I'd rather they be poked at now, while I've got slack to do damage control without breaking flow, instead of later when the details have immediate tactical relevance.
>>
No. 116665 ID: 3d2d5f

>lots of general-knowledge questions about Overmire
Some of this may veer into things that would require a roll to look up, so don't feel like you have to answer all of these now. I'm just gonna poke at things I feel would probably come up.

What's available for money sinks? (New equipment, opportunities to upgrade or enchant existing gear, magic items, spellcasting or other specialed skilled services, luxuries, etc). Especially ones that are a better deal locally than they might be elsewhere, or flat out aren't unavailable elsewhere.

If we get paid in a bonus immovable rod, how much can we liquidate it for here (where they're made) versus if we held onto it until we got back?

What kind of protections does the merchant company and/or their business partners have in-city, in case someone tries something while we're on furlough?

What's the local population like? For instance, what's the majority race(s) making up the population, and is it different than where we've been? What religions or gods hold significant sway locally?

Are there any social or cultural norms significantly different than what we're used to seeing so far? Racism, sexism, or other -isms against specific groups, people, religions or behaviors for instance. Weird social rituals that could get strangers in trouble for not knowing. Groups with significantly different rights than elsewhere ("all X are property, not people" or "you can't move that sacred cow out of the street!"). Those kinds of things.

What's the local government structured like, below the level of "answers to a dragon at top"? Is the normal behavior or gear of any of our characters illegal here but not elsewhere? Is there extradition or a shared jurisdiction with anywhere any of us are wanted?

Do we have npcs for various social stuff? (Sex, proselytizing, various pursuits of ambitions, sticking body snatching worms into, etc).

Do the prior Fire Hawks have existing contacts, relationships, or business partners we can interact with locally? (Do any of our characters have their own personal connections, or people from their past who have made their way here)?

The city is "built on the immovable rod industry". Over land? Over sea? How high up? How are the logistics of travel / trade with the surface below accomplished? How 'together' is the place (solid floating island? Venice of the sky, with aerial canals between structures)?

More may follow later, I'm hitting post before my phone decides to drop all this text.
>>
No. 116666 ID: d36af7

>>116665
This isn't comprehensive, I'm just hitting the easy parts first.
>money sinks
>npcs for various social stuff
It's a huge diverse city. Lots of people, lots of things to buy.

>What kind of protections does the merchant company and/or their business partners have in-city, in case someone tries something while we're on furlough?
Different guards, local law enforcement, and various interlocking layers of insurance. Fairly standard set of precautions for a docked vessel and adjacent warehouse holding material of moderate strategic significance. Anything goes wrong during those three days, it's not your problem unless you directly started it.

>Are there any social or cultural norms significantly different than what we're used to seeing so far?
>Over land? Over sea? How high up? How are the logistics of travel / trade with the surface below accomplished? How 'together' is the place (solid floating island? Venice of the sky, with aerial canals between structures)?
If you were hoping to have some solid ground under your feet instead of an ever-shifting deck, you might be out of luck. Overmire is, as the name suggests, a city built above a swamp. Not, it must be noted, ON the swamp.

When the city was established, in the early days of the Drakocracy, a certain faction of Green elves found themselves in a position to dictate the terms of certain civic ordinances, and took the opportunity to impose strict ecological and aesthetic standards on all permanent construction within city limits, essentially outlawing any effective commercial development in and around one of the best natural harbors in the known world. Then, as their influence waned, some clever artificer figured out an assembly-line process for producing Immovable Rods, making it possible to establish large load-bearing structures which were nonetheless inarguably temporary, since they could be torn down at the press of a button.

The result was a city as airy, fragile, and amorphous as a puffball fungus. There are no load-bearing walls in Overmire, no shingled roofs. Floors are made of taut canvas, or metal gridwork in the fancier parts of town. Privacy consists of blankets and paper screens, some of them enchanted to radiate silence or darkness.

There are no streets and barely any stairwells, just balance beams, ladders, bucket-chains, and elevators, some more than 200 feet high. Locals scamper around like rats or monkeys through the rigging of a ship. Anything heavy that has to be moved any significant horizontal distance is lowered by block-and-tackle to a raft or barge, poled or towed or rowed to the destination, then hoisted again. Some counterweights are fixed slugs of metal, but more often they're great mud-encrusted amphorae full of potable water going up, or empties and garbage going down.

Docks and industry are closest to the muck, of course, out of practical necessity, but residential areas aren't stratified the way you might think. Beggars, thieves, and common laborers nest in the tangled mid-strata, with tradesmen and bureaucrats above them getting progressively more living space and sight-lines, but in this place where altitude is cheap, the truly rich and powerful demonstrate clout by clearing out vast hemispheres of potential cityscape just so they can have clear air and sunlight in their penthouses near ground level.

>If we get paid in a bonus immovable rod, how much can we liquidate it for here (where they're made) versus if we held onto it until we got back?
Trying to resell a new car right after you drove it off the dealer's lot, eh? Maybe four thousand gold, if you can find a buyer at all in three days. Even if you do, the bosun'll yell at you for bringing along excess weight (unless you somehow spend it on things that weighs less than the rod did, or which obviously make you better at your job) and for being bad at mercantilism.

Anywhere at least a week away from Overmire by conventional travel, with time to collect competing offers and play them off against each other? Probably closer to five thousand. Maybe more, if there's a specific need and you're the only available supplier (meaning at the very least someplace that's not a direct trade partner, like Passholdt is).
>>
No. 116668 ID: 3d2d5f

I am glad to have feather fall and I feel bad for Vos trying to get around already. Sounds like a playground for Ji.

More stuff to consider:

Where's the city's food coming from, and how are they getting it up in the air? What about their fresh water? Those same building codes sound like they might restrict agricultural options.

Any significant imports and exports outside of the raw materials in, immovable rods (and other tools) out we're already familiar with?

How has the city been impacted by that recent civil war, with all the demonology and such?

Any big public entertainment? Organized sports of some kind, colosseum fights, grecian theatre, festivals, executions, debates, etc. What about smaller scale popular entertainment?

What's the climate like? (What season is it)?

Is there a dungeon entrance nearby?

What's the local military like? (The city's layout impacts how it could be defended, and how the forces tasked with that would be built, organized, armed, etc).

Is the criminal underworld into anything outside what we might normally expect?
>>
No. 116669 ID: d36af7

>>116668
>food?
Like almost any major city at a natural confluence of trade routes, food consumption wildly outstrips local supply, so it has to be imported from all over.
>water?
Actually I already mentioned this, albeit indirectly. The titular mire is a big swampy tidal estuary. and salinity is low enough most of the time that it's possible to dunk great big pots into the mud, let water percolate in through semi-permeable unglazed ceramic, then lift them back up hours or days later full of potable water. Has to be made from the right kind of clay, though, or the pots just melt.

>how are they getting it up in the air?
Certain amount of magic, certain amount of animal labor or wind power, but that's for big urgent stuff. Much of the routine small-batch lifting takes advantage of pulleys with suitable mechanical advantage and the social convention that ladders are one-way, up only. Anybody climbing down a ladder for any reason much less urgent than fleeing a burning building is being super rude and wasteful. Instead, people descend by grabbing ropes or bucket-chains or piling into elevators, acting as living counterweights to hoist supplies.
>>
No. 116670 ID: af6e04

>I feel bad for Vos trying to get around already.
He'll make a good counterweight at least

I guess it's relevant to ask then. Is Vos strong enough to pull himself up a ladder or rope with all that extra weight and only the use of his arms?
>>
No. 116672 ID: d36af7

>>116670
His flipper-spikes and tail can also aid in climbing.
>>
No. 116673 ID: d5ff27

Are there railings to keep people safe?

Did cap get a mutation that turned his hand into a fleshy club?

Do the buttons in question have protection so that terrorism is less convenient?

How would climbing a ladder be faster than sliding down a pole or using a rope? Are there protection for younger kids or the handicapped who would have more difficulties?

Is there just like a solid floor of immovable rods? It sounds like there's flotation devices used. Is gas involved?

Are most buildings made of wood? Does that make protections against fires or war adding difficult because they can't utilize a lot of denser materials that are the typical industry standard?

Also if there's no streets, is it like mostly a vertical structure like an apartment complex? How do you move laterally?

How does the city prepare for storms?

Why doesn't anyone overturn the old ordinances and just make the ground available?

More to come as I think of more
>>
No. 116677 ID: d36af7

>>116673
>Do the buttons in question have protection so that terrorism is less convenient?
Structurally significant rods get enclosed in load-bearing material to the point that opening it up for deactivation would be no easier than tearing the structure apart conventionally.
>Is there just like a solid floor of immovable rods?
Not unless somebody incredibly rich needs a floor that can support hundreds of pounds per square inch.
>It sounds like there's flotation devices used. Is gas involved?
No. The 'floatation devices' are immovable rods. They float in the sense that, when active, they fail to fall, even under significant loads. Buildings hang from them. Picture a hot-air balloon with an iron girder in place of the actual balloon, or a tent with very short poles that don't need to touch the ground.

>How would climbing a ladder be faster than sliding down a pole or using a rope?
Climbing down a ladder or sliding down a fireman's pole would be equally antisocial because in either case you're letting the gravitational potential energy of your body and immediate possessions go to waste, instead of putting it to use lifting something else. Doing so efficiently often involves waiting around in elevators until enough other people (or outgoing mail, garbage, etc.) accumulates to counterbalance the next major thing-to-be-lifted.
>>
No. 116679 ID: d36af7

>>116673
>How does the city prepare for storms?
"One of the best natural harbors in the known world" includes the fact that they don't get a lot of spontaneous inclement weather. Immovable-rod-based construction is naturally resistant to damage from high winds, immune to all but the most extreme flooding, and need not present any conductive path for lightning. Most of all, magical weather control to negate such problems before they begin.

>Why doesn't anyone overturn the old ordinances and just make the ground available?
Several reasons. It's a swamp, so the ground isn't exactly ideal for conventional construction anyway. Permanent buildings aren't outright prohibited, just heavily restricted, so somebody who really needs a solid stone foundation inside city limits (for whatever reason) occasionally manages to jump through all the hoops of licensing-and-permit hell to make it happen; anyone who gives up partway through presumably found an easier alternative. Reactionary Green elves don't have as much political pull anymore, but blocking change is a lot easier than initiating it. A lot of them are also druids of high enough level to do proper miles-wide weather control spells, so if they decided peaceful engagement with government policy wasn't going to get them what they wanted, things might get fairly ugly even if it was just a matter of withdrawing protection (see above). And, in a classic baptists-and-bootleggers alliance, the current construction paradigm creates steady demand for immovable rods, a situation which the rod manufacturing syndicate is in no hurry to disrupt.
>>
No. 116683 ID: 756753

I want to rephrase one of my question; I know you talked about lateral movement, but that seems awful inconvenient for large volumes of traffic, which a city certainly has. Unless the city is mostly vertical, meaning the large traffic routes are up and down rather than side to side, it seems implausible that there are all these flimsy sounding rigging could hold up under major foot traffic. Any time there's a big event, like a siege or a festival that would surely overload those kinds of paths, right? Or am I missing some details here?

I also didn't realize that structures were usually hung from rods rather than place onto them. If that's the case, how do they prevent structures from collapsing under their own weight, buckling in the middle or just pulling loose at the stress points, etc. In the same way you can't hold a cup by the lid or it'll buckle and fall, that must represent serious architectural problems.

It also sounds awful inconvenient for tradepeople and merchants. Any dense tools or large shipments of goods must be a pain to store.

Also, it sounds like people lived there before elves put up laws. If a mire sucks to build on, what were/are the factors make it a good harbor? You mentioned weather, I also assume shape of the land. Anything else?
>>
No. 116688 ID: 3abd97

>Well, that's a typical arrangement rather than an absolute metaphysical necessity, and Rhea has an unusually good position from which to negotiate. What are you looking for?
>Though pathfinder has a much bigger spell list so I can see how it would be easier to get lost in the possibilities.
I think I can work around the problem of scope by paring that list down into a smaller and more manageable list-of-things-I-might-actually-use. (If I felt a spell was non-thematic, or something that messed with numbers in the background instead of actually doing something, it went in the trash pile).
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HMaPwOtpj9Ohq_F0p_mIMcBZKbYp7GlARuG2xupq1pY/edit?usp=sharing

The other thing I'd like to do is not stick rigidly to what the sourcebook domains give you. Fire and Community make sense thematically, but there's a few things I might want to swap out. (Which mechanically I suppose is equivalent to using custom subdomains?).

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo-domains/community-domain/
-Calming Touch and Bless look good.
-I don't understand what Unity would even do in our game, but that can probably be addressed or swapped out much later.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/domains/paizo-domains/fire-domain/
-Rhea already has fire resistance. Swap that out for some kind of diplomatic power, maybe? Perhaps expand the scope of the protections offered by marking something as official diplomatic correspondence.
-I'm having a hard time comparing Fire Bolt to what Rhea can already do by applying her ability to her mutation. Is this an improvement?
-Burning Hands is unambiguously AOE, while wisps aren't, so I think I'm good with that.

The other thing I'm a little disappointed at are the options I'm seeing for mundane utility. The origami spell is great fun for finding different ways to apply it, and I'm wishing for something similar.
>>
No. 116692 ID: d36af7

>>116688
>what Unity would even do in our game
Sounds clear enough to me. Instead of being just a roving ambassador, at that point she becomes a mobile embassy, capable of routinely (though perhaps less reliably) extending protection to others. Need to get formal recognition from appropriate elemental courts before protection applies to much other than fire, though.
>Abstemiousness
Same basic effect as Yisheng Ji's "plums ripen into peaches" spell, but for Rhea it works on starchy stuff and baked goods instead of fruit. Bread or cake that's been sitting out for months might still be salable as 'day-old,' on top of enhanced nutrition and deliciousness. Her ambition as a pastry chef is to make stuff at least that good without magic.
>Air Bubble counters super drowning skills
To an extent, yes, but having those flame-wisps submerged in water is also bad. On top of the short duration, it's got the same limitation as Condense Water: can't create pure elemental substances out of nothing before 3rd circle. Deoxygenated water yields a bubble of equally unbreathable air, and hard vacuum won't even give you that much. Works fine in the 'death zone' at the tops of the tallest mountains, though, and if you're in a sealed room that some jerk is pumping all the air out of, you could use it to stall (but not reverse) that process.

>Rhea already has fire resistance. Swap that out for some kind of diplomatic power, maybe?
She had it back at first level, AS a diplomatic power. It's a direct reflection of her mom's authority and influence over elemental fire. In GURPS, fire resistance 5 is the same level of functional immunity that fire-breathing dragons and inferno-dwelling imps get, because in that system, being engulfed head-to-toe in ordinary fire deals 1d6-1 damage per second, so reducing that by five means it can be safely ignored. More than five fire damage in one hit can happen from the initial splash of a molotov cocktail or flamethrower, but even then reducing the damage by five would be a noticeable improvement. Damage spillover could be considered equivalent to someone overstepping the bounds of legitimate behavior in a moment of excessive zeal, mistaken identity, or blatantly misbehaving diplomats being temporarily held until their credentials can be verified. Beyond that, you're talking about things like getting dunked in molten rock or metal, or hit with ultra-tech energy weapons, or serious battle magic, all of which seem like the kinds of things Rhea's diplomatic immunity might not be a perfect solution to, at least not until she's gained a few more levels.

>Clarion Call
Yes, this is good. http://www.casualvillain.com/Unsounded/comic/ch04/ch04_63.html

>Blessed Fist
>Magic Stone
I think you might be undervaluing these. It's not just a broad, vague, hard-to-explain +1; they both take an otherwise suboptimal but technically valid weapon and upgrade it to a credible threat, including the ability to bypass some DR which low-level or poorly-equipped characters might otherwise have trouble with. Pick up a piece of pea gravel, make it glow, flick it at somebody so it hits as hard as a swung baseball bat... that's not "nothing."
>mundane utility
Grease? Detect Secret Ingredients (including live plants or fungi with potential culinary applications, and any poison with a distinctive taste)? Transmute Wood to Charcoal? What sorts of effects are you looking for, or what sorts of problems are you looking to solve?
>>
No. 116698 ID: 3abd97

>fire resistance
I'm not sure if you're making the case that I don't need more protection because it's only corner or extreme cases that get past it now and what I have will grow, or that more rF is good because it will be Rhea's own power and will eventually outstrip what mom's authority offers her. If you mean the latter, I can roll with that.

>undervaluing
I also sort of assumed those would require being good at throwing a punch, or hitting things with a thrown object, to really take advantage of. I'll consider them, though.

>comparing Fire Bolt to what Rhea can already do by applying her ability to her mutation
Any input there? I'm happy to throw fire around, if it's an improvement on her capabilities.

>What sorts of effects are you looking for, or what sorts of problems are you looking to solve?
Actually I think the second bit is sort of it- every cantrip I currently have that seems worth using is specialized to solve a specific problem, or a narrow band of problems. None of them are really things you can turn to multiple applications with a little creativity.

Grease is probably a good example of the kind of thing I'm looking for, in that it's versatile enough to solve a lot of different problems. I'm less sure it's what I would want for this character, though.

Basically, I'm wondering if you have any other not-Prestidigitation effects to play with. (I'm somewhat of the opinion that boundary conditions foster creativity to an extent? Give me the origami spell, I look for ways to make it useful. Give me straight-up Prestidigitation, and I'd likely ignore it not knowing what to do with something that broad). I mean, if you have a class of spell you can use at any time, you might as well have one you can invoke in multiple situations.
>>
No. 116699 ID: 3abd97

>>116683
This does bring to mind one problem that occurred to me. Industry that depends on working metal, and cooking. Forges and fireplaces are heavy, and with lots of canvas and paper construction, the place strikes me as pretty flammable. People preparing hot meals for themselves on a regular basis might need to be addressed.

Not that there aren't magical and/or engineering workarounds for those problems.
>>
No. 116717 ID: d36af7

>>116699
Iron gridwork floors can support reasonably heavy loads, and won't burn.

It'd be simple enough to design a stove or oven or kiln that dangles from an immovable rod like a campfire cook-pot on a tripod. Set it up with an air gap all around, over an empty elevator shaft. When a fire gets out of control, just reach over with a pole to push the button and it plummets into the swamp. Whole building catches? Same response but more so.

Or you could go with the more elegant solution, enchanted cook-pots which need no fuel and only get hot on the inside.

An anvil could be essentially some odd-shaped extra bits grafted on to an immovable rod, with the button underneath.

Those who seek to discourage gunpowder development might well consider overall urban flammability a feature rather than a bug.
>>
No. 116740 ID: 094652

>>116717
Just to clarify, is the first week of studying over, or do we still have an extra day to finish up?
>>
No. 116747 ID: fc3fc0

apparent Kent is not the best person for financial advise
>>
No. 116748 ID: 3d2d5f

>>116747
I'm just glad that roll wasn't for tinkering with the sunterrene.
>>
No. 116749 ID: fc3fc0

>>116748
Not that time! I'm certain Kent and I are both going to enjoy making a number of poor rolls as they try to figure out the ins and outs of everything.
>>
No. 116757 ID: 3abd97
File 150827957828.jpg - (529.40KB , 886x896 , Team Magic Sword 02.jpg )
116757

>you could even get standardized insignia and decorations
I doodled up an icon for Team Magic Sword (probably more formally something like The Order of the Holy Sword and Medical Reclamation, in-universe).

A drama / comedy mask bisected by the eponymous magic sword, wrapped in a serpent. I'd think the sword / serpent should be wreathed in a corona of fire, but shapes that look like flames are beyond my lineart skills.

The mask invokes our faceless leader and his divided nature, as well as the union of opposing celestial forces backing the mission. The central serpent-wrapped sword invokes the driving forces of the mission- the sword both divine threat and reward, the serpent an allusion to the staff of Asclepius and our mission to reclaim a hospital, or perhaps the serpent and dangerous knowledge (invokes Mode and Kent), or just the devil intertwined with the divine. Flame also invokes Rhea / Firemom, and Azure.

Hmm. Occurs to me a little late, maybe I could have put an open road directly below the mask to invoke Hanspur too. (Or had the snake tail widen and transition into a road beneath the mask, instead of tapering away to a point). Although I suppose a empty mask invokes our animate suit or armor as well as our face-stealing demon.
>>
No. 116778 ID: fc3fc0

>>116757
Looks pretty radical! I like the way you use symbolism to incorporate the different archetypes and themes of the group!

>>116740
I think the week is over, but I'm also still under the impression there's no such thing as a take 10 mechanic in this setting- you keep saying you're "taking ten" but I'm pretty sure Jamesleng has emphasized that anything you think is non-trivial needs a roll, and I believe appraisals and checking motives are traditionally non-trivial actions. Honestly I think you're just gimping yourself by not rolling because it means you have little to no chance of being successful, even in areas where you have relevant skills and experience that could offset a bad roll. I'd suggest that you stop trying to take ten and follow the outlined rules, unless you can establish a different president beforehand.

Speaking of, JamesLeng, can you approve/deny Isaiah taking the extra revelations feat and getting the water sight revelation?
>>
No. 116780 ID: af6e04

>Has Nistamatsin studied or practiced carpentry, metallurgy, herb-lore, any sort of craft and trade skills like that?
I realize now that I didn't actually answer this question. I think herb-lore would make sense, with a special focus on mundane warding methods.

>>116757
This is great! Nin approved

>>116778
>It's actually more like taking six, in D&D terms, or fourteen where low rolls are better.
JamesLeng said that in the last dis thread, so there is a 'default' mechanic. Not ideal, but I guess it's there if you really hate crit failures.

So we're on the same page, you guys should know that every character I make is going to be big on party cohesion. A cohesive group is just more fun to play with. Nin's old bindings placed a focus on family loyalty, which has persisted and could definitely reshape itself to encompass his fellow PCs.
>>
No. 116781 ID: fc3fc0

>>116780
Whoops! Sorry Kome, thats my bad.

>character cohesion
Thats a good philosophy to go off of! I'm struck by so many character ideas I've had to make a notes sheet

I've publicly talked about Tellus Matrem, the Honeyed Courier before, and Bulgruf Many-Woman, lightning caller, but I also have on my list:

Karrod, a Minotaur with a devotion to war, and a passion for the tools of the trade

Salt, Alphious's demonic sister turned ranger, on the hunt for thrills and challenges in the human world

Pip the white elf who's convinced he's a lizard, a cavalier mercenary with an enthusiasm for reptiles

Cathos, Green elf who feels a compulsion to preen, and uses his silver tongue to collect magical artifacts and oddities from around the world

and finally for now Little Jenny, also known as "The Red Hood", a telepathic athlete who was a prodigal merfolk Smash player a blood-sport I came up with for her character, turned adventurer after she had to undergo some extensive surgery.

After Riv, I made an effort to ensure all my characters A) would have a motivation to go adventuring, and B) be a little better suited to team gameplay. Karrod would be interested in dungeon gameplay, and have crafting capabilities, so thats useful. Similar to Tunic's character in the first thread, although with more of a lawful evil vibe. Cathos would also probably follow a similar moral path, but he, Salt, and Little Jenny would also enjoy dungeon crawling. Telepathy would have been damn useful at many points in our campaign thus far, no doubt it'd be helpful in the future as well. Pip would probably go down the cavalier tree, which is sort of a support warrior class, providing bonuses to allies who can see them and stuff; think bard/paladin, but without magic or healing. Cavalier here would represent both personality and class focus, so he would hopeful bring some lightheartedness and support his allies, much like Vos. Do you guys have any character ideas in the bag? I've no doubt Kome has some in depth stories and mechanics rattling around somewhere, but I don't know if you and Magey have anything waiting for a good opportunity to be revealed
>>
No. 116783 ID: 3abd97

>I've publicly talked about Tellus Matrem, the Honeyed Courier before
By the way, did you happen to notice when...

>>/quest/827743
>A mound-builder (olive-brown skin except for bright pink tattoos coiled around the forearms, distinctive red porcelain mask and yellow-and-green leather satchel, both proprietary marks of the Courier's Guild, travel-stained clothes, smells vaguely of honey) steps out of the woodshed and shouts:

>a prodigal merfolk Smash player
I'm willfully assuming either alternate-universe Blitzball or Smash Brothers. Either would be hilarious.


>Do you guys have any character ideas in the bag?
Fewer in any state of completion. My process for this game has largely been starting with an idea or few for the initial "seed" and then lots of experimental (and oft revised) attempts to flesh out from there. Big stuff like personality or character can evolve fairly late in the process.

Dav was partially inspired by a quest idea Idiom didn't end up using (something something lesbian fencer versus all of hell) and a ridiculous DCSS character I once had (who, among other things, had a lucky randart combination that allowed at-will semi-controlled blinking on a heavy armor dex fighter https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4144 ). The initial seed was an attempt to make someone more combat oriented than Marijke, not a mage, and not the diplomat. (Which of course is all rather amusing now). Also to use a parasite, since no one else had picked one.

Rhea's seed was someone who originated below ground, would have an easier time talking to things other than her own party, and to try to use some of the less-popular items on the starting list (which didn't survive the ambitions flip and second draft).

For unused ideas, I considered a white elf probably soldier formerly (or less formally) from one of those 4-man special ops teams that are supposed to be wandering out. Never made it far past initial concept, though there were several drafts of different traits on top of that.

Possibly overlapping with that idea, I'd also considered some kind of espionage specialist.

For one somewhat close to competition I have a huldra lawyer. https://pastebin.com/dWCHsmcc Although she'd probably go back down the pit of revision and rewrites before getting finished. The initial seed for was the spider-power and townie/books/drugs. She ends up overlapping other roles too much, and the power doesn't quite fit the rest of her anymore.


Really though, I haven't put a lot of thought into this subject recently. The character creation process for this game is fun, but I don't want more people than I already have going for now.
>>
No. 116785 ID: d36af7

>huldra lawyer
Alright, for the innate power you get two forms: tiny little infiltration spider, and monstrous spider-hybrid form, which is very intimidating to look at but not actually any more effective in a fight, since regular huldra form has more raw strength. Both spidery forms can spin webs, but not at combat speeds, and doing so requires a proportionate amount of protein. Can't inject any sort of poison or digestive acid, at least not yet, which is a problem because
>vulnerability deliberately left blank
She's an obligate carnivore. Specifically, can only eat meat which has been cooked down to mush or otherwise thoroughly processed. It's possible to get by for a while on things like pemmican, eggs, and/or certain types of cheese, but health consequences could be usefully compared to a coffee and ramen noodle diet.

As a further complication, she is supernaturally unable to steal, or even scrounge. Before she can carry or use any item, it has to be formally transferred to her possession via either sale (with a written contract or at least a receipt), or as a free and un-coerced gift. If some acquisition would violate this rule, her hands can't grip it, or it bounces away, or some other blatantly supernatural phenomenon thwarts the attempt. Various convoluted loans, leases, or holding-in-trust arrangements are also possible, with their exact terms subject to the same supernatural enforcement, at least with regard to her loss of the item in question. Trivial workarounds, like having someone steal something on her behalf, fail the same way. Whoever she's buying from has to first clearly establish their ownership of the thing being sold.

Fortunately, becoming entangled with a snare she set can count as 'gifting' her your flesh, even if you're a nonsapient animal who stumbled in by mistake. Without that loophole, survival in the wilderness would be nigh impossible. Even with it, questions of how to obtain basic things like fuel for a campfire, or water, are non-trivial.

>>116778
>no take ten
Some actions are trivial, and Azure's background does suggest knowing a fair amount about mercantile stuff, so she can do some ballpark-estimate math without needing to roll for it.
>gimping yourself by not rolling
This part is accurate.
>Isaiah taking the extra revelations feat and getting the water sight revelation
That's fine, yes. Seems very appropriate.
>>116780
>if you really hate crit failures
Walking into a bad situation all spaced out like you're half-asleep does not provide immunity to horrible mishaps. When you're trying to, say, dodge something heavy and sharp, ordinary failure is bad enough.

In GURPS, an average person, aware of the threat and mobile but not completely focused on defense (perhaps because they're also trying to proactively participate in an ongoing fight), needs to roll an 8 or less on 3d6 to dodge. Further bonuses are available, but you'd have to stack up a lot of those in order to succeed on a roll of 14. Various penalties can also apply for things like encumbrance, less than ideal visibility (flickering torchlight is -3 unless you've got some sort of vision advantage to offset it), bad footing, deceptive attack techniques from a skilled opponent...
>>
No. 116789 ID: d22dc0

>>116783

>A reference to Tellus
No, I actually completely missed that! I was skimming over a lot of the stuff I missed when I was out for a bit and I guess I just read right over it without realizing! That's awesome though- thank you for pointing it out to me, and thank you JamesLeng for putting some of my ideas into the campaign!

>either alternate-universe Blitzball or Smash Brothers
Both actually. The character is obviously somewhat inspired by FFX - star player in a violent underwater sport, forced to leave home to go on an adventure in a new world, etc. The game evolved from thinking about how to implement that idea, and make a character who was a professional player for some sort of water based sport. The game itself is probably more similar to quidditch than blitzball, but the name is an excuse to say my character is a pro-smash player, because that idea made me laugh much more than is probably reasonable. The in-world excuse for the name comes from a snitch-esque mechanic where one can smash the "ball" to immediately end the game. Haven't fully fleshed out the details, but I don't have much real life experience with sports so mostly bs anyways. Then again, it's an underwater blood-sport meant to entertain a community of telepathic merfolk, so I'm not THAT concerned with how feasible it is in relation to normal sports.
>>
No. 116792 ID: d22dc0

>>116785
>needs to roll an 8 or less on 3d6 to dodge

Wow. Thats actually pretty tough, I might have think about making Maru more defensive. Never quite enough feats to go around, huh? At least it makes me feel like her fears relating to the dungeon and traps and such are more justified and less of her/me being paranoid about dying around every corner.
>>
No. 116796 ID: d36af7

>>116792
Well, keep in mind that's an average human. Attributes at 10, no advantages. Combat Reflexes gives +1 to all active defenses (among other things) and someone with, say, Dex 12, Health 12 would get another +1 to base dodge from that (in addition to better initiative and movement speeds and higher defaults on physical skills). Retreating a step gives +3, acrobatic hijinx can give +2 (or -2 if you screw it up), focusing completely on defense instead of attacking can give +4, and all that stacks.
Or, if you've got a ready weapon you know how to use, you can parry. Weapon skill doesn't improve parry active defenses as fast as it improves attacks, but if you've got, say, Two-Handed Axe/Mace at skill 12 (a good reference point for "average competent professional"), you can parry on a 9 or less - 10 or less with the Combat Reflexes advantage. Retreat bonus is only +1, but on the other hand, encumbrance and footwork don't matter. You can parry just fine wearing sixty pounds of armor, or sunk up to your knees in concrete. Only tricky part there is, swinging an axe to attack somebody means it's out of guard position, so you can't really use it to parry until you bring it back up.

Critical success on the attack means the defender doesn't get any active defenses, though, and usually in GURPS one good hit effectively puts somebody out of the fight even if they're still at positive HP, thanks to the stun and knockdown associated with major wounds. Rather than thinking in terms of maximizing active defenses to prolong a toe-to-toe fight, it might be more useful to figure out how to get that decisive hit in before the other guy does, or how to identify and avoid fights you can't win, or don't need to be involved with.
>>
No. 116797 ID: af6e04

>>116796
>usually in GURPS one good hit effectively puts somebody out of the fight
Since we're on the subject, I think you've said before that you use the higher of the two hitpoint values between GURPS and Pathfinder. Would that mean that a single hit stops being much of a concern past a certain level? In GURPS, hitpoints seem to directly represent physical damage to the character, whereas in Pathfinder it seems to be some sort of abstraction based on the character's combat sense and ability to mitigate damage. How do you fit that together? How would the rogue's sneak attack ability be handled in GURPS?

Main reason I'm asking is cause I've always been kind of annoyed with how you can't really pull any meaning from D&D's hitpoints system. If somebody's taken 50 damage it's hard to describe what that represents in actual terms.
>>
No. 116799 ID: d36af7

>>116797
Bit of inspiration from the World Tree RPG on that point, actually. Physical damage is constant, but high-HP characters with what would realistically be low-HP bodies are making up the difference spiritually. Some 20th level demigod might have a barbed arrow through the heart and a caved-in skull but fight on like it's nothing (though they would be a bit loopy from the brain damage) because their soul clings to their body with such ferocious intensity. When the spirit is willing enough, it doesn't matter as much that the flesh is weak.

>sneak attack
Physiology knowledge to identify vitals and other significant hit locations on various creatures, weapon skill and specialized techniques to put the blade in just the right spot. Element of surprise or flanking doesn't provide a direct bonus to hit, but you can spend a few seconds aiming for +3, make a telegraphic attack for +4 (giving the target +2 to active defenses, but they don't even get to roll against an attack they can't see coming), and neglect your own defenses for another +4. That offsets the called shot penalty. Different targets can have a variety of effects, stuff like 3x damage for chest vitals or slipping through the gaps between plates of rigid armor.
>>
No. 116801 ID: c5c6dc

>>116796
Yeah, it definitely makes sense, I was just thinking about the dungeon setting where it's low lighting, cramped or dangerous surroundings, who knows what underfoot, etc, and trying to navigate that resulting in a lot of penalties. Then again, the dungeon isn't meant to be a welcoming place.

>what do hitpoints mean?

For me, instead of having a constant across everyone, where six points of damage is enough to do exactly X, I usually do percentages. This works for me because I have a lot less of a focus on enconomy and simulating physics, because while I'd like to emulate real world situations, I simply don't have the knowledge, and it often slows things down when playing in person. So it's easy for me to have taking 2 damage and 20 damage both result in the same kind of injury for two different characters, based on experience, with the rational being that most of my players receive supernatural boons or become more than ordinary in some way, and these extraordinary people are able to midigate etraordinary amounts of damage. A trained warrior can take 20 damage because they know how to deflect blows and handle combat, so that 20 isn't anywhere near lethal for them. A sorcerer has magic running through their veins, and has a supernatural ability to take punishment compared to your average joe, etc.

I also sometimes implement a real hit points vs extra hitpoints, where certain attacks like sneak attacks can bypass some of those fake hitpoints and actually penantly damage your body, resulting in a loss of abilities and stats, with massive damage or prolonged fights that burn down your extra hit points and damage your real ones.

Basically, for me, with enough training, experience, and specialness, 20 damage doesn't hurt a higher level character the same way it would hurt a low level character, simply because they're better, stronger, faster, etc.
>>
No. 116810 ID: 3abd97

>>116785
Pffffff. That's a hideously entertainingly vulnerability. And it does manage to tie into both the ability and the book.

A larger-but-non-warform form was not a variant I had considered. Changes role to transportation, intimidation, trap manufacture (assuming sufficient protein).

>health consequences could be usefully compared to a coffee and ramen noodle diet
Well, law student, so apt.

And a casual diet of sucking eggs or a meat smoothie washed down with coffee to the disgust and disquiet of others is just the right degree of off-putting.

>supernaturally unable to steal, or even scrounge
I almost think she might be better off in a(n officially designated) dungeon than an ordinary wilderness- you'd think some kind of salvage law would apply to goods recovered in such locations, especially if you're employed by a company explicitly there for that purpose.

I think I might prefer it being a crippling obsessive compulsion to supernatural geas.


In any event, still unlikely to do anything with her soon.
>>
No. 116812 ID: fc3fc0

On the note of character ideas, are there any monstrously large frogs in this setting? Got an idea for a wizard who's a frog that was given sentience via the animal awakening spell
>>
No. 116814 ID: af6e04

>>116799
>When the spirit is willing enough, it doesn't matter as much that the flesh is weak.
That's a good take on it, I think.

>taking 2 damage and 20 damage both result in the same kind of injury for two different characters
That seems to be the most common consensus. The only problem is that a cure light wounds spell can restore a nearly dead commoner to full health but on a powerful adventurer it hardly provides any significant healing at all. If 2 damage and 20 damage can represent the same injury then shouldn't the spell heal both the same?

>character concepts
I still have Euler the clockwork enforcer, think I posted a full character sheet for it back in the last dis thread. I've also been tossing around ideas for another character without the innate power. Sort of a 'gentleman thief' archetype. Haven't gotten much further than that though, mainly because...

>The character creation process for this game is fun, but I don't want more people than I already have going for now.
>>
No. 116815 ID: d36af7

>>116810
>better off in an officially designated dungeon
Yep! Just tuck a formal Letter of Marque in there among the notes, designating the Church of Orcus as hostis humani generis and empowering the bearer to seize their worldly goods on the behalf of some distant patron.
>I think I might prefer it being a crippling obsessive compulsion to supernatural geas.
The geas version makes it easier for me to snag with plot hooks, and explores the consequences of 'rightful ownership' being a property of things which can be tested objectively.
>>116812
>are there any monstrously large frogs in this setting?
Yes, particularly associated with Tsathoggua. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/aberrations/froghemoth/
>>
No. 116819 ID: d22dc0

I also agree that 3 characters is plenty enough- I just really enjoy making them personally.

>why doesn’t healing work the same if damage is equivalent?

Think of it like pro boxing. A beginner is going to go down a lot faster, and their recovery time is going to be much quicker, because they only have to recover from one injury despite it nocking them out of the fight. An experienced professional can maximize the beating they take and keep fighting, but even though they’re not knocked out of the fight, they’ve got a lot more their body needs to catch up. They’ve trained themselves to maximize their body’s stamina and fortitude, which is how I think about it. 6 points of damage is enough to mock me on my ass, but not someone like Rocky Balboa- we both still need to recover from 6 points of damage though.

So this medical examiner seems like a bad idea- maybe we can get the ship quarantined and then have the goods be examined and played as they’re unloaded? Ji’s hitch-hiking friend could be an issue though, especially if they go “hey what’s this” break client patient confidentiality, make the assumption that it’s an Exton parasite, etc.
>>
No. 116820 ID: d36af7

>>116819
>healing
Problem is, that's not how it works for natural healing in Pathfinder or in GURPS. (I'm not factoring in Exalted because health levels aren't subject to the same level of inflation: Bob the Peasant has seven, someone like the Scarlet Empress has less than twenty when she's easily top ten for most powerful humans ever to have lived, and even Qaf, one of the titans who forged the world, a literal mountain with no base and no summit, only has a hundred health levels.) A first level fighter might have 10 hp and recover 1 hp from a good night's sleep. A tenth level fighter might have 100 hp and recover 10 hp from a good night's sleep. Hit both of them with a maximized magic missile, exactly 5 damage. First is going to need multiple days and maybe some attention from a doctor to get back to 100%; tenth sleeps it off no problem. But if you use spells, it's going to take the same amount of magical energy to undo the wound for both. A 1d8+1 Least True Healing is worth between two and nine days of natural healing for the first, but less than one day for the tenth.
>>
No. 116821 ID: 3d2d5f

>maybe we can get the ship quarantined and then have the goods be examined and played as they’re unloaded?
Quarantine is a pretty hard non-starter. There's no way the merchants reach their deadline if they accept it, and if our crew ditches them that's a time consuming breach of contract. Submitting is giving up and means we've wasted a bunch of time and effort not to get paid and ruin our reputation.

Fighting out is also not viable. We pretty much need a diplomatic solution, or possibly to subvert the inspection in some way. (Which is why my first idea was to give them our doctor's testimony and show off our countermeasures to try and demonstrate we're clean).

>bodyguard's various contraband possessions, Decaro Vos's babies, Yisheng Ji's "patient," or Davina and Viste's inability to stand next to each other
I'm most surprised that carrying giant be larva would be a problem. Sure, it's not the typical container, but they're a domesticated animals (well, maybe not the babies in particular, but in general).

>appropriating a crit fail to hold a petulant and hypocritical grudge against someone we're being paid to protect
>one of the people who would have no problem passing an exam immediately and strongly opposed
*Sigh* I swear, Maru is rapidly approaching Riv levels of "would you stop undermining me at every turn before I strangle you".

Although I'm kinda surprised I didn't get slapped or something for a failed pass at a catgirl. Did that not require a roll or something?
>>
No. 116826 ID: fc3fc0

>>116821
I mean I hope it makes sense in character why she'd be upset- I tried to make it clear this was tied to her past, and we've all agreed that character authenticity is important. I feel like people get frustrated with me for the way I play her but I don't know what I should do differently, yanno? She's not actively trying to obstruct anyone or anything. The 4 big incidents have been

1) Trying to punch Ji. Came from a place to good will, but Ji still holds a grudge against her even now despite her attempts to make up with him

2) Feeling like her "family" she had built was spitting on everything important to her and sending one of their closest friends to his death because it might bring them profit. Talked about how the money outweighs the risks, which she sort of gets now, and the amended that bridge, despite her still being uneasy

3) Wanting to kill cap, after he attacked, stole from, insulted, and belittled her. Her father being a particularly taboo and sore subject, combined with all the other motivating factors, is a good reason for her to be upset. This is still unresolved, and I don't know how anyone can fault her here. The main motivators for carrying cap are protection from the sorceress, who we've at multiple points been afraid would attack us, so nothing valuable there, especially when we weren't struggling to protect the ship anyway, and then a magic strap on for Davina. As a character, Maru thinks it's fucking bullshit that once again, people and feelings are being place as the second horse to material gain- especially now that it's intensely personal and specific for Davina only. As a player, I don't understand why everything Maru does is taken as a personal offence; it seems like she's better at offending people when she tries to show concern, as opposed to any of her other characteristics.

4) Maru opposing to being medically examined. While it's hardly a fair comparison since tunic isn't here controlling him right now, Ji harboring a parasite is a direct problem here, and that's motivated personally, so I don't see why Davina would be upset only at Maru. No one was mad when Vos basically said "I'm going into Ecton, you can come with if you want."

I don't know what I can do differently, but it feels like everything I do with Maru, intentions aside, are taken as subverting orders or being obstinate for the sake of being obstinate, and I don't know how to make her motivations anymore clear. If this is really making it less fun for everyone though I can go with my original plan from after Ecton, and have her turn in her badge and leave the force. Obviously I wouldn't stop playing as a whole, but it seems like Maru's value system clashes with everyone and I'd rather retire her than just like erase what's important to her as a character; it seems like she's just causing problems for everyone, and my workarounds aren't working around, yanno?
>>
No. 116828 ID: d36af7

>>116826
>turn in her badge
Have you considered the possibility of doing the exact opposite of that? Thanks to that Lengese ruby, and her equal contribution to turning in somebody else's badge, Maru arguably owns more shares in the Fire Hawks Company than anyone else alive (with the possible exception of Helen Nabot, who's in no position to object at the moment). http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2001-02-17

You've also got the out-of-character option of calling in the favors associated with that recent patronage for a new cataclysm, or maybe even something of equivalent power but tidier.

>>116821
>Quarantine is a pretty hard non-starter. There's no way the merchants reach their deadline if they accept it,
The deadline isn't quite as much of a problem as it might be. If the manufacturing syndicate complains about their tungsten being late, the shipping company can deflect blame onto Overmire's own public health authorities and navy for not allowing obviously non-infectious and strategically vital metal ingots through the quarantine early. Shipping company's main objection might be that they'd still be paying you greedy mercenaries by the day during that time.
>>
No. 116833 ID: d22dc0

>>116828
>Maru owns more shares

If character authenticity is the major factor here, which I’d like to believe it is, Maru wouldn’t try to subvert everyone like that. She’s obviously feeling hurt and upset, but she wouldn't try to leverage a gift given in good faith. Vengeful, not petty kind of deal. She’s also not interested in administrative work, and if she’s upset with people I don’t think it would make sense for her to try to go from coworker to boss. She doesn’t feel anyone in the company has wronged her like, say, cap has, she just feels as though Davina has been callous and unconcerned with what happens to her, compared to Maru’s normal state of high emotions and volatile more-bark-than-bite reactions. It’s not even that she’s not being listened to or engaged or anything like that, it’s just that her goals and ambitions currently run contrary to what davina wants, and since she can’t get her way she’s thinking about leaving to go pursue her vengeance without roping anyone else into it. Basically “what’s important to me isn’t important to you, and what I want isn’t what you want, so I’m gonna I leave and prepare myself somehow to kill Cap and the rest of you can go jump down as many trap filled pits as you want for all I care.”
>>
No. 116837 ID: 3abd97

>>116826
I think you fundamentally misunderstand my frustration.

I'm not saying Maru doesn't have reasons for what she does, I'm saying I'm frustrated that the opportunities she seems to take to express her deeply held personal beliefs are frequently in opposition to another PC trying to do something. A strong "don't do that" or "I won't let you do that" or "I don't care if I mess up what you're trying to do" position is kind of hard to work with!

This is especially frustrating as I don't feel I have an in-character means of conflict resolution with Maru. If I need to reach a compromise with Vos, I can talk it out in terms of friendship and what's right. With Ji, professionalism and utility. With Hore... well it's hard to put in words, but there's a certain kind of emotional appeal that seems to work. With Dav, I expect people to appeal to what she's trying to achieve, or established relationships, or her pride / personal exceptionalism (Tunic did this last one rather masterfully right before the Ekton fight- he put her right in a spot where it would be damn hard to say no). You will note, I don't 'win' in all these compromises. The important thing is there's a way to resolve the problem.

In comparison, I got nothing on Maru. I've tried appeals to her dreams of glory, her vaunted family loyalty, reminding her of the mission, hoping she would back down if she saw she was insulting to a friend to her face, etc. Every time, she digs in her heels, and any disagreement with her position is met with escalation. I've yet to find a lever or approach that allows compromise or even a useful dialog.

This is me coming to you OOC and saying, "come on, how am I supposed to work with you here." Give me a bone!

How do you expect or want me to deal IC when Maru expresses sudden vehement opposition to something? Cause I don't get it.

>bulleted list of conflicts
I don't feel 1 needs to be addressed any further.

2. You left out the fact that Maru didn't trust her allies to judge a threat, or to know their own capabilities (to point Ji says "I can do this" and Maru goes "fuck no this is suicide!"). That's a pretty serious lack of trust / faith, and insulting to anyone who takes pride in their abilities. That's where the most the conflict lies for the other side. (That, and questioning the very premise of mercenary work).

2.5 You completely ignored the last big fight we had. Where Maru choose to express support by saying "you know how I feel about this"- referring to the fact she didn't believe in what Viste was doing. In the middle of a hostile confrontation.

This also ties into my current frustration in 3. You took great pains at the time to explain that Maru was (1) expressing support and would follow my lead and (2) that she wanted to talk about this later. So when you know, I took a lead and tried to solve the problem by changing the circumstances around our prisoner, Maru decides what I proposed is unacceptable and swears a blood oath that runs directly counter to what you know is one of my goals. She doesn't, you know, confront me for that explanation. Or trust me to work something out.

Nevermind the fact that what I suggested never happened because Vos intervened with a better plan. And that one could reasonably assume Maru never heard Dav suggest that. Or that you appropriated a roll aimed at something else to justify it.

So yeah, OOC, I'm frustrated with how you chose to handle that.

IC I have no idea how I will handle this. Right now I assume Dav isn't aware of Maru's plan. I can't imagine Dav will be happy to learn Maru wants to backstab her professionally and personally because of a headbutt and an insult. (From someone who barfights and insults people recreationally)!

4. Dav isn't insulted by this, nor am I. It's more that we have a complicated problem to think through, and announcing "I am vehemently and completely opposed to one option! (And by extension, any compromise that would partially include this option in some form)" is the opposite of helping.

>>116828
>out-of-character option of calling in the favors associated with that recent patronage for a new cataclysm
Yeah, invoking an entertaining deus-ex-machina to remove the problem is an option if Santova wants to go that way.

>make Maru a sergeant
If that's a gesture of trust and respect Maru would be inclined to reciprocate, I'd certainly be willing to go for it. Would placing greater trust and responsibility in Maru make her more inclined to trust other people's plans?

>Shipping company's main objection might be that they'd still be paying you greedy mercenaries by the day during that time.
Could conceivably be negotiated around, if the military is reasonably the ones providing security while we're in quarantine, and would be responsible for keeping us all fed as long as we're detained.
>>
No. 116840 ID: 333104

>>116837
I’m a tad bit distracted, so I may forget some parts, but I’ll say I was feeling a tad bit hurt because it felt like I could do no right BUT I’m feelin like I reacted a little strongly now that I look back on my response.

I didn’t realize that your frustrations were coming mainly from timing and an inability to appeal to her. The problem is I’m not sure what is a good motivator for her, because what normally motivates her is doing stuff for the people around her. Like, for example, when she thought Ji was jumping to his death, what would have appeased her would have been exploring more options and trying something else other than sending him to what she thought was certain doom. I don’t know how to reconcile the insult there, because she still thinks its appropriate to say “hey, I think you’re going to die, I’m not gonna at you do that”. It’s not insulting to Vos to say “I think you’re gonna die if you charge into the bandit army don’t do that.”

As for the idea of her saying “I’ll listen” and not listening, that may be a difference in perceptions. Her thing was “I’m going to do what you say, but if you say this, I won’t like it.” She backed you up and never directly went against your orders. She was verbally aggressive, but she never attacked cap, complied with everything you wanted, despite disagreeing.

I’ll think more on what you’ve said and try to tailor her to have more approachable desires and hooks. If I’m the tunnel Vos had said “Noted” and left it at that, she wouldn’t have blown up. I can’t have expected you or anyone to know that’s how I thought it would go, but I don’t try to make her obstinate, she just gets upset easily. To address the timing point, I don’t think I can do anything BUT react to things. If she doesn’t want Ji to do something, when should she say “hey don’t kill yourself?” If she doesn’t want to get examined, when should she say that? Especially in this online setting, JamesLeng says what’s happening in the environment, and we say how we react. We were told people wanted to search us, Maru says “I won’t do that.” I don’t know how to time it better, but I’m open to suggestion. Like I said, I wouldn’t quit, but if Maru isn’t working out we have in character reasons to have her split from the party. I’d just run her over to Zelkors fairy probably, join the other party so there’s fewer problems; that or I would retire her and add a different character to the Home team thread.

Like I said though I’ll read back over this later on and maybe give a better response then. I really am sorry my characters keep clashing with yours!! I’ll try to make someone more driven and manageable next time, pinky promise
>>
No. 116846 ID: 3abd97

>I was feeling a tad bit hurt because it felt like I could do no right
Yeah, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to dump on you.

I'm only bringing this up now because wanting to kill 'Cap' while Dav is obligated to protect him puts our characters on a direct collision course. And I would prefer to work something out OOC now instead of the disaster where we misunderstand each other IC like last time.

And I would really like to work with you instead of fighting.

>We were told people wanted to search us, Maru says “I won’t do that.” I don’t know how to time it better, but I’m open to suggestion
The complaint for me here was less the timing and more the absolute. Leaving yourself unopen to compromise from the onset is setting yourself up as part of the problem to be worked around, not a teammate helping to find a solution to the problem.

>leave party
Genuinely not what I want. If we've lost Tunic (I hope we haven't) the party's already gotten smaller, and it does work well when we're not at each other's throats.

>better response
It's fine, I don't need a point by point reply to everything. Smaller posts are where we actually discuss shit is probably better than essays where we talk at or around each other. *Glares at my own huge post.* (For that matter if you want to try and talk live, I am on irc most the time).
>>
No. 116847 ID: fc3fc0

>>116837
>Nevermind the fact that what I suggested never happened

Not sure what this references to- Maru is upset because she's not allowed to kill him, and she doesn't think the reasons she's not allowed to kill him aren't reasonable. Her thing was "I don't like what you're doing, but I'll help you do it. It's going to piss me off though if thats what you choose." Since Vistevina chose not to kill him, she's pissed off. Didn't have anything to do with your roll really- I thought since you had used that as a reason for IC rebuttals before, it would help back up my reasoning if I referenced it, but basically it seems natural for her to be upset.

>I assume Dav isn't aware of Maru's plan
Perhaps it's coming off OOC that she's going to murder him in his sleep or something, but no, she was serious about backing you up even if she didn't like the decision you made. She's not going to do anything until Daviste changes her mind, or their loose contract with the sorceress is up. Until they fufill their end of the bargain or make other arrangements, Maru isn't going to try to off cap. That's why it's an ambition, not an imediate action. It reflects long term character goals as opposed to immediate actions she's taking. I guess Davina might see it as betraying potential clients or relationships or something of that nature? But if she's of the mind that AFTER their responsibilities are fulfilled that it would still be backstabbing her, I don't know what to say to that, because I really don't get it.

>opposite of helping
Sorry, I felt like since Maru was being all pissy it would make sense for her to shout angrily about stuff she doesn't like, and I could come in here and chat about what we think is a good plan- quarantine or Sending Ji forward still looks good to me, but I don't know how they could trust Ji with a parasite on board, so i didn't suggest that because it didn't seem like we had a viable way to cloak his ally we all don't know about. We can't actively plan to help hide it, and we can't send him out with it wiggling around on his spine, so it seems like an impasse. With Vos, Ji, Cap/sorceress, Maru and Davina all representing problems for the sweep, it seems like getting searched is a no go.

>Invoke a disaster or miracle
While I could,
A) I'm not going to. I gave JamesLeng extra money as a birthday present, and I fully intended it as a gift, not a purchase of rewards; patreon just happened to be a convenient method to send that money. Even if this is a problem for us, for me as a real person, using that gift for in game perks would feel distasteful to me and go against the spirit of the gesture.
B) i don't know how I could invoke such a miracle or disaster that would resolve the IC/OOC conflict here anyways, so even if I was willing, I still might not have been capable.

>Give Maru more trust and responsibility in hopes or receiving the same
This is an interesting idea, and while I'd love to say "that's a great level, use that and this whole thing'll be resolved!" it doesn't feel like it matches to me? She grew up in a setting where there wasn't really ranks, just jobs, and you did what you were good at to help everyone survive. The symbolic gesture of "here, I trust you, will you trust me" would make sense, but being a Sargent or given more control of the company doesn't really equate to that to her.

I think a major snag is I feel like she already trusts and listens to Vistevina, Vos and the others. Just because she's afraid everyone is biting off more than they can chew doesn't mean she doesn't trust them; for instance, I still feel she trusted, followed, and basically took orders/did what viste said in the tunnel, and afterwards. She's noisy, but her bark is worse than her bite. She's going to yell, a lot, about the myriad of things she is unhappy about, but ultimately she's going to listen and do what is asked of her. Her subordination is in name only from where I'm sitting, and if that's not the case, I'd like to play her closer to that idea, so if I'm forgetting areas where t's not like that I'll try to keep those in mind and do better in the future. She'll about about how she hates you for what you're asking her to do, but she'll do it, and wait for you to tell her the next step too.

In the immediate area, knocking her out is a seriously viable, no major consequence solution. She's already shown she thinks that's an appropriate measure when someone is being unreasonable or endangering others; if someone knocks her out, give her ice for the bruise when she wakes up, and explain that she was being over dramatic and everything turned out fine, she'd be grumpy, but not even as upset as she was with everyone when they were coming out of Ecton. I know that seems weird- violence will upset her less than talking her down, but her opposition to the search isn't so much rational as it is "I don't want to relive my childhood trauma".

>For someone who starts bar fights intentionally, she's awful upset about being headbutted
I don't know if you're intentionally downplaying her causes for anger, or if I haven't done a good job explaining them, but it boils down to Relating her to her father, and being chummy with him, + the physical violence and insults against herself. If he had just attacked her wordlessly, she'd actually be fine with keeping him alive. If he'd just insulted her, she'd be more upset than an attack, but less upset than now; as it stands, the combination, + her perceiving a lack of immediate and brutal punishment against him is upsetting for her. I don't know if I've made this clear, but the whole thing about commenting on her Father is a major part of her disproportionate reaction. She doesn't like being reminded that they're in any way connected to each other, and doesn't like to find out that other people were chummy with him either. Cap insinuated both, attacked her, and then to her eyes got a slap on the wrist. So she's going to exact revenge- not to make him feel bad, because she knows he won't, but to give herself the satisfaction of hurting someone else she hates so much in such a graphic manor. It's not about justice so much as it is that she feels good about inflicting pain on those people she carries a grudge against.

Let me know if there's any salient points I missed, and I'll keep thinking on a more general carrot that can be dangled to help make her approachable, other than how something makes life easier for the people close to her.
>>
No. 116848 ID: fc3fc0

>>116846
>IRC

Might be a good idea- I really like playing with you, and everyone else, and instant chat is an easier way to sort things out. Being on a forum makes these posts kind of unfeeling and argumentative, when really I'm tryin my best to be like "How can we get back to having more fun!"

And for the record, it would be a change of player character, not me leaving the home thread; it's just that if Maru is constantly unfun for everyone and a problem to manage, I'd rather do something that fits better with the composition of the party and more fun for us! Not like "Man, I guess I'll leave if I'm not wanted..." and more of a "Hm, this isn't fun for everyone, let me change what I'm doing to try to solve that!"
>>
No. 116849 ID: fc3fc0

>>116848
Meant to say IRC is a good idea, but I can't get on right now; work in the morning, social gathering in the evening, long drive saturday to reach an all day event I'm attending, before I take a long drive back out. I feel like we've both gotten a chance to say our piece though and now that I know what I need to make it work out, it shouldn't be too big a leap for us to get this thing rollin again. Pinky promise I'll do my best to make this less of a "work around San's weird character's issues" and more a game of "let's combine our resources to overcome these obstacles.

On that point, should probably look into selling those rings since I don't think they pinged as magical to anyone.
>>
No. 116850 ID: d36af7

>>116847
>i don't know how I could invoke such a miracle or disaster that would resolve the conflict here
Simplest answer would probably be the classic "these aren't the droids you're looking for." Warp the minds of all concerned such that they believe the inspection has already been concluded without finding anything of interest.

Cheaper, more cataclysmic options would be "rocks fall" or "release the kraken" or anything else that sinks, otherwise neutralizes, or at least thoroughly distracts the interdiction force long enough for you to slip past.
>>
No. 116852 ID: 3abd97

>She's not going to do anything until Daviste changes her mind, or their loose contract with the sorceress is up
Well that's a completely different matter then! If you're not sabotaging the job trying to kill a client, Dav won't care. (Well, I mean, she'll probably regret it when Maru runs away to commit suicide by 'Cap', but that's different). Go ahead and pick fights on your own time.

(Although it might be a lot healthier if Maru just joined in on the wrestling / sparring sessions Vos has arranged to take the aggression out on 'Cap').

Seriously if I wasn't under the impression you had just announced your intent to actively oppose my competing the mission I wouldn't have raised a fuss at all.

>trust
I don't understand what definition you're using but not having faith in others' abilities or judgement seems a pretty clear cut lack of trust to me! You talk about what's emotionally important to Maru a lot, but the kind of validation of having some believe in what you're capable of is pretty basic. Everyone wants that. So long as Maru continues undervaluing her teammates out of fear, she can probably expect to keep offending them. (Not saying you have to change that, just that this seems a very basic human response you seem surprised by).

>i don't know how I could invoke such a miracle or disaster that would resolve the IC/OOC conflict
It can't resolve OOC problems but it could cause the army inspectors in-game to stop being a problem. Again, you certainly don't have to use it.

>I don't know if you're intentionally downplaying her causes for anger
I am intentionally downplaying it because Maru's response is hypocritical, petty, and patently ridiculous to me. She is the least wronged party here. We stabbed 'Cap' in the back, broke his army, ruined weeks or months of planning and preparation, maimed his hand, and took him prisoner, among other indignities. Maru personally slandered him to his face, with her falsified song.

Maru, whose whole shtick is brawling and pushing people's buttons to start fights, has the temerity to swear an oath of bloody vengeance on someone daring to do the same to her when she wears her bright red buttons on her sleeve.

I'm sorry, that gets zero sympathy from me OOC. Sure, she's a flawed character in this respect, but that doesn't buy her a pass in my mind.
>>
No. 116854 ID: d36af7

With the schlock mercenary link, I didn't actually mean that that specific solution was the perfect one in this case, just that Maru was, like Schlock, a low-class brawler who stumbled into a position of wealth and power which nominally entitled her to make arbitrary demands of the small mercenary company she was working for. Accordingly, the solution might be as simple as asking her to clearly enumerate what she wants.
>>
No. 116855 ID: af6e04

Looks like Nin's luck finally ran out as soon as he entered the dungeon, haha.

>115709
I've been thinking about this again lately. Trumpet archon. The trumpet turns into a +4 greatsword.
>plus that greatsword (fourth-tier named weapon) as a prize

Oh my god I'm going to get enlisted into an angelic marching band
>>
No. 116856 ID: af6e04

Sorry, >>115709
>>
No. 116860 ID: 3d2d5f

>>/quest/838182
I'm sorry but I don't think Kome's proposal works.

Among other things, it depends on the assumption we will be let back out of quarantine when it is convenient for us. That is not how bureaucracies, governments, or quarantines work.

Even if it works, it results in most the party (including people who want to go there) being unable to enter the town we just spent a week sketching out. Which is not only uninteresting OOC, but denies us the chance to do shopping that improves our characters / capabilities.

And for the record, not getting Esmeraude into the city is not a small ding in payment, it's denying her access to the resources she needs to complete her payment. (Although I am growing frustratingly accustomed to being almost the only one who gives a damn about either fulfilling professional obligations or getting paid).

Plus the city is a great opportunity to ditch the tsochari, who I would really like to be rid off. I want my doctor back.

>what do
Possible plans I'm considering (needs fleshing out):

-Everyone accepts quarantine (including merchants), we use sendings to get the company to exert pressure, negotiate a lesser fee while the military is handling security / providing meals. Slow, but we all get to town eventually, and the government mostly eats the blame.
-Diplomatic coup: somehow convince them we're clean without a detailed inspection. Establish sufficient trust in our existing countermeasures. (The trick of course, is how we establish that trust while we're being held at arm's length and studied with justifiable paranoia).
-subversion: Stick a tsochar in someone important here, get the whole thing wrapped up for us. (Problem is the people in charge won't be interacting with us, they have security, they might have class levels, and a competent enough crew might relieve a compromised commander from duty even if we pull it off).
--alternatively, we might more easily be able to find leverage to use against the people in charge to force concessions. (Especially if someone uses an OOC question to cheat. Probably needs to narrow down to a more specific inquiry first though).
-stealth: submit to inspection, somehow hide all our dirty laundry (Just kidding, no way everyone rolls that well. Plus we have to circumvent Maru in this case).

I'm particular to the first two, but still thinking. Thoughts?
>>
No. 116864 ID: d36af7

>>116860
>uses an OOC question to cheat. Probably needs to narrow down to a more specific inquiry first
'Shot in the dark' questions are fine. Something like "what's the weakest link in that sharpshooter's chain of command, for bribe-or-blackmail purposes" might get you code words and price-points with almost no personal or institutional context, but it'd still be enough of a lead to act on. If I were to jerk somebody around with literal-genie pixelbitching when they used one of those questions, that would somewhat undermine the point of them paying for premium content, would it not?

>>116855
>The trumpet turns into a +4 greatsword.
Getting closer. When does it do so?
>Oh my god I'm going to get enlisted into an angelic marching band
Technically Nistamatsin already has been enlisted, insofar as he's reporting to a lieutenant commander, but no, that's not the pact's big 'gotcha' catch.
>>
No. 116865 ID: d22dc0

>>116852
>when Maru runs away to commit suicide by 'Cap'
>not having faith in others' abilities or judgement

Hey seems like the same thing she was saying. She just happened to think one particular trap was more deadly than it was. In my opinion, if your friends blindly tell you they think you can do anything, you've got shitty friends. Going around telling someone they're strong enough and capable enough to do whatever they say they're going to do, while surely a nice ego boost, doesn't really work well for the safety and well being of those people you care about in the long run. The important thing is to apologize when you should have had more faith, and re-adjust how you think about things, which I think Maru kind of did when she tried to make up with Ji.

>Maru IS being petty
Well, I suppose I can't say "No, that's wrong!" It's not how I saw things, but if it doesn't seem like she has good reasons for being upset, I suppose I can't make anyone think her reasons are good. And yes, cap does have very good reasons to be upset, but I wasn't under the impression it was a matter of revenge Olympics to see who had the best excuses to be angry. Maru didn't enjoy her childhood, blames her dad, and so being told by one of his work buddies that she's one of his shitty kids right before said person assaults her seems like good enough reasoning to me. If it doesn't to others, well, I guess that's just how it is.

Everyone accepts quarantine seems like the best option to me- except that we can't go into town unless we get cleared to go, and if we don't want to get searched, it's hard to ensure we get that clearance. If we use our parasite friend to open the doors for us once we're in town though, that seems like it might work.

I'm not sure what leadership/authority we have to throw around; the only thing I can imagine is Ji and Sage Frisk vouching for us, but that would take stronger magic and good rolls, and I'm not sure how we'd pull it off.

If we want to stealth our way past the checks, like I said, knocking Maru unconscious for the duration of the search is possible and wouldn't result in long term issues; the rest of that still poses a problem though.

I think the easiest way to circumvent things would be the OOC question line and find a way to manipulate the circumstance to our behavior. Magey, Strngy, and I have question privileged, right?

Also, as for Nin's luck, honestly I'm amazed that you've managed to roll 4 crits in a row on either end- he truly lives up to his nature as a symmetrical, split down the middle demon.
>>
No. 116866 ID: af6e04

>Although I am growing frustratingly accustomed to being almost the only one who gives a damn about either fulfilling professional obligations or getting paid
Vos of course wants to fulfill professional obligations and get paid. He just doesn't want his eelbee babies taken away. Who would?

I agree that the first two plans seem best. We don't really have a clear idea of how we'd go about any of these plans except the first though.

Another idea is to let cap free so he can kill them all. A pretty terrible plan, but I thought it'd be amusing to bring it up.

>Getting closer. When does it do so?
'On command as a free action' is the only answer I can really put together to that question. The SRD doesn't say much else about the sword/trumpet. It's a useless hunk of metal in anybody else's hands, I guess, which would be a pretty hilarious gotcha for an angel to pull (have fun with the sword you can't use idiot) but seems unlikely.
>>
No. 116872 ID: 094652

Since Pog is now in the dungeon, and, well...
>>838065
>rolled 5, 5, 6 = 16
>>838200
>Seems safe.
>>838229
rolled 5, 4, 6 = 15
>>838271
>Door opens smoothly and quietly as if the hinges were well-oiled.
I'm going to finalize Pog's class as Armored Hulk and his level 2 rage power as Guarded Life.
Pog might have an amazing Constitution, but previous combat encounters have shown that he doesn't really handle defense well. In the event that he can't get to a healer in time or suffers a massive crit to the head, he could die quickly and stupidly. Getting this rage power means if he's raging, there's a sort of last-chance barrier that knocks him unconscious instead of getting him instantly killed, which is more than enough time for the multiple healers in Team Magic Sword to get to him.
Question: If Pog uses rage right before a potentially trapped room, then gets hit by trap city, what are some conditions where Guarded Life won't be enough? Banishment to a place where he can't get healed, for sure, but is there a damage limit when guarded life doesn't work, like total disintegration?
Also, I understand that Pog won't realize the danger because of the detect trap fail on Nistamatsin's part, but if something pops up, then Pog will go into a rage. Depending on the circumstances, he might be able to rescue Nistamatsin while Geoffrey quivers at the entrance room.
>>
No. 116882 ID: fc3fc0
File 150856165897.png - (229.49KB , 1536x654 , HeroForgeScreenshot_Maru.png )
116882

One of the things I've long wished I could afford was a custom Hero Forge miniature. I was playing around with the program and looking wistfully upon my creations, and I thought it might be fun to share my somewhat inaccurate Maru figurine I designed.
>>
No. 116883 ID: d36af7

>>116865
> Sage Frisk vouching for us
Sage Deros Frist (that's Frist with a T) is a couple thousand miles away, and very busy with other work, and last time you saw him in person he was getting ready to scream at you for the unscheduled partial demolition of his house. Even though he's apparently had some time to cool off and rethink that position, he's almost certainly neither able nor willing to stick his neck out for you on this particular issue... and he's not a medical doctor in any case, so his opinion would be of limited value. Yisheng Ji IS a medical doctor, but having a personal stake in the issue at hand potentially compromises his objectivity.

>>116860
>-stealth: submit to inspection, somehow hide all our dirty laundry (Just kidding, no way everyone rolls that well.
Do you have any options for moving people off the ship before the inspection proper begins, without being noticed?

The thing about combat-rated triremes is, they've got prows optimized for ramming. Great big pole just below water level, reinforced (particularly on the pointed tip) with some corrosion-resistant metal. Behind that, the above-water part of the hull starts with a couple of big sloped plates, like the moldboard of a plow or the 'cow-catcher' on a steam locomotive. Those have to be fairly heavily reinforced too, because ramming means you're going to be getting the front end of your ship very close to the dangerous bits of an enemy ship. Accordingly, there's a little bit of a blind spot, maybe just enough room for somebody to stand on top of the ram without being noticed by anyone aboard, particularly if the trireme's crew were mostly focusing their attention on something off to the side rather than in front.
>>
No. 116884 ID: d36af7

>>116665
>What's available for money sinks?
>Especially ones that are a better deal locally than they might be elsewhere, or flat out aren't unavailable elsewhere.
Overmire's a good place to shop for specialty tools, particularly if you're willing to settle for "slightly irregular" stuff that's mostly serviceable but didn't quite measure up to the Immovable Rod Syndicate's production standards.

You can also get bottom-of-the-line armor enchantments done same-day by down-on-their-luck journeyman runesmiths. Two or three silver per piece for +1 to DR, and it even works on clothing that wouldn't normally qualify as armor at all. Potential downsides: ordinary clothing becomes more difficult to repair (since it'll resist a tailor's needle or scissors just as much as an assassin's blade), lots of weak overlapping magical auras makes detection and analysis trickier in the field, and it's shoddy work done in a rush for beer money so all sorts of exciting things might happen if the enchanter botches.

>What's the local population like? For instance, what's the majority race(s) making up the population, and is it different than where we've been?
Humans and Green elves are about 40% of the population each, remainder is primarily lizardfolk, swamp ogres, and other warm-climate amphibious types. Relatively few half-elves.
>Are there any social or cultural norms significantly different than what we're used to seeing so far? Racism, sexism,
Non-mammals (including reptiles, eelfolk, and insects) can legally be sold in bulk as slaves or food, as usual for the drakocracy. There's no particular social stigma associated with this, it's mainly regarded as a bureaucratic technicality. For the most part anyone sapient has equal rights under the law.

As for informal bigotry, there might be 'bad neighborhoods' of other groups, but the main thing to watch out for is the biases of those reactionary Green elves. They're staunchly meritocratic: if you can do a given job correctly, with elegance and grace, that's as much proof as anyone should need that you have a right to be doing it. So, no sex discrimination for careers. Moderate stigma against heterosexual romance, but they can't afford to flip the figurative table every time there's a tiny hint of that among shorter-lived races, so keep the public makeouts to a minimum and you'll be fine on that front. Don't be an orc or White elf in public, or at least try not to look like one.

>Is there extradition or a shared jurisdiction with anywhere any of us are wanted?
Esmeraude is reasonably confident that's a "no."

>>116668
>What's the climate like?
Subtropical and wet. Lots of mangrove trees.

>What season is it?
Autumn. Stormy weather down south this time of year, which the tungsten run is timed to avoid, while Overmire's heat and humidity are low enough to get useful work done.

>Is there a dungeon entrance nearby?
Not that you know of, but that's the kind of question some scruffy randos in a tavern would probably know more about than a shipping company rep who doesn't even live there.
>>
No. 116890 ID: 3abd97

>>116865
I mean, yeah, sorry but "disproportionate retribution" against someone who has grounds for legitimate grievances hits "petty" pretty hard for me.

Also I don't know if you missed it / factored it in, but 'Cap' was lying to your face. He didn't know Maru's father.

>Hey seems like the same thing she was saying.
Mild hyperbole for the sake of the pun (And OOC besides).

>ego and other stuff
You seemed confused how Maru was managing to offend her teammates, so I was trying to explain. If you're not, I can drop it. Where Maru's head was at in that encounter has been adequately explained already, I think.

>knocking Maru unconscious
One problem there is a dearth of teammates both IC-willing and able to make unprovoked non-lethal attacks against their own. The other problem is making attack rolls against your own team is asking for trouble. Failure either means too much injury, or not enough followed by an even worse social situation.

>everyone accepts quarantine seems like the best option to me- except that we can't go into town unless we get cleared to go
The idea behind that plan is if we're held long enough without showing symptoms, we would all get cleared to go without further action. The biggest cost in this plan is time. And possibly managing fraying npc patience while we wait.

>>116872
Okay, if/when JL gives that a stamp of approval, I'll add those upgrades to the ref doc.

We might want to finalize Nin's and Geoffrey's upgrades too, since they're in the dungeon already?

>>116882
Horns aren't removed, so I guess that makes this more of an idealized self-image.

(It's occurred to me that if we'd taken or eventually take that side quest Ji found for physically entering the realm of dreams, stuff that might be relevant. Like Maru might have her horns, Davina and Viste might both be 'physically' present as distinct personas, and other weirdness).

Out of curiosity, what would be the cost for reliably regrowing horns? Or fingers, I think Hore's still missing one of those. (I assume those are minor goals for these characters, and we are close to a payday). There's always Vos' power, but that doesn't exactly restore original condition.

>>116883
>Do you have any options for moving people off the ship before the inspection proper begins, without being noticed?
We have portals, but I was under the impression we were being scryed on right now, which makes not being noticed difficult. Plus, if the inspectors learn from questioning or inspecting records that there are missing people, wouldn't that get the ship held up regardless? It's the same problem as Viste not appearing in a line up, only bigger.
>>
No. 116891 ID: 3abd97

>>116866
>angel gotcha
Okay, so if non-angels can't hold the sword without it turning into useless metal, that's one way of screwing you over.

Here's one interpretation that might horrify Nin more: if the angel promised to give him the sword on success, that could also mean ensuring you can hold it.
>>
No. 116894 ID: 3abd97

>Moderate stigma against heterosexual romance
Is that a green elves in general thing, or is that a regional or sect-based thing?
>>
No. 116903 ID: af6e04

>>116891
>that could also mean ensuring you can hold it.
Haha yeah, that's what I was getting at with the 'enlisted into the angelic marching band' thing.

>draw a map
I'm working on it!
>>
No. 116904 ID: af6e04

Also, kinda funny that two of my characters have stigmata now
>>
No. 116907 ID: 3abd97

>But as long as they're willing to help pilot the subterrene he's not too upset.
As getting this thing up and working is a long term prospect, I think Rhea's probably gonna wait a few levels so she could say, blow a whole day's spell allotment on Comprehend Languages and get a useful duration for studying.

Share Language would also be pretty handy, if anyone actually studying Derro picks it up. (Might make thematic sense for Helen?).

Or you know someone could just write down a translation.

Oh geeze, I forgot about Helen. We still need to do her level up, don't we. And Kent. And Nin and Geoffery (and Wendy if we're acknowledging her).
>>
No. 116909 ID: af6e04

>Share Language
I wonder how any knowledge sharing spells like that would interact with her curse.
>>
No. 116915 ID: d36af7

>>116872
>Pog's class as Armored Hulk and his level 2 rage power as Guarded Life.
I might not be using those exact mechanics, due to the different ways GURPS handles armor and nonlethal damage, but for Pathfinder purposes that's entirely consistent with my understanding of his "tank" specialization.
>>116810
>unlikely to do anything with her soon
That's too bad, she'd make an interesting team with Valeno.
>>116821
>I'm most surprised that carrying giant be larva would be a problem. Sure, it's not the typical container, but they're a domesticated animals (well, maybe not the babies in particular, but in general).
In general? Sure, it'd be just another weird biology experiment and/or religious affectation. In the context of trying to quarantine a phenomenon they don't completely understand, but one symptom of which is people being turned into weird plant-bugs from the inside? Belly pouch full of weird bug hybrids might get a bad snap-judgement reaction from somebody with a weapon.
>>116890
>teammates both IC-willing and able to make unprovoked non-lethal attacks against their own
Sounds like a job for Yisheng Ji's pressure point techniques.

>what would be the cost for reliably regrowing horns? Or fingers
As an arm's-length transaction, no questions asked? Probably around nine hundred gold when it's available at all. Major cities usually have somebody like that for hire, or a group that can do the equivalent with some cooperative rituals and infrastructure, but selection is limited at the best of times. Doesn't actually cost the caster much of anything beyond a 7th circle spell slot, so some places have a first-come-first-served charity operation, or a waiting list for amputees who served honorably (with varying definitions of "honorably"), or you could trade some favor to the caster that they'd otherwise need to use a high-circle spell slot for, or better yet something they wouldn't be able to do at all.

Horns, hair, fur, and fingernails might be a bit of an exception. There's a type of enchanted hat - a standardized mass-production item like immovable rods and portable holes, but not made anymore, not since resultant disruption to the wool industry led to the Rhestmere Incursion - which accelerates the wearer's keratin production by a factor of roughly one million, which is to say two years worth of growth per minute, without corresponding drain on the metabolism. If you could obtain one of those, it might restore damaged horns good as new.
>I was under the impression we were being scryed on right now, which makes not being noticed difficult.
Lots of potential countermeasures for scrying. Details of those, relevant and otherwise, are available at standard OOC knowledge rates, or possibly through some in-character channel (but in that case you'd certainly need to roll for it). Given the previously discussed typical dragon's regard for the typical elvenoid's concept of privacy, and the apparent priority of the issue based on visible resources being allocated to this mission, if Overmire's public health authorities had some way to reliably scan the entire ship from a distance, they'd probably just go right ahead and do that instead of asking for permission.
>Plus, if the inspectors learn from questioning or inspecting records that there are missing people, wouldn't that get the ship held up regardless? It's the same problem as Viste not appearing in a line up, only bigger.
When it comes to lies, "bigger" isn't quite the same as "worse" or "less likely to work." You could talk to the bosun, maybe offer him some more bribes, and have him fudge the logs to show that all the mercs and passengers who had contact with anything out of the ordinary in Eckton - that is, everybody except the Agate siblings and the ship's actual crew - just so happened to magically disembark very shortly before the triremes showed up, presumably to pursue yet another side job or distraction on shore. A review of older logs, and follow-up investigation all along the coast, could confirm that such behavior is entirely typical of the New Fire Hawks.

After that, you'd just need to reach Overmire on the overland route and show up at the docks by the time the return trip is ready to depart. Without Davina's ability, crossing 120 miles of swampland in four days or less might be a challenge, but not an absurd impossibility, particularly not when you're leading a small group, with two aerial scouts, no heavy equipment, and a good road network already in place. With at-will portals, that's barely more than a casual afternoon stroll.

>>116894
Core philosophical point it's based on (that you shouldn't perform rituals frivolously, or in a deliberately flawed and ineffectual way, and that procreative sex is a ritual, from which one of the intended consequences is the creation of a child) is common to all Green elves.

However, only the most hardcore zealots reject the 'Modularity of Transient Affection Thesis' and claim that the entire relationship, from eye contact at a party through flirting, formal courtship, marriage, sex, birth, guiding the child to adulthood, all together is an indivisible ritual action. From that perspective, flirting with someone of the opposite sex who you don't intend to marry is almost as blatantly stupid and dangerous as carving a pentagram on the floor, chanting the first half of some summoning incantation, then getting bored and wandering off.

More moderate Green elves say the various degrees of intimacy can be worthy goals in themselves, but still disapprove of potentially procreative intercourse being made 'incorrect' by deliberate contraception. When you just need an itch scratched without a deep and decades-long commitment, says Green elven philosophy, the Right Action is finding somebody with the same bits, who knows how to use 'em. Which isn't to say that they don't believe in long-term same-sex relationships; if anything, those are the most common. Two people enjoying compatible styles of gay or lesbian sex is regarded as just another convenient and auspicious factor in the degree of sympathetic similarity between them, like their taste in clothing or food or music.

Recreational hetero intercourse, or anything involving condoms, is also regarded as potentially corruptive and depraved at least partly due to association with White elves.
>>
No. 116917 ID: 7667b9

>>116915
Well I guess the obvious solution, for Vos at least, would be to just tell the examiners about the eelbee larvae and how they came about in advance. Could even turn it into a proselytization opportunity.
>>
No. 116947 ID: 3abd97

>That's too bad, she'd make an interesting team with Valeno.
Because Valeno's a thief? Because they could both cheat through small spaces, the poison is neutralized by coffee... or are we assuming she trips their vulnerability?

At the very least her inventory needs reconsideration, plus reevaluating personality / character in light of that debilitating geas. (An idealized appreciation for law as concept doesn't work as well when you've been dramatically shackled by objective laws).

>>116915
Okay, so I guess then we've got more than one feasible plan.

The first plan is the slow route. We get the whole ship quarantined and wait it out. We'd also need to negotiate a reduced pay right while the military is responsible for protection and providing food.

The big cost here is time. Which doesn't impact us outside the game much at all, but could have other consequences (like, if we're delayed enough, we might not might not make it back in time to pay our bills in Passholdt). Other costs might be NPC (or PCs) acting up as patience frays.

Second plan blackmail or bribe, where we use an OOC question to find us a social weak point to apply leverage to. Biggest drawback there I think is such activities require communication, and we're in a position that might complicate bringing that leverage to the fore. And we're banking on a cold call through a possibly indirect medium going according to plan.

Third plan is to duck out: interrupt / block scrying, convince the bosun and crew to fudge the truth, and then portal away and meet up in town overland. Big risks there are probably if we botch covering our tracks or making the getaway. (Getting lost following the coast, when we have flies to rely on, seems low).


First plan is probably the most straightforward, but I sort of don't like just giving up and I feel like there's probably more drawbacks I'm overlooking. Plan 2 or 3 have the disadvantage of getting messy if caught. Plan 2 is the hardest to think out in advance, as whatever we do will be informed by information we don't have yet.

I think I'm leaning towards 3, now? It's the most proactive, and relies on a relationship we've already developed (the bosun by this point sees value in us, and has at least some trust we know what we're doing), and our magical abilities.
>>
No. 116975 ID: af6e04

>I sort of don't like just giving up
>relies on a relationship we've already developed (the bosun by this point sees value in us, and has at least some trust we know what we're doing), and our magical abilities.

Yes, I'm leaning toward plan 3 just because it seems a lot more fun. But how exactly do we go about it?
>>
No. 116977 ID: af6e04

>(An idealized appreciation for law as concept doesn't work as well when you've been dramatically shackled by objective laws).
It's possible she might have willingly taken the geas upon herself as part of the process of passing the bar. Also, it seems as though geasa and other spiritual bindings cause an actual change in personality and motivation rather than reluctant compulsion

>Original binding may be gone, but the effect on Nistamatsin's nature doesn't just vanish.
>His loyalty to Esmeraude was initially established by magical bindings, but has become habituated and might persist even if he were unbound, much like Nistamatsin's selective pacifism.
>>
No. 117039 ID: d22dc0

>Frisk

Knew he was far away, and previously mad, but we saw him after the events in Ecton, appearing fine, and Ji was on good terms with him I thought. I was assuming the army could magically contact him, and his reputation would be worthwhile rather than his medical expertise. Basically “you trust me, and I trust them, so don’t waste their time.” Kinda deal.

>doesn’t know Dad
I had considered that, but didn’t decide whether I OOC thought that was the case or not, because Maru IC hasn’t considered it, and won’t agree. She’s marked him for Calistras Sting, she’s not gonna back down now.

>Maru’s appearance
The lack of scaring, pretty face, and corn rows compared to Afro are also not super faithful to her description, but it’s a good approximation. The main idea was to see if anyone thought the website was cool enough to design their own mini as well. Might be hard though, it’s a somewhat limited program.

>knocking Maru out
Tryna work with the “throw you a bone” plea earlier. She could also be talked into standing down by basically harping on how if she’s the only one opposed, she’s fucking everyone over, and wouldn’t that be hypocrital of ms “I care about everyone and no one else does.” Combined with attacking her pride, a sort of “quit being a fucking baby and stop fucking this up for everyone” could also work depending on how you phrased it. I pointed out non-lethal takedown as a option first because she’d have a better reaction to it after the fact and it’s more sure fire than trying to verbally convince her. Kind of an, “ignore her, she’s doing this for attention” approach would be mildly successful in most cases, but I’ll make sure to outline motivators in chat here. I also don’t know is JamesLeng allows for this sort of thing, but I’m fine with not having to roll to knock her out- as a player, I see that it’s benificial, so I don’t mind sacrificing some realism to not contrast things and get the show moving. Obviously this isn’t a super necessary topic since we’re trying not to get searched, but I thought I’d bring it up anyways since that’s how the long character discussion started. Basically, use her pride against her and give her the “do it for us, please?” Line and she’ll begrudingly, bitterly, comply. Knock her out, explain that she was being a baby and you didn’t have time for her foolishness, and she’ll probably just be a bit sheepish.

>Plans
I agree plan 3 sounds like more fun; it also carries significantly higher risk. I wouldn’t vote for it, but Maru would, mostly because there’s the potential for her tonight her way through government agents if it goes wrong. I don’t remember the 4 traits JamesLeng talked about in terms of an alternate alignment type system, but I’ve been trying to play a sort of chaotic neutral with her, where Isaiah and Kent are more along the lines of chaotic good.

Honestly, it seems like most of my characters run in the vein of “anti-government” for one reason or another.

>no hetero
Interesting take on the natural extrapolation and evolution of some of those historic ideas. As always, I’m impressed with the way you think about things. Do they have established positions on masturbation, individuals who don’t fit into a binary sex model, or who want to carry out a heterosexual relationship without sex? Magical birth control I assume is also no good, and what about relationships involving multiple partners, either romantically or sexually? Are orgies frowned upon?

Also, I agree with strngy, about the law character ideas. Just because you change the mechanism doesn’t mean you HAVE to change the character. Obviously still can though- you’re basically due for your third character anyways.

Still wonder where the sword went. That’s like if we lost the mace after our fight with Styx. Should have followed up honestly. And I still was wondering because I’m too lazy to try to find it on mobile, is one of his hands a fleshy club? Did that happen and he fixed it? What’s that situation?
>>
No. 117055 ID: d36af7

>>117039
> Do they have established positions on masturbation,
A valid meditative exercise, though precautions must be taken to minimize the mess.
>individuals who don’t fit into a binary sex model,
Green elven formal etiquette recognizes at least a dozen genders, as well as various liminal conditions, and is (at least in principle) open to the discovery of others, just as botany is open to the discovery of new plant species. For practical purposes anything unexpected outside the three or four most prevalent will be met with some stiffness and quiet resentment, but this is seldom anything more than the awkward feeling of inadequacy which comes from being obligated to recall and carry out procedures one hasn't studied in a long time. Some Green elves nurture in their hearts a deep and abiding hatred for all people of a given gender, or hair color, or any other arbitrary trait; this is regarded as an acceptable practice, when pursued with elegance and grace, but also essentially isolating. Any two Green elven bigots or serial killers would be more likely to fight a duel over incomprehensibly petty distinctions between their personal ideologies, rather than find common cause for alliance. Of course, such a philosophical pursuit being morally acceptable doesn't make the acts it might motivate any less criminal; the Right Action in such cases is understood to involve taunting the authorities, but submitting gracefully if cornered and making a full confession, unless the arresting officer happens to belong to one's target demographic.
>or who want to carry out a heterosexual relationship without sex?
Progressive types who embrace the Thesis say that's fine; reactionary types who reject it say there's little meaningful difference between that and pulling out right before climax.
>Magical birth control I assume is also no good
Yes. More generally, throwing a bunch of flashy magic at any problem which could be solved by mundane effort is not elegant at all.
>what about relationships involving multiple partners, either romantically or sexually? Are orgies frowned upon?
You'd get a somewhat negative reaction, but more out of skepticism than moral disapproval. If you can successfully manage all that multitasking, with elegance and grace, you'll earn as much respect as would a martial artist who can fight alone against a crowd and emerge unscathed.
>>
No. 117076 ID: 3abd97

>>116975
>But how exactly do we go about it?
My best guess for anti-scrying protocols would be a Maria-Esmeraude team-up. Maria's talent lends itself to setting up wards, and Esmeraude has a communications theme (and scrying is conveying information at a distance). I'd be willing to burn an OOC question on information to help with that, if we're going with this plan.

Then someone (or more than one someone) rolls for diplomacy with the Bosun. Now, we've got two factors in our favor there. There first is a measure of respect we've built up, the second is he doesn't want to be held up because his security team got arrested and needs replacing. I'm thinking that means he'll agree to fudge the truth for us, but how much of a concession / bribe that will cost us is up in the air.

Then running away is probably a navigation roll (possibly more than one character contributing). Between following the coast and having more than one character of getting an areal view, getting lost seems unlikely. Initial slip-away is the biggest chance.

Additional rolls to troubleshoot other problems as they arise.

>>116977
Hmm. Worth considering.

>>117039
>see if anyone thought the website was cool enough to design their own mini as well
I was amused that they actually had a pillbox hat, but yeah, there's not nearly enough options to accurately recreate what's in my head, and what's there is frustrating to navigate.

>I agree plan 3 sounds like more fun; it also carries significantly higher risk. I wouldn’t vote for it, but Maru would
Is that a vote of support? This situation is complicated and makes unilateral productive action difficult, which is why I've been trying to iron out a plan in dis before executing.

>Just because you change the mechanism doesn’t mean you HAVE to change the character.
Not necessarily, no, but character and/or personality is informed by many factors, and when you introduce a life altering trait it behooves oneself to think through the impact that could have and/or what in the character could have lead them to that trait. (My approach here is more bottom-up than top-down).
>>
No. 117082 ID: af6e04
File 150889687731.png - (518.99KB , 1920x915 , HeroForgeScreenshot.png )
117082

Behold my final form!
>>
No. 117157 ID: d36af7

Two obvious potential complications, which may interlock to some extent, during any quarantine-dodging portal hijinx: what are you going to do with the Efficient Quiver, and the tsochar called Prisoner?
>>
No. 117166 ID: e66869

>>117076
>diplomacy with the Bosun.
Probably should be Davina or Maru. I think Vos is not high on the bosun's list of favorite people after the shenanigans he pulled in Eckton.

Vos CAN swim away with our assets that can't be portaled. Hard to say if he can do so stealthily enough to avoid being spotted though.
>>
No. 117168 ID: 094652
File 150902346382.png - (13.90KB , 1601x1000 , mouthofdoom3.png )
117168

Work in progress.
>>
No. 117178 ID: d22dc0

>>117082
You know, I never pictured Nin with a beard, but the snack staves and motorcycles truly are rock and roll

>>117168
Nice work!

>What to do about prisoner and quiver

Can't we leave the quiver on the boat, take the prisoner with us, and come back for our goods once the ship is past inspection?
>>
No. 117179 ID: 3abd97

>>117157
Hmm. I was hoping the tungsten he was hiding in to be sufficient, since they shouldn't be able to unload the hold. It'll be a problem if they have a specialized means to search there, though.

>>117166
I don't remember Vos doing anything to annoy the bosun specifically?

Vos might be able to hide underwater, if he mutates himself some gills? Problem there is swimming the distance without portals will be a lot harder and slower. Might be able to hang out under the ship until the army leaves? (Although that might be a known smuggling tactic, and they might check under the hull). Also, bringing an open container of holding underwater might be a bad idea.

Might be able to swim to shore and just cache the quiver and travel with the others to the city via portals, but that's also a risk.

...how long do we expect to be detained if we just let them quarantine us? We could use Esmeraude to coordinate getting the shipping company to pressure the government.

>Can't we leave the quiver on the boat, take the prisoner with us, and come back for our goods once the ship is past inspection?
Taking 'Prisoner' with us is problematic, as Ji is still host to Tchalcedo. 'Prisoner' defected or deserted after I interrogated it, rather than face punishment for sharing classified information. It probably doesn't want to be where it can be easily detected by its former roommate. Right now the tungeston is blocking easy detection.

Ideally we should be able to leave the quiver, unless the inspectors have some kind of divination that will tell them it was inside the Green Tide, and came directly in contact with someone killed by the illness they're trying to contain. Then they might confiscate it. And I think we can all agree letting a government take our valuables is not a good thing.
>>
No. 117180 ID: d22dc0

>>117179
Ah, I forgot about that interaction. Can't leave prisoner on the ship, but it can't be near Ji, but we can't leave Ji on the ship. If only we had tried to foist Ji's friend off onto the prince, this whole scenario would have gone much differently. In the same vein, such a play is possible to attempt, but against highly alert, well protected, parasite killing agents it seems a poor decision. Depending on how legalistic Viste is, the prisoner could be executed and burned; seems a bit hardcore, but it is an option. Otherwise everyone but the prisoner and Vos could portal away, Vos could swim away with the prisoner and quiver, and once Ji goes off on his own we could meet back up. Ji does seem to prefer the company of others, so i doubt it'd be hard to find something to get the bird man invested in.

Third option, we DO leave the prisoner on the ship, and hope it's not discovered. If it is discovered, basically play it off as a parasite from Ecton; it could talk, but who will the germ police believe, a wiggly brain eater or the bosun of a trusted merchant ship? The ship gets quarantined, we play the pressure game, and get everyone still on the ship un-jammed from out position in town. Assumedly all thats needed is some magical checks and precautions to show that everything still on the ship is find to go into town, unless, unbeknownst to us, it's not.

Side note, JamesLeng, how would you feel about a Salamander player character? http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/salamander

Thinking about having one that was born uniquely affected by whatever the wood essence in Ecton is, instead of being fire based.
>>
No. 117186 ID: d36af7

>>117179
>Taking 'Prisoner' with us is problematic, as Ji is still host to Tchalcedo. 'Prisoner' defected or deserted after I interrogated it, rather than face punishment for sharing classified information. It probably doesn't want to be where it can be easily detected by its former roommate. Right now the tungsten is blocking easy detection.
>Ideally we should be able to leave the quiver, unless the inspectors have some kind of divination that will tell them it was inside the Green Tide, and came directly in contact with someone killed by the illness they're trying to contain. Then they might confiscate it. And I think we can all agree letting a government take our valuables is not a good thing.
The interesting way these problems interlock is, things inside an exodimensional space are almost always difficult to detect, and Prisoner has just the right body type to be able to hide inside the quiver, if you empty it out first.

>>117180
>Salamander player character?
Half-spirits tend to work better. How are you proposing to fit it into the character creation framework?
>>
No. 117190 ID: fc3fc0

>>117186
So we can take the quiver, maybe give the stuff inside to Davina's party, put the prisoner inside, have Vos swim off separately with the quiver + prisoner, then re-unite and sell the quiver after Ji goes back to the ship? Ji seems to be pretty amenable to Davina, so if she asks him to watch the boat after he finishes his shore leave, finalizes the quiver sales, then head on back?

>How would you build her
I was mostly in the information gathering stage, but the goal is to make a classic black brimmed hat witch who happens to look like a leopard gecko and does earth magic

Name: ________
Race: Half Spirit salamander?
Class: Hedge Witch (Or maybe rich bastard)
Specialization: Geomancy
Higher Ambition: __________
Lower Ambition: __________
Phobia: Imbibing "healthy" foods
Mutation: Kind of winging this one but something along the lines of "Her birth was twisted by cursed geomancy, causing her to be uniquely aligned with with the wood element as opposed to the fire element." I don't know what that really entails, but basically I was thinking of taking all the fire based stuff for salamanders and change it to acid based- so acid resistance, extra acid damage, legs instead of tail, and then she'd be affected by anything that targets spirits or half spirits or outsiders or the like.
Supernatural Vulnerability: Vulnerable to fire (Instead of cold)
Innate Power: She can animate hay and straw and such to form creatures that defend her (also not yet hammered down)
>>
No. 117191 ID: d36af7

>>117190
What's the logic behind an aversion to healthy food? In most preindustrial settings there's not really going to be mass-produced synthetic "junk food," just a gradient from bland stuff that peasants eat (coarse bread, weak beer, turnips, and beans, with just enough other vegetables and cheap meat to fill in essential nutrients) up to elaborately-prepared stuff loaded with fat, protein, and spices that high nobles eat. Genuinely unhealthy food, stuff that's spoiled or contaminated or just unbearably disgusting, gets fed to beggars, or dogs, or pigs, or composted as fertilizer, or in the worst cases burned, and even then the heat is useful.

For the leopard gecko thing, a tail that can store excess food or be detached as a decoy is a valid mutation.

As for the elemental substitution, how about a residual phobia of cold, vulnerability to salt (including ocean water and over-salted food), and the innate ability to set things on grass?

Works by touch, or conducted through a metal-hafted weapon or chain, or maybe even as an area-effect breath weapon, though that costs some fatigue. Being set on grass deals just as much damage as being set on fire, but actual fire extinguishes it and fresh water or loamy dirt makes it worse. When something made of meat gets grassified to death, 1d4 minutes later you gain a yellow-musk-creeper-style zombie minion.
>>
No. 117208 ID: 3abd97

>So we can take the quiver, maybe give the stuff inside to Davina's party, put the prisoner inside, have Vos swim off separately with the quiver + prisoner, then re-unite and sell the quiver after Ji goes back to the ship? Ji seems to be pretty amenable to Davina, so if she asks him to watch the boat after he finishes his shore leave, finalizes the quiver sales, then head on back?
The black market buyer for the Quiver is back in Passholdt. So we take it off the ship, it has to go back on. So maybe Vos caches it for pick up on the return trip in a few days (not sure if 'Prisoner' is a good candidate for guard duty? But you're right that Viste could double back to pick up 'Prisoner' and/or Vos without Ji) or maybe he just swims back to ship when the army leaves (assuming they leave anytime soon) while we all portal on to Overmire (or Prisoner flies back to ship with the quiver after us and the army are gone?). Either way, it needs to get back to the ship.

Similarly, Ji can't go back to the ship until the army's gone, since he is host to a tentacle monster and all. Getting the anything back on the boat after we get to town shouldn't be hard- I've been assuming Tchalcedo wants to disembark in Overmire (staying with us just means doubling back to where she was before, or where Yikk Tasst is already operating). I'm not sure if 'Prisoner' would want to stay in Overmire? Similar problem where staying with us brings us back towards what it ran from, but it probably wants to avoid Tchalcedo too, and I don't know if the city is big enough for its tastes.

>Lots of potential countermeasures for scrying. Details of those, relevant and otherwise, are available at standard OOC knowledge rates
Okay, since we seem to be committed to this idea and are just fleshing it out, I'm going to get things moving by spending a question on relevant countermeasures.

>set things on grass
The phrasing here makes me giggle.
>>
No. 117214 ID: d36af7

>>117208
>spending a question
>scrying
The only scrying capabilities Overmire's navy is willing and able to apply at this point either depend on very tight sympathetic links, the sort which usually need to be carefully prearranged, or are simply a matter of supernaturally acute elven eyesight. They can't see any part of the ship unless it's got line of sight to some marine scout's eyeballs back on one of those triremes, or the document nailed to the mast.
>relevant countermeasures
Obstruct that line of sight by e.g. hiding in Dav/iste's private cabin, the same one with the conveniently shore-facing peephole.
>>
No. 117217 ID: 3abd97

>>117214
>shore mounted porthole
So evac procedure would be something like open portal to water for Vos, not-Dav drops Quiver with 'Prisoner' out the porthole (but not a portal) for Vos to catch, everyone else portals to shore, Vos swims away or dives down.

...although, if we assuming Tsochar need to breathe, or that the quiver will fill with a lot of seawater, we might want to cover it in some way first.

>eyesight
Hmm. Might be hard for the Bosun to lie that we'd left earlier if they already saw some of us on deck reading that note, though.
>>
No. 117222 ID: d22dc0

>>117217
>already saw us

So I can think of 3 major solutions which are

Bribes
Deception
And taunting

Bribing is obvious- pay them to look the other way, along with some reassuring side talk of “hey, they just didn’t wanna waste time, everyone’s safe, so just let it slide okay?”

Deception is basically us going “yeah these crew members ARE the ones you saw on deck. One of them had a tail? You must be mistaken- jimmy was dragging a sack of rations at the time though” trick them into thinking no one left and the people they saw are still there

Taunting boils down to a gamble based on their jobs- yeah, these people did leave the ship as soon as your note landed, I tried to stop them, etc. basically, have the bosun rat us out, play it up like he’s on their side- ship gets inspected, gets the all clear and passes on quickly because they’re suddenly short staffed after having to devote extra resources to tracking us down. The downside is obviously we’re wanted criminals now, and they may not want to let the ship in, even if it passes with flying colors.

Any other solutions you guys see? More difficult solutions involve ambushing the search party once you corner someone in a room alone, then infiltrating with prisoner, or combat with crew once their on our ship, hostage situation rather than ship to ship combat. We could always let them search us without any tricks, and then try to diplomacy/bribe them into believing us when we say all our various parasites and mutations aren’t related to Ecton.

Also, I thought the quiver had a cap which could keep water out, does it not?

>character creation
That seems to fall in line with the spirit of the character; I’ll add it to my idea list and work on makin a full character out of her to add to my list.the only major change I would probably make is related to the mutation, since it’s a little bland, even though it’s useful, fits the character, and makes sense realistically. Might do that and just make her abnormally small, and add the leopard-esque skin pattern as part of it because I really like that color scheme and pattern, part of why I was drawn to leopard gecko as my specific inspiration; that and he big tail, which is already spoken for.
>>
No. 117240 ID: d22dc0

So it completely flew over my head that the dungeon is the hospital, otherwise I would probably have sent my characters along, given that they agreed to help. During the next expedition I’ll go in properly.
>>
No. 117243 ID: af6e04

>>117240
Well, it's only a couple hours south of town and we've been mostly messing around in the first few rooms. You could probably catch up to us.

In fact, you could probably jump the distance in a fraction of the walking time. Bring food and water.
>>
No. 117249 ID: fc3fc0

Since Kent and Isaiah are going into the dungeon, it's probably relevant to double check if the extra revelation feat Isaiah took is legal, and to get a better handle on what exactly Kent's level up did. Any new abilities I need to sort out or know about?
>>
No. 117252 ID: 3abd97

>>117222
I'm not really sure bribery is an option without hitting just the right person- it's hard to bribe someone while they're being watched.

"Taunting" might be a bad way of saying it, but yes, one fallback option for the bosun is to blame everything on us, we made him lie, etc, if he gets caught in a lie.

>>117240
Honestly I would have had Rhea go along too, but I kind of missed the boat an figured my time would be better spent roleplaying talking the reticent party members into coming next time instead of retroactively jumping in.

It's only a quick scouting mission, anyways (unless something goes wrong).

>probably relevant to double check if the extra revelation feat Isaiah took is legal
That was okayed back here:

>>116785
>That's fine, yes. Seems very appropriate.
>>
No. 117254 ID: d36af7

>>117252
On the subject of that water sight power, it occurred to me Rhea's mom is connected with geysers, so Obscuring Mist and suchlike would make sense as clouds of steam. Just make a note that the ambient temperature rises by about 30 degrees inside the cloud. Usually a harmless 'flavor' side effect, but it might save lives on a frigid mountaintop when the thin dry air sets people to coughing, or be used as an insidious weapon in an already warm environment when those caught inside lose the ability to effectively cool themselves by sweating and thus rapidly succumb to heatstroke. Could be used to subdue, or as a nice tidy "natural causes."
>>
No. 117255 ID: 3abd97

>>117222
>Also, I thought the quiver had a cap which could keep water out, does it not?
>>/quest/808426
Hmm. I'm not seeing a cap mentioned in the original description, unless it's mentioned offhand somewhere else. Quivers are usually open ended, aren't they?

>Any other solutions you guys see?
The ones I've elaborated on in detail are the only ones that look viable.

Combat seems ill advised, as it would make us unwelcome in the town we're headed for, and even if we were victorious I don't see how we can protect the merchants and their ship sufficiently during any action.

Compromising the person in charge with a tsochar seems unlikely to work. We're not likely to find or get them alone, they likely have class levels, and the bridge may well be warded against teleportation (or just have alarm wards). And they're on guard against preciously the kind of infiltration tsochari represent, with the plant-disease.

Talking our way through an inspection was my first idea, but it's been since raised just how many things we have they might object to, and that nervous military types might be inclined to stab first, ask questions later.

>>117254
Oh, neat. I approve.
>>
No. 117267 ID: 29d032

>>117255
I did not notice it had been approved, thanks! As for plans, I also have a question I can ask if you can think of a good/useful one, but I think we’re best off with the window escape plan; I thought the quiver had compartments that opened and closed, hence me imagining a cap, but I don’t currently have the ability to search easily.

The reason I called the plan “taunting” is because in my mind, it was like we were saying “yeah, we’re breaking the rules, what are you going to do about it?”

I didn’t really consider Geoffrey’s coin purse available, but since it is, I might pack some more mundane or useful items with Isaiah (Kent likes to travel light). I won’t be able to post a revised inventory list until later tonight or tomorrow probably, but if anyone wants to help me brainstorm it’d be appreciated. Medical supplies are the biggest thing that spring to mind, and I have this inventory I made up for Riv in an old pathfinder game from which I might draw inspiration; also going to check what she bought when she got into town before and grab some of those things if any don’t overlap.
>>
No. 117322 ID: 094652

Forgot to ask, how much silver does Azure have?

Opening the jar with her head in it is a last resort. See, usually her head would catch on fire when she dies. She hasn't exactly tried to preserve parts of her body by dunking her head underwater to death like a suicidal ostrich, but this head was preserved in freaking alcohol - not exactly flame retardant here. Finding out how this thing was preserved is something of a priority, because if it can be burned and act as charred remains for Azure to respawn from, that increases her survival rate even further. Keep in mind; this is Azure's train of thought. Whether or not it works is up to JamesLeng, and either way it needs experimentation first.

And also, she's afraid the head will explode the moment it comes into contact with air. So there's that.

I had this entire side story about one of her serial killers who had this ridiculous name to go with his cold-themed torture, which somehow caused the preservation, but it needed editing and I forgot about it.

>What are you going to buy already
Order of priorities: Medkit, basic adventurer's bag, marbles.
>>
No. 117334 ID: 3abd97

>>117322
Isn't it Azure's blood that auto-ignites in contact with air? I would guess the head has already been drained of blood, and/or that being suspended in liquid (even flammable liquid) is sufficient to keep it from making contact with air.

Guessing aside, though, the head already works as an insurance policy. Let's say Azure goes off and gets killed and her ability is somehow blocked from saving her. So what do we do? Th party hands your head over to the Deva and asks her to res you. The head represents mortal remains that are pre-recovered.
>>
No. 117339 ID: f3e670

>>117322
Azure is welcome to half the marbles, and a personalized medkit might be more expensive, but useful given her particular needs. Kent and Isaiah just rolled very well to spend nearly 3 gold from Geoffrey's purse while he's out of town, and got most of the stuff I thought was useful, but extra supplies usually don't hurt- containers might be of particular use, and JamesLeng I believe listed some types and prices in thread 3.

Are we about ready to proceed with plan "Don't rock the boat?" I can still burn an OOC question, or finalize the details about how we're going to seal the quiver, but I think we've got the details down for right now.
>>
No. 117351 ID: 3abd97

>>117339
Isn't giving Azure a bunch of marbles basically turning her into a Claymore the next time she explodes?
>>
No. 117354 ID: fc3fc0

I thought it was merely combustion and subsequent burning to death, not really an explosion with enough to launch projectiles any distance. JamesLeng?

I’ll also go do the group inventory in the character sheet after I get confirmation on purchases
>>
No. 117371 ID: 094652

>the head already works as an insurance policy
>The head represents mortal remains that are pre-recovered.
I don't think that's how it works.

While having small pieces of yourself chopped off so your teammates can resurrect you later is a valid tactic -
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0783.html - resurrecting from pieces that were torn off BEFORE you died, or AFTER your latest resurrection, would be all too exploitable. If things worked this way, a retired adventurer could have his body parts chopped into tiny pieces once a month, resurrect from one, and prance about in dungeons knowing their cleric servant will just cast resurrection on the other body parts every day if something goes wrong! Pathfinder rules state "the portion receiving the spell must have been part of the creature’s body at the time of death". As in, the latest death.

The thing is, Azure's power is all about flipping the bird to the regular rules of resurrection. Her auto-revive condition is specifically when her charred remains (ashes and stuff) spontaneously burst into flames 24 hours after her death, and she appears intact. Whether or not the above "no resurrecting from body parts that were cut off before the latest resurrection" rule applies to her is kind of nebulous at this point, but I expect the answer is yes.
>>
No. 117374 ID: d22dc0

>>117371
This isn't a traditional pathfinder game, and I believed we actually discussed this point in the prior disc thread, but her head should work to resurrect her, and if so, the combustion of her ashes wouldn't yield anything because she was already alive I believe. May have to fact check that though, but just know that we're not using strictly pathfinder rules and spells
>>
No. 117381 ID: d36af7

Basic first aid kit is $50, 2 lb. More elaborate medkit for use with a particular style of Esoteric Medicine is $200, 10 lb, and gives a +1 bonus to First Aid. Basic field surgery kit is $300, 15 lb. Spare bandages are $10, 1 lb for five or six applications.

>>117354
Yes, if Azure is on fire when she dies, she does explode. This deals 4d6+1 damage (calculated based on her body mass, assuming Strength 7 for someone with bird bones and a personal history of avoiding manual labor), modified by range: 3x damage to someone who swallowed her whole, 2x (or just assume all the dice came up 6) if she's being grappled, base damage for someone right up in her face but not touching, divide damage by three for someone one yard away, six at two yards, nine at three yards, and beyond that nobody's going to be taking more than a point or two or damage from the concussion. She also scatters burning fragments out to five yards, similar to a white phosphorous grenade. Beyond eight yards you're probably completely safe. If she was wearing a backpack crammed full of marbles or caltrops or something, that might cause 2d6 cutting damage per fragment out to a ten yard radius.

As for the debate of whether the head in a jar will work as a backup... that's a question for in-character knowledge skills. Occultism, Theology (any religion which has any sort of official opinion on phoenixes and/or the afterlife, or Comparative at -5), Thanatology, or some types of Esoteric Medicine would be enough for educated guesswork, and can be attempted even without training at the "saw this on TV once" level, but Hidden Lore (Elemental Fire) would be the best for a definitive answer. If that skill isn't available within the party, and you want to be sure, you could consult with NPC sages, or shop around for reference books. Knowledge skills generally operate at a penalty for highly specific and unusual questions, but there's also a +4 bonus when you already figured out the right answer (from some other skill or a lucky/obvious guess) and just need confirmation.

Alternatively someone could spend one of their weekly patron-benefit questions, or simply test it and see what happens.
>>
No. 117382 ID: d36af7

If you're worried about broken or otherwise crippled limbs and have at least six gold to spare, you could also buy some elven-made orthopedic braces. Specialized by body part (right or left, hand or foot or arm or leg or ribcage or pelvis or neck, etc.), strap it on right after the injury occurs and get +3 on the roll to see whether you can recover without surgery (or heavy-duty magic), and, if so, how long it takes.
>>
No. 117431 ID: fc3fc0

Question: is Kent’s whole body sticky? Or just hands and feet? Is it restricted to skin without pores, or something else that applies to that general region? Do Elves even have the same basic kind of skin structures that humans do, like pores that secrete sebum, and poreless palms/soles?
>>
No. 117442 ID: d36af7

>>117431
No part of Kent's body is sticky. Impact velocity combined with temporary liquefaction of stone creates a tight seal and strong but temporary connection, the exact mechanics of which are unclear. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_block#Wringing

Elves which have not consumed significant quantities of quintessential food are physiologically similar to humans, enough so that a real-world biologist looking at autopsy data could reasonably figure they have a common ancestor no further back than Homo Habilis. A doctor or surgeon trained exclusively with humans could practice on such elves at only -2 to skill. Eyes and ears may be larger and more sensitive, a few metabolic oddities (varying by environment), but all the major organs are in the same places, doing the same things. For one with relatively mild mutations like Kent, that would be -3 to skill. For Kent's great-aunt who looks kinda like https://tgchan.org/kusaba/draw/res/29755+50.html#36312 it'd be -5.
>>
No. 117443 ID: 094652

So does Azure tag along, or should she stay behind to manage the remaining party members at the town? She's falling behind on exp, but she was assigned second in command by Nistamatsin.
>>
No. 117444 ID: e9490d

>>117442
Sticky was a word of convince- I’m aware that they aren’t really “sticky” I just wasn’t sure if their whole body would cling to stone, or just certain areas.
Aunt Destiny Adler is perhaps part of the reason Kent regards arachnids so fondly

>>117443
The more the merrier! It’s no fun to role play in town by yourself while everyone is in the dungeon.
>>
No. 117455 ID: d36af7

>>117443
As an architect, do you want to be sitting around staring at the same half-dozen wooden buildings of the truck stop/motel/quik-e-mart complex? Or exploring the ruins, where somebody urgently needs an expert opinion on whether any given wall is load-bearing, or okay to smash?
>>
No. 117460 ID: 3abd97

>>117455
Oh, hey, that's a fun angle I hadn't thought about. Azure's background certainly gives her connections that will be useful when we get to the repairs and rebuilding phase.
>>
No. 117463 ID: af6e04

I'm guessing the reason Nistamatsin doesn't smell any fresh mangoes is that he's pinging as an angel for the sake of Valeno's curse. Hmmm
>>
No. 117464 ID: 094652

Forgot about spell prep, I don't usually play spellcasters. What's sad is all the days those spells aren't cast.

Azure has prepared two charges of Cure Light Wounds and one charge of Remove Fear.

I'm starting to regret getting Fool's Gold. when would be a good time to use 6 gold pieces to dupe someone? There are many different situations where giving a gold piece, even as a transaction, is suspicious.
>>
No. 117467 ID: d22dc0

So do we passively gain "skill points" as we level up? I know there's no real nitty gritty detailed list for us, just sort of going off generally accepted rules, character backgrounds and precedent, but I was looking at all the proficiency Isaiah gets for accepting the waves mystery, trying to imagine him doing cartwheels and such, and I was curious.

On a similar note, there's a pathfinder mechanic where you get either a bonus skill point, hit point, or bonus based on race every level, and I was mostly looking at the list of bonuses going "Man, sure would be nice to learn more spells." I know we don't really do racially based bonuses and such, but if we have any options to get more tools in our belt I'll gladly take them.
>>
No. 117468 ID: 3abd97

>Forgot about spell prep, I don't usually play spellcasters
I'm pretty sure you can get away with handwaving it for non-cleric casters in this game. I haven't been preparing specific spells in advance for Davistina, just keeping track of charges spent/remaining (like Final Fantasy 1 or 3). I haven't seen Ji or Maru prep spells either.

Rhea sorta needs it though, since if I don't specify what she prayed for, her spell list is all the spells.
>>
No. 117481 ID: d36af7

>>117463
Valeno's demon-attracting scent hasn't had time to propagate that far. Dungeon air circulation tends to be poor in general, this dungeon in particular has been noted as having dangerously bad air in some spots, and there are closed doors in the way.
>>
No. 117482 ID: d36af7

>>117467
I'm mostly using GURPS rather than Pathfinder skill rules, and not keeping a particularly strict accounting of points. Any time there's a level-up or training montage, just specify what you want to be getting better at. Backflips? That's the acrobatics skill. Unless you mean underwater backflips (aquabatics) or wacky stunts while flying (aerobatics). GURPS has literally hundreds of skills, even without considering specialties - and for many of those skills, specialization isn't optional, like with theology for different religions.

The good news is, excelling at one skill improves related skills incidentally. Acro-, Aero, and Aqua-batics all default to each other at -4, so if you've got skill 16 in one of them, that provides skill 12 in the other two at no extra cost.
>>
No. 117483 ID: d22dc0

>>117482
I don’t think I’ll have Isaiah preforming underwater backflips anytime soon, or at least not training to do then in any case.

Speaking of skills, and what people are good at, any chance we could flesh out Kent’s advancements? Getting better at their specialty, engineering/articicing with a focus in older technologies, would be the main goal, but other than mentioning a few different classes I don’t think we worked out any specifics. I generally like to know what exactly my options and capabilities are before jumping into dangerous territory. I liked the roguish gadgeteer vibe, having bonuses to all the stuff you need to preform heists on rich folks libraries, while also having advancements that represent Kent’s tinkering and quizzical side. Being able to reliably aim and land longer distance jumps would also be nice, although it’s second or third on the list. Not really interested in the backstabby stealth attack nature of rogue, and while uncanny dodge and evasion are both super nice, they’re not really what I imagined Kent being skilled at.
On the other side, I like everything in the artificer class, but there’s nothing relevant or applicable to Kent’s background as a sneak. The rogue talents and bonuses have a lot of focus on diplomacy and bluff, and I think it’d be very ammusing to have the drow who refuses to talk in front of a crowd be the flirtatious diplomat.

Advice from anyone regarding class progression for Kent is welcome at this point, although if my goal really is to get clarity I think JamesLeng is the only one who can give a final say on anything
>>
No. 117498 ID: af6e04

>>117481
Ah, that makes sense. Still puzzling over that gotcha clause, think I might use my OOC question to ask what it is.

I just can't do Geoffrey's dialogue/rants nearly as well as Riotmode did. Sigh
>>
No. 117501 ID: d36af7

Just to clarify, thread 6 is waiting on someone taking some sort of action for which they roll dice.
>>
No. 117502 ID: f0eaf4

>>117501
I've been waiting for the go-ahead from magey, but I guess we've mostly decided on a course of action. I can roll that diplomacy check with the bosun
>>
No. 117512 ID: f3e670

>>117502
As was I. Things are more fun when you rush in and have a little chaos and uncertainty though. Let’s hope the Bosun is amenable to a 9 because this whole plan hinges on him.
>>
No. 117513 ID: 3abd97

>>117502
>>117512
Whups, sorry guys. Been a busy week, and I got distracted. You have my retroactive green light.
>>
No. 117517 ID: d22dc0

>>117513
Don’t worry, I figured something like that was going on- it’s not really fair to you if we force you to do all the planning and work either; you just seem to be the best at it out of all of us so I think often times we default to your leadership- at least I do. Take your time, there’s no rush
>>
No. 117546 ID: 094652

Note that I'm retroactively claiming Pog's neck bracer goes around his neck so that he doesn't strangle himself to death with the chains from his tools. Youngmasons found that most of their dumber orc slaves have enough instincts to keep dense or sharp things AWAY from their eyeballs, but not ropes from their necks. This one has a partial coverage design, it gives just enough space to move but prevents pressure around the front of the neck where most choking takes place. Hurts like a &!+(#, but Pog's worn this his whole life, to prevent him from choking himself whenever he's playing around with his weapons. I'm mostly posting this so there's no "Azure accidentally strangled Pog to death by flying around with Attention Deficit Disorder", and Pog's strong enough to stand in place if Azure darts at full speed.
>>
No. 117548 ID: d36af7

>>117546
I already considered Pog's armor to be effectively incorporating an anti-garotte collar. It's possible to choke him by yanking on the chains, but his windpipe can't be crushed that way, and wrapping a noose around the outside of the collar isn't very effective.
>>
No. 117550 ID: d36af7

So, Santova, you willing to have Tellus Matrem jump in and maybe rescue Valeno from the leeches? Wouldn't have to join the party long-term. Couldn't join immediately, in fact, due to time paradox: have to set off marching up north pretty soon to deliver that letter on schedule.
>>
No. 117552 ID: fc3fc0

>>117550
I’d be happy to- you also have my express and explicit permission to use any of my character ideas as references or NPCs because by the time I’ve typed something out here I’m probably already working on the next idea; I just really enjoy making characters, in general and in this system, so I’d be happy to churn out some ideas. Let me know the five W’s for Tellus to try and save the day
>>
No. 117590 ID: 094652

Question: Did you just copy a stock dungeon map for the Mouth Of Doom? Please tell me you used software to generate that map...
>>
No. 117591 ID: 3abd97

>>117590
Well, I mean, he used software to crop, censor and/or alter it.

But yeah, many of the 'official' maps are clearly source-book derived. Taking the good bits from other things and using them to suit our needs is kinda how this game works.
>>
No. 117593 ID: d36af7

>>117590
>Please tell me
I'm, ah... *adjusts glasses* ...not actually seeing you anywhere on my list of patrons, Kome. For OOC info like that, you'd need to be contributing monthly at the $5 level or higher.
>>
No. 117594 ID: e9490d

>>117590
Makes it easier on everyone if the maps are pre-made. Less work for JamesLeng, we know it’s not arbitrary and that we could theoretically find a matching map if we were that way inclined, seems like an overall win to me
>>
No. 117603 ID: d36af7

I'm thinking about properly explaining and applying the GURPS Mass Combat rules for resolving Vos's retreat from the sharkmarines, since it's such a weird situation at this point - sorta like an amphibious assault in reverse, or some bizarre mirror-universe miniature Dunkirk Evacuation.
>>
No. 117604 ID: 3abd97

>>117603
I'm just trying to stop laughing over Vos' flock of loving octowasps.

I figure 'Prisoner' would factor in if he sticks out of the quiver- if it's telepathic, it should be able to sense the sharkmen within a certain distance, right? Although given they can smell Vos at range, that doesn't solve anything by itself.
>>
No. 117605 ID: d36af7

Let's see, if the nearer trireme is diverted, that's a war galley, two units of medium infantry, and... honestly the arcane archers probably count as basic battle mages rather than mundane bowmen. B-rank competence all around, corresponding to "Long-service professional soldiers, or troops from warrior backgrounds that emphasis early and realistic combat training," 'cause they're active-military elves but the really elite types don't get stuck on customs duty. A-rank gear for the ship itself and the infantry, but C-rank gear for the 'mages' since their actual spell selection is bare-bones. And the marine modifier, of course.

Relevant sharkmen are... let's say five units of amphbious warriors (the book specifically mentions weresharks as an example), C-rank competence for "enthusiastic and skilled part-time militia," B-rank gear representing the ice spears and disease precautions, and the Impetuous and All-Weather modifiers.

Decaro Vos and the octowasps I'm going to treat more or less as a unit of light cavalry with the hovercraft modifier, C-rank gear and D-rank competence for "enthusiastic but very inexperienced."

Esmeraude counts as an entire unit of flying mages by herself (the 'hero' modifier), with A-rank competence for "raised from childhood as full-time soldiers" but D-rank equipment since she's short on contextually-applicable heavy artillery equivalents and her best C3I spells are outgoing only. Her bodyguard is equivalent to a similarly elite (and possibly better-equipped) unit of heavy infantry, with swamp affinity that might be extremely useful... if you're willing to let him off the leash. That would be something of an all-or-nothing decision, since Maria's not available to fine-tune the bindings.

Less certain how to represent the remainder of the group already on shore. Individualistic adventurers who prefer a stand-up fight over skirmishing normally count as medium infantry, but between Viste and Yisheng Ji's powers, flying infantry almost seems like a better fit.
>>
No. 117606 ID: 3abd97

>>117605
This does sort of assume (a) we're willing to commit to fighting the local military and not allowing Vos to surrender or be captured and (b) that the others locate Vos in time to assist instead of bugging out of the search radius.

I mean, consequence-wise, I sort of feel we're better off not fighting the local military. Even if we don't lose any of our own, we're likely going to be made to regret any losses we inflict.
>>
No. 117608 ID: d36af7

>>117606
GURPS Mass Combat encompasses options such as winning the initial recon and then deciding not to engage, or, after the battle has begun, orderly retreat without any attempt to inflict damage. That "full retreat" strategy actually gives you +8 on the opposed roll, AND reduces friendly casualties for the round by 10%, so on a tie or better your side takes no damage unless the enemy was so desperate to hurt you that they'd disregard their own safety. Even if they do, your side might still get away clean if you win by 7 points or more. On a failure, most of your force still gets away, minus some casualties - and in the context of a police action, 'casualties' mostly means captured rather than killed.

The Misfortunes of War table is a nice impartial mechanism for determining which of the PCs get in trouble and by how much. Main meaningful decision for individual characters is the 'risk modifier.' Taking more risks makes your side as a whole more likely to succeed, but also means you're more likely to be personally paying the price if they don't, or even if that success is any less than perfect.
>>
No. 117610 ID: 3abd97

>if you're willing to let him off the leash. That would be something of an all-or-nothing decision, since Maria's not available to fine-tune the bindings.
Wait how would we even do that without Maria? The bondage expert who tried and failed to force it, and who got burned and magically impregnated for her trouble, was arguably more qualified to break the bindings than the rest of us. Unless the Fire Hawks are keyed into the bindings as authorized users?
>>
No. 117616 ID: fc3fc0

>>117605

Sounds like our main options are engage the local militia or let Vos try to sort things out on their own. We’re up against 7-8 units of military, which is 42-128 soldiers by my count- a force which given our previous experience in Ecton, we might actually be able to beat. In Ecton there were more attackers, with better equipment, but there were more defenders and we have surprise. We also didn’t engage the whole army at once. Still, I think depending on how the dice roll, we do have a chance to win if we end up engaging. Vos alone probably doesn’t stand a good chance of success- at least, not with the mass combat rules; I don’t know all the details, but I’m pretty sure the modifiers for being outnumbered 10-1 affect your success pretty drastically, and it only gets worse the close we get to 20-1. Even in a full retreat, it’s probably gonna be a serious gamble. Then, there’s the question of what you do in the event of a success- getting back together with the group, who can’t tell what’s happening, might be an issue. All around it seems like Vos resisting has heavy consequences, although we don’t really know what the consequences for submitting are. Worst case, Vos is probably purged of “parasites” and at risk for execution. On the lighter end, it turns out this was all a big misunderstanding and they don’t hurt Vos at all, some gold and a bit of paper work is all that we need to arrange for.

If we think we need to, or if this isn’t a particularly fun roadblock, I can burn a weekly question to address the odds of success and what options are more likely to yield favorable results, but if Viste and Vos and all aren’t too bothered by it then we can just roll the dice and see what happens, no gaming the system required.

I’ll join in with Tellus soon, I’m trying to get an idea of the personality and how they might converse or approach things down in my head before I do anything.
>>
No. 117621 ID: d36af7

>>117610
The guild expert misunderstood the situation, and tried to speed things up with a knife. When someone hires her to remove bondage, it's almost always amateur hour gone wrong, so customer satisfaction correlates much more closely with speed and discretion than with listening to whatever ridiculous face-saving story they made up on the walk over.

Maria significantly reconfigured the bindings based on feedback from that incident, and instructed Davina and Decaro Vos (who may have ill intentions for her little brother but at least doesn't seem inept or malevolent enough to needlessly get a whole lot of innocent people killed), and possibly others (but definitely not Esmeraude), in how to untie it all without divine backlash, in case some 'godzilla threshold' type event should occur while Maria herself was incapacitated or unavailable.
>>
No. 117624 ID: 3d2d5f

>>117616
>In Ecton there were more attackers, with better equipment
I don't recall the rank and file of the bandit army in Ekton having enchanted equipment like these marines do. (And a bandit army having a better standard of rank and file issued equipment than a standing military with proper funding and close to home sure would go against my expectations).

>Even in a full retreat, it’s probably gonna be a serious gamble
Not really? JL just said we had a plus 8 for running away, and if we start the portal hopping before they close, we can move a hell of a lot faster than they can. Seems much less of a gamble than engaging, especially if Vos is effectively acting as a distraction.

Retreating with Vos is more risky, I suppose, since we have to get to him and lose some of those advantages trying to back away after.

>All around it seems like Vos resisting has heavy consequences, although we don’t really know what the consequences for submitting are.
Worst case for capture: we lose the quiver before we can sell it, Vos is detained in a way we can't free him or killed, 'Prisoner's' existence is made public and Ji's parasite eats his brain or otherwise lashes out realizing it has been made.

Worst case for engaging: we're put down by the military, or we get away with expensive losses, or we do enough damage getting away / winning that we rile up the resources of the city against us.

Both cases could also include causing significant delays or problems for our merchant clients, or being denied access to the city.

Surrender worst case might be mitigated if 'Prisoner' split with the quiver before Vos is caught (although we might still never see it again) and if Vos gets a good diplomacy roll?

There's risks both ways, but I can imagine scenarios we talk or bribe Vos out of dodge after. Kicking the army's butt might be good for our long term rep (to an extent), but I don't see how we spin it to work with any of our current objectives.
>>
No. 117626 ID: af6e04

>light cavalry with the hovercraft modifier
My hovercraft is full of bees

>>117605
This seems pretty stacked against us on first impressions, but I really don't know much about GURPS mass combat rules
>>
No. 117627 ID: fc3fc0

>>117624
I know we get a plus 8, but they have better equipment, and outnumber Vos somewhere between 10-1 and 20-1, which I'm guessing gives them some pretty serious bonuses to their rolls too.
>>
No. 117637 ID: d36af7

>>117627
Let's say it's just Decaro Vos and the octowasps versus the sharkmen. By headcount, he's outnumbered 5:1, but differences in equipment quality make the effective odds factor 10:1, which would give a strategy skill bonus of +12 to the sharkmen. However, they don't have any fast cavalry equivalent, so Vos's team gets +3 for superiority within that special class, effectively canceling out the sharkmen's similar bonus for naval superiority. With the +8 for a full retreat, he's only at a 4-point disadvantage, which would be surmountable with other modifiers or simple luck. Even on a failure, Vos personally probably gets away. To actually be captured, first his force would need to take at least 5% casualties. Then he'd need to get a critical "success" on the Misfortunes of War roll, and even then he gets a choice between surrender and taking 6d6 injury (which bypasses armor, since rather than a single specific attack it represents the enemy having found some credible way to threaten you).

Let's say Esmeraude gets involved. Despite the penalty for being unable to breathe water during a mainly underwater fight, her effective troop strength brings the odds factor down to about 2.5:1, so that +12 is cut back to a +4, and she adds four more types of uncontested special class superiority (air, artillery, C3I, and direct-fire), giving your team an eight-point advantage, or sixteen with the bonus from a full retreat. Adding in the war galley would swing that somewhat back the other way, of course, including enemy mages contesting those special class superiority bonuses, but they still wouldn't have any airborne force.
>>
No. 117639 ID: 3abd97

>>117637
This is sooooorta getting deeper into the mechanical weeds than I really like, but what I'm reading is "if you want Vos to have good odds of escaping, you guys should help him to stack bonuses".

>>117616
>if this isn’t a particularly fun roadblock
I mean, personally I'm a lot more excited at the prospect of getting to muck around in town than dealing with these marines, but Vos is consistently on point for getting wonderfully entertaining outcomes, whether stuff is going right or wrong for him.
>>
No. 117642 ID: af6e04

>Vos is consistently on point for getting wonderfully entertaining outcomes, whether stuff is going right or wrong for him.
I know right? Haha it's like a gift
>>
No. 117643 ID: fc3fc0

>>117637
Ah, then I misunderstood the headcount; I was going off a gurps rule page for mass combat that stated a squad was 6-16 troops; if vos is a squad, and there's a bunch of other squads, then odds place you at anywhere between 2.7:1 up to a 22:1 troop disparity, and that would be numbers alone. If we take the averages, Vos is still outnumbered 7:1, so i figured it was better to high ball it a little and give us some wiggle room when counting our odds.

Personally I like knowing the nitty gritty rules and all the odds- never liked gambling, so it helps offset my natural proclivity to underestimate us and overestimate the bad guys.

JamesLeng has been gracious enough to grant us some OOC info on the odds already, and given that they're not stacked too heavily against us, I think it's fine to roll the dice and hope for the best.
>>
No. 117649 ID: af6e04

I got caught up in the character creation hype. This time, I wanted to try something new and make a character who wasn't a monster boy. Let's see how well I did.

Matthew Lathuft
Rich Bastard

Specialization: Breaking and entering
Ambitions: Stealing valuable things from powerful individuals / Gambling
Phobia: Dragons

Left hip - Rope + grappling hook
Right hip - Candles
Left shoulder - Big Hammer
Right shoulder - More Rope
Chest/neck - Tools for lockpicking, quick but subtle forced entry (big pliers, hand saw, etc.), and disabling magical traps (chisel wrapped in miseltoe, etc.)
Top of head - Leather armor (more of a wide-brimmed hat, really)
Somewhere uncomfortable - The 'Slaad Eye' gem. Huge, famous, beautiful, completely unfenceable.

Growing up poor, at a young age he realized he had a knack for sneaking, climbing, and blending in with the socially elite. It didn't take long for him to start putting those skills to use. Soon he was stealing more for the thrill than for any sort of financial need, but he's in a bit of a legal bind after his latest heist. Never carries a weapon.
>>
No. 117668 ID: fc3fc0

>>117649
Helen isn’t a monster boy! She just has a horrify, Cthulhu esque abomination on her back.

That being said, I like the look of your mission impossible style heist boy. I too was thinking of doing a no power character, although I’m not sure I want to commit to that kind of restriction- the powers can be incredibly helpful, and define a character more so they fit an image or an idea; having a phobia, mutation and weakness all lend themselves to more fun an interesting character, for me at least. It’s hard to say no to all that and give up half the character customization options
>>
No. 117671 ID: 3abd97

Hmmm. I wonder if the target moving through a portal would interrupt a true-strike arrow's pathing, especially if it closed.

Game theory wise, I feel like it probably would have been the best move if we all picked +3, but it felt too in-character to hold back from going all out.

>>117649
Does the gem do anything? Seems kind of a shame if the very expensive item is just a MacGuffin.

I sorta regretted not defining anything specific about Dav's sword compared to the magic items some other characters got (although I do enjoy the running 'magic sword' lie to imply a weakness or limitation that isn't there. Misrepresenting your powers and weaknesses is good).

>>117668
Or is she a horrifying monster that wears an absentminded scholar on her front.

You commentary on no-power was sorta how I ended up feeling about Marijke. I had fun with her, but ended up regretting the low level of weirdness compared to the rest of the group. Not having those options to play off of is less fun imo.
>>
No. 117672 ID: d36af7

Some pretty weird stuff is possible without innate powers. For example, I've kinda been wanting somebody else to try something like Yeven Surgis's active-scan-only vision.
>>
No. 117673 ID: af6e04

>Helen isn’t a monster boy!
>Or is she a horrifying monster that wears an absentminded scholar on her front.
Hmmmm

>Does the gem do anything? Seems kind of a shame if the very expensive item is just a MacGuffin.
Oh hopefully. I'd rather not know what it does though, least at first. I like the idea that he just stole it thinking it was sort of super valuable gem without knowing about its eldritch magical powers. In 5e at least, a slaad eye can be used to control the chaotic outsider frog monsters.

>I do enjoy the running 'magic sword' lie to imply a weakness or limitation that isn't there
The lie can be double-edged though! (haha) If people know it's an innate power, you'll probably attract less sword thieves.

>It’s hard to say no to all that and give up half the character customization options
>low level of weirdness compared to the rest of the group
Yeah but at the same time there's something strangely satisfying playing the relatively normal character to play against all the wackiness. Also being the only one who's not dropping dead because of their allergy to crucifixes or going mad because of their fear of interpretive dance or whatever.

And I think it fits the archetype very well. The simple thief who defeats their supernatural foe with wits rather than special powers.
>>
No. 117674 ID: 094652

>>843624
>If Azure is confident in her ability to charm these men while she has a giant orc breathing down their necks, she must be an incredible seductress.
Well, yes. Also, it's a tactic; suppose you're looking at a nubile harpy girl with cute puppy eyes and bouncing tits. Something in your subconscious tells you this is too good to be true, you need a break, so you look away. You can't turn your back on the bodyguard, and if anything the bodyguard is the one who stands the most to get a sneak attack in while you're distracted, so you look at him. Him and his butt-ugly, grease spattered, fatass pork face. You feel sick and disoriented. The harpy girl regains your attention while you're debilitated with a high note, and goes back to her smooth bouncing motions. Now you just want to focus on her.

Basically, it's a sexy cop, ugly cop scenario; you pay attention to the sexy, then get paranoid, then look away, then see the ugly, then get sick, now you just want to look at the sexy to get that ugly out of your head.

And Azure doesn't seem like a noble to others without a giant dumbass bodyguard following her around; more like an escaped beastwoman sex slave. She's kidnapped less frequently when Pog's around.
>>
No. 117675 ID: fc3fc0

>>117671
I would hate to act like i know the rules and feed everyone misinformation again, but from what i understand, the +3 verses -3 makes it more dangerous for us- -3 shows us being conservative, and not taking risks, and therefore reduces the likelihood
of casualties and bad stuff happening- those catastrophe rolls jamesLeng mentioned, that can result in 6d6 damage, or getting capture? The +3 makes those bad results more likely from what I understand. As a player, I think it'd be in our favor for everyone to take lower numbers, something in the negatives, although I don't quite understand the trade off there; I felt like fore Maru the +3 made sense though. Go all out, and risk your own hide, for the sake of glory and protecting those that are important to you. Makes in character sense I think. I think it makes sense for Vos to go for glory and risk his hide for his octo-squad too, although doing so places his children at risk, so that's a rock and a hard place kinda deal. Given that I don't quite understand the +/- trade off, I cant be sure what makes sense for Viste, but I was assuming she'd be less for glory, and more for conservation; sacrifice the pawns to save the special pieces kind of deal, as opposed to rushing in herself so others can make it away more safely.

And when i read back over the old threads, all the way until, and after I joined in, I very much liked Marjike, and thought she & the sun paladin who's name I don't wanna mispell were great examples of how you can define a character and make them fun without writing wacky mechanics on paper. The part where she gets high on opium in the goblin caves, her reactions to Riv scrambling around and gathering up her blood, her general disposition and stuff I thought were really fun. I think she and Davina are really similar, character wise, despite their very different backgrounds, builds, and circumstances. You're really good at playing the managerial leader, trying to manager her crew of dissatisfied employees who aren't willing to do what they signed up for.

I also, really enjoyed playing Riv, even if she was a pushy thorn in the side. It was a little bit of a darker take on her than I had done before, just through the setting and world building, but the prodigal alchemist who hates everyone was a fun character to play as.

>>117672
I agree that you can still do some pretty out there stuff; doesn't negate the fact that you do loose some dimensions of definition when you take out those hard and fast, immutable traits. I can say Maru doesn't like, for instance, people in priest garb, but I still have agency over how she acts. When you have a strict phobia that you have to roll against, it really impacts your character, and forces you to get creative with how you play. The same goes for all those special features; unless it's written under one of the 4 headers, role-playing and everything else is a little more flexible. I know that sounds like it shouldn't be a complaint, but it's kinda the situation where too much freedom gets boring- if my characters can do anything I say, then it's not really as much of a game anymore. Challenges and obstacles and roadblocks and such are what make a game fun and interesting and engaging, and those character headers impose new rules that add a few extra pieces to every puzzle.

As for radar sight, I wasn't planning on doing exactly that, but I was thinking about a character having a fungal parasite; lost their eyes, but they gained blind sight kind of deal.

On the subject of weird sight, I was also thinking of someone who's mutation was a were-animal type situation, but the were-animal was a separate individual with their own personality, who would have a full phobia, mutation (were person) and supernatural weakness to counter balance their fortune telling power. I thought it would be fun to have boring, average joe who turns into a mystical other-worldly being by accident sometimes.

>>117673
I think that description in particular really makes the character click for me, it's a fun concept! Your powers and characters are usually pretty interesting no mater what you do- mutations, history eating, face stealing, all your powers and stuff are pretty much universally useful and fun.

Although nothing has been quite as handy as portaling everywhere. I also thought Ji had a really cool power, and was kind of jealous that I wouldn't be able to make a character who could do the same thing without, well, stealing that idea and having my characters do the same thing. There's already plenty of ideas on my list though, so I think I can survive without weightless floating.
>>
No. 117679 ID: d36af7

>>117674
>sexy cop, ugly cop
That might work on squeamish townies, but bandits who've already been having a run of bad luck aren't going to regard Pog as any less of an immediate threat just because he's ugly, and might be temperamentally incapable of turning up their noses at 'too good to be true.' If they were calm, cautious, and disciplined, they wouldn't have become bandits - or they'd at least be successful bandits.

If you don't want Azure going in alone, what about Rhea? She's fireproof.

>>117675
Risk modifier affects two rolls: Misfortunes of War, where higher risk makes you more likely to be hurt, captured, or killed, and Significant Actions, where higher risk makes you more likely to do something that affects the whole course of the battle in some way which benefits your side - mechanically, giving +1 to that round's strategy roll on a success, +2 on a crit, or -1 on a botch.
>>
No. 117680 ID: 3abd97

>>117674
Good cop / bad cop is a routine you generally play when you're in a position of control, though. The point of this scenario was largely giving the bandits the illusion of control over Azure, and seeing how they acted. (And having an unseen axe looming over there head, in the form of a explosion in an enclosed space if they chose to abuse that control).

Putting Pog in the room sort of undercuts that dynamic? (And exposes him to the explosion too).

>>117672
Well sure, but you have more slots for weirdness when you take an innate power than not.

>>117675
>>117679
>rules and risk
As I understand it, it's something like the prisoner's dilemma tradeoff. The group is better off if you choose to be nice / brave, but you're more personally at risk if something does go wrong / if someone chooses to be selfish at your expense.

>>117675
>I think she and Davina are really similar, character wise
If that's really the impression I can't help but think I've gone pretty wrong somewhere.

Marijke... was sort of a hot mess who stumbled into a position of authority as the (comparatively) straight women to a band of misfits. Who for some reason trusted her, insisted she should be in charge, and that she should take the lion's share of the money. And she remained honestly quite confused as to how that happened. And uncertain and conflicted between her own greed, her self worth, and trying to be a good person when she didn't really know for sure what that meant. (Especially with her specialization and greed). Uncertainty, conflict and muddling through defined Marijke for me.

Never came up, but sexuality would have probably come down to "quite confused and befuddled by this whole sex thing" and "really relieved Dimitry never approached her over his mind control fetish".

Davina's a hell of a lot more confident, knows exactly what she wants, and is proactively working towards it. Questions of right and wrong matter a lot less when you're driven by a mandate you have absolute confidence in. She's probably more ruthless and more compassionate than Marijke was. Actually a lot of compatibility with green elf ideals from what we've learned. Strong respect for professionalism, merit, and mastery (which with her duty and obligations sort of merge into an expectation / demand / need for her own excellence). Davina's got her contradictions (casual sex / legacy, discipline / hedonism, direct and to the point / stealthy, ruthless / compassionate), but they're more a source of strength, or defining character, than confusion.

>You're really good at playing the managerial leader, trying to manager her crew of dissatisfied employees
The managerial style is mostly me bleeding through, although my philosophical approach to running both pirate crew and mercenary company is strongly influenced by Schlock Mercenary and/or The Seventy Maxims of Maximally Effective Mercenaries (I own a hard copy of the later).

Marijke's mercantile background started out as a tiny spec in her background that pretty quickly grew to be more important than anything written in her stats. In character, she suddenly found herself in a situation where she could take something she knew, and use it, and do well, and she rode it for all it was worth. She may not have known how to be an adventurer, or a captain, but she knew that.

As a character, Dav was really never intended to be the managerial leader, she just grew to fill that role when no else stepped up to do so, and when the dual nature of the magical child class made it convenient. In character, pre-Viste Davina modeled herself pretty strongly after her father. Then, she shunted / surrendered several important parts of what had been her identity to Viste, forcing some readjustment. Post-Viste Davina is her modelling herself much more after her mother.
>>
No. 117719 ID: d36af7

Tellus and Valeno are currently up against half a dozen giant leeches, a swarm of rats, and a minor demon with a moderately cunning plan. I'd like to resolve (or at least significantly progress) that situation before the raid on the bandit lair, both for in-setting timing reasons and to more effectively manage my own mental swap space.
>>
No. 117720 ID: 0e104f

>>117719
Sorry about the delay everyone, busy weekend. I’ll post a character sheet and action soon hopefully, given some luck and free time. I’m still active and checking up, just not together enough to gather all my details quite yet.
>>
No. 117737 ID: 3abd97

Awkward question: is Yisheng Ji's and Tchalcedo's situation going to be resolved while we're in town? I sort of assume Overmire is Tchalcedo's last stop on this trip, since we're only going to retrace our steps after this, bringing her closer to her old cell and where Yikk Tasst is already operating. And you know, lots of things for a new spy cell to look into in a big city.

Awkward since Tunic hasn't posted in over a month and it would be preferable for him to resolve it, but I'd really like to not have to consider what I'm letting a spy see for the entire return trip. (In character, Dav would probably pressure Vos to pressure Ji if it looked like nothing was happening).

Least toe stepping way might be to gloss over the details so Tunic could retroactively play through things later if and when he returns.
>>
No. 117743 ID: 20ea96

>>117737
Hi. Sorry for being absent. I've been dealing with a number of issues in my own life recently, and participating in this quest has been really emotionally exhausting for me. Taking on the parasite by choice only to learn almost immediately afterward that I really just took on an excuse to kill off my character anytime a particular npc (aka the DM) decides to "bore him hollow" like Sage Frist, was really not a great feeling. I didn't really want to say anything about it because I felt like my character's now being held hostage against me as a player pissing off the DM, and complaining about it would do exactly that. I still didn't really want to post this, because I feel like JamesLeng will take offense to something I'm saying and I'll have to spend many, many more posts (and hours of composition) trying to justify why I feel uncomfortable, but I guess I can't really avoid that at this point.

Trust me, I want to get rid of the parasite more than anyone, and if I knew how to do it, I absolutely would. I know I could just Diligent Vermifuge it away, but my character would have to break their code of honor to do so, and if I've learned anything from Sgt. Nick, it's that there is a zero percent chance JamesLeng wouldn't hold such a decision against me until the end of time, bringing it up at any opportunity and finding unique and colorful ways to punish me for it (as I felt was done with "Sir" Garaile). Since I'm not willing to invest real money in a deus ex machina, I honestly don't know how to handle the situation. I don't even know what I need to do to offload the creature on someone else.

Taking on this huge dilemma was a huge mistake on my part, and to add insult to injury, the creature's group initially refused to even pay or reward me in any way (again with the implicit threat of murder if my character proved too difficult for them to work with), which was another huge sucker-punch for my character who literally has being paid for his services as a lower ambition. I managed to at the very least beg for a few herbs as reimbursement, and the very next scene was "The blockade cuts off your ability to get supplies, including water, so all your herbs will probably die, haha.", which, coupled with some real-life issues I've been having, was when I decided I needed to take a break.

I haven't really been reading or interacting with the quest since then, so I apologize for not being up to speed on everything. I just checked in today because I'm coming out of the tail end of the worst of my current real-life problems.

If there's something (non-monetary) I can do to help resolve this, I'm all ears. If there's nothing I can do, this is the last straw, and you're kicking me out, well, you've already got a convenient in-universe excuse for getting rid of me.

Sorry in advance if my words come off as grating or abrasive. I'm just trying to explain my point of view honestly.
>>
No. 117745 ID: ca4ff8

>>117743
I wouldn’t want to kick you out but it seems like
A) you feel as though the DM has a grudge against you, and is attempting to be vindictive, based on your past experiences
B) you aren’t having fun

JamesLeng has said many times he’s not targeting you, and isn’t trying to be vindictive. It seems as though this is not something that you believe; the major way to resolve this situation would, I believe, find a way that you can trust jamesLeng, and come to a place where you don’t feel you’re being personally targeted.

As for the second part, if you’re not having fun, don’t play. That’s a simple fix.

I’m sorry you feel the way that you do, as I missed your presence in the game. Good luck with your personal life, hopefully you can find an amiable path forward to the next chapter in your book
>>
No. 117746 ID: 3abd97

>>117743
I'll begin this by saying I'm glad to hear you're still around! I was beginning to fear you'd just dropped out and we'd never hear from you again, which I would have regretted. I enjoy having you in the game.

>bunch of real life problems, take a break
Those absolutely take priority over a game, and I can only hope those are going better for you.

>not being up to speed on everything
You only missed two encounters during the escort mission after we left Sage Frist's tower. There was a strike blocking resupply in one town, and later we had to run away from getting probed by a military patrol, which was nervous about people being infected by plant-monsters from the Green Tide. (I can write up a more detailed summary if you'd like).

We're currently sneaking into town to reconvene with the merchants, get paid, and then do shopping and such.

>If there's something (non-monetary) I can do to help resolve this, I'm all ears.
If you're interested in still playing, it seems to me you have a great opportunity to ditch the parasite honorably while we're in Overmire. There must be a suitable host somewhere in this city, and you could have an adventure getting ahold of one. Ji could probably even get some of the party to help him (although to satisfy the parasite's desire to stay hidden you'd probably need a cover story).

That was mostly why I posted- I want our doctor back, and didn't want to miss the chance to get him back.

>bore him hollow
It was my understanding she'd only try to kill you if she decided you'd betrayed her, or if she thought she was corned, and we just had to avoid that. And even in that worst case, it wouldn't be instantaneous and we would have a chance to try stuff, like Daviste trying to go intangible with Ji.

But yeah, I can understand why you would have felt trapped by that.

>not getting paid by the spies
Those thought to be extinct medical herbs might be more valuable than you think?

>real money in a deus ex machina
For future reference, if we're ever in a situation where we're gonna lose a teammate, I'm totally willing to spend an OOC question on their sake. I don't even use most of em.
>>
No. 117747 ID: d36af7

>>117743
>what I need to do to offload the creature on someone else
One possibility for this was already presented.
>>116470
>Option three, Yisheng Ji could wave around supposedly-extinct life-extension herbs to get a quick audience with the Prince, then have Tchalcedo eat the Prince's brain and assume his identity. At that point she could simply sort out the political situation by fiat, as payment to Yisheng Ji for services rendered.

That specific situation is no longer relevant, but might be useful as an illustration of the possibilities. As for the current scene, well, customs inspector at Overmire's perimeter might not be quite as nice a position as ruler of a city-state, but it certainly has no shortage of potential hooks for espionage.

>you're kicking me out
I've said it before and I'll say it again: I'm not kicking you out. It's frustrating as hell how those emotional scars from some previous horrifically abusive GM seem to be steering you to find the worst possible interpretations of some things and forget others (like how I explained in detail which courses of action would definitely be safe, and eventually ripped the teeth out of "Sir" Garaile's paladin code, retroactively, just to make you comfortable, rather than "holding it against you until the end of time," much less setting up any actual no-win or 'gotcha' situations for him), but I'd still be sad to see you go if you did decide to leave. I'll do what I can to persuade you to stay, and make the game more fun and engaging for you, within the limits of my responsibilities to the other players and other such commitments.

Yisheng Ji is a cool character, ascent to immortality and general vast mystical power is a cool story arc, and wanting to pursue that by being a divinely excellent doctor and getting paid at or above fair market rates for that service is a perfectly reasonable motivation. I'd like to see you doing more of that kind of thing, proactively, or at least setting up defenses against real in-setting threats, rather than worrying about how I could abuse my position to hurt your character for OOC reasons.

Yes, Tchalcedo could theoretically attack at any moment, but Yisheng Ji is unusually well-equipped to fight back (vermifuge, anti-healing, martial arts body-control techniques, maybe other things), and Tchalcedo would need an extraordinary reason to resort to such measures. If Yisheng Ji started working against her interests, she'd try to work out the problem and negotiate something mutually agreeable by telepathy, or figuratively twist his arm by literally constricting his innards, or, if he came up with a good counter to that, sink into a depressive sulk until the situation either improved or became utterly intolerable. She's a spy, first and foremost, an infiltrator. "Going loud" or "burning" a major contact is regarded as a last resort. Apart from reputation and professional ethics, Yisheng Ji is simply worth more alive. Tchalcedo would not be able to effectively imitate his divine or martial-arts powers, since the spiritual underpinnings would be missing, so his value as a cover identity would be short-lived. That makes finding a new host harder, and even if it could be accomplished there'd be a corpse to dispose of, which the other Fire Hawks would be honor-bound to track down and resurrect, and then he'd probably spill the beans since the Hippocratic Oath doesn't prohibit testimony on the subject of your own murder... it'd be a real ugly mess, from Tchalcedo's perspective, not a situation she'd dive into voluntarily while any plausibly better option remained.

On the subject of voluntarily getting into bad situations, this "tsochar host" gig is something Yisheng Ji knowingly and at least somewhat willingly signed up for. I'm not pursuing a railroad plot, but I am laying out a world which contains various obstacles and hazards, and playing various NPCs, some of whom are intelligent, many of whom do not have your best interests at heart, and absolutely all of whom have their own perspectives, interests, and agendas. Sometimes they're going to attempt to pursue those agendas with deception and/or intimidation rather than straight violence, because benefiting from someone's partial cooperation has obvious advantages over facing their direct opposition. You are allowed to not cooperate with NPCs, even outside fight scenes. You have my permission, same as everyone else here, and always did. Think about what you actually want to achieve in the game, instead of dowsing for http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ButThouMust in anything I say.

Do you need me to go back and compile a 'clip show' of unlikely plans that succeeded thanks to a timely crit, or powerful and well-informed NPCs (which some other GMs might have used as infalliable author avatars) who were nonetheless outwitted and/or violently subdued by the PCs? For that matter, cases where such characters were meaningfully confused by a rapidly developing situation, as evidence of my respect for partitioning IC and OOC knowledge?
>>
No. 117763 ID: 20ea96

>>117746
>>117747
That does make me feel a little better, thanks.

>voluntarily getting into bad situations
Well yes, that's part of the adventurer job description. It'd be absurd to try to avoid danger in a game about overcoming danger. Taking on the parasite was also a character decision based on Yisheng Ji not being a xenophobe who immediately attempts to murder any nonhumanoid creature he encounters, especially if he's just been asked to help them. Mainly my concerns came from feeling trapped options-wise, with a Sword of Damocles dangling long-term (possibly multiple threads) over my head, with apparently nothing I could do about it other than wait for a merciful opportunity allowing me to escape. Knowing Tchalcedo is, at the very least, not the impulsive type is a little comforting. That said, if I were playing Tchalcedo and I took on a host relatively well-equipped to deal with me who I later felt to be too dangerous to keep, I'd simply wait for a moment when my host would not be able to effectively defend themselves. Throttle them in their sleep, attack when they're already injured after a battle, incapacitate them while they're attempting to do something risky and difficult, etc. As a general rule, I don't feel comfortable around any potential enemy if I can step into their shoes and immediately come up with one or more near-guaranteed (short of a fumble or a crit) ways to defeat me.

>"burning" a major contact is regarded as a last resort
Such as if one found out a sworn hunter of one's kin has become aware of one's presence, and one's host is reluctant to leave said hunter's company?

>worst possible interpretations of some things
I'm just being cautious. Expecting and preparing for a worst case scenario that doesn't happen is better than taking things at face value and having unexpected things sprung on you. This sort of mindset is how I survived on a single character a rather long Pathfinder campaign that had a pretty significant body count. One of my particularly unlucky co-players, for example, lost five characters in that campaign. Refusing to put out Sgt. Nick with my only potable water in thread 1 is an action that stemmed from the very real fear of, say, running into some kind of desiccation trap or enemy in the next room and dying of thirst. I have been trying to tone down my paranoia since then, but old habits die hard. Though it's a little frustrating to be unable to micromanage my own inventory (or indeed even know what I'm carrying or how much money I have), it does help limit this sort of behavior.

All in all, my complaints mostly have to do with lacking sufficient knowledge or understanding of a situation to make an informed decision, when I feel like I really should have at least some measure of that information in-character, not with the situation itself. The fractured-dimension death blade spiral hallway, for example, was a situation I felt entirely comfortable and at home with, as I felt my (the player)'s understanding was caught up to speed with Yisheng Ji's understanding of the issue at hand.

I hope all that makes it a little easier to understand where I'm coming from.
>>
No. 117772 ID: d36af7

>>117763
>Such as if one found out a sworn hunter of one's kin has become aware of one's presence,
While the hunter is not attacking, possibly because of a hostage in the way, eliminating that hostage preemptively would be deeply unwise if there's any chance the hunter might notice.
>and one's host is reluctant to leave said hunter's company?
If the host is being otherwise cooperative, or at least making a good case for why such behavior is necessary to maintain cover, no, that's not a last-resort situation at all. Tense and risky, sure, but in deep-cover espionage the baseline for that kind of thing is pretty high.
>>
No. 117774 ID: 63dcb5

>>117763
I feel like I was a little curt in my original response; want to emphasize that it was due to business, not hostility. I meant it when I sent well wishes.

I also want to say that we are, for the most part, working as a team. As players we generally try to work together so our characters can work together, but aside from Stone, I can’t think of a time any one of us intended to do some player killing. So, with the idea of being on the same team, and working together in mind, I just want to say that any perks I get through donating aren’t giving me an advantage over other players; they’re really giving extra options and choices to everyone in the group. I would hazard a guess that matey feels similarly. I just don’t want anyone to feel like they’re getting shortchanged because of my decision to help support the people who make content I enjoy. The paid advantage should be beneficial to the whole group, not just me paying to get a leg up on anyone else.
>>
No. 117775 ID: af6e04

Hey, Tunic's back! I was worried we wouldn't be seeing you again. Party hug!
>>
No. 117776 ID: 3abd97
File 151061593275.png - (1.69MB , 1280x2053 , samus_aran__mystic_knight_by_coronaditempesta-d7ep.png )
117776

>[NPCS] going to attempt to pursue those agendas with deception and/or intimidation
Sounds like the IC intimidation attempt here was too effective, resulting in OOC success.

>Ji a hostage to keep "The Hunter" at bay
Suddenly imagining myself as Samus-with-a-rapier. Defending a chozo sage from evil aliens.

It's worth pointing out that if the situation deteriorates this hostage situation is essentially double edged. Tchalcedo has an obvious sword to hold over Ji (comply or pain / death) but Ji can threaten her right back (Vos knows and can see our double aura- kill me and he'll expose you to the Hunter). Although so long as both spy and doctor act professionally towards one another, you can have peaceful cooperation without resorting to threats of mutually assured destruction.

Although I must admit some curiosity as to the nature of threat Daviste poses to tsochari. Especially since Tchalcedo displayed immediate wariness / recognition but 'Prisoner' seemingly hasn't (suggesting perhaps ignorance from a lower security clearance, or a well-guarded reaction?). I'd normally think a creature made of "iron-hard cables" would be proof against a rapier, but maybe her specific flavor of phasing is particularly harmful to them? (I could have crushed 'Prisoner', but that was only thanks to a lucky crit, and isn't reliably reproducible).

>>117774
I mean, I'm more offering a small bit of support for JL than expecting any in-game reward. I haven't bothered to cache in the OOC benefit very often. Good works deserve support.
>>
No. 117783 ID: 2d0d28

>>117776
That is also my motivation- I would be donating without reward tiers or anything like that. But since their are rewards, and we do use them, I want to stress that the point is not to gain an advantage over other players. We’re all in this together 👍🏻👌🏻👌🏻
>>
No. 117784 ID: d9acdc

>>117783
Got sidetracked from my original reasonfor checking in, which was to say that I should be back into the swing of things tomorrow afternoon. Sorry again for the delay everyone.
>>
No. 117788 ID: 8a9fee

I am miles long, yet smaller than a troll, I have many roads, but nary a building, and though I have water, it never holds fish; what am I?

A map / a person
>>
No. 117790 ID: d36af7

>>117788
Second answer's flawed. Candiru.
>>
No. 117792 ID: d10e29

>>117790
I would argue that, given your specific example is known in folklore for entering through the genitals, either into the vaginal cavity or the urethral tract, that it's not a violation of the answer. The riddle specifies that their water never holds fish, and as far as I know water isn't stored in the vagina. In the case of entering a urethra instead, urine is not the same as water- at least it's dissimilar enough that if I asked my host for a glass of water and they handed me one filled with urine I would be able to tell the difference and protest. If condense water pulled urine out of the air, then that spell would have markedly different uses. Therefore, even if the candiru does enter the body through those areas, that doesn't violate the principle of the riddle.

On a somewhat related note, there is no certain evidence a candiru is capable of actually entering the human body- at least no accurately documented cases of entering through genitals https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru

This is not to say that there couldn't be other reasons the riddle doesn't work. I wouldn't think that specific example invalidates it though.
>>
No. 117793 ID: 3d2d5f

>>117792
I don't think that level of nitpicking is valid- to say the body has roads sets a certain degree of abstraction in the metaphor. You can't have that but simultaneously claim "but this can't be water".

"Never holds fish" could also break if fish were depicted on a map (a not uncommon artistic touch), or if you swallowed a fish whole.
>>
No. 117794 ID: 8a9fee

>>117793
The roads metaphor was used by JamesLeng on more than one account to describe the effects of healing magic and later on some of Isaiah’s powers. Normally I’d agree that level of abstraction is too subjective to be certain; I just thought that since it followed in setting logic it would be permissible.

People do draw fish on maps though, can’t argue that. I would say that you can swallow a fish without it being suspended in water, but you can certainly swallow a small fish in water. I’ll think on another one though. Maybe something about reflections?
>>
No. 117796 ID: 2aae91

I am always inside you you, but we'll never touch. I can cause you to freeze, or give you direction. In writing I bring clarity, but excess makes it hard to talk. What am I?
>>
No. 117799 ID: 3abd97

>>117794
You interpreted that the opposite of how I meant it. I'm not saying the roads metaphor is invalid, I'm saying that equating the body's fluids to water is as valid. You can't insist on being literal in one case and not the other.

I think the concept of the riddle is sound, the exact wording just needs to be tweaked to try and close loopholes. Maybe...

"I am miles long, yet I fit indoors; I have many roads, but you will not walk upon them; I contain water, but it is not sailed. What am I?"

(Rewording to avoid possible problems caused by small trolls or large people, maps with buildings, and fish / parasites in bodies).

I'm not sure "person" is the best word for the answer, though. We want to rule out self aware spirits and such. Sorta mean "organic bodies" since most animals would meet the criteria as well. "Body" is too broad though.

>>117796
Kinda hard to vet the condition of exactly two valid answers if you're keeping them to yourself. Fear?

>>/quest/845060
So your 'riddle' has two invalid answers. The whole point of a puzzle is it's supposed to be something that could be solved.
>>
No. 117807 ID: d36af7

>>117792
>difference between water and urine
"Making water" as a euphemism for peeing goes pretty far back. I could probably dig up some Shakespeare citations, or at least a comic in early Dragon Magazine cracking puerile jokes about standard low-level spells. It's well within the range of poetic license that could accept "on three legs" for "with a cane" and "the evening" for "old age."
>candiru swimming up your peehole is a myth
In a fantasy setting, with horror elements, particularly body horror, and even more specifically both Tittivila and an approved-but-not-yet-deployed character concept involving variant http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/fey/alpluachra/ how sure are you that this particular myth remains false? Or, more relevantly, that there isn't any other sort of elvenoid-compatible endoparasite that could usefully be described as a fish, and which a professional smuggler (with access to rumors from all over the civilized world and beyond) operating in the riskier, off-the-beaten-path parts of a swamp might know of?

If you're going to beat somebody at the riddle game, everyday stuff obfuscated by tricky phrasing only goes so far. You've got to think of what subjects you're deeply familiar with that your opponent might be ignorant of, or reluctant to even consider. Putting the classic riddle from Oedipus Rex in context, the sphinx is a dispassionate and timeless outside observer of humanity, while prideful men shy away from the thought of their own oncoming decline.

Green and White elves are both, in their own ways, outraged and disgusted by the other faction's "perversion" of the riddle game, which they both agree is a sacred tradition older than elves as a species. The conflicting ideals, one correct answer or two, strike at a deep philosophical nerve: Green elves try to refine and ultimately perfect the single correct way things should work, while White elves try to explore and ultimately understand alternate ways things could work. Both of them see riddles as educational, and the wrong kind of riddle obviously teaches the wrong lesson.

Contextually, this riddle-game discount is a shibboleth. It's not really about winning (though that's fun, and the stakes are real), but whether you throw a tantrum at "would also have accepted" or otherwise botch the game badly enough to out yourself as Briarbird. http://www.prequeladventure.com/dodger-break-the-law/

>>117799
>problems caused by small trolls or large people
Rhea likely considers the trolls who bravely defend her home city to be people, but I didn't bring that up since I was less sure a typical White elf would be as inclusive.
>>
No. 117809 ID: 8a9fee

>>117799
I also thought I could perhaps lay the ground work and someone clever could make it work properly; I have been shown that is correct!

And sorry I forgot the answers, that was unintentional. I was intending for the two responses to be thoughts / space. There are thoughts inside us, as there is empty space, but as thoughts are intangible and “space” is the the absence of something else, you can’t touch them. A common phrase or idea, especially in war time, is that stopping to think will kill you; you freeze up, littlerally frozen in thought. It can cause indecisiveness, causing you to come to a halt physically or metaphorically. The vacuum of space would just straight up freeze you. It can give direction by looking at the stars to navigate, and thoughts obviously give us direction in life- help us make choices and all that jazz. A “space” is needed in writing. Ifidontuseanyspaces,mywritingishardertoread. It lacks clarity. Thoughts, when in your head, or explained outloud, can be jumbled and unclear. When written, you have time to sort them out and make them coherent, and the process is also often helpful to sort out thoughts and feelings- for me at least. Too much physical space between makes communication hard, or harder at least. Too many thoughts can again be overwhelming and make it hard to talk.

I think your edit to the map riddle makes it a solid choice. Maybe say living elvenoid? Since that sort of means “person” and the riddler could be a white elf, given that they’re using white elven traditions. I’m going to guess where or not they get our riddle will be based on a roll, with modifiers for how good JamesLeng thinks it is. That means we may need round 2.

My friend did point that the firsts riddle could be interpreted as a person named miles long, who collects miniature railroads. I think that still falls under living elvenoid though so it doesn’t violate the 2 answers only rule.
>>
No. 117821 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/845167
For some reason I'm really irritated with Maru's garbled, repetitive manner of speaking, so I'm going to take a little break from thread 6 and run a different quest ( https://tgchan.org/kusaba/quest/res/845246.html ) while I try to think up another riddle.

Still waiting on Tellus and/or Valeno's reaction to the rat swarm in thread 7.
>>
No. 117824 ID: e9490d

>>117821
Sorry to hear that; had I realized it was something that was grating for you, I'd have worked to amend it. Is it the typing quirk, where I replace "th" with either "d" or "f", and replace "h" with an apostrophe? Or is it just generally how I have her phrase things? I can certain denote "She talks with an accent" and "Maru says x" rather than speaking in character, or at least do those things more often than I already do.

Responded to the Tellus situation this morning, sorry for the delay. I'll jump into that new quest later today probably.

Any other characters you'd like me to modify their speaking pattern, or dial back on any quirks?
>>
No. 117831 ID: d36af7

>>117824
>Is it the typing quirk, where I replace "th" with either "d" or "f", and replace "h" with an apostrophe? Or is it just generally how I have her phrase things?
Combination of factors. Typing quirk makes it more work to read, and she used a lot of words to convey very little new information, so it left a bad taste like the decoder ring scene in A Christmas Story, too much work on unpacking a noisy channel for too little payoff.

Not normally a significant problem. Noticing myself being more upset with that was just the cue that I needed to get more variety, come back to thread 6 with more enthusiasm and a fresh stock of ideas. Maru just has the most talent at provoking anger in those around her, in or out of character.
>>
No. 117832 ID: 3abd97

>>117807
>throw a tantrum at "would also have accepted"
If anything, I'm impressed by this variant of the riddle game. Coming up a riddle with two simultaneous differentiated answers is a lot more challenging that one with a single answer. (And one I haven't succeeded at yet. My ideas so far keep going to places that are too technical or don't work in-universe).

Also I'm a lot more amicably inclined towards a shopkeeper trying to feel his customers out with a friendly game, ulterior motive notwithstanding.

>Rhea likely considers the trolls who bravely defend her home city to be people, but I didn't bring that up since I was less sure a typical White elf would be as inclusive.
I mean, yes, by the same measure that the syphix's answer is "man" the answer here could be "elf". Racism is a handy shorthand. The more general answer here isn't even elvenoids, it's whatever category next up the taxonomic tree encompasses the various -oids.

>>117809
>model railroad
A scale model of a place could probably still conceptually be considered a map.

>>117821
Maru really needs an off switch for that draw aggro specialty if it's working OOC. :V
>>
No. 117833 ID: d22dc0

>>117831
>used a lot of words to convey very little new information

Like player like character!

>I needed to get more variety
As always, I hope you take whatever time you need to ensure you've got your own batteries charged up; hopefully you enjoy running your new quest. If you just need some time off overall, don't be afraid to dial it back or take a hiatus.

>>117832
>Enjoying the riddle game

As am I. Like Maru was saying, I'm not great at them, but I think they're fun, and good ways to get you to think outside the box.

>Maru really needs an off switch

She's becoming too powerful! Someone, quick, pull the simulation! We can't let her into the real world!
>>
No. 117835 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/845335
Pretty sure that checking out the bandits means Nin's group, fire diplomat included, is currently headed in the opposite direction from you.
>>
No. 117836 ID: d22dc0

>>117835
It's also being resolved at a separate time; I just thought it was a funny coincident that Isaiah was like "hey lets go to the fire snake room instead of ambushing people" and before he could convince everyone to go Tellus and Valeno needed the fiery blessings provided by Rhea, just a few rooms away, but unable to come to their aid. Sort of a "close only counts in horseshoes and hand-grenades" kinda deal.
>>
No. 117840 ID: af6e04

I do kinda regret not going straight for Valeno
>>
No. 117843 ID: 094652

Will this work?

Question: The following sentence is true. The previous sentence is false. What am I?

Answer 1: A Gnoll / I.
Answer 2: Stay silent, because a paradox does not have a valid answer
>>
No. 117844 ID: 094652

>>117679
Also, this works. I figured Rhea was immune to fire but not explosions, shrapnel, force damage, etc, but if she can take it then she's probably a better bodyguard for this situation; few bandits can resist a priestess and a dancer for the raping.
>>
No. 117846 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/845142
>>/quest/845405
Hmm. We are at something of a disadvantage here, being aliens with a limited understanding of this world's metaphysics. It's not really apparent to me that the boundary between two of the elder gods is equivalent to the concept of space, especially as that concept should exist anywhere people can physically be present (which includes at least several of the elder gods, possibly all). Just commenting on the nature of the challenge we face, not calling foul or anything.

>>117843
A paradox exists at the very least as a named concept and is therefore a permissible answer- you wouldn't have to remain silent. (And it seems likely one of the gods would in some way embody paradox and be a possible answer).

"A gnoll" is invalid because it if we accept that, every other riddle so far would had three or more answers- anything that describes the speaker. (For example, "an elf", "a white elf" "a smuggler" etc would have all been valid answers to our opponent's riddle).

There's another answer to that riddle- "a liar". If you assume the speaker is lying in one or more sentences, the paradox resolves.

>>117844
>I figured Rhea was immune to fire but not explosions, shrapnel, force damage, etc
Well yes, that's true. Rhea doesn't have supernatural protection from shrapnel or concussive force (unless the spirits involved decided it's conceptually part of the fireball she should be protected from or something).

Could be mitigated by where Rhea is standing in relation to Azure if/when she goes up. Deflect missiles could work on shrapnel, if Geoffrey's isn't self only.
>>
No. 117847 ID: fc3fc0

Now I’m confused, because I thought he said the first answer was “thoughts”. Then I said I would also have accepted “space” and he said that’s the answer he gave. Did he win?
>>
No. 117849 ID: d36af7

>>117847
He guessed both intended answers as aspects of one thing, and opted to continue rather than win on a sour note.

>>117846
>supernatural protection from shrapnel or concussive force
By the GURPS mechanics, all the direct damage AND innate fragmentation damage from Azure's self-destruct is fire-based burning, so Rhea's diplomatic immunity would apply. Fire resistance 5 is enough to shrug it all off, or absolute worst case be very lightly singed for 1-2 points of damage, provided you're at least arm's length away. Rhea would only really need to worry about incidental fragmentation from Azure's clothing and equipment, pre-existing debris on the floor between them, a chair Azure was sitting in, things like that.
>>
No. 117850 ID: 3abd97

>>117849
Oh nifty! Then the biggest immediate risk to Rhea would be if the bandits decided to stab her first.

We'll probably want to leave some equipment behind with the others. For instance, I see no reason Rhea should risk damaging Mode's relic set.
>>
No. 117851 ID: fc3fc0

>>117849
I just want to say that i don't think your patreon links are working when you put them under a spoiler; I've tried clicking on it in a couple different quests but it looks like it includes the spoiler as part of the url and takes you to a page that doesn't exist. The link works fine in on this page though.
>>
No. 117852 ID: 3abd97

>>117851
If there's no whitespace between the hpyerlink and the formatting tag, the second tag can get treated as part of the hyperlink, yeah.
>>
No. 117853 ID: 08510e

>>/quest/845526
Answers: The wind and You, if you don't watch your tongue.
>>
No. 117854 ID: fc3fc0

>>117853
Shit, thats a good riddle and a good roll
>>
No. 117855 ID: 3abd97

Okay, here's my attempt at one.

I am but a small thing, fallen from my creator.
Sometime I travel in the wind, though I will never grow a feather.
Other times, I find myself encircled, protected by a hard container.
When conditions are right, I grow into something greater, of vibrant color.
What am I?

A seed.
A spark.
>>
No. 117856 ID: 3f99eb

>>117855
Seed was obvious, but I completely overlooked the second answer. Good job.
>>
No. 117857 ID: 3abd97

>>117856
The hope is it would be less obvious to a white elf, as they don't do a lot of agriculture.
>>
No. 117860 ID: f44af8

>>117857
Could be worth a shot! I was really thinking that crit would win us the riddle contest though, i didn't expect us to need another round. We could probably use the map question, but it seems as though that'd be easy to guess compared to how good this elf is at some of the other more abstract and difficult riddles. Maybe something relating to Green elves? Maybe even a riddle that conflates the two together, try to get him riled up? It seems like a bad move to try to anger the guy with his finger on the price of entry, but JamesLeng suggest that the point of the game was to see who made a social fopaux first
>>
No. 117862 ID: 3abd97

>>117860
Well the roll might still impact how well the second answer being meta, or a threat, is received.

>the point of the game was to see who made a social fopaux first
That's not the win condition so much a shorthand for the smuggler to feel us out. If we're poor sports, that doesn't bode well for his ability to do business with us. If we react like green elves to the white riddle game, that potentially reveals us as moles or agents of local law and order.

>It seems like a bad move to try to anger the guy with his finger on the price of entry
Winning the game fair and square shouldn't anger him? Playing to his intellectual biases, or things he's less familiar with, is fair game.
>>
No. 117863 ID: 20ea96

>>117860
>seems like a bad move to try to anger the guy with his finger on the price of entry
I was gunning for respect through fear (aka the barbarian's discount), but unfortunately it seems he's either too dense or too arrogant (possibly both) to recognize a blatant threat.

Whether or not anyone will be compelled to carry it out has yet to be seen.

>>117862
>the roll
It's just as likely the roll affected nothing at all, since I didn't append an action to it, and he doesn't seem to be taking any action in response to it. No point in crying over every wasted crit.
>>
No. 117864 ID: d10e29

The statement about angering the dealer was specifically in relation to the idea I had proposed about conflating green elves with white elves as a way to catch him off guard or in a philosophical blind spot so to speak; I didn't think Ji would upset him with his question or anything like that.

>wouldn't get upset over winning fair an square
I mean, that's not something we can rule out off hand. Poor sportsmanship isn't a new concept. Just because he proposed the contest doesn't mean he wouldn't be upset if we somehow beat him. In fact, since he's good at riddling, he may have just assumed victory was assured, and could be very unhappy in the case of a fair/square victory. Not saying it's LIKELY he's a poor sport, just that it's an option to consider. And, like I was saying, intentionally upsetting him may also have adverse affects on our ability to avoid the worst of his price gouging. Not much we can do really, although i still have a question we can burn if we want to get a run down on topics that'll blind side him or something like that.
>>
No. 117865 ID: d36af7

>>117863
>blatant threat
>ambiguous riddles
I think you and I may have different definitions of the word "blatant." I did figure out the 'wind' half without looking, at least, and that the other half referred to a bad end in some trade with negative value-added... though I feel obligated to point out that smuggling and theft are completely different business models.

Out of respect for that critical success, I think I'll translate my OOC lack of further riddle ideas into the smuggler being IC intimidated, cooperative and respectful. However, proper scene-setting in the big city will have to wait until after that break I mentioned before. Feel free to debate fantasy Aztec dinosaur ultratech doomsday-prep skillsets and equipment loadouts over on the Dragon King Quest thread while I'm recharging.
>>
No. 117869 ID: 20ea96

>>117865
>Ambiguous riddles
I think threatening to cut out someone's tongue, break all their teeth, and steal all their belongings is just about as blatant as it gets. The rest was just being as aggressive and rude as possible without being technically inaccurate. And I was careful to use "take" instead of "steal" regarding the possessions. Taking things and moving them elsewhere is very nearly the definition of smuggling after all.

Even if it didn't result in any benefit though, I felt I had to do it for IC reasons. Yisheng Ji is a prideful rooster and greatly dislikes being publicly mocked and humiliated, especially regarding his intelligence being belittled.

That said, I'll accept the pity victory, even if it's only for ooc reasons. Beggars can't be choosers, and anything that helps the party is a good thing.
>>
No. 117873 ID: d36af7

Alright, no more Pdn[T}tO updates at least until DKQ character creation is done. Species, transport, and primary weapon are settled, but exact power armor type, other equipment, and most importantly the Paths of Elemental Mastery are still up for discussion and/or votes.

>>117869
>just about as blatant as it gets
Think about stuff Hore and Maru have done.
>>
No. 118025 ID: d22dc0

Dragon quest is really cool, especially since it’s basically all character creation which is my favorite type of activity; it’s boiled down to me going back and forth with people at this point but I hope we get to progress and do more with our dragon once they’re back up and running! On a different note I wanna send wellwishes out to everyone. I know many of us have our own various struggles, and holidays can often amplify those stressors. Whatever you celebrate, whatever you’re doin, hope it’s nice and goin well for you guys. 👌🏻👍🏻✌🏻
>>
No. 118035 ID: fc3fc0

Accidentally double posted- don't wanna delete either one though because of the roll discrepancy. Would it be okay to keep that six for another activity listed on my weekly plan? or should just I delete that post?
>>
No. 118036 ID: 3abd97

>>118025
I regret I didn't really have the bandwidth this week to get involved in the nitty gritty of weighing the plethora of chargen options.

>stay in touch for further exchanges of information and espionage-related favors?
Tunic, I just wanna say OOC, I have no problem if you choose to do this. Daviste's inherited conflict with these things notwithstanding. You don't have to pass on the plot hook on my sake.

I tried to avoid stepping on your toes in the tower, limiting Viste's role mostly to assessing the severity of the threat once she was made aware of it.

If Ji does go for a long term arrangement, and Dav finds out about it, she's much more likely to play a counter-intelligence game, or use it as an opportunity to try and learn more about the tsochari and their organization than do anything rash (though obviously circumstances would matter).
>>
No. 118046 ID: d36af7

>>118025
>basically all character creation which is my favorite type of activity
>>118036
>I regret I didn't really have the bandwidth this week to get involved in the nitty gritty of weighing the plethora of chargen options.
I'd still be very interested in your take on it, when you've got the spoons, Magey.

Given some of the themes of Dragon King reincarnation, and in-setting astrology, particularly the grand observatory at Rathess, if the main character dies I'll probably start the whole thing over again at step one.
>>
No. 118070 ID: 3abd97

The Agate siblings have been pretty much demoted to npc support units, but does anyone have any good ideas for stuff they could spend their pay on while we're here? Might as well make them useful.

I was thinking if Daniel dumped everything into XP (hey Vos can you talk him into a gay brothel or something) he might level up and get more spells, so he could function as a buff-dispenser.
>>
No. 118076 ID: 0e104f

>>118070
Money to XP sounds like a good way to handle things - Daniel getting his fill of titilating new experiences, Maria with some sort of bondage based religious ceramony perhaps. It might be worth considering their eventual departure; obviously they’re an asset to us, but personally I prefer to retire old PCs who aren’t being controlled by their player anymore. Maybe have Maria take Daniel on a sabbatical away from the corrupting influences of his monster boy suitors, to potentially return at a later date?
>>
No. 118084 ID: 3abd97

>>118076
We could retire them from the group, but I figure it doesn't make sense for them to leave before the escort mission is over.

There's also the fact having npcs along on the escort mission means the other PCs can go haring off after random encounters and there will always be someone left covering the ship, which is convenient.

Even outside the context of the escort mission, I'd be a little reluctant to see them go, even if their role is much reduced now. They cover some bases no one else on the team does, and well, we start to feel a bit small for a mercenary company without em.
>>
No. 118089 ID: 094652

I figure Maria and Daniel became support NPCs - we generalize their powers so they're less confusing for other players to utilize, and they generate passive bonuses depending on where they are - they'll add in an extra attack or buff us on the field, perform skill checks involving religion, and if we leave them at the base they'll generate passive income and gain experience slowly but safely.

Story-wise, we'll say something has happened to them but nobody really knows. Which is 100% true. By definition. Because chemical processes in their bodies have occurred that nobody has detected including themselves. But this can range from agitation of the boat trip to a slight change in personality to Saint Agate himself flipping off the twins in their worst nightmares. Whatever the case, they're showing less independence and generally staying quiet, but they still have their souls. Maybe. It's kind of like what happened to Pog when he got the brain damage, I just stopped playing him so enthusiastically and directed him around like a pawn for a while.
>>
No. 118103 ID: 8043dc

>>118084
>Even outside the context of the escort mission, I'd be a little reluctant to see them go, even if their role is much reduced now. They cover some bases no one else on the team does, and well, we start to feel a bit small for a mercenary company without em.

Like I said, they’re an asset. We’re absolutely worse off without them- if they leave, there’s no upside for us in game.

I’m still in favor of retiring PCs who aren’t being played anymore. I think it’s a good idea to leave a dangling hook in case they ever wanna rejoin the crew, but ultimately I feel like when it makes sense within the world, it’s best to have anyone not being played anymore to retreat until further notice.

That being said, anyone got any good shopping ideas for Maru? Haven’t thought much about it these past couple days, but my main goal is to have her get better at things she’s already doing- inciting violence, brawling, etc. having actual weapons to fight with is a good first step, but other stuff might be useful too. The idea of a more deceptive and ornate covering for her horns keeps crossing my mind, but I don’t know if I feel like that’s in character for her to care enough. Maybe more basic supplies. I feel like shopping is close to the bottom of her priority list compared to the other things I listed at this point, but it’s the only thing I can build off of and get nutty gritty with right now. Maybe some flashy outerwear that lights up when she uses magic to intimidate her foes and stuff. Also thinking she’s gonna blow her leftover money on penthouse suit style living after they get back since she’s never gotten to live it up before.
>>
No. 118104 ID: 3abd97

>That being said, anyone got any good shopping ideas for Maru?
Brainstorming:

A blade concealed in something innocuous, similar to Davina's jewellery. So you have a way to cut yourself and summon your axe, even locked up or with most your possessions missing.

Some piece of enchanted equipment that wards against cold, or helps keep her warm, to counteract Maru's weakness?

Drugs- some combination of recreational enjoyment, and useful bonuses of some kind seem like they'd be right up Maru's alley. Take the edge off, have fun, and kick ass all at once.

Other magic instruments? The catgut legion (while probably out of our current price range) builds buildings. You might be able to pick up something else that effectively adds a completely new option to your repertoire, but relies on preexisting musical skill.

>Maybe some flashy outerwear that lights up when she uses magic to intimidate her foes and stuff
As described in >>/quest/847126 there seems to be a lot of customization in the observable effects given off by enchanted armor. A sparkly jacket variant that reacts with your casting (and/or that reacts to your axe's 'song') seem well within the bounds of what's possible, and would be showy in an interesting way. Plus increased defenses are always useful.

>more deceptive and ornate covering for her horns keeps crossing my mind, but I don’t know if I feel like that’s in character for her to care enough
Some kind of armor, or concealed armor under more innocuous wrapping, that protects her head (after 'Cap' cheap shot her) and/or makes you better at headbutting people feels like it would be in character to me.

>>/quest/847126
>>/quest/847274
So I'm pretty sure I got played a bit by Esmeraude (she offered payment that can't be quickly delivered, so it's in Dav's interests to keep her around until it can be) but on the whole I'll take it. She might be benefiting from this arrangement, but on the flip side, the team gets useful assets we aren't paying full price for.

If she's using us as her medium-term power base, and her possible line on setting up a longer-term one, betrayal seems a lot less likely. Which I figure puts the risk of her causing a problematic disruption more near the risk of the other PCs doing so.
>>
No. 118105 ID: d36af7

>>118104
>pretty sure I got played a bit by Esmeraude
She's a Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple with roughly the same backstory as http://gate-thus-the-jsdf-fought-there.wikia.com/wiki/Sherry_Tyueli so of course she drives a hard bargain...
>but on the whole I'll take it
...and makes you love her anyway.
>>
No. 118106 ID: af6e04

>hey Vos can you talk him into a gay brothel or something
Maybe, I don't know if Vos can even get into the city with all his octowasps though.

>retire old PCs
Vos will probably be sad to see Daniel go.
>>
No. 118113 ID: 3abd97

>>118106
You might be able to talk the octowasps into staying behind for short jaunts into town? (Maybe they can be distracted with a treat or toy or something, I wonder what octowasps like)? Or pile them on a party member to 'babysit'. Worst case, if you're stuck on the outskirts with them you can ask allies to do your shopping for you.
>>
No. 118114 ID: d9acdc

>>118104
>>118104
Yeah, the sparkly jacket is what got me thinking.

So far I'm thinking

-Metal coverings for her horns, so she can headbutt harder, and a decorative cover- maybe something similar to the attached image.
-Pocket Sand, or the equivalent. Maybe a stingchuck?
-Perhaps a more expensive version of those gloves that bypass some DR or do something else useful in addition to protecting me and hitting harder; maybe even decorated with symbols of Calistria?
-Drugs are already on the list
-Probably not going to get too much armor- Maru prefers to be as loosely dressed as possible, and doesn't really wanna get bogged down with too much armor for every day use. Might go for something like a light shawl or some other form of baggy clothing that's been reinforced to be just as light, but otherwise extra protective.


Things that are too expensive to buy now are probably

-more magic instruments (Doss Lute is cool)
-wands, maybe enlarge person or attribute enhancing spells
-shirt that provides fire resistance and allows Maru to self immolate
-In a similar vein, something that lets her do an effect similar to the hellish rebuke from 5e would be cool
-Crown of swords is also pretty cool
-Having something similar to this

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/h-l/helm-of-fearsome-mien

that chains with everyone who can hear her song, would be an eventual goal later on down the line.
>>
No. 118115 ID: d9acdc
File 151155686155.jpg - (26.20KB , 213x320 , ebe7302ce89602d7b8ceb4c85a003919.jpg )
118115

>>118114
Whoops
>>
No. 118118 ID: 3abd97

>baggy armor
Looking at the prices quoted, the "sparkly jacket" (which presumably could come in different cuts) is 24 gold for 2DR and not much different from ordinary clothing to wear.

>Things that are too expensive to buy now
Worth thinking about for the future though, we'll have a much bigger pay day when we finish the second leg of the journey and can sell the immovable rod(s) and the quiver of holding.

>decorative cover
I like! Mundane clothing changes are probably mostly negligible on the order of gold though, I would think. (I was considering getting Dav a travel dress or something, since that persona has become more businesswoman and diplomat than action girl. ...not that a dress would be very practical while we're still in Overmire).

>>/quest/847793
I think the assumption is he would be a cat (or similar) temporarily, until we could afford to kill the pet and rez him as an elf, or apply polymorphs / Tittivila for radical reconstructive surgery.

So the question would become if it's more of an inconvenience to have the wrong body for a while, or to be out of the loop and unable to influence the world for another month plus.
>>
No. 118119 ID: d9acdc
File 151156902722.jpg - (90.15KB , 600x800 , 8349265f64d4b30a747bdda464377914.jpg )
118119

>>118118
If I’m honest I was picturing Davina in more of a pantsuit type garb. Perhaps a Gilderoy Lockheart style uniform, fit for fencing and fashion?

The question of resurrect once or twice is difficult though. The ease of travel certainly makes up for the cost, so I’m not considering that as much of an important factor. I think the major risks are if he decides to go awol, how long prosthetics will take to make, and if he’ll be okay dying again. Seems like that sort of thing wouldn’t be something you want to plan to happen. Ultimately he may be powerful enough to transform into an elvenoid form, or at least trade favors with someone who can.

One major limiting factor is time to make prosthetics. If they’re just hangin around, available on demand it’s no problem, but I’d imagine custom clockwork prosthetics take some time.

JamesLeng, once I’m ready to take actions in town and shop, what’s the best way for me to format my plan and conduct rolls so that is easy for you to work with?
>>
No. 118120 ID: d36af7

>>118118
>Looking at the prices quoted, the "sparkly jacket" (which presumably could come in different cuts) is 24 gold for 2DR and not much different from ordinary clothing to wear.
2 DR from spider silk + 2 DR from magic, for a total of 4 - or 12 vs. starmetal. It's flexible, though, so strong hits (particularly bludgeons) can cause damage by blunt trauma without actually penetrating.

>Mundane clothing changes are probably mostly negligible on the order of gold though, I would think.
One gold coin is $400. Replacing your whole wardrobe at common adventurer/soldier levels (status 0) is $600; an individual outfit is $120 for normal clothes, $180 for heavy winter clothes, $240 for formalwear. Fancier stuff for respected professionals (moderately successful merchants, licensed couriers, doctors, priests, a knight's heir and assistant - all status 1) costs twice that much. Landless knights, lower-court judges, village elders, district-manager level merchants, and the rest of the more approachable lower fringes of the ruling class (status 2) spend about five times as much. Guildmasters, landed knights, and ostentatiously successful mercenary captains or bandit lords, twenty times as much. Beyond that, the ratios start to break down, since visible clothing quality hits diminishing returns so individual outfits can't get much fancier. Full wardrobes keep getting more expensive thanks to variety http://ctenophorae.com/post/144257320778 and accompanying jewelry or other acessories. Similar multipliers apply to cost of living in town, if you want to be maintaining those clothes rather than letting them get dirty and decrepit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ql9-82oV2JE (most relevant bit starts 2 minutes in)
>>
No. 118140 ID: 3abd97

>>118119
Spiffy ref. Yes, Dav's been wearing an outfit similar to that since the start (although more of a proper traveler's cloak than an asymmetrical cape, and different colors). And Viste's wearing the magical girl version of the same (so a skirt, sillier and more action-y, with palette swaps).

I think you've reaffirmed my confidence in that for now.

>>118120
Oh that's actually better than I thought. I misread you before, and thought 2 of the DR were from the plate.

>>/quest/847880
I would presume recruiting you as an asset is something Tchalcedo directly benefits from. (I mean, even if they never ask you to do a specific job for them again, just knowing where our group is in the future so they can avoid having us stumble into one of their plans has value).

>Is there any equipment within budget that could possibly be useful to someone like Yisheng Ji
Artifacts or other items you attune to your chi are a thing with cultivators, aren't they?

There's enchanted spidersilk clothes, which can get you 4 DR from non-metallic armor. Probably various magic tools that might be useful (wands?). Anything that might augment or enhance your casting or cultivation? Alchemical or other supplies so you can put more of those hours Ji isn't sleeping towards productive crafting or research? Medical tools that make you a more effective doctor?

In terms of weapons, certain martial arts tools might make sense, and something like a staff can be the symbol of a healer or a warrior. Also some medical instruments can be pretty nasty.


I think you're asking fundamentally the wrong question here. Instead of demanding what could possibly be useful to you, ask yourself, what do you want? What does Ji want, or what do you want for him? What's on the wishlist? Once you know that, worry about finding lesser compromises that fit the current budget.
>>
No. 118151 ID: 20ea96
File 151163972957.jpg - (65.32KB , 580x870 , fang-wei.jpg )
118151

>>118140
>fashion
Yisheng Ji dresses in something like this image, given the option.

>artifacts or other items you attune to your chi are a thing with cultivators
Treasured weapons / armor / talismans / medicinal pills and so on are as common as clouds in the sky in xianxia stories, but the "cultivation" part of cultivators is literally cultivation of the self and one's inner power. Yisheng Ji only desires to walk ever further on the path to self-perfection. Material goods are just a means to that end. His low ambition of being paid stems from a combination of pride, self-worth, and realistic pragmatism, not greed. However, progression of inner power is represented by level here, and there's no fast-track to leveling up.

I can think of uncountably many useful magic treasures that would be a delight to have, but I can't imagine being able to afford any of them for a long time. A +1 armor enchantment in pathfinder is 1000 gp. I have, what, 70-ish gp at the moment, minus whatever Tchalcedo takes? It sounds like I might be able to afford the mundane spidersilk garment, but I have to know my other mandatory expenditures first.

>weapons
Yisheng Ji only knows how to use weapons in a scholarly way. He can identify weapons, even recognise famous weapon techniques, but still not practice with one himself. A weapon is too easy to lose or break. (Especially in this campaign). Yisheng Ji believes too much reliance on external power just sets one up for failure, because there will always come a day when you don't have that power beside you. It's almost certain he would have brought this up to Viste at least once.

>productive crafting or research
I tried this in the last town before we set out on the escort mission. Yisheng Ji spent the entire two week break doing this, and pretty much accomplished nothing, receiving no money or experience payout for it. It's pointless to waste another entire break trying to do it again, especially with Tchalcedo's disapproval on top of it.

>Alchemical or other supplies
I'd love to replenish Yisheng Ji's brass balm if it weren't locked away behind a level 10+ plot barrier.
>>
No. 118152 ID: af6e04

>short jaunts into town?
Problem is I was planning on blowing most/all of the money on XP indulgence. Vos isn't a very materialistic eelman. Though I guess the money could be saved up for another shrine to Tittivila in Passholdt.
>>
No. 118153 ID: 3abd97

>>118151
>A +1 armor enchantment in pathfinder is 1000 gp. I have, what, 70-ish gp at the moment, minus whatever Tchalcedo takes?
Your pricing expectations from pathfinder don't seem to sync up with the prices JL has been quoting us.

Here's a quick summary of how much money we have to work with, and (I think) all the prices that have been quoted to us since we hit town and started asking questions:

https://pastebin.com/AbbBD1nK

The above doesn't include any gold characters might have been carrying before the shipping company paid us.

In addition, Ji is holding 10 gold and 30 silver in the "Tsochar field operations budget" which Tchalcedo is presumably going to spend on setting up those communication devices and/or taking with her.

>I'd love to replenish Yisheng Ji's brass balm if it weren't locked away behind a level 10+ plot barrier.
Might not be the case more than a month's travel away. Or there might be a local alternative.

But yeah if in the end you don't see anything worth having, blowing gold on indulgences to earn XP is an option.
>>
No. 118154 ID: e8af6f

>>118153
I think it’s a combo of both. First tier magic armor is a costly enchantment that’s usually pretty broad but shallow in terms of effects; harder to destroy, better protection, etc etc. The other affects available to us do exist at much more affordable prices, but are more limited in scope.
>>
No. 118157 ID: 20ea96

>>118153
Alright. Since Yisheng Ji doesn't use a weapon and needs his hands to be uncovered to use his techniques, the only thing I can both afford and wear is the spidersilk shirt, so I suppose I'll be getting that, unless something else crops up unexpectedly. I'm still going to wait to hear my budget before I post in the main thread again though.

>blowing gold on indulgences to earn XP is an option
For other people, yes, but not for me. Yisheng Ji is prevented from doing so by Tchalcedo, who is antsy to leave and explicitly warned him against wasting time on frivolous activities.
>>
No. 118158 ID: 3abd97

>>118157
I will point out that list is in no way everything that's available, and is currently biased towards things Dav and Maru have already asked about. It's very possible there's more stuff Ji can wear or use for sale.

>wait to hear my budget
Unless someone makes a strong argument to keep much less gold in reserve, it'll be 50-60 gold. It'll be settled as soon as we've finalized if we're rezzing Azarthraine now. Party seems kinda split on it, and I wanted to see if JL responded to any of the concerns that were raised on that subject.

>Yisheng Ji is prevented from doing so by Tchalcedo, who is antsy to leave and explicitly warned him against wasting time on frivolous activities.
I mean, we're in town for three days. That seems like plenty of time to me to set Tchalcedo up and then sink your own gold somewhere. Especially when Ji can be up for 23 hours a day.
>>
No. 118160 ID: d36af7

As unattended objects, or when targeted directly, most metal melee weapons have DR 6, and HP proportional to the cube root of their weight, as normal for Homogenous items (that is, those with no significant moving parts or other internal structure, but which are too solid and rigid to be considered Diffuse). However, when parrying, those stats don't matter so much. This is partly a reflection of the different forces involved, since deflection is less violent than a direct impact and calculated to dissipate rather than maximize stress on the weapon's structure, and partly a simplification to minimize bookkeeping during combat time. Instead of HP, weapon weight is considered directly. Quoting from GURPS Basic Set p.376:

You cannot use a flimsy rapier to parry a titan’s tree-sized club, the slam of a charging linebacker, or the sword of a giant robot! Heavy weapons are liable to knock your weapon away – or even break it. The same is true for unarmed attacks from high-ST creatures. For the purpose of these rules, treat a punch, kick, bite, etc. as a weapon with an effective weight of 1/10 the attacker’s ST. Use his full ST if he made a slam, flying tackle, pounce, or shield rush! Your weapon may break if it parries anything three or more times its own weight. (This does not apply to barehanded parries; for damage to limbs when parrying unarmed, see Parrying Unarmed.) A weapon parrying three times its own weight has a 2 in 6 chance of breaking: it breaks on a roll of 1 or 2 on 1d. Add +1 to these odds per whole-numbered multiple past 3 (a 3 in 6 chance at 4 times weapon weight, a 4 in 6 chance at 5 times, and so on). Weapon quality modifies these odds: +2 if the parrying weapon is cheap, -1 if fine, or -2 if very fine. If your weapon breaks, the parry still counts unless the odds of breakage exceeded 6 in 6. If so, your weapon offered so little resistance that the parry does not count! Regardless of the weight of your weapon, if you are parrying unarmed or using a one-handed weapon, you cannot parry a weapon heavier than your Basic Lift – or twice BL, if using a two-handed weapon. Attempts to parry anything heavier fail automatically; whether or not your weapon breaks, the attack sweeps it aside and damages you normally. If your weapon does not break, you drop it; if you are unarmed, you are knocked back one yard (make a DX roll to avoid falling over).

Weapons made of starmetal, orichalcum, and other abnormally durable materials will not break on a parry (though they might be knocked aside due to insufficient strength or other user error), and further, increase the odds of the other weapon breaking by 2 - but only when that would already be a risk.

Named weapons (standard designs, anyway) improve the effective weight ratio by two per tier, even to the point of reversing it. For example, consider a one-pound knife which is a Named weapon of the second tier, up against a very fine two-pound fencing saber. The knife would be safe, but the saber would have a 1-in-6 chance of breaking when used to parry - three for being effectively outmassed four-to-one, minus two for quality. Even a four-pound quarterstaff or steel buckler might be at risk. You'd need a larger shield, or something like a bastard sword, to block it safely - or a Named weapon of your own.

King Kazleth's signature weapon only counts as first-tier for this purpose (most of it's power having been tied up in the whole neck-severing, destiny-thwarting aspect), but it's also a huge two-handed axe weighing eight pounds. When he marches to war, shields shall be splintered.
>>
No. 118163 ID: 3abd97

Okay, we got a bunch of options, so I'm going to summarize them neatly so it's easy for the group to vote on them.

On the table: Oldaric, a 6th level fighter, and Azarthraine an <some big number> level wizard.

Common Costs
25-30 gold; confirm remains are Azarthraine's. (May be waved if we commit to the rez in advance)

Option 1: Wait till Passholdt
2000 gold; Both of them back in elf-sized bodies (later)
???; Cost to equip them. May be mitigated if they have anything in storage, or funds in bank accounts

Option 2: Pet Sized Archmage
100 gold; Azarthraine in a random cat sized body (now)
100 gold; Prosthetics if he gets a body that can't make the necessary gestures for his spellcasting.

Option 3: Druid Barter
1 immovable rod (approx 5000 gold street value away from Overmire, maybe 4000 in Overmire);
Both of them back in elf-sized bodies (now), bearer bonds valued at 2000 gold, letter of introduction to other druids.
???; Cost to equip them

(This is sort of only a good deal for us if we've valuing the letter of introduction at 1000 gold or more).

>what do
We considered options 2 already (Vos a yes, Hore a tentative yes, Maru and Ji against). Anyone's feelings change with option 3 in the mix?

The obvious trade off is more revived high level allies should make dealing with threats on the way home easier, but that safety comes at the cost of less money to work with now, and the possible risk of leadership conflict / having to listen to what said high level allies want.

I think I'd be willing to consider option 2 (though I'm on the fence). Option 3 doesn't look like a good deal to me.
>>
No. 118164 ID: 20ea96

>>118163
To be perfectly honest, that druidic letter of introduction alone is extremely tempting, though it's negatively offset by having to resurrect two npcs with legal authority to order us to do anything, and enough raw power to coerce any of us who might be unwilling to obey.

If I were the one calling the shots, I'd rather trade the rod for the letter of introduction and 4000 in bonds, then spend 2000 of that to resurrect the two later.

The ability to safely parley with druids in distant lands and seek hospitality with those who would not otherwise accept visitors, in a form that is worthless to would-be forgers, thieves, or translators? That is far, far more valuable than anything else a mere 1000 gold can obtain. I guarantee you, when we're all strung up in spiderweb in the deepest darkness of Mirkwood, 1000 gold is not going to purchase the local druid circle's assistance.
>>
No. 118167 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/848060
>ignore my repeated requests to know how much I have to spend
That's because how much you have to spend personally depends on what decisions we, the players make as a group.

We have 650 gold paid to us by the merchant company (plus whatever coin we were already carrying and the net worth of our possessions).

>137.5 is significantly more than the 50 estimated by magey.
That estimate comes from paying out 50 gold to each of the seven party members, spending 100-200 on a reincarnation, and holding the remaining 100-200 reserve.

If we don't revive anyone now, we can go for a bigger individual payout. 60 each, 230 reserve, for example.

You have a few options if you want to buy something that costs more than your "fair share" of the payout. You could convince one or more of your teammates to go in on the purchase with you, or to loan you the cash (or to give it to you, possibly). You could try to convince the rest of us the purchase benefits the group, and is worth paying for out of company reserve cash. You might be able to cut a deal with someone else to make up the difference (like those spies). You might try haggling with the shop keeper and roll really well. We could take option 3 above >>118163 , and then liquidate and split the cash from the bonds.

>>118164
Yeah, I agree the letter could be pretty useful. It's just the application is conditional and it's hard to predict or put a cash value on.

Don't know if the druids have more bonds to trade, or if they'd still be willing to make the deal at all without any reincarnations.
>>
No. 118172 ID: d36af7

>>118167
>Don't know if the druids have more bonds to trade, or if they'd still be willing to make the deal at all without any reincarnations.

They've got plenty of stuff potentially available to trade, but most of it is biomass (defining that somewhat broadly, wine and cheese for example) rather than high-value-density metals or manufactured goods. The main material component for artificial reincarnation is peaty soil. Less than a cubic yard for a human-sized body, but it has to be sanctified and otherwise pre-processed one spoonful at a time, which is where most of the cost adds up, then stored under somewhat controlled conditions. Paying for the rod with that stuff means they can save more of their relatively liquid assets (the bonds) for other outside business or emergencies, and buying from you instead of direct from the syndicate means they don't have to deal with a waiting list. They'd be at least as happy if you wanted to buy $400,000 worth of fresh mangoes and bamboo (hundreds of tons) instead of one of the reincarnations.
>>
No. 118174 ID: af6e04

Option 3 sounds good to me, just because it solves multiple problems at once. We can have our dead NPCs back and we don't have to wait to liquidate the immovable rod. The letter is icing on the cake.

Sure we could probably get a little better deal if we waited. But time has value too, especially when we could potentially be making money with the help of an eighth circle dynastic sorcerer. (Though I honestly question what, exactly, Azarthraine will even need us for with how powerful he is)
>>
No. 118177 ID: 24aec8

>>118174
With that, I count two yes from me and strngy, one maybe from a tunic, a no from Magey, and nothing about the fruit option from kome yet, is that right?

My personal take on the whole “resurrecting the people in charge of us” thing is that I honestly doubt they’ll bother us. Our fair leader is probably at least 16th level, so we’re comparatively small fry. Like I said before, if I had a group of level 3-5 subordinates who were willing to resurrect me, no orders needed, I’d be happy to let them handle the petty stuff while I plan my next excursion to the well. Leave the company business to the business woman who seems interested in it, after all, that’s what we hire people for, right?
>>
No. 118178 ID: 3abd97

>>118177
I read Kome's response as "this sounds good, it's not a trick, is it?" >>/quest/848053 So tentative yes, dependent on how he reacts to >>/quest/848070 , maybe?

The biggest unknown is the letter here. We don't really know how well regarded this druid sect is regarded in the world, and how far and with how many people that letter will gain us purchase. (Although there's the questionable meta-logic that it makes a handy plot hook, so it's rather unlikely to be a total scam).

And if Tunic's biggest reservation is Azarthraine will try to fuck us over, there are immediate barriers to that:
1) The mercenary company is currently under contract (and we wouldn't follow orders that break that contract without good reason, even from the founder or a large shareholder).
2) Enlightened self interest. Dav and the other PCs certainly have no reason to let themselves be fucked over if he's not acting in our self interests. ("Lawful" does not mean "roll over for your boss no matter what"). Worst case, we make a play for control, or we all leave and call ourselves something other than "Fire Hawks".
3) He honestly needs us more than we need him. He fucked up hard, he died, all his allies died or are missing, and his business is in tatters. A new set of competent allies who have already started fixing his problems and keeping his rep intact? Even a powerful wizard can't do everything by himself, and he needs us more than we need a powerful patron.

I think we have closer to a majority on option 3 than anything else, and I'd be willing to support it. It is a little bit of a gamble on the finances, but it does give us interesting gameplay hooks.

Gonna have to insist we have someone check if the bones are actually Azarthraine first, though. For all we know it was some other elf with his robes, since Helen didn't find any other identifying possessions. (Oldaric left a much more convincing 'crime' scene where he died).


Hey, JL, while we're on the subject of reincarnation, what are the options for someone who would really like their own body back, eventually? (Like, if the situation were reversed, Dav would likely be less than happy to be some other race, or even human-but-the-wrong-one, long term. The whole bloodline thing and wanting things done "right"). O and A are obviously gonna have to cope for now if they're unhappy, since we won't be able to afford any more expensive fixes.
>>
No. 118181 ID: d36af7

>>118174
Power doesn't matter if it's misapplied. The world's best rifle can't be used to change a lightbulb, Esmeraude couldn't capture a town without sound tactics and infantry support, and 8th circle spells (or whatever he had left at that point) couldn't get Azarthraine's hand out of a pickle jar - possibly because he couldn't form proper arcane gestures while restrained.

Why would he have willingly put his hand in there, knowing what he surely must have known about the limits of his own capabilities? Whatever he was thinking in that moment, that's the real reason he needs a your help. Being higher level, without a political career, just means he's gone to wilder parties and/or been in mortal danger more often than you. He might have more and better spells, and even high Intelligence, but that still doesn't necessarily mean he's smart when it really counts.
>>
No. 118184 ID: 20ea96

>>118163
>>118178
>resurrection options
It's my policy to never trust an NPC who I couldn't take in a straight fight, and it's never steered me wrong so far.

Of the three options though, I vote for the third. The druidic letter of introduction is too good to pass up. You may say the application is conditional, but the condition here is "being in a place where druids are", which is any sufficiently large natural biome. As long as we remain a mercenary company and not a labyrinth-delving team, we're very likely to be spending the majority of our time in places where druids are.

>reincarnation bloodline things
This is an interesting thing to consider. If Yisheng Ji is killed and reincarnated, would he retain his divinity? What about with a normal resurrection? Being reincarnated into a mortal body with the same mind but no abilities to speak of would be a fate worse than death, as it would put an immediate and definite end to his lifelong ambitions. Depending on DM's response, I may need to have Yisheng Ji compose a will to prevent people from bringing him back as a powerless husk.
>>
No. 118185 ID: d36af7

>>118178
>Hey, JL, while we're on the subject of reincarnation, what are the options for someone who would really like their own body back, eventually?
If you're already dead, but with enough left for an open-casket funeral, 5th circle healing magic and a few thousand gold worth of ritual prep (potentially involving a citywide funeral/parade/festival in your honor) gets you alive again in the same body. If they can't find your whole spinal column, 5th circle still works - potentially down to very small tissue samples, if reasonably well preserved and uncontaminated - but the results will be increasingly unpleasant for everyone involved, so 7th circle resurrection/regeneration is necessary for the good-as-new rebuild. The 5th circle 'breath of life' effect always does something, but... remember that bandit you got the magic quiver from? He died of an accelerated infection, then ambient geomantic overflow hit his corpse with the equivalent of a Breath of Life. When the vital organs have decayed or been corrupted beyond a certain ambiguous threshold, that sort of 'healing' chucks out the original blueprint and improvises with whatever is left. In such a case, it's effectively a whole new organism. Higher-circle effects could still bring the intended person back, but the repurposed remains are no longer useful for doing so. If you'd kept one of that guy's fingerbones and handed it to some druids to reincarnate, you'd be putting the bark spider's mind that new body, not his.

If you've already been reincarnated, and want to roll the clock back to some previous incarnation's form, conventional healing magic won't work because the 'template' has been overwritten. Approximations would be possible with some combination of personal memory, shapeshifting, and divinations, but, ah... you might be headed for a Panacea/Glory Girl bad end there. Conceivably there's some specialized 7th or 8th circle spell to do it right, but the usual advice is to just go straight for a Wish.

There's something within a day's foot travel of Zelkor's Ferry which is capable of granting Wishes, and will answer when called by name. Probably safer to look elsewhere.

Smartest option is to have a clone body ready in advance. Get splattered, wake up in the vat ready to go again. Usually same-day, but sometimes there's a month or more of lag, particularly for exotic causes of death, cross-planar travel, or when the clone is located somewhere you don't have a good mental map of. (I've got some "lost soul wandering the planes" mechanics worked out, originally for one of the cards from that custom Deck of Many Things. A bad situation to be in, certainly, but not entirely without benefit.) I'm leaning toward GURPS Bio-Tech rules rather than strict interpretation of http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/clone so it's actually surprisingly cheap, if you've somehow got an 8th circle wizard willing to work for free. Main challenge is building and maintaining storage vats and, in Dav/iste's case specifically, obtaining an adequate supply of chirality-reversed nutrient slurry - quintessential food will NOT work here. Could get into metaphysics of exactly why not, but the short answer is it's food, not blood substitute.

The good news on that is, cloning would also present an interesting opportunity to fix the whole chirality problem, since experiments only needs to be done on about a cubic inch of bone marrow or something in a specimen jar instead of risking her whole body at once. The weirder and even worse news is, well... think about it. She's spent her entire adult life on a very narrow (albeit well-balanced) diet, in an effectively sterile environment. How do you think her immune system is holding up? Little bit rusty, maybe, from lack of practice?
>>
No. 118188 ID: 3abd97

>>118184
>It's my policy to never trust an NPC who I couldn't take in a straight fight
Not that I disprove of healthy skepticism and wariness, but it's kind of hard to arrange that we'll always be the bigger fish. From Aaphia to the government of Passholdt to 'Cap' to Deros Frist, we'd had to deal with powerful npcs before.

It does help that we are not limited to fair fights.

>the condition here is "being in a place where druids are"
With the important secondary caveat "and who will listen to these other druids". The letter's worth is directly proportional to how much weight this group of druids' word and reputation carries with their peers.

>prevent people from bringing him back as a powerless husk
I would guess your divinity is more closely associated with your spirit or soul than your fleshy meats, and it would require a spiritual violence to separate you from it?

>>118185
Interesting. Where would "I rolled the wrong race and I just want to fix that" fit on that scale?

>fix the whole chirality problem
Honestly, as a player, I have no real interest in fixing that. It's the source of too many interesting complications. (Poor Dav would have to learn to write and read backwards. ...again).
>>
No. 118189 ID: d36af7

>>118184
>If Yisheng Ji is killed and reincarnated, would he retain his divinity?
Yes. Might take some time to relearn how to do some of the chi manipulation stuff efficiently with a different body plan, but we're talking days, a month at most unless it's something completely bizarre - which would only come up if he got reincarnated on the tsochar homeworld or some equivalently alien environment. Even in such an extreme case, engaging the fundamental processes of life from a different perspective, with fresh eyes (literally and figuratively), seems to me like the kind of thing that could be very beneficial to cultivation in the slightly longer term.
>What about with a normal resurrection?
Also yes. If core spiritual and mental traits weren't retained, it wouldn't be you coming back from the dead, really, would it?
>fate worse than death
This being a horror setting, there are certainly some of those out in the realm of possibility. Bodies and minds can be destroyed, or (arguably worse, in that it can be harder to fix) messed up to the point that they're unrecognizable. However, one thing that Yisheng Ji has that he cannot lose, short of some cataclysm which would be memorable across cosmological timescales (a bigger deal than the Titanomachy, on the same order as the Serpent swallowing the Sun, along with the subsequent pacification and extinction of all mortal life, etc.) is that eternal youth boon from the chessboard puzzle.

See, the Church of Orcus takes death, and fates worse than death, and that whole "you can't take it with you" concept very seriously. When they were setting up the chessboard puzzle, they wanted to make sure it could pose a threat to mid- or maybe even high-level adventurers. One thing they considered was the possibility that someone would use various divinations to check whether the puzzle's description was accurate and truthful. Misleading hints clad in ambiguous metaphor can slip past that kind of test, since they're obviously meant to be incomplete and not literally true, but what about the prize? If the cake was a lie, somebody would find out, word would get around, and that'd be that, no more puzzle fun. For the "prize one can keep" to register as an unambiguous truthful statement, it would have to be something that a high-ranking priest of Orcus sincerely thinks you can take with you. something not even Orcus Himself could rip away, whether by force or trickery.

That's how deeply dedicated they are to petty cruelty: they'll build (or at least track down and retrieve) something of true enduring value, a plenipotentiary source of imperishable sublime beneficence, as bait for a rigged game show.
>>
No. 118190 ID: d36af7

>>118188
>Where would "I rolled the wrong race and I just want to fix that" fit on that scale?
Dysphoria? There are various alchemical and surgical body-mod options, but if you want a drastic change with basically perfect accuracy and no weird body-horror side effects, the best option is a custom magic item, usually in the form of a hat or belt, providing a permanent http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/alter-self Costs vary between jurisdictions, since some places subsidize it (particularly to disabled veterans) as a one-size-fits-all quick fix for cosmetic scarring, impaired senses, and crippled limbs including up to two amputations, while others tightly restrict it as an obvious potential vector for espionage.

>>118184
>never steered me wrong
How would you know for sure? Conceivably a powerful individual could take note of who trusts them and who doesn't, then behave in ways which benefit the former group more than the latter. Minimum loss and maximum gain are very different strategies.
>>
No. 118196 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/848212
Dang the dice haven't like me much my last few rolls.

I think I'd like to invoke my privileges as an extra-worldly horror making material offerings to this world's highest deity to have the remains authenticated anyways.

If the answer is "yes, that's them", you can go ahead without further confirmation.
>>
No. 118198 ID: 094652

>horror setting
I thought the setting was science fantasy punk. Maybe even fantasy grimdark. You're saying over 66% of pathfinder is horror? I figured it was 60% suspense, 20% eldritch horror, and 20% players @#$%ing around with sex and humor.

>/quest/848212
Is there anything the party can do while waiting for the resurrection? Also, how long until the ship needs to leave?
>>
No. 118201 ID: 0e104f

Just to clarify, the questions I’m looking for insight into are
1) what’s the best way for me to phrase and roll for my shopping/other actions in town? I had named a number of things I wanted to do, and didn’t know what the best way to deliver the plans would be so that there’s minimal frustration for you
2) Can I buy “pocket sand”? I was thinking something between mace and dirt- easy enough to handle that you could store it loose leaf style on your person and throw it at your enemies no problem, but distracting or painful/damaging enough that it’s somewhat better than kicking dirt in their eyes or throwing away all your ink to try and blind an enemy
>>
No. 118206 ID: 3abd97

>>118198
>Is there anything the party can do while waiting for the resurrection? Also, how long until the ship needs to leave?
We're in a big city, so... almost anything you can think of to do you could probably do. And we're here for a total of 3 days.

>>/quest/848216
Depends? I figure stay with 50 gold each / 300 gold reserve until we see how the rez goes. Then we're going to have to spend some cash from the reserve fund to buy basic equipment for the people we're reincarnating, and we might get an influx of extra cash to divvy up if opt to we sell those bonds immediately (unless there's reason to wait until they mature). I figure at the end of the day we probably want 100-200 in the reserve fund for emergencies and expenses?

>>118201
Asking "hey can I get X" or "how much does X cost" or "what kind of things are available like X" in-thread seems to have worked reasonably well for me, on the shopping front.
>>
No. 118207 ID: d36af7

>>118196
Yes it's fine.
>>118198
Not saying it's exclusively or even majority horror, but Pathfinder has way too much Lovecraft stuff in it to not be at least partly.
>>118201
>best way to deliver the plans [...] so that there’s minimal frustration for you
Ironically this is a very tricky question which I will need to consider with care. As for off-the-cuff reply: in-character dialogue often seems to end up with relatively low value-density. Too easy for it to accumulate padding. Should be spices, rather than the main course.
Yeah, let's go with that food metaphor. I'm kinda hungry at the moment and it's making sense.
Post is a sandwich. You want it to be easy and fun for me to eat.
Specific physical actions with unambiguous mechanical consequences (go to the place, buy the thing, punch the elf) are the bread. Kinda bland by itself, but easy and clean for me to get a grip on. Without at least a little bit of bread, it's not much of a sandwich at all.
In-character emotional motivation is the cheese, and dialogue is the ketchup or mustard or whatever. Rounds out the flavor, but if somebody just squirts a buncha mustard on my hand and calls it a sandwich, I got no idea how to deal with that.
Strategic motivation and scheming is the meat. What are you hoping to achieve or prevent, what interests are you advancing or defending, by punching that elf, in this place, in that particular way, while saying those things? How do you think the way things are differs from the way things ought to be? Who are you and what do you want? What's the big plan?
Bread's what I need to keep things moving, but meat's why I'm here. Good post ought to have both.
Maybe some pickles, too. No, I don't know what pickles represent, and yes that's part of the metaphor.
>pocket sand
Sounds like you want 8-scream devil powder. Ten gold per one-ounce dose. Stored in little wax-paper envelopes. Throw it at somebody, it scatters and swirls through the air, then comes together like a whole flock of tiny homing pidgeons, guided by your own malicious intent. It'll chase 'em around a corner, or lurk on the outside of a sealed suit to pounce when they take it off. Incredibly painful once it touches bare skin. Compared unfavorably with heroin withdrawl, or the sensations of being burned to death, in surveys of those who'd experienced all three. Water alone won't wash it off, you need heavy scrubbing or acid. Mild acid like vinegar or lemon juice will work. You ever gotten lemon juice on a paper cut, or a patch of skin that'd been scrubbed raw? Imagine how bad things would have to be for that feeling to be a relief, by comparison. Completely nonlethal in that it causes no physical injury whatsoever. Distraction around other hazards might be trouble, though, or somebody could turn out to have a weak heart when the stress is too much.
>>
No. 118208 ID: d36af7

>>118206
>we're here for a total of 3 days
Four, actually. The ship's going to be in Overmire for three days, but you ran ahead while it was held up by the coast guard for inspection.
>>
No. 118215 ID: d36af7

I'd like to note that I wrote up Azarthraine of Hollowfall's "what year is this" monologue long before I'd even begun planning Dragon King Quest, and the timing is purely coincidental.
>>
No. 118234 ID: fc3fc0

>>118207
You said that was an off the cuff response, but from my perspective it’s pretty much exactly what I need, in a flavorful and easy to digest metaphor. I appreciate the time and effort you put into not only the quest, but in making it accessible and putting thought and such into questions like that.

Can’t make any promises, but since I have a better idea of what you’re looking for, I can at least make an effort to give you more meat and cheese to go with the bread and mustard.

On that note, 8 scream devil powder does sound like what I need, if a bit pricy. Ive got a few questions, but I’m probably getting it, whatever the answers. Just curious about how I can use it honestly. Gonna wait for our two friends to get revived before I make my plans in town, since our budget depends on their resuppy needs, and anything they may decide to do.

Can it hurt the weilder, intentionally or unintentionally?

Does it have a max range/lifespan? Major use here would be tracking cap down by designating him the target and following the powders path until it reaches him, and then still have it hurt him afterwards.

Does it do anything more serious if applied internally, or to sensitive openings that lack skin, like wounds and eyes. Does it hurt any more/less?

Does one have to concentrate particularly hard to make it work? Would it prevent casting spells or even using another dose on another target? If you get distracted does it stop working?
>>
No. 118235 ID: 3abd97

>>118207
I'm sort of amused that right after you say this, we get a scenario where the reasonable response would seem to be giving you a pile of mustard covered cheese as we roleplay introductions.

>>118215
I'm assuming you rolled for race, and that his coming back as a saurian was also coincidental.

>>118234
>tracking 'Cap' down
*cough* I dunno if you skimmed over Dav and Esmeraude's conversation, but for the near future, locating Cap really wouldn't be your problem.
>>
No. 118243 ID: fc3fc0

>>118235
For that very reason, it is probably best to hold off on her revenge plan until we part ways. Don’t want to muck things up for everyone else by killing Cap now while the boat is still and easy target, before Dav gets her strap on. Best to carry out such revenge plans separate from your group of people so as not to get them involved.
>>
No. 118246 ID: 83b277

>>118190
>a powerful individual could take note of who trusts them and who doesn't, then behave in ways which benefit the former group more than the latter
An interesting hypothetical, but I think it's far more likely for an individual with the supernatural ability to detect trust to behave in ways which benefit themselves at the expense of the former group. After all, if you know someone trusts you, you can get away with a lot more than with someone you know does not trust you. This doesn't even necessarily need to be actively malicious. It can be as simple as "Hey, can I borrow a hundred bucks? I'll pay you back eventually, when I have the cash and I remember to."

>>/quest/848279
>Doctor Yisheng Ji
This is humorous in ways that don't make sense unless you have a rudimentary grasp of Chinese. Also, there sure seem to be a lot of people who recognize Yisheng Ji. I guess he gets around.
It does make it a little awkward to respond if you don't tell me what Yisheng Ji knows about them, though. I would have been less resistant in-character if I'd know Azarthraine and Yisheng Ji were already familiar with each other.

>>118235
>saurian
He's a lizard wizard. :v
>>
No. 118248 ID: fc3fc0

>>118246
>Already know each other

Ah see, I took that completely differently. I assumed Ji had cultivated such a noticeable spiritual presence that it was noticeable from beyond the veil so to speak. Your identity was projected to the point that the lizard wizard was able to spot you and get a grasp on who you were before even returning to the mortal coil. Sort of a stretch given he knew you by name and title, but didn’t recognize you as a firehawk, but I was just kinda figuring those were the parts of his identity that were held most closely, and therefore translated most strongly into your spiritual projection of self
>>
No. 118250 ID: f3e670

>>118246
>Doctor Yisheng

A cursory google search indicates this is somewhat of a Sahara Desert situation

Planning on getting gloves, scream powder, a hat and helm, and try to save a gold piece to splurge on food and drink for the next few days on shore
>>
No. 118260 ID: 3abd97

>>118246
Think of it as a kind of game theory. There's utility in encouraging behaviors and attitudes that benefit you. If you reward trust, it's more likely you'll have trust to draw on when you need it.

>He's a lizard wizard. :v
Now he just needs to cast blizzard!

>>118243
Well if you're willing to be the patient vengeful type, works for me.

>>118248
That was how I interpreted it, that Ji's divinity made him more 'visible' from further off when returning to the mortal coil.
>>
No. 118261 ID: d10e29

>>118260
Think about the description of Maru’s first act of vengeance. She split from her group so as not to endanger them as she knocking commited heinous acts that would likely put her at odds with the law. Similar situation here. She knows she’s not ready to take him yet, and if her life’s at risk, she likely wouldn’t enjoy herself as much. She’ll need more skills and experience at the very least, and she plans on having more supplies too. Probably something suitable for flaying skin, and some magical healing potions or scrolls so she can extend and repeat the process. She can’t really return the insults given tit for tat, like she did with her biological contributor, filling him with “hot loads” in the form of burning coals inserted into various orifices, so I’m trying to think of something else suitably metaphorical and damaging. Current plan is something akin to cutting off his limbs above the joints, pinning him to a wall using red hot iron rods, removing his tongue and lower jaw, and then flaying him, but after that there should probably be something symbolic of what she feels his crimes are. I thought about killing him nine different ways, or perhaps shoving a hot rod into a new organ every time she revived him, but it doesn’t have any real relation to how he insulted and degraded her so I’m not sure really what she’s planning on doing, at least not 100% yet. 8 scream devil powder sounds like a good start though
>>
No. 118265 ID: d36af7

>>118234
>pretty good for an off-the-cuff response
Thanks. I do some of my best work when frantically improvising! Also some of my worst, so I try not to lean on that too much.

>8-Scream Devil Powder questions
It's expensive because it's the product of extremely complex and delicate alchemy, with obvious applications both civilian and military.

It can't hurt the wielder unless they've got some unresolved self-loathing AND roll a botch. The figurative vitriol of hatred is literally what activates and guides it. Can't be used as the payload of a straightforward mechanical trap, though a magical trap enchanted to be intelligent might work, if it had sufficiently strong opinions.

Actually setting that up might have some long-term downsides, because the range limit has nothing to do with the strength of your throwing arm, it's a matter of emotional focus and willpower. Powder moves through the air at six yards per second, most people can't keep it going for more than 10-15 seconds, even less if they're trying to do other things - like, say, dodge return fire. In GURPS terms, you're concentrating on steering a guided weapon, so you can walk (slowly), and speak (carelessly) or do other free actions. Supernatural powers of fury, hatred, and revenge might synergize well, perhaps even reducing the need to concentrate.

The level of pain doesn't vary based on where it hits, but directing the stuff onto specific body parts might affect how easy it is to remove. Vigorous scrubbing and acid aren't good for the eyes, or possible at all inside the lungs. In such cases, specialized counter-agents or generic "universal antidote" effects would be necessary, or the poor bastard could wait about a week for it to be metabolized.

>>118248
>noticeable from beyond the veil
That's what he meant by "on the way back in," yes. If Azarthraine of Hollowfall knew Yisheng Ji by conventional reputation, rather than something more like a mix of aura sight and miamaska.com/index.php?pn=194 he would've gotten the name/title distinction right.

>>118246
>An interesting hypothetical, but
There IS such a thing as having power without abusing it. Perhaps it would be useful to read https://content.psychopathcode.com/ and see who the patterns documented therein remind you of?
>>
No. 118268 ID: 75a537

>>118265
>Self-loathing
In case it isn’t clear, Maru definitely struggles with these feelings, and at many times wishes she was never born; she is not actively suicidal, but those feelings of self loathing are amplified in some degree during such acts of vengeance, primarily because the targets of her wroth have done something to intensify said feelings or remind her about aspects of herself she hates.

Gonna put the info below under a cut just because it might be somewhat upsetting for others, but it’s a description of how Maru sees herself and why she did the things she did. Nothing overtly graphic.

Her torturing people is less about making other people feel bad, and more about making herself feel good through symbolic acts of self destruction. Essentially, she’s self harming in a metaphorical sense. At a base level, she tortured her biological progenitor to death because she wanted to hurt him as recompense for the hurt he forced on her and others around her; he was the reason for her painful existence, therefor it’s only fair his existence becomes painful. On a more theoretical level, her act of vengeance was a way of punishing herself. She cut ties with the only people she loved and cared about, and the only people who loved and cared about her, in order to commit an act that would likely see her jailed and possibly killed. The torture was her recreating the acts that led to her creation, with her in the role of the person she hated most, and her progenitor in the role of her mother, the pain he was experiencing representing the way she hurt her mother, simply through existing, by the hand of someone else. She considered her creation, and thereby herself, an act akin to torture for her mom, at the very least on a subconscious level, and to some degree consciously.
>>
No. 118271 ID: 20ea96

>>118265
>who the patterns documented therein remind you of
Are you calling me a psychopath, or just my character? Because if it's the latter, it's not intentional, and if it's the former, that's a pretty immature response to someone disagreeing with a few of your DM decisions, even if I am abrasive sometimes. I'm sorry for not being altruistic enough for your liking. If you really feel that negatively about me interacting with you and your quest, then just kill off my character, ban me from participating, and be done with it. I know you said you wouldn't do that the last time this came up, but I won't hold it against you for changing your mind if it's affecting your life to the degree that you would compare it to an abusive relationship and link a 205-page ebook as a reference document.

The reason why I've chosen not to bring in any more than the one character is so that if the camel's back does break, you only need to kill off one character, and it will minimally affect the other players. (It won't affect the Thread 7 Party at all.) I actually have another character written up in a document from before I made this decision, that I could have used in thread 7, but didn't, for this reason.
>>
No. 118272 ID: d36af7

>>118271
I was mainly thinking of whatever previous GMs made you so hypersensitive to railroading and 'gotcha' situations.
>>
No. 118283 ID: d36af7

>>118268
Yep, pretty straightforward Malfeas thematics, right down to music and dance being a temporary escape.
>>
No. 118289 ID: 094652

>>118268
Hore has her own self-issues, but they're interpreted differently. As I said, her tribe interprets the Gnoll-Philosophy of laziness as a virtue due to a problem they see as inherent in the universe: the gods gave mortals so much - so how much can they take back? Everything and interest, apparently; power, fame, souls, all of these can be stolen by those on a higher point in the chain of being. Kingdoms can be conquered, legends can be reinterpreted or outright re-written, souls can be claimed by any god and brainwashed to obey, so how do you prosper when your profits can be confiscated - as taxes, as recompense, as fate itself - by those in charge, let alone defend what little you have? The Gnoll answer: Take from others first, and create a stopgap; the just and the good cannot steal what you have already stolen, for a breaker of chains cannot reclaim the physical effort that was 'given' by a master's slaves (or something to that effect, I dunno). Obviously, there is a logical gap in the fact that what is stolen can be repeatedly stolen or claimed as spoils of conquest or some other self-justifying excuse for a lawful good to steal from the poor, but the Gnolls don't realize that. Hore recognizes the fallibility of the answer, but she cannot ignore the question. She's an abomination in the eyes of all greater powers in the world, so how does she stop the rest of the world from eventually killing her (and worse) for who she is and what she has done, when they have enough power to take everything from her and need little excuse to squish her on a whim?

Her answer is to @#$% off to another universe where the people in charge don't want her dead. She's waiting patiently for a path to show itself. In the meantime, there's a profit to be made.
>>
No. 118292 ID: af6e04

>I actually have another character written up in a document from before I made this decision, that I could have used in thread 7, but didn't, for this reason.
I'm sorry to hear this is the reason you haven't been participating in thread 7. I imagine you'd be a needed voice of reason in the beautiful slurry of insanity that is the thread 7 party.

I don't actually have a clear idea in my head of what Nistamatsin looks like(that Hero Forge thing I posted earlier was just a goof). I kinda think it's better that way, but at the same time I do kinda want to draw him. What do you guys picture as far as specific features?

He's pretty nauseating to look at, but his ugliness is more Bosch painting or old testament style. I imagine a large predatory maw because of his tendency to devour organs and his super drinking powers, but filled with incisors and molars as he doesn't actually use it as a weapon.
>>
No. 118316 ID: 3abd97

>>118271
Well, I'd be glad to have one of your characters on Team Magic Sword if you ever change your mind.

>>118292
>I imagine you'd be a needed voice of reason in the beautiful slurry of insanity that is the thread 7 party.
Yeeeeah. Rhea's not a great conduit for strategy. I am glad Nin stepped into the role of party leader with such enthusiasm, though.

>What do you guys picture as far as specific features?
I imagined his frame as spindly and knobby and twisted up on itself (sort of cross "spy old man" with "hunchback, only everywhere"), and the void where his face is supposed to be (when he's not wearing one) as something like a Salvador Dali painting- the ones where faces are constructed from other objects. Like your mind (or the world) is trying desperately to assemble a face in its absence- a conceptual vacuum trying to be filled. And of course its slowly moving and changing all the time.

Also when I found Face of the Devourer on the cleric spell list my first thought was if it would break in an entertaining way on Nin.
>>
No. 118325 ID: 094652

>>848794
Well that was funny. Can we vote on what elven race our warrior friend has found themselves in?
>>
No. 118329 ID: 3d2d5f

>>118325
Considering white and green elves are biologically the same race before diet unlocks neotenous traits, I'm not sure there would be a difference at this point.
>>
No. 118335 ID: d36af7

>>118325
The differences between various flavors of elves (apart from the aquatic type, which are born with gills and have their own range of variants) is entirely a function of diet and environment during childhood and puberty. A Reincarnation spell sets those variables as if the individual grew up on the spot where the spell was cast. So, no, voting will not be necessary.
>>
No. 118343 ID: d22dc0
File 151208805083.jpg - (42.20KB , 327x244 , viperfish-02.jpg )
118343

>>118292
Hadn’t thought about it much if I’m honest! I was imagining him with somewhat gray, rubbery skin, kind of a unsettling tall/thin vibe that seems to be so popular in horror right now, but I never put down any details. The unnerving smile always made me think of deep see fish, like the image attached, but with a full mouth kinda deal. That said, if I saw a bunch of teeth that shouldn’t go together and aren’t where they’re meant to be, it would probably be equally upsetting. Every entertain the idea of a TV head? Not really thematically appropriate for this setting, but I always enjoyed that as a character design feature.

After searching for the photo attached, I also happened to run across several pictures of “fish with human teeth” which weren’t too pretty to look at either, so maybe that can give you inspiration. I certainly didn’t find them pretty.
>>
No. 118350 ID: d22dc0

I already posted my response, but I'm feeling some remorse because I'm not sure I accurately understand the positioning of everything involved, and am now risking a cask of amontillado situation.
>>
No. 118351 ID: d36af7

Think I should make a separate disthread for Dragon King Quest, possibly also covering Neomah Quest and any other strictly-Exalted quests I run?
>>
No. 118352 ID: fc3fc0

>>118351
If you'd like to; I know I'm certainly confused as to how everyone but I seems to know the setting like the back of their hand. I'd say this is a fine place to do it, but I'd fear scaring away people with how in depth and often we talk about Pdn[T]tO. After the hurricane I lost track of Race for the edge; I'll have to look through the threads and find it. Sorry I was never able to provide the art you were looking for, the bad weather ultimately had bad timing for both of us in that regard.
>>
No. 118356 ID: d36af7

>>118350
If you're worried you might be misunderstanding the layout, draw a map of the relevant area as you understand it, possibly with arrows to indicate intended movements, and include it with your post. I realize that goes against the usual norm of suggesters not including images, but this is a fairly nonstandard quest anyway.
>>
No. 118360 ID: fc3fc0
File 151210576980.png - (5.05KB , 641x622 , confusion.png )
118360

>>118356
I think this is correct. Color coding is because... well, I guess in my head I thought it would make disparate features easier to identify, but now that I'm submitting it I'm having second thoughts on that front.

Important thing to note is that Tellus and Valeno, in orange, are inside the corridor, while demon, red X, is outside, with a shiny bit of floor, gold star, between them. Green rectangle is the door, red rectangles are other doors, purple rectangle is the corridor we're in, grey bubbles are the collapsed portion, dark blue is stairs, light blue is the room proper, and if memory serves me that's all the important features.

When I wrote up my action I was thinking the demon was in the room with us, but in order for it to behind us, with a shiny square between us, which is close to the door, I think it has to be laid out the way I drew it. In which case we may be in tough spot.
>>
No. 118363 ID: d36af7

>>118352
>art
It's alright, don't worry about it. I was having some completely unrelated problems with my enthusiasm and focus for Neomah Quest: Race to the West Pole, anyway.

If you're interested in trying again, the image for the next Dragon King Quest update is going to be a Street Fighter screencap, more or less: side-on view of two chunky, simplified humanoids pointing weapons at each other in a dark tunnel.
>>
No. 118364 ID: fc3fc0

rolled 4, 6, 4 = 14

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BIx2x-Q2fE

Completely unrelated, I thought the mechanical underpinnings for how this old fashioned calculator stored memory was interesting. The parts I find most interesting go from roughly the minute mark to six and a half minutes in, where he explains how the acoustic memory functions. It takes a peice of coiled piano string, and uses a combination of binary and speakers to create unique vibrations along the wire, which then get transmitted to other speakers that repeat them, creating an acoustic memory. Not sure of the exact mechanics yet since they don't go into detail but I wanted to share if anyone else was interested.
>>
No. 118365 ID: fc3fc0

>>118363
Cant get it done tonight, but given time I could try to have it in tomorrow. Shoot me an email if there's any important details I should attempt to convey.
>>
No. 118376 ID: 3abd97

>>118350
>>118356
If you're ever lost, asking for help is also an option. I'm more than willing to throw maps together.

>>118360
>if memory serves me that's all the important features
There's also some suspicious statues in the SW part of the room.

I might question which side of the door the shiny part of the floor is on.

>>/quest/848865
I think I'm going to wait and see how (or if) other characters react to Oldaric's plight? Davina would be inclined to be sympathetic, but I don't want to unilaterally decide how much and what kind of resources we're throwing at it. That, and most of the in-the-moment things I can think of that could be done feel more in the other PC's wheelhouses.
>>
No. 118381 ID: af6e04
File 151216666384.jpg - (3.18MB , 2000x2671 , Bosch,_Hieronymus_-_The_Garden_of_Earthly_Delights.jpg )
118381

>>118316
>>118343
I like the mental image both of these descriptions provide. I've always pictured him kinda spindly and slender (you can see that in the thread 7 title card). The angler fish mouth is cool and fits the concept well. Kinda reminds me of the guy in the picture. I'm starting to feel like Vos and Nistamatsin are like dark mirrored reflections of each other.

>Salvador Dali painting
Hmm, that's a good idea I hadn't considered. Not sure how I'd draw that eating somebody though.

>Every entertain the idea of a TV head?
Some sort of flesh and plastic hybrid creature with a TV head is giving me cool ideas, but I don't think it quite fits the character in this case.

>I think I'm going to wait and see how (or if) other characters react to Oldaric's plight?
Vos would absolutely offer to help with holy mutations, but I think he's still stuck outside town
>>
No. 118383 ID: 3abd97

>>118381
I think the druids are a little out of town (or at least at the outskirts) since they needed ground to work on, and most the city is in the air.

Also it might make sense that druid magic might be easier removed somewhat from the disruptive spiritual influences of a city. Hmm. Overmire might actually be a uniquely good site for druids, come to think of it. All the nature you want is relatively undisturbed at ground level, and you have the conveniences of a nearby city with less of the usual complications.
>>
No. 118384 ID: d36af7

First things I'd think of for lack-of-face are https://killsixbilliondemons.com/comic/wielder-of-names-3-59/ and http://www.mangapanda.com/uzumaki/3/26 I figure, the former being an angel and the latter being a minor manifestation of what GURPS calls a "Thing Which Must Not Be," Nistamatsin's naked maw would be somewhere between the two. Maybe like a lamprey's mouth, but with the individual teeth not fixed in position relative to each other, and broken perspective so you can't quite tell whether it's a flat disk or a miles-deep pit. No actual eyes, at least not where you'd think. Instead, incoming light is chewed up (hence the broken perspective) and digested to similar result, with broad peripheral vision. Wearing a borrowed face is like having to eat, drink, and see the world all through the same little plastic straw.
>>
No. 118394 ID: 094652

It's been a while since the last Team Magic Sword post, mostly because thread 7 has been focusing on Valeno recently. I'm waiting for Azure's debut on the bandits' stage, but should we post according to our initiative or wait for you to draw up the encounter?
>>
No. 118395 ID: 0e104f

I think the plan is to resolve the situation with Telly’s and Valeno, then do bandits. Which is a shame since this imp has us dead to rights currently
>>
No. 118396 ID: 0e104f

>>118383
Count Maru as amused and unphased. Sort of a, wow, haha, sucks to be that guy huh? Not really taking the problem seriously as per usual.
>>
No. 118397 ID: af6e04

>>118384
Light chewing lamprey face sounds wonderfully horrifying and I love it. Not sure how you'd actually get a smile out of that though, or any sort of emotional expression.
>>
No. 118399 ID: d36af7

>>118395
Waiting on one more post from Shadowkaisen, to either bust out of the trap and get moving in some other direction, or fail and be stuck there for long enough to catch up with Team Magic Sword's timeline.
>>
No. 118404 ID: af6e04

Now that I've actually tried to draw this, I realize I have no idea exactly what you mean by
>but with the individual teeth not fixed in position relative to each other
Some sort of 'mouths within mouths' setup?
>>
No. 118406 ID: d36af7

>>118404
With an actual lamprey, teeth are arranged in rings which only move when the underlying flesh flexes. For Nistamatsin's maw, I was thinking individual teeth could migrate across the larger space as freely as birds within a flock.
>>118397
Such movement could convey emotional content with anything from crude emoji-shaped clumps to 'magic eye' optical illusions subtly suggesting complex 3D contours, possibly multiple layers of such information at once, yet retain the sense that you might be staring too hard at TV static, seeing patterns which aren't really there.
>>
No. 118456 ID: af6e04

>>118406
Sounds perfectly fitting, though I'll probably have to dispense with my usual messy scribbly style to actually draw that.
>>
No. 118476 ID: 094652

>/quest/849668
Yay! Or did I just waste a critical success?

I don't think my luck will be as good over multiple rolls. I think there's a system called Let It Ride, like when Hore got in good with the Union. When do I need to roll to persuade harder?
>>
No. 118481 ID: 3abd97

>>118476
Yes, "let it ride" was first discussed back here (with a link to a longer explanation in-post). >>99618

Your roll could plausibly be applied to a broader series of interactions (say, the pre-planned attempt at winning the bandits over / establishing a positive impression) rather than the narrow act of stripping once.

Of course how much a single roll or action ends up actually covering is at the GM's discretion. (Like it might get you through the whole plan, or only get you halfway through the plan, or get you past the rank and file bandits but have to roll again to impress the boss, who knows).

>When do I need to roll to persuade harder?
When you want to do something different. To go back to the union example, making friends and talking to them was all one action. If you wanted to talk the union into doing something for you (riot, stop rioting, work with the catgirls, smuggle some stuff for you, etc) that would have probably been a new roll.

I mean, you sorta have to see how far that roll gets you and what the situation is.
>>
No. 118514 ID: af6e04

Stealing Tall Jack Rat's face might offer some advantages, but there's also the risk of them all just immediately figuring it out and trying to kill us. Might not be worth the risk for a group that seems like it'll be pretty loyal anyway. What do you guys think?
>>
No. 118517 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/849946
>already spent most of his 50 gp on supplies and equipment
Sure, but we're abstracting the shopping trip enough that I'm assuming there would be no real difficulty in anyone changing their mind before we move on.

>>118514
They're already willing to work for us. If you steal their leaders identity, that just means we lose their cooperation when he gets it back. And if he doesn't get it back, that means any time you go to town or separate from the bandits, they're deprived of leadership, which will either get them killed or lead to a shuffling up of power and someone else in the gang ending up in charge (who might like us less). We also lose him as a source of knowledge we can ask questions of / trade information with, if he's faceless.

Tl;dr, I don't see a lot of value in replacing someone who's already willing to be a minion. (If you take Jack's role, it's not like you can get the bandits be happy working for free or anything).
>>
No. 118519 ID: af6e04

>>118517
Right, I guess I just wanted to eat some bandits and their unexpected cooperativeness kind of put a damper on that. I imagine Nin is getting increasingly frustrated at how reasonable everyone he runs into is acting.
>>
No. 118520 ID: 3abd97

>I imagine Nin is getting increasingly frustrated at how reasonable everyone he runs into is acting.
On the flipside, Rhea's rather enjoying her track record of diplomatic successes, and meeting so many people friendly to her home!

Maybe Nin can console himself with the megalomania of having so many minions to play to? He seems to enjoy being a ham.

I know where you're coming from. Viste had the same problem waiting for a chance to actually kill something and pull her Zoro routine with arcane mark.
>>
No. 118521 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/849901
>Shame [therapeutic gardening] doesn't have any attached experience benefit
In GURPS terms, it's either self-directed study or on-the-job practice for the Gardening skill. Possibly also Meditation skill, and/or buying off chronic stress related disadvantages.

In "costly sensual indulgence" terms, using superb agricultural land to grow flowers of purely aesthetic value (and lounging around staring at them), or recreational drugs for personal consumption, definitely counts even if there's no money changing hands. Incentivizing the shortsighted pursuit of genre-appropriate-yet-otherwise-strategically-suboptimal personal pleasure is the whole reason I made that rule.

I mean, look at Conan the Barbarian. After he steals the gem from that temple, what's he do with the money? Upgrade his armor, or get some amulets and potions to patch whatever weak points he noticed during the raid? Nope. Buy a herd of sheep or oxen, or a mill, or make some other capital investment to start earning longer term revenue? He's got to be aware of the concept, since he worked in a mill for years and studied abroad with nomadic raiders as part of his gladiator training, but no, he doesn't do that either. What does he do? He throws a party. Eats the finest meats, chugs the finest wines, dresses up in fancy clothes and then destroys them in a drunken stupor. I wanted to make sure that even a hardcore munchkin with no interest in RPing said drunken stupor for it's own sake (and particularly the risk, of which any disciple of Jon Chung would be acutely aware, that one might be ambushed before recovering from such a state) would at least seriously consider such a course of action, and XP is the obvious carrot to wave. Consuming fine food and drink is meant to be, literally, a pleasant and desirable experience. For the sake of versimilitude, getting a better or worse deal on such things should still be possible: if stealing a gem and selling it to buy some booze gets you XP, stealing the same booze directly has much the same in-character result and should provide a similar benefit. That logic applies equally to brewing the booze yourself, or anything else people do primarily for fun.

The assumption that various indulgences are for the most part consistently priced according to their XP value is necessary for game balance, but in a world where things actually work that way, where finding a better than average ratio of cost to objective deliciousness in some luxury item can give your city-state a key strategic advantage in training up elite troops quickly and cheaply, market forces would tend to maintain the balance as a stable equilibrium.
>>
No. 118522 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/850026
>the level of detail being provided is ringing warning bells in my mind against not taking it.

You think I'm going to punish you if you don't.

>_<

You're still thinking this a fucking railroad plot. A poorly-documented railroad where everything is either an indispensable necessity or vague, blurry, non-interactive background scenery, and God help you if you can't guess which is which before you trigger the next scene and an impassable door slams down to stop you from backtracking. That's what you meant there, right? Any NPC with a name and a backstory will hunt you down like a dog if you don't accept their quest, any item with more than one sentence of description will be the key to an otherwise impassable puzzle in the next dungeon?

How many times do I, and your fellow players, need to explain and/or actively demonstrate how that isn't how things work? Not in this game, not in any game I run.

I happen to personally like the basic idea of extradimensional sanctums, and they show up in GURPS Dungeon Fantasy, and GURPS Ultra-Tech, and Exalted, and even Pathfinder, all in slightly different yet reconcilable forms, so I've put a lot of thought into the subject. The products of that thought tend spill out into whatever relevant info I provide, and it's a big-ticket item with a lot of potentially counterintuitive features, so there's no obvious-to-me IC or OOC reason to hold back on giving you enough information to make a meaningful decision.

In this specific case, Yisheng Ji was asking for more information related to medicine and finance, areas which he really should be something of an expert on. There's no time pressure or other apparent penalties, you're discussing the subject with friendly NPCs who also have relevant skills, and you rolled a six, which is a critical success when effective skill is 16 or higher, which it very well might be in this case.

If giving you an infodump, when you roll a crit success on a lore check, is suspicious behavior on my part... what the hell am I supposed to do to not make you feel threatened?
>>
No. 118526 ID: 3d2d5f

Yeah, that infodump is still relevant even if we pass on this offer. There's a good chance we'll encounter exodimentional spaces in other contexts. And even if it happens later, or on a different scale, or grown in a more ordinary garden, Ji's likely going to do something with the Cyrenian laserwort at some point, so it's a useful to know your prospects.

>limited-time-offer druidic discount
I mean that's a nice sweetener, but 1200 down from 1300 is only 7.7% off. That's not a deal of a lifetime missed if we pass on it. With good social rolls (or Renown, or Comfort for the Lonely) I see no reason we couldn't get a similar deal on a later large ticket purchase if we saved the cash.

I'll say it again. It's a plot hook your character could act out, but don't support it if it doean't sound fun or interesting to you. From a role-playing running the company perspective, savings and investment are both pretty easy approaches for me to justify. (If anyone wants Dav to blow company funds on a big Conan style party to generate xp, that would probably be a harder sell).

>fellow players demonstrated
I mean I've passed on a bunch of hooks. Skipped the chess puzzle immediately, argued to sail past Ekton as "not our problem", a bunch of stuff Rhea never followed up on, a whole character JL expressed interest in I didn't want to move forward with yet.

Heck, consulting in-game experts about quintessence was a hook that took me threads to follow up on. (Although, our rolls don't bode well for getting accurate information out of this checkup. :p ).
>>
No. 118528 ID: 4a7a65

>>118522
>You think I'm going to punish you if you don't
>thinking this is a railroad plot
No, not at all. I didn't say anything of the sort.

>I happen to personally like the basic idea of extradimensional sanctums
>I've put a lot of thought into the subject
>it's a big-ticket item with a lot of potentially counterintuitive features
This is a powerful enough reason for any player to find such an item desirable. I am genuinely interested in obtaining the item, not because I feel threatened or feel I will be punished if I don't, but because I think it will, in fact, become an indispensible item.

Let me explain more clearly what I meant by ringing warning bells based on level of detail. A high level of detail in explanation is directly indicative of a high level of interest in the subject, (which you've confirmed right here and now). A high level of detail in any particular aspect of the world directly equates to that particular aspect of the world taking a more central role than other, less-interesting aspects of the world. This is common sense stuff so far.

However, all aspects of the world exist as a sliding scale of helpfulness vs danger to the PCs. Where there is helpful magic, there is also dangerous magic, and so on. In many cases, one side of the scale is invaluable to combatting the other side. An easy example being the Shield spell versus the Magic Missile spell. Understanding extradimensional space as a major element of the world (due to particular DM interest) means one must be prepared for both sides of that scale. There will be danger involving or requiring extradimensional space, not based on the presence or absence of any such items in the PC's party, but simply due to DM interest. A DM who likes goblins will naturally include goblins in their campaign. You are accusing me of fearing a railroad plot, but I'm concerned here with the exact opposite. I believe this sort of danger would exist regardless of what the player decisions may be, and thus it is always better to be pre-emptively prepared for it. And all of that is before thinking about mundane application, which I'm told is staggering.

>>118526
>1200 down from 1300 is only 7.7% off
Being able to turn it around for the full 1300 if we change our minds makes it a 7.7% profit opportunity. And 100 gp is twice the wage any particular person received this time.

>don't support it if it doean't sound fun or interesting to you
You misunderstand. It does sound very interesting to me. From the get-go, it sounded very interesting to me. I would have dismissed it offhand and not requested any details at all if it weren't interesting to me. However, I am a practically-minded person, so I still need tangible justification to purchase it, regardless of how interesting it may be. I requested it, rolled for it, and received it. Thus, I can now satisfactorily make the call, both IC and OOC, that it's a good decision to purchase this asset.
>>
No. 118529 ID: 3d2d5f

>>118528
Well that makes this an amusing comedy of misunderstanding, then. Let's buy us a magic garden.
>>
No. 118534 ID: 094652

I've kept Azure speechless because I'm also as shocked at how well that went.

So here's my plan: Azure offers a challenge to Tall Jack Rat's gang (BTW what should we call them from now on?). If they can teach Pog a new fighting style or two, she'll sleep with them. Time spent is proportional to Pog's increase in combat effectiveness, and if they can explain a style she likes with enough detail for Azure to transcribe into writing, she'll give them a whole night. Honestly, it's cheaper than the 5-gold an HOUR deal she usually offers from high-value clients (she'll keep the price high because her charisma and critical success have convinced the bandits to overestimate her already-high abilities).

IC, Azure believes Pog will be too stupid (and something happened to his brain, which she thinks will hinder his learning ability) to learn anything for a week, but this will keep the bandits busy and not demanding paychecks for a while. She won't be too sadistic; a few blowjobs for trying to teach a sack of bricks. However, Pog has changed and should be able to learn slightly more than he could when all the mental conditioning in his brain wasn't chopped in half by an axe. Literally.

OOC, this is a good way to get exp for Azure (sensual indulgence) and Pog (combat training), since I'm not having them take constant risks these days.

Any suggestions?
>>
No. 118535 ID: d36af7

I apologize for reading too much into that comment.
>Understanding extradimensional space as a major element of the world (due to particular DM interest) means one must be prepared for both sides of that scale. There will be danger involving or requiring extradimensional space, not based on the presence or absence of any such items in the PC's party, but simply due to DM interest.
Most of this is true, but "or requiring" does not necessarily follow from the premises when I'm designing simulationist scenarios, rather than narrativist plotlines or gamist balanced encounters. I'm not going to be going out of my way to include situations where an extradimensional space is the perfect tool for the job, probably not even subconsciously, because I'm fundamentally working the design process from the opposite end: coming up with environments and problems first, possible solutions later, if at all.

>>118529
Pretty much, yeah.

On the subject of 'solutions later,' moving in or out of a standard exodimensional sanctum could be less dangerous to Daviste than trying to use a typical crystal ball to extend her portal range, provided she takes it slow, carefully crawling through the center of the door while staying as far as possible from the frame. Force-field bracers like the ones Azarthraine bought would qualify as the "something much more exotic than heavy gloves" to provide DR against such problems, but would also possibly cause other complications.
>>
No. 118538 ID: 3abd97

>>118534
>So here's my plan
That sounds like an effective way to have Pog learn not a lot, for Azure to not sleep with any bandits, and to generally cause a lot of hurt feelings over being led on.

Honestly, from my standpoint, Azure's role in interacting with the bandits comes down to maintaining morale / offering luxuries and entertainment to keep them happy (which may include sex or other things). Charging them for it (at way less than 5 gold a night) would at least keep who gets a turn when orderly. Getting with people without charging them might be good for more goodwill, or offset things if we can't make payroll.

>this is a good way to get exp for Azure (sensual indulgence)
But it's not a costly indulgence for you, so I wouldn't expect a high return on that.

>since I'm not having them take constant risks these days
That seems pretty counter intuitive considering Pog is a super durable meat tank and Azure has limited functional immortally and any healthcare you need beyond that is currently being subsidized by a deva.

Frankly your characters are the people in the party best suited to take certain classes of risks with the least consequences (as the tank and a respawning CHA rogue).

>>118535
Interesting, although certainly not going to chance that without very good reason anytime soon.
>>
No. 118574 ID: 094652

Anyone got a pastebin for our purchases in Overmire?

I haven't had Hore spend anything beyond exp from purchasing a few grams of rare metals. Gotta get a flail or some better armor or something.
>>
No. 118594 ID: 094652

>>850371
Don't forget about Maria and Daniel! And even if the ship captain's budget is mutually exclusive from ours, we should get an official report of their intended supplies for records and future decisions. Knowing what cargo to prioritize in the event of a disaster and how to save it is vital to our security work.

Should we also add "minor" living expenses from Esmeraude? Because... noble.
>>
No. 118598 ID: 3abd97

>Don't forget about Maria and Daniel!
Good point, added. Discussion before seemed to mostly be "have them invest in xp", although I feel they should probably grab some kind of armor upgrade so if we need to use Daniel for his aura, or Maria for undead burning, they're less squishy.

>And even if the ship captain's budget is mutually exclusive from ours, we should get an official report of their intended supplies for records and future decisions.
Well, most the cargo hold is going to be the immovable rods we're being paid to protect. Next most valuable commodity would probably be the q-rations for Dav / Viste. After that, food, water, and basic supplies.

>Should we also add "minor" living expenses from Esmeraude? Because... noble.
Room and board for the entire group over a week is on the order of low single digit gold. Even if she lives it up, and orders a bunch of room service and ruins the sheets, the end result isn't really significant on the scale of the total budget.

Also, she's a fallen noble in a nebulous grey area between client, sub contractor, indentured servant, and camp follower currently. Speaking as the fallen noble running the company, I say she doesn't get extraordinary living accommodations unless she earns them or wants to pay for them herself. :v
>>
No. 118604 ID: d36af7

Thought of a new 0-level effect for Rhea, a downgraded Unseen Servant: instead of 'any reasonably simple task,' it can only apply a short repetitive back-and-forth movement, though the exact details are adjustable. That could be kneading dough, stirring a pot, providing a clumsy massage, scraping crud off a wall (if provided with a suitable tool), pumping bellows, waving a signal lamp, or any number of other things. It's got no ability to adapt to changing circumstances on it's own, so when a hacksaw breaks, or cuts all the way through, it'll keep waving back and forth as if attached to a freewheeling piston mechanism.
>>
No. 118623 ID: 3abd97

>>118604
I am reminded of Snow White using woodland animals to help her with cooking and cleaning, which seems wholly appropriate. Disney princess chore spell go! (Although magician's apprentice might be more apt in terms of the potential for simple actions to run awry).

I like it, thank you.

>>/quest/850496
I think Shadowkaisen's only used gender neutral terms for Valeno so far.
>>
No. 118629 ID: d36af7

>>118623
>pronouns
Dangit I'm usually pretty good about that kind of thing.

Sorry, Shadowkaisen.
>>
No. 118698 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/850822
Hmm I'm not sure what Team Magic Sword is carrying at the minute that would actually count as group funds. Most of their material acquisitions occurred before the current group came together. Oh well, I need to update character sheets for all the shopping anyways.

>>/quest/850905
What's the exchange rate for silver to gold again?
>>
No. 118707 ID: af6e04

>>118698
Yeah, I'm really not sure what she means by on-hand funds. I thought we were broke.
>>
No. 118711 ID: 094652

>Vos wants JATO hammer
Wait a minute. Maria and Daniel haven't spent more than a few silvers so far (downgraded to ally NPCs for now). So if Hore, Vos, Maria, and Daniel pooled their gold shares together they'd have enough to buy the rocket.

They can agree to a time-share situation; Hore is a technologist so she can work on fixing its hidden functions (and gain exp or some other benefit), Maria can use it in low-power mode as a fire hammer, Daniel can use it as intended so enemies underestimate him until it's too late, and Vos can use it when he mutates the appropriate muscle structure and reflexes.

But I need permission from the other players to use Maria and Daniel's gold reserves for this one superweapon.
>>
No. 118715 ID: 3abd97

>But I need permission from the other players to use Maria and Daniel's gold reserves for this one superweapon.
I say treat them like any other npc. If you want them to help you buy that weapon, you gotta try and talk them into it in-game. And probably roll for it.

(An even 4-way split would be 37.5 gold each, with 12.5 left over for personal purchases).

>>118707
I'm just hoping she's not counting the bandits we recruited as currency. :v
>>
No. 118717 ID: d36af7

How silly would it be to throw a sword in combat?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTC_1HRgbuo
Not as much as you might think, particularly one with some sort of magical auto-return feature.
>>
No. 118718 ID: d36af7

>>118698
>exchange rate
One copper coins = $1 = enough maggoty bread to keep a beggar alive for another 8-12 hours
Twenty copper = one silver coin = $20 = good day's pay for a peasant supporting a small family
Twenty silver = one gold coin = $400 = enough wine, women, and song to safely earn 1 XP

Fifty coins weigh one pound. One pound of adequately pure metal in the form of ingots or plates or whatnot is theoretically worth the same as fifty coins of the same metal, but without a (usually draconic) banker's imprint the purity might be disputed, meaning you might have to get an assayer involved, and if so, they're going to take a cut.
>>118715
>hoping she's not counting the bandits we recruited as currency
"Be not afraid" protocols and the injunction against non-mission-critical reallocation of material wealth both, independently, mean she can't just collect the bounties on them herself.

Even if she were allowed to, the nicer and more rewarding way is too slow, while the quick, messy way isn't that much quicker, not when you think it through, take into account how much severed human or orcish heads usually weigh, so teleporting ten or more of them around with a fifty-pound payload limit would mean at least three trips, waiting in line and paying tax at some city's gate three times, filling out all that paperwork at the bounty office, and an incident report for the 77th Celestial Signal Corps HQ, and washing the blood out of her robes afterward... just not worth it, or so she says.

Not without clear provocation, anyway, certainly not while they seem to have more or less surrendered in good faith and continue to cooperate with the larger mission.

No, the cash reserve in question is something which I mentioned already in thread 7 - twice, actually, in quite plain terms - but nobody asked any follow-up questions about. Maybe it's another issue like "the possessed man."
>>
No. 118724 ID: af6e04

>>118717
But does GURPS have rules for unscrewing the pommel and throwing it at your opponent?
>>
No. 118725 ID: af6e04

>something which I mentioned already in thread 7 - twice, actually, in quite plain terms
All I could find skimming the thread was mention of selling the excess ale barrels. Is that what it's from?
>>
No. 118754 ID: 3abd97

>>118717
>particularly one with some sort of magical auto-return feature
As the sword-swinger in the group with a magic auto-return option, I still feel like I've got other options I would turn to first on the priority tree (closing distance with a portal, obsidian butterflies, throwing daggers).

>>118725
Oh! Possibly. I had thought before we'd traded the entire pile to the inn and they were selling off excess, but that would also make sense.
>>
No. 118775 ID: 20ea96

>>/quest/851338
>row after row of overlapping itchy fungus-infected fingernails going all the way up to your elbow
Every single time Tittivila comes up, I feel deeply gratified in my decision to be my own primary source of healing.

>Miraculous regeneration of all missing or mangled limbs and organs at once is a 7th circle spell
>If you only want to replace those two fingers, leaving the rest of the biological hand in place, that means fewer parts AND simpler surgery
Out of curiosity, what circle spell would it be to regrow a small local area like that? I'm very interested in when Yisheng Ji will be able to do this sort of thing. (That'll also be the day I can stop living in fear that he'll randomly get his limbs lopped off and be unable to use any of his abilites.)
>>
No. 118777 ID: d36af7

>>118724
Sure does! Probably at least two or three Ready actions to unscrew the pommel, and then the formula for how far improvised weapons can be thrown and how much damage they do on impact is based on the item's weight and the thrower's strength.

Assuming ST 10, anything under 2.5 pounds is only going to deal 1d6-4 crushing damage, easily absorbed by any armor worthy of the name. Max range would be 20 yards between two and three pounds, 25 yards between one and two, or 35 yards for projectiles less than one pound, assuming they're dense enough to avoid being caught by the wind. Strength 12 increases damage by a point, range limits by 20%, and weight limits by 45%. A ST 10 peasant could throw a 3.75 lb rock fifteen yards to deal 1d6-3, and thereby inflict a 1 hp bruise through leather armor one time in six; a thus-bruised ST 12 guard could pick the same rock up and throw it twenty yards (perhaps to cover the difference if the rioter had turned and spent one second running away) for 1d6-2, enough to plausibly cripple a hand or foot or do unpleasant things to a bare head, but probably not enough to break a major bone or kill outright, except of course on the worst crits, or against someone already in bad shape.

Accuracy is based on Throwing skill, which defaults to DX-3, or Dropping skill if you're directly above the target and letting gravity do most of the work, or various specialized Thrown Weapon skills (Stick mostly meaning boomerangs, Spear, Shuriken, Knife, Harpoon which is for tethered spears, Dart, and Axe/Mace), and finally a cinematic martial arts skill, Throwing Art, which makes all those others redundant since it applies to anything you can lift and deals more damage besides, but requires either chi powers, or supernal mastery of a throwable weapon, to learn or use.

A ST 12 sword-sage with the Throwing Art skill at 20 might lob that detached pommel to hit a head-sized target at forty yards 50% of the time, given a few seconds to aim, dealing 1d6+2 damage. That's enough to reliably put normal people out of the fight (and into a hospital) even on a torso hit, plausibly kill outright with a headshot, leave bruises through plate armor. If the pommel misses, they could try again with a 1.4 pound paperback book, which wouldn't work at all for someone using ordinary Throwing skill, or fling playing cards for 1d6-1 cutting, which is enough to sever a rope (a 3/4" thick rope might take two or three hits), or with max damage, similarly sever an unarmored hand.
>>
No. 118784 ID: d36af7

>>118775
>Out of curiosity, what circle spell would it be to regrow a small local area like that?
The same, 7th. Rebuilding absent or utterly ruined tissue from the germline template while seamlessly linking it with existing healthy tissue is always tricky, regardless of scale.

Reattaching a cleanly severed part could be done with Least True Healing if you lined it up just right and cast before the blood had time to clot. If the cut was messier, or the alignment was off, or the severed bit had to be kept on ice for a few hours before magic became available, there will usually be lingering complications from nerves and tendons not linking up right. Worst-case is some mix of infection, paralysis, and chronic pain, but it might be mostly functional with slightly reduced strength, or limited range of motion, or patches of skin which are persistently numb, or an ugly scar. Such problems can be sorted out with mundane reconstructive surgery, or at most 4th circle magic (supported by herbal tinctures and geomancy), so long as the bits you're trying to heal are alive and in roughly the right places.

Healing magic at the 4th circle can't fix an amputated limb because it's not really looking at the whole body at once, just searching for a dysfunctional organ or subsystem and bringing it into harmony with the surroundings. Rather than expelling any parasites or toxic heavy metals that may have accumulated, it might retool metabolic processes to tolerate, work around, or even benefit from them. A healed-over stump doesn't have enough residual function to register as a problem from that perspective: the skin is intact, blood circulates properly, bone and muscle are sufficient to the structural needs, and so on. Similarly, 5th circle magic can rebuild vital organs, but only by looking for what's necessary to have a complete living system and then sketching in missing sections without regard for what came before. Torn-out heart might grow back with a different number of chambers, or, if other injuries were extensive, even be replaced by a dozen smaller pumps spread throughout the body. Punctured lungs and a slashed throat? The Breath of Life could rework that whole respiratory system for more efficient continuous flow-through of air, like a bird, but remove the patient's ability to breathe through their mouth and thus leave them functionally mute, though also immune to choking on food. Drowning compounded by stolen kidneys could yield amphibious gills.

Heavy use of such spells might permanently change someone's height, weight, hormone levels, or other bodily proportions and homeostatic set-points, though usually only in ways beneficial to their overall health. http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2001-11-07 Same principle as artificial reincarnation picking a random race appropriate to the environment.
>I'm very interested in when Yisheng Ji will be able to do this sort of thing. (That'll also be the day I can stop living in fear that he'll randomly get his limbs lopped off
Ah, if it's your own welfare you're concerned with, that's much simpler. Physiology to heal perfectly, without scarring, including regrowth of amputated bits (like an axolotl or a troll), could have been taken as one of those 21-mote boons on the chessboard puzzle, or Ji could get it right now as that new chi-based ability, instead of the translation link.

Basic version only lets him regenerate minor bits - fingers, toes, ears, cosmetic scarring - over the course of a few weeks, but it'll also slowly reverse non-hereditary mutations, spinal cord damage, or other miscellaneous body horror, and magical healing (plus surgical excision of objectionable bits, as appropriate) can speed it up. With further study and development he could regrow a whole limb in 2d6+2 months, consciously tweak and optimize various metabolic processes, then eventually accelerate the regrowth process from weeks to hours - or instantaneous, with a boost from low-circle healing.
>and be unable to use any of his abilites.)
For the record, the world of Pdn[T]tO isn't Shadowrun or The Sword Interval or some other cosmology where tech and spirit are inherently opposed and allergic to each other. Spells and chi powers can be channeled through a prosthetic limb, provided it's built primarily out of formerly-living material (such as wood, bone, starmetal, or ghosts) and installed competently enough to be otherwise functional. There's not even any penalty for doing so, beyond surgical recovery time and the awkward period of adjustment after any such serious injury or major body mod. If the prosthetic limb is otherwise mundane, a little bit of magic is necessary to get all the subtle energy channels linked up and smoothed out, but any remotely competent journeyman enchanter could do the job in an hour, and even Geoffrey Vargas could manage it with help from a sufficiently well-written reference book. Costs 20 FP to cast or one or two silver to hire someone to do it for you. Usually that'd be two enchanters working together, or one with some appropriate sort of industrial power supply. Working solo without support probably means falling unconscious right after you're done and then spending the next week bedridden - or collapsing during the job, with appropriately disastrous results.
>>
No. 118789 ID: 39fba9

>>118784
>chi powers can be channeled through a prosthetic limb
Oh! That's good to hear. I was concerned about that.

>could get regeneration right now instead of the translation link
Very tempting, but it would be selfish to take an ability that only benefits me over an ability that benefits the entire party. When's the next level Yisheng Ji receives a new chi power? 6? 8? If I get a limb severed before taking regeneration, would regeneration regrow that part? Or would I be screwing myself over, regenerating to a state without that limb? If it's the latter, then taking regeneration might be a now-or-never thing.

How effective at disrupting slashing weapons are these enchanted spidersilk wrappings? I'm not experienced enough with GURPS to comprehend "DR4 sparkly jacket". Can you put that in system-agnostic terms? I'm not sure exactly where on the attack/defense arms race that falls.

For example, in normal circumstances, if someone brought their sword down hard on someone else's arm, they're probably gonna get that arm taken off. Against an armored knight's heavy gauntlet though, chances are pretty good the knight's not going to lose that hand. But then if the sword is adamantium, the odds of losing that hand suddenly become phenomenally high again. A mage wearing a gauntlet of pure force, however, is pretty much assured of not losing that limb even to adamantium. But then a magic (or magic-disruptive) sword might cleave right through that with no problem. And so on, so forth.

What, exactly, should I be afraid of, here? Is pure force enough to cut through it? How about special materials? Magic? Fire or acid? Can Yisheng Ji actively block a blade strike with his forearm? Or is this all information that I'm going to need to ask the seller IC, and roll to not be lied to?
>>
No. 118791 ID: 3d2d5f

>it would be selfish to take an ability that only benefits me over an ability that benefits the entire party
In fairness, a regenerating doctor is still useful to the rest of the party. Both in the sense it allows you to take some risks more safely, and in the sense it reduces the risk that the medic might be disabled when someone badly needs his attention.

By all means, make the choice you think is most useful, or most interesting, or best suits the character. But don't think you have to go a certain way on our account.
>>
No. 118804 ID: 3abd97
File 151321532076.jpg - (26.26KB , 733x440 , How-to-do-Sphinx-Pose.jpg )
118804

>>/quest/851558
Nin you are a goddamn treasure.

>>/quest/851583
>Azure has that sphinx pose again.
Really? That seems pretty ill suited for dungeons in general, or hasty diplomatic interventions in particular.

>Take 10 (let me know if I need to roll)
Also seems ill suited for hasty diplomatic interventions, tbh.
>>
No. 118805 ID: d36af7

>>118789
>If I get a limb severed before taking regeneration, would regeneration regrow that part?
As an innate ability, yes. There are magic items that provide the same basic benefit but only apply to injuries taken after you put them on.

>How effective at disrupting slashing weapons are these enchanted spidersilk wrappings? I'm not experienced enough with GURPS to comprehend "DR4 sparkly jacket". Can you put that in system-agnostic terms? I'm not sure exactly where on the attack/defense arms race that falls.

Key distinction is between 'damage,' mostly meaning how much energy is behind that incoming attack and what form it's in, and 'injury,' meaning how many HP you lose. Crushing damage (I also use 'blunt' and 'bludgeoning' interchangeably) gets reduced by DR and then converts 1:1 to injury. Cutting damage that penetrates DR is multiplied by 1.5, or 2 if it targets the neck or a major blood vessel, but armor is particularly good at preventing it from fully penetrating. Impaling damage is multiplied by 2 on most living targets, but that depends quite a bit on what's deeper inside the target.

Let's say Yisheng Ji has 12 hp and is wearing enchanted silk robes with DR 4. A ninja appears as if from nowhere, throws a flurry of shuriken at him. None roll more than four cutting damage, or strike unprotected parts of his body, so they either get caught in the cloth or bounce off ineffectually.

Frustrated, the ninja draws a sword, closes to melee range, and chops at the doctor's hand (covered by a long flowing sleeve) for 8 cutting damage; this is reduced by DR to 4, and fails to fully penetrate the armor. The doctor is not exposed to any poison on the blade, and takes 4 hp of injury to the hand, which is exactly equal to 1/3 his HP; to cripple an extremity would require one more than that. So, his hand is badly bruised but remains functional. He'd be taking a -4 penalty to any non-reflexive action on his next turn from the pain, but that goes away after one second, and doesn't affect active defenses. Basically a flinch.

If the damage roll was a 9 instead, then the 5 penetrating damage would cause 7 injury to the hand, and cripple it (at least for the duration of the fight, duration of crippling injuries is a separate roll), but actual loss of HP would be limited to 5, the same as the crippling threshold. There would also be poison, infection, and other such matters to worry about at that point, since the blade's actual cutting edge touched flesh and blood rather than being blunted by silk. Crippling threshold for a limb is based on HP/2, so 7 with 12 max HP. Any crippling effect, as well as any hit over HP/2 even to the torso, or any noticeable damage to the head or vitals (heart, lungs, kidneys) can cause stunning: no deliberate actions at all for multiple seconds, reflexive stuff like active defenses at -4. That's the level of damage which usually puts somebody 'out of the fight,' even if they're still conscious and mobile. Good time to offer the opportunity to surrender.

Automatic permanent crippling due to amputation or destruction of a limb or extremity requires twice as much injury as would be required to cripple it. If magical healing is applied before the 'duration of crippling injury' roll would have been made, meaning either during the fight or in the immediate aftermath, it can undo this damage before it fully sinks in.

The wounding multiplier for impaling damage depends heavily on what part of the body it's targeting. On a limb, it's only x1, same as crushing - but it does break the skin if it penetrates armor DR at all, causing blood loss, delivering poison, etc. On the torso it's x2, and it can even target the vitals inside for x3. Lots of swords can be swung for cutting or thrust for impaling, and a swing does more base damage at the same ST, but against armor the thrust is often more effective because it can target weak points and then multiply whatever damage does slip through. A cut across the chest for 7 damage would leave no more than a painful bruise through DR 4 enchanted silk, chainmail, or scales, while a stab to the heart for only 5 damage against that same armor causes the same amount of immediate lost HP, plus stunning, and bleeding which for most practical purposes would require rapid magical healing to survive. First Aid would be useless, and treatment with Surgery would be at -4, as would HT rolls for natural clotting.

Skull hits have an x4 wounding multiplier for all damage (except toxic), since the brain is about as fragile and mission-critical as organs can be. Good news is, it also gets DR 2 for free, thanks to the bones involved. That's fully cumulative with armor, and fitting armor onto the head is fairly straightforward since there are so few moving parts. Eyes get that same x4 wounding multiplier, and no natural DR, but they're much harder to target. Unfortunately they're also extremely difficult to armor effectively with low-tech materials, so mainly the solution there is expensive magical force fields. As a cultivator, though, you could put some points in the Blind-Fighting skill and then wear a helmet without eyeholes, like Daredevil or Toph Bei-Fong. If you're opposed to protective headgear on an aesthetic basis, you could buy something like this http://www.threepanelsoul.com/comic/props which functions just like the force field bracers, apart from providing mundane DR 6 to the skull rather than the forearms.

Muscle-powered personal weapons hit diminishing returns somewhere around 10 damage. Reliably doing more than that usually means a big buff guy swinging a heavy two-handed weapon with everything he's got, wide open to counterattacks, and even then it wouldn't be too much more without superhuman strength or heavy-duty magic. Somebody with DR 10+ is a tank, functionally immune to almost anything but crits and specialized anti-armor weapons (meteoric iron for magical forcefields, starmetal for mundane plates, siege engines for anything that can't dodge, etc.) DR 4 or 5 on at least the torso and skull is a sensible minimum for counter-assassination and protection from random battlefield hazards. At that level, you'd still want to avoid getting hit, but any random arrow or knife is likely to be more of a painful inconvenience than mortal danger.

Azarthraine of Hollowfall's highest-circle direct damage spell, Supreme Disintegration, deals 30d6 corrosion damage, or 5d6 to those who pass a fort save or are generally resistant to magic (such as golems, Minoan ox-men, or items made from cold iron), or obliterates a thousand cubic feet of relatively homogenous inanimate material, and in any case ignores most DR. That's enough to reduce most mortal creatures to a wisp of ash and regrets, though meteoric iron or other dead magic areas thwart it outright. Six castings (the most he can manage in a typical working day, with no other high-end spells) could slay a 300-ton kaiju. A magical force field can absorb it and thereby protect whatever's on the other side, but is disrupted by doing so. Rather than waste that kind of power on cracking 1st circle Mage Armors off a squad of mooks, he might use it to cut the floor out from under them.

Inerrant bolts of force (magic missiles) ignore most protection apart from specialized countermeasures, but they only do 1d4+1 damage each and can't target specific hit locations.

Lightning is usually five or six d6, half on a successful dodge. Metal armor's no good, but silk would protect with it's full DR.

Being on fire, due to a direct hit with a molotov cocktail for example, deals 1d6-1 damage per second for about 30 seconds. This damage is spread across most of the body, so armor DR doesn't help much unless it's a full sealed suit. After ten seconds, your clothes will probably also be on fire, so the damage might continue even after the initial fuel is exhausted. After (3xDR) seconds, you start rapidly losing FP due to heatstroke. Incendiaries can be a very efficient way to deal with heavy armor, by simply turning the whole tin can into an oven rather than trying to find a weak spot, but in melee combat time it's also perilously slow. A lot of stuff could happen while you're waiting for that killing heat to percolate inward through layers of protection.

Meteoric iron weapons would treat enchanted spidersilk robes as mundane silk, effectively reducing DR to 2, but that's still better than nothing. Starmetal weapons rip through mundane protection easily, but magical DR is worth five times as much, so against those the silk robes would have DR 10.
>>
No. 118808 ID: d36af7

https://blog.patreon.com/not-rolling-out-fees-change/

Well, that's reassuring. Everybody's had some "seemed like a good idea at the time" moments, the important part is whether that instinctive reaction afterward is to repair, or conceal.
>>
No. 118815 ID: d36af7

The thing about Jalkaren is that card's effect, more or less "a powerful outsider of opposed alignment makes you a tempting offer, the finer points of which you will likely come to regret," was meant as a 'deal with the devil' setup. But how was I supposed to resolve that when the one who drew it kinda already IS a devil? So, sorry 'bout basically having a big cutscene with NPCs talking to each other instead of responding more fully to declared actions.

Strngy, if you want a knock-down drag-out Nin vs. Jalkaren fight scene, we could do that, but the statue and extra lives probably aren't enough to make up for the power disparity. By far the most likely outcome would be releasing an olympic-sized swimming pool worth of blood (no I haven't actually checked the math on that, yet) into the room, then having to roll up a new character, and also no more angelic support for everybody else.
>>
No. 118820 ID: 094652

I want to solve this situation non-violently, but in-character? Azure is a slutty diva first and a dwarven businesswoman second. Of all the things that can utterly stab her pride in the heart, getting accidentally conned into a horrible deal by someone without a lick of deceit is somewhere in the top five. She's going to need some kind of compensation, spiritual goods only if necessary, before she can bring herself to get off her ANGRY roost.
>>
No. 118821 ID: af6e04

>Nin you are a goddamn treasure.
Heehee

>Nin vs. Jalkaren fight scene
Nin is capable of biding his time. Though I wonder if we could take her, all together.
>>
No. 118822 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/851635
>Maybe it's another issue like "the possessed man."
While this was highly amusing, and a very nice play on the lieutenant-commander's part, in this case, it's that I never would have considered the minions' treasury at our disposal. (I read the second quote as "you can sell them things" not "you're free to use their money"). People whose continued support you pay for in cash don't typically let you raid their bank account (unless you con or strong-arm them into it).

Jalkaren appearing personally and having a much stronger negotiating position was not an outcome I considered.

>>118815
Personally, I find the whole devil-shanghaied-into-repairing-a-hospital thing to be a highly entertaining premise, and pretty much any time Nin and Jalkaren interact is gold.

>>118820
If you want to resolve any time critical, stressful situation, you should probably roll for it. Take 10 is taking time to to a mediocre job.

And I mean Nin is laughably irresponsible and Rhea is a niave optimist who trusts the angel. They had in-character justifications for not stopping to ask what the price actually was before accepting. If Azure is annoyed, she has only herself to blame for not speaking up sooner to as the obvious question.
>>
No. 118824 ID: 3d2d5f

>business communication protocols, in particular the part where you're supposed to explain the exact cost and methods of any business transaction
Okay, considering how often you've described the Youngmason family's business practices as straight up cheating people, Azure's indignation at not being quoted an accurate and detailed price up front is adorable.

>I want to solve this situation non-violently
In my estimation, mouthing off to the angel who specializes in communication about unfair business practices when you live in a glass house is most likely going to earn you a lecture, not a violent response, so mission accomplished?

>but in-character? Azure is a slutty diva first and a dwarven businesswoman second.
Seems to me not provoking a fight you can't win and getting killed is just good business sense. You can't be profitable if you're dead! (Usually. Baring elaborate gambits, insurance scams, or other things that take a lot of prep work). Dead divas also have a much smaller market to peddle sluttishness in.

>Though I wonder if we could take her, all together.
Nin's biggest problem might be convincing the rest of his team to cooperate in such an attempt.
>>
No. 118835 ID: d36af7

>>118822
>While this was highly amusing, and a very nice play on the lieutenant-commander's part, in this case, it's that I never would have considered the minions' treasury at our disposal.
As an angel accustomed to operating in a military command structure, Lt.Cmdr. Jalkaren could argue that she was considering the bandits new recruits for the quest, and thus part of "your group," the set of people who are under your command and for whom you are responsible.
>(I read the second quote as "you can sell them things" not "you're free to use their money").
If on the other hand they're to be treated as mercenary subcontractors (with no written contract? the depth of hypocrisy in Azure's complaints about sloppy business practices here is almost surreal) keeping their own entirely separate accounts, well then, you're selling them shovels and a wheelbarrow for immediate individual use. How is that any different from charging for other materiel? Their quartermaster was present in negotiations, actively consulted, and was even presented with an alternative solution - one which was arguably more consistent with relevant laws and ordinances both local and throughout the Drakocracy.

Insofar as Jalkaren Blessed-Is-The-Light is acting as a GM avatar (which I really am trying to keep to a minimum), OOC I'm trying to encourage focus on logistics, and follow-up questions about details that may be important later, through the expedient of beating you over the head with a problem which could have been easily prevented by paying more attention to that sort of thing. http://archives.erfworld.com/Book%201/134 On a more IC note, isn't it traditional for angels to prefer harrowing ordeals, dreadful sacrifices, and awe-inspiring miracles over penny-pinching and banal marginal drudgery, even when the latter might be easier, kinder, AND more effective for the immediate issue? I mean, in It's A Wonderful Life, the main angel we see throws himself in the river and then sets up an elaborate vision-quest, rather than snatching that newspaper full of money back from Mr. Potter right when Uncle Billy dropped it. Someone you can count on in your darkest hour, when all hope seems lost, has a very different business model from someone you can count on to provide quality farm tools at unbeatable prices, and they'd likely both prefer not to be casually mistaken for the other.

>>/quest/851704
> Isn't there some kind of magic shovel or drill she could have suggested instead, something lightweight but fairly expensive?
User-friendly earth-moving magic items aren't generally priced so low on the open market as to radically undercut slave labor for routine uses, so anything significantly more effective than well-made shovels would cost more than you can readily pay. There's another bandit group out in the woods with a Catgut Legion (a harp which can, for a few hours per week, produce results similar to a labor pool of five thousand men), maybe you could "negotiate" with them somehow.

>>118821
Her combat-relevant capabilities are a by-the-book Trumpet Archon statblock. She's also got Greater Scrying at will, but it can only target Nistamatsin personally, and it requires contact with either the silver statue or the Deck of Many Things to initiate, though not to maintain.
>>
No. 118837 ID: af6e04

>They had in-character justifications for not stopping to ask what the price actually was before accepting
Oh no, let's not justify what the angel just did! She openly admitted to tricking us and then threatened to kill the bandits if they didn't hand over their money. Threatening to kill people seems to be her go-to solution.
>If he's upset about being tricked out of the seventh part of that money, she asks, would it be more to his preference to lose it all, by violence

>could have been easily prevented by paying more attention to that sort of thing.
But this was a scouting mission, not a 'let's start remodeling and worry about the skeletons and centipedes later' mission. We really didn't NEED the shovels but Nin went ahead and approved their delivery cause the party convinced him. I'm taking this as more of a lesson of 'don't do something just because the angel told you to.'

>Nin's biggest problem might be convincing the rest of his team to cooperate in such an attempt.
For now...
>>
No. 118838 ID: 094652

>>118835
Like I said, Azure's charisma is far beyond my own. I might forget stuff that she wouldn't.

Honestly? Azure wanted to have faith. She's heard a bunch of strange stories from her father and even some of his friends about gods of good who cheat and swindle and indoctrinate and still manage to convince others they are the definition of good. Years in the open have told a different story, of angels flying down from the skies to save the innocent and help the just in their times of need, and expecting nothing but devotion to the cause in return. Azure figured the latter was more reasonable (given the world she's in and the powers she has), and so she focused more on the mining right there and then (as in, actually helping others instead of arguing) instead of helping Nistamatsin with arguing at an angel, since that is what devils do and mortals complaining at angels for no good reason isn't rational. She figured Nistamatsin wouldn't be stupid enough to take the deal without asking the exact price first (being a devil and all), and Jalkaren wouldn't be shrewd enough to overcharge them for simple tools.

She wanted to try and have faith in Jalkaren. She won't make that mistake again.

>No written contracts
She's got them partially enthralled by her beauty and grace, so the contract part is for Nistamatsin, an actual devil, to devise and co-sign.

>Bandit's treasure part of our assets
From the description of their current status, you made it sound like they had a fair amount of gold (~10GP) but were wearing down due to not having anywhere to spend it fairly with bounties on their heads. 175 gold, on the other hand, seems like far more than enough to bribe someone in town into buying them the necessities, at a 400% markup.
>>
No. 118841 ID: 3abd97

>>118835
I'm not criticizing Jalkaren's decision making- the goals make sense, it serves more than one at once, and fits her established modus operandi. Just pointing out my own thought process and why it lead me to miss what you were thinking of.

I was pretty much modelling them as mercenaries. Hmmm. I guess 'converts to the cause' would be more accurate. Or house troops- we're paying for their upkeep more than loyalty.

>OOC I'm trying to encourage focus on logistics, and follow-up questions about details that may be important later, through the expedient of beating you over the head with a problem which could have been easily prevented by paying more attention to that sort of thing
Gotta admit I took a small amount of umbrage when I realize the puzzle of the moment was "hey magey your asset tracking missed something you want to go over everything again." (Which is why I was more than happy to leave it to Nin's 'diplomacy').

>follow-up questions about details that may be important later
Abstractly, there is a little disincentive to ask too many follow up questions about every potentially interesting detail (starmetal is a formerly living material?) in the sense that your spoons are limited. Sometimes a detail doesn't feel important enough.

>>118837
I was actually justifying my own not asking the obvious question in-character (even when I thought of it), not Jalkaren's actions. Rhea was perfectly willing to trust the angel at her word without looking for the catch or asking for the specific price. And it worked out quite well, from her perspective. >>/quest/851712

But I can pretty easily justify Jalkaren's actions too. It accomplished several positive objectives, and pretty effectively established authority over the bandits. A flaming stick to Azure's hot carrot. As a group, I'd say that leaves us better off than before. And all it cost us were assets we didn't even realize we had.
>>
No. 118843 ID: d36af7

>>118838
>save the innocent and help the just
Azure considers herself just and/or innocent?
>>
No. 118845 ID: 094652

>>118843
No, but she thought angels were NICE.

Polite? Definitely. Nice?
>Conned a devil and a merchant princess out of 24 gold and then chided them for their 'foolishness', AKA trust in her sincerity.
>Implied death threats and general lack of respect towards lives of bandits compared to a few hours of bureaucratic work
Not so much.
>>
No. 118846 ID: 3abd97

>No, but she thought angels were NICE.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GoodIsNotNice
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GoodIsNotSoft
:v

I'm not sure why you and/or Azure think being nice is a necessary requirement in being an eternal soldier in the unending battle against the forces of darkness.

As for the rest, yes, not asking what the price was in advance was foolish, no air quotes required, especially if you're trying to lean on 'merchant princess' chops. The death threat was was overt, and she showed nothing but respect towards the people it was directed at.

I'm kind of surprised at the level of hostility in the face of someone leveraging superior force to do good (or to accomplish a goal). Broadly speaking, that's what adventuring is. I'm also somewhat confused by the leap from "we didn't think the bandits gold was ours" to "the angel cheated us!"
>>
No. 118848 ID: d36af7

>>118841
>Gotta admit I took a small amount of umbrage when I realize the puzzle of the moment was "hey magey your asset tracking missed something you want to go over everything again." (Which is why I was more than happy to leave it to Nin's 'diplomacy').
Not something you failed to keep track of. I got lazy about describing the results of Azure's crit success seduction, and nobody bothered pressing the bandits to describe their material assets in comprehensive detail. Also, if all the asset tracking is feeling like too much work, maybe other players should be doing more of it?

Speaking of bell-curve-breaking seduction attempts, back with the catgirl architects, I figured Davina ended up very briefly looking sorta like Itami Youji did about two days after the Battle of Italica, then she had one or more of the team's various healers sort that out almost immediately, because barefaced secret identities do not mix well with highly visible scarring. http://ctenophorae.com/post/157171857348/ouchies (NSFW)
>Abstractly, there is a little disincentive to ask too many follow up questions about every potentially interesting detail in the sense that your spoons are limited.
Pouring out more info in response to direct, specific questions is one of the easiest parts of this for me, though.
>(starmetal is a formerly living material?)
Yep. Sounds like it ought to be metal from fallen stars, right? Only it's almost the exact opposite of dull meteoric iron, hypersensitive to magic rather than immune. Some say starmetal is smelted from the lint of rejected potential destinies which the Norns comb out of their hair after a long day working the Loom of Fate, or perhaps the shavings and chips left behind when a solemn oath or geas or curse is carved into the flesh of the Unbroken Word. Some say nuggets of it are found inside the empty shells left behind by those who successfully transcend mortality. Or. more cynically, it could be there's some simple alchemy trick to transmute it from ordinary dragon bones or something, and the producers make up stories as a smokescreen for corporate counterespionage. Regardless, it's widely known to be a valid material for wands.

For some reason I thought you'd be more curious about ghosts being a valid raw material.
>>
No. 118849 ID: 094652

>>118846
There's a lot Azure doesn't know about the world yet, these tropes included. A few years of hedonism and the occasional encounters with serial killers do not make up for her sheltered upbringing. But she IS learning.

>"we didn't think the bandits gold was ours" to "the angel cheated us!"
Well, Azure's too spoiled to care about a few dozen gold spent here and there for a good cause. The real issue is, Azure trusted the angel to do her best to resolve situations with minimal bloodshed and maximized happiness for all parties on her side, and maximized bloodshed and justice for enemies opposing the ideology she has sworn to uphold (and at the moment, this does NOT count Nistamatsin because he has undergone serious paradigm shifts to his alignment and is utilizing his free will and imagination as any other mortal would). And then the angel found a way to make someone on her side, and on Azure's watch, pay a ludicrous sum for a paltry and inefficient asset. If their lives were in danger and/or their limbs were in chains, she'd understand the price jack; praise it, even. But as it stands, they had options, and the angel convinced them, inadvertently, to choose the worst possible one.

And the worst part? Azure has a sinking suspicion that Lieutenant Commander Jalkaren Blessed-Is-The-Light is not in fact consciously attempting to con, betray, or otherwise oppose us in any way, but is in fact working to the best of her ability according to protocol and orders for a greater legal system or higher power which IS trying to screw thousands of independent contractors off at the same time for profits in gold and faith. It's like watching a little boy accidentally dig up a pirate's entire fortune, or figure out where that fortune is or whatever, and then willingly give that fortune directly to the king (who may or may not be a decadent incompetent sadistic etc.) for no reason than "principle", never stopping to consider what such a huge profit could do as a long-term investment or a stable dedication to better services or a contribution to public-dedicated technology, instead of just giving it to a higher power as a lump sum for some imagined hope of it doing good.

Since someone "on the side of someone good" took a large sum from someone "on the side of bad", Azure wants to SEE that money directly benefit those orphans Jalkaren is talking about, and not just be sent to that big vault in the sky so it might one day be used to help a small-time prince take care of his starved-peasant uprising for being 'disobedient'. If Jalkaren started boasting about suckering them, Azure would feel respect for someone better than her at economics instead.
>>
No. 118857 ID: 094652

Okay I should probably stop ranting, it's stressing me out. Personally, I feel guilty for not fulfilling the role of quartermaster. I mean, I want Azure to keep the role, but I personally can't keep up with the level of charisma and micromanagement that Azure would have. Suggestions?

Right. Final decision, Azure will vote to just pay the angel, be paranoid about any further help she gives, and get to doing the actual rescue work for good karma. And both IC and OOC, from her constant character descriptions and self-restraints I honestly felt that Jalkaren seemed like a truly virtuous soldier, if a bit stern. Not anymore.

And before I forget
>Sphinx pose
Not what I meant. Picture a bipedal sphinx trying to arch its back like a scared cat. Heh.
>>
No. 118859 ID: 20ea96
File 151333021065.jpg - (8.94KB , 364x375 , Palpatine_grin.jpg )
118859

>>118845
>thought angels were NICE
>>118846
>the angel cheated us!
>>118837
>She openly admitted to tricking us
>I'm taking this as more of a lesson of 'don't do something just because the angel told you to.'
>>118857
>be paranoid about any further help she gives
Yesss, I welcome all of you to the dark rational and pragmatic side with open arms.

>>118841
>It accomplished several positive objectives
>all it cost us were assets we didn't even realize we had
You also learned a valuable lesson about trust, and I hope you'll hold it as close to your hearts as I do. Frankly, I think you all got off very lightly. (Please don't misunderstand this as schadenfreude.) Jokes aside, I sincerely and genuinely consider you fortunate to have only lost as much as you did. Everybody gets cheated once in a while, no matter how careful you are. To minimize losses and learn from the experience, that's the key in my opinon. Everyone survived, and there are thousands more gold pieces on the horizon. Eric Idle wrote a song about this sort of thing.

As an incidental aside regarding alignment, I'd just like to say that in other campaigns, I've personally met far more abuse at the hands of lawful and/or good humanoids than any bestial monster. It's that moral high ground you have to watch out for. https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/352737
>>
No. 118860 ID: 3abd97

>>118848
>Also, if all the asset tracking is feeling like too much work, maybe other players should be doing more of it?
In general, it's not, although I wouldn't complain about help. (Speaking of, if Vos, Hore and Maru could unambiguously state their final purchases at some point, that would be handy for bookkeeping. Granted, Hore already did once, but there were a lot of questions asked following that).

>Speaking of bell-curve-breaking seduction attempts, back with the catgirl architects, I figured Davina ended up very briefly looking sorta like Itami Youji did about two days after the Battle of Italica, then she had one or more of the team's various healers sort that out almost immediately, because barefaced secret identities do not mix well with highly visible scarring.
Pfffff. Well she probably took it in stride. Don't play the game if you're afraid to lose!

>Pouring out more info in response to direct, specific questions is one of the easiest parts of this for me, though.
Noted.

>For some reason I thought you'd be more curious about ghosts being a valid raw material.
Well they're obviously formerly living! I would expect something along the lines of literal phantoms limbs, or gooey ectoplasm slime constructs, or exalted style soulsteel.

>>118849
>>118857
Azure's worldview is a stupefying combination of sheltered absurd idealism and cynically jaded selfish elitism.

>I feel guilty for not fulfilling the role of quartermaster. I mean, I want Azure to keep the role, but I personally can't keep up with the level of charisma and micromanagement that Azure would have. Suggestions?
The primary skill of a quartermaster isn't charisma, it's keeping track of stuff. That should be possible OOC, even if you can't match your character's charm.

>>118859
>Everybody gets cheated once in a while, no matter how careful you are
>careful
I'm sorry, was anyone under the impression little miss walked-off-a-cliff-on-faith was being careful in her dealings with an avatar of good?

Also I'm kind of amused for all you're all being paranoid about the manipulative and death threatening angel who shanghaied us into this quest (why is anyone surprised she used the same MO again), my character isn't the one who agreed to owe her vaguely defined 'favors'.
>>
No. 118861 ID: 094652

>>118860
>Azure's worldview is a stupefying combination of sheltered absurd idealism and cynically jaded selfish elitism.
Oh man, that's pinpoint accurate. Nobles, right? She'll grow out of it eventually.
>>
No. 118862 ID: 3d2d5f

>Nobles, right?
New money, jumped-up merchants, right?

:v
>>
No. 118864 ID: af6e04

Wow this blew up! Nin really only cares about using this as ammunition to rally everybody against the angel and isn't paying any real concern for the bandits' 25 gold.

>asset tracking
I'd be happy to help. If you need my gmail account for the sake of granting edit access, JamesLeng should be able to send it to you. (rather not share it on an open forum if that can be helped)

>Personally, I feel guilty for not fulfilling the role of quartermaster. I mean, I want Azure to keep the role, but I personally can't keep up with the level of charisma and micromanagement that Azure would have. Suggestions?
If I remember correctly I assigned Azure the role of second in command and Rhea the role of quartermaster. If both of you think those positions should be reversed then that's fine, it makes sense either way. Azure is a merchant so should be competent at keeping track of things, and Rhea has a moral compass more aligned to the task at hand, which Nin would probably consult a lot.

As far as being able to fill the role OOC, don't worry about it. I'm a terrible leader, but this is a game in which we can try things we wouldn't normally do in real life.

>Yesss, I welcome all of you to the dark rational and pragmatic side with open arms.
Heehee Tunic is right. As far as learning lessons about blind trust in NPCs this was about as soft as you could get.

>if Vos, Hore and Maru could unambiguously state their final purchases at some point
That spear is it, unless we end up buying the JATO hammer. Vos is saving the rest of his money for a benevolence fund for the Church of Tittivila.
>>
No. 118866 ID: 3d2d5f

>>118864
I think edit access is open. Although if you don't want your primary email all over it you might want to use a secondary.

>If I remember correctly I assigned Azure the role of second in command and Rhea the role of quartermaster. If both of you think those positions should be reversed then that's fine
I'd forgotten about that! I have no problem leaving Rhea as quartermaster, although she's probably better at making sure everyone has something to eat and somewhere to sleep then managing finances.

Roles necessarily sort of overlap as we think of things to contribute anyways.

>unless we end up buying the JATO hammer
Gonna require some in game action if Hore and Vos agree to pursue that. Need to raise more money than the two of you have. Talk Maria and Daniel (or someone else) into helping, find some way to get a discount or earn some additional money in town, etc.
>>
No. 118896 ID: d36af7

I'd like to thank kome for pledging $1.
>>
No. 118897 ID: 094652

>>118864
>Azure is second-in-command
>Rhea is the quartermaster
Oh right, my mistake. Should keep the second-in-command role for Azure instead of switching, OOC I'm too disorganized to keep track of every single little thing at the same time, even with a ledger. I've tried.

>Vos is saving the rest of his money for a benevolence fund for the Church of Tittivila.
To be clear, I was hoping strngy would make the roll to convince the twins, because their current characterization includes "Maria will use flamethrowers on Hore if she and her lewd gestures get within five feet of Daniel". So basically, it's strngy's decision whether or not they should co-op purchase the JATO, and if not then I'll just compute a heavier shopping list instead.

>>118896
yer welcome!
>>
No. 118960 ID: 094652

Still thinking up a shopping list. Might need some help.

* Since there's still a small chance that other team members might change their minds and accept a small dip in their assets or permission to loan the mutual fund to buy the JATO hammer, I want to invest most of Hore's 50GP. For instance, if she opts to fund the purchase of expensive plants, can she earn a bonus from the company? Or some other bonds that have stable returns.

* Hore's a war mercenary at heart. She doesn't really care about survival tools or communication magics, just attack, defense, and rations. Everything else is on-site procurement or funded by her clients. Which might explain why she did so badly on her first dungeon crawl. OOC, my focus is on video-game RPGs and not tabletops, and the former don't care as much for logistics as tactics. Might need some help figuring that out.

* For attack, a steel flail with multiple heads means Hore can specialize her future battleaxe purchases in the two-hand category. I've been looking into swiss army weapons though - stuff that turns from one weapon into another as a swift action. Or is that just plain expensive?

*As for armor, what happens if I ask for a +1 DR enhancement on the leather and chainmail simultaneously? How much would it cost to get either retrofitted for extra dexterity and stuff?

* In particular, since they're doing work in the middle of the ocean, how much would a water purifier cost?

* And last, is there any sort of battle focus for the kineticist class? I mean, maybe the arm is the limit, but what about new focal lenses for extra damage?
>>
No. 118967 ID: 3abd97

>Might need some help figuring that out
In abstract, your options for self improvement are simple. (1) You can try to do what you already do better, (2) you can try to acquire new options / capabilities, (3) or you can try to cover existing weaknesses and deficiencies.

>stuff that turns from one weapon into another as a swift action.
>Or is that just plain expensive?
It has to cost as much as a good weapon, then stack on the cost of the mechanical and/or magical bits that allow it to transform, then it needs to be optimized to be fast (you ever notice how many steps the good transformers took as a kid?), and it needs to do all that without compromising its efficacy or durability. That's a lot of extra craft and design work.

>what happens if I ask for a +1 DR enhancement on the leather and chainmail simultaneously?
Then you pay around 2.5 silver for each enchantment, as was already quoted.

>how much would a water purifier cost
As much as it costs to keep Daniel alive.
>>
No. 118983 ID: 20ea96

>>118960
>how much would a water purifier cost
>>118967
>As much as it costs to keep Daniel alive
As it happens, the answer to that is "nothing", because both Yisheng Ji and Daniel can condense fresh water out of salt water at will, as much as they like.
>>
No. 118996 ID: d36af7

>water purifier
Apart from in-house magical options already discussed, you could buy one of those clay jars to filter swamp water (one gold, 52lb empty, twenty gallons per three weeks), or an alembic to boil seawater along with some tubing to condense the steam (small version is included in a field alchemy lab for 2.5 gold, 10 pounds; big version intended for alcohol production is 6 gold, two tons, and can only fit through the exodimensional sanctum's door by being partially disassembled; intermediate sizes, or buying some essential fittings and doing assembly yourself, may also be possible but require a roll). Distillation by alembic requires a steady heat source, normally meaning either charcoal, direct sunlight, or a bound elemental. Hore's plasma cannon could substitute but is far from ideal. Efficient distillation also benefits greatly from a source of cold. If you don't want to be leaning on a caster's constant attention, best option there might be a chunk of unmelting ice, more than forty gold for any useful quantity.
>>
No. 119012 ID: 094652
File 151384369508.png - (57.11KB , 800x800 , Meeting Room Proposal.png )
119012

Here's my proposal for the room. It needs work, but if it can be good with potential, Hore will officially submit it.

The point is, make a hexagonal or circular room, then place a gazebo in the center, and put rooms around two areas of the gazebo to simulate a connecting path between two long hallways, which are actually just four rooms. We also need a secret room for Esmeraude and Cap to hide behind.
>>
No. 119013 ID: d36af7

>>119012
If I'm reading the scale right, those little triangular rooms are about fifteen square feet, smaller than a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatami which is a handy approximation for one person's minimal sleeping space. Closer to a phonebooth than a bedroom. Two people couldn't share one overnight unless they were sleeping in shifts or laying on top of each other, and I'm not actually seeing anything about bunkbeds in your proposal.

The toolshed/airlock is twenty square feet, probably meaning four feet by five, and it comes between the greenhouse and the outside in order to minimize drafts and other contamination.

You seem to be using almost all the space as living area, which would definitely impact agricultural productivity. Five hundred square feet isn't much, only about one hundredth of an acre, so to grow enough crops there to feed even one person (or an equivalent amount of other plants) requires absolutely ideal conditions and a lot of cleverness besides, without much room to spare. http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/images/lifesupport/lifesupport3.jpg
>>
No. 119014 ID: 094652

>>119013
Dang. Wasn't thinking straight.

Okay, take out the living quarters, but keep the hexagonal shape and gazebo. We can pack a layer of soil on the floor by using those wicker privacy screens as floorguards, grow crops on the gazebo-without-a-roof for the time being, and then use it later as a meeting room or bunk bed area.
>>
No. 119020 ID: 3abd97

>Vulnerability: Bags of Holding, portals, and other technological exceptions to Euclidean geometry are treated as if wrapped in razorwire
Not to rain on anyone's parade but Davina's not even going to try to enter this thing for anything less than a significant emergency. Which makes its current value as a meeting room limited.

That, said, the concept of a mobile sanctum / base with space for everyone, gardening, and other stuff is pretty neat, and might be feasible as a long term goal. It just needs to be bigger than the current magic garden, and work around Dav's vulnerability if you want her in there (which is possible- it would just take expensive research into more 'natural' exodimensional space design. Which between Azarthraine's research and Dav's own powerset, we're sort of in a good starting position for).

...or you could just wait till Dav's high enough level to rip her own sanctum open in space, if you don't mind bunking with tentacles.
>>
No. 119027 ID: 3f5235

>>/quest/853129
>Draw up a map of the sanctum, list every item brought inside by name and weight. Specify where things are being stored.
I'm working on a design now, but it will take some time, since you're limiting me to player knowledge instead of letting me use character knowledge. I have to now do a lot of research on gardening which Yisheng Ji should already be very familiar with, and even precisely come up with calculations on the weight of dirt and whatnot.

Since you're asking for an exact tally of items I'm bringing in and only noting that complicated traps cost extra, I'm assuming "reasonable mundane furnishings" will include all the gardening supplies (such as pots, water containers, and basic tools) necessary to maintain the garden that I'll have to specify in my final plan. If I write up the research paper on garden layout you're requesting, I don't want to afterwards hear that half the things have to be thrown out because they're not in the budget.

>>119012
>>119013
>>119014
>meeting room / bunk bed area
>which would definitely impact agricultural productivity
As magey noted, Davina cannot use the space, which makes it useless as a meeting room. Also, I don't understand why you're so fixated on making it the primary sleeping area for everyone else when you can easily sleep anywhere outside the extremely expensive extradimensional space. The main purpose of the space is for agricultural cultivation and goods storage, both of which have been noted to being potentially highly profitable, so any alternative uses for the space must be something that does not negatively interfere with those functions. Using it as a living area is right out, unless it is for someone who both cannot safely rest outside the area and is more valuable than the opportunity cost of housing them safely inside.

>a secret room for Esmeraude and Cap to hide behind
Which brings me to the next point: neither Esmeraude nor Cap can be trusted. In fact, Cap is very explicitly untrustworthy. Keeping them hidden in the same space as our valuable and irreplaceable plants and goods is a profoundly bad idea.

>Vos is in charge of water duties
Why? Yisheng Ji has actively volunteered to take care of the garden to the best of his ability, and can also condense fresh water with his mind. If anyone else would be assisting him with water duties, it'd be Daniel who also has this ability. Plus, Vos already has child-rearing duties to attend to. And all of that is before considering the fact that Vos has a tendency to wildly alter the biological structure of living things in his vicinity with alarming regularity.
>>
No. 119030 ID: 3abd97

>since you're limiting me to player knowledge instead of letting me use character knowledge. I have to now do a lot of research on gardening which Yisheng Ji should already be very familiar with, and even precisely come up with calculations on the weight of dirt and whatnot.
I think you can just describe the general layout you'd like, and the kind of tools you'd like, and let character knowledge fill in the gaps? Put in as much resolution as you're comfortable with.

>I don't want to afterwards hear that half the things have to be thrown out because they're not in the budget.
I'm pretty sure most mundane equipment and supplies are going to be on the order of silver, price-wise, which the budget can eat pretty easily. It's not even a significant delta in the reserve funds unless you find extra costs on the order of tens of gold.
>>
No. 119033 ID: d36af7

>>119027
>calculations on the weight of dirt
Please don't worry about the weight of dirt. Some thought should be put into the sanctum's other 'standard accessories,' but they don't need to be described in such painstaking detail. My own research on the subject was partly GURPS, partly http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/lifesupport.php and partly handwaving because in this case it's literally magic. There's plenty of room for back-and-forth negotiation of the details, and I'll gladly do the math and IC-knowledge research, or at least point out and suggest corrections for major problems - as I just demonstrated with Kome. I'm mostly asking about Yisheng Ji's clothing, personal equipment, ammunition, medical supplies and so on.

Alchemist's fire, for example, is a pound per "dose" (including the fragile clay or glass bottle) and would cost at least five silver normally, but Ji knows the secrets of selecting or synthesizing oil with the right combination of volatility and viscosity, distilling small amounts of white phosphorous as an ignition source, mixing the two and decanting it all into convenient-sized containers without setting it all off by premature contact with air, so he can save a lot of money by doing the work himself.

Lamp oil is only one silver per ten pints, and not volatile enough to be an effective incendiary weapon by itself, but throwing some on a fire already in progress (or, equivalently, applying at least 3 points of fire damage to something soaked in oil) can keep the fire going longer, which might be helpful if you face more monsters large and durable enough that one flask of alchemist's fire won't reliably finish them off.

Consumable supplies for long-term medical treatment - the esoteric equivalent of sterile-packed bandages, single-use syringe needles, antifever drugs, and so on - would normally cost 1.25 gold and weigh 5 pounds per 20 patient-days, but, again, do-it-yourself alchemy can provide discounts. Anything that might have interesting 'off-label' uses? I am inviting you to be creative, express your character's themes, and thereby add something to the setting, not demanding an arduous homework assignment.

Ji had the opportunity to shop around and stockpile such supplies back in Passholdt, on the Fire Hawks Company's budget, and hasn't had too much need of them in the intervening time, since other forms of direct damage and magical healing have been in adequate supply. So, how much of all those things do you have on hand?
>>
No. 119037 ID: 094652

>>119027
>why you're so fixated on making it the primary sleeping area for everyone else when you can easily sleep anywhere
^&*( happens. Having a dimensional door to hide in while your teleporter and minions just grab the door and run is a viable survival strategy. Having a portable, comfortable, anti-sniper home to sleep in is always a plus.

So if Hore bought her own door, could she sleep in it and keep an eye on the cargo inside? Or is staying inside a dimensional door for prolonged periods actually bad for your health?
>>
No. 119038 ID: d36af7

>>119037
>So if Hore bought her own door, could she sleep in it and keep an eye on the cargo inside?
Yes, absolutely.
>Or is staying inside a dimensional door for prolonged periods actually bad for your health?
A minimal-size version, with a lot of other stuff crammed into it, probably wouldn't have ideal ergonomics for sleeping. Maybe get some padded leg restraints on a secure mount and hang upside down? Good for your spine, supposedly, not so much for blood pressure in your head.
>>
No. 119050 ID: 3abd97

>Having a dimensional door to hide in while your teleporter and minions just grab the door and run is a viable survival strategy.
It's really not, actually, when your teleporter can't touch the door without losing a hand, and any d-door carried through her portals have a nasty tendency to explode and/or spew invisible razor-wire.

Mixing Dav's portals and bigger-on-the-inside spaces is a bad idea unless you don't mind losing limbs or being flayed alive.
>>
No. 119079 ID: 094652

Oh crap I didn't finalize any purchases

Can I say Hore bought a personal dimensional door after she confirmed a shipment of extra cargo with the trading company? If not, then I'll just wait until we get back to Passholdt to buy something expensive.

One (1) 1H steel 3-ball-flail
+1 DR enchantments to her leather armor and chainmail tunic
A crate of nut rations (for exp, shared with friends)
And some rare metals to upgrade her bionics in the near-future (for exp)
>>
No. 119080 ID: 3abd97

>Oh crap I didn't finalize any purchases
>Can I say...
I think the rule of thumb we've been playing by is you can define stuff retroactively up until it becomes relevant. (And in special cases, even after if we're willing to retcon things).

For example, it mostly doesn't matter what you bought until you want to use it, which hasn't happened yet. So it should be fine to retroactively list your purchases after we left.

Which is handy for play by post, especially when players aren't always around to offer input over every detial.
>>
No. 119108 ID: d36af7

>>119080
Yeah, I'm probably not going to go further into resolving that encounter until boxing day, apart from rolls for perception, background knowledge, and so on. Just want to maintain momentum rather than getting stalled indefinitely by whoever has the most RL obligations or decision paralysis.

Speaking of which, still waiting on a description for those caves Nistamatsin tarot'ed into existence, and an illustration for the next Dragon King Quest update.

>>119079
>confirmed a shipment of extra cargo
You'd need to roll for the negotiations. They might not need the extra space right now, and even if they do, might not want to rent from you personally - at least not at full price.
>crate of nut rations
How big of a crate? A 54lb crate of hardtack would go for two silver, and each crate is sixteen man-days of food, or $0.50 and 1 lb per meal (plus $15 and 6 lb for the box, which is relatively flimsy but water-resistant material somewhere between wicker with a tight weave and waxed cardboard), but it sounds like you're going for something less like plain hardtack, more like an extra-fancy type of trail rations. Basic trail rations are $2 and half a pound per meal, raw almonds are $3 per pound near places where they're grown (naturally prices rise due to shipping costs), so let's say $4 per meal, or seven silver for a 54 lb box which occupies most of a cubic foot and can feed a man for just over a month.

If you spend the full 50 gold budget on an extradimensional closet and food, you could get what superficially looks like a 4' x 2'6" closet with an 8' high ceiling, but actually has a concealed hatch in the floor, with a 7' deep secret compartment crammed full of enough fried almond cakes to feed six people for a year.

A well-made flail would require lightening that load by one crate (roughly one cubic foot, and one man-month of food) but also leave you enough change to enchant a piece of armor for +1 DR, and enough space under the trapdoor to hide a few other things.
>>
No. 119129 ID: 3abd97

>You'd need to roll for the negotiations.
Want a hand with that? Assuming you go for that option, that is.

I'm kind of curious why turning the shipping company hasn't already one up this ship like a TARDIS. Is buying off the shelf doors for extra space just not cost effective versus buying and staffing a second shipping vessel? Does it just not work out long term to put so many eggs (in the form of both investments in the extra space and additional cargo) in a basket already subject to being lost at sea, being attacked by pirates, or a myriad of other dangers? (And proportional increases in maintenance and security costs). Diminishing returns on additional cargo?
>>
No. 119137 ID: 93a5e9

Hore intends to buy the closet as a means of storing any equipment she scavenged from corpses, and eventually repurposing it into a secret laboratory. But for now, her inventory is sparse and the closet is going to have a receipt, so she'll use it as extra cargo space, and accept Maru's aid in convincing the company to take a risk and store some stable goods for purchase in Passholdt. If she can't get a deal, she'll wait until they get back to Passholdt and look for a bettter means of spending her gold.
>>
No. 119154 ID: d36af7

>>119129
>Why not a TARDIS?
>Diminishing returns on additional cargo?
Mostly this. Only so much tungsten dug up and refined in a given year, only so many rods manufactured, only so much other stuff that's worth the trouble. One of the limiting factors is how many smelters Philista's Burning aspect can bless at once - perhaps negotiations for that sanctum-construction job will reveal something of interest on that point.

In general, even if there were enough traffic, incremental refitting with lots of small extradimensional pockets sounds like an attractive strategy, but it's unreasonably dangerous in practice. Resonance effects start accumulating combinatorially, you get headaches and insomnia among the crew, hallucinations and/or weird vermin (which can be hard to distinguish from each other), Things show up to hunt the vermin, and if somehow all that doesn't discourage you, some clockwork bastard with too many arms http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/inevitable/inevitable-lhaksharut/ eventually has a little chat with your insurance underwriters, and then you're really in trouble, hoo boy. Simpler to just take bigger ships, instead. Magic can cause a living tree to grow into the ideal hull shape as a single piece, and triple the wood's structural strength besides, so it's possible to construct vessels almost as big as WWII battleships and heavy transports.

There are several safe ways to use higher-dimensional space for commercial freight on a large scale, but they all involve massive infrastructural investment, fiddly negotiations with spirit courts, and a staggering regulatory burden - some of it over legitimate safety concerns (one of the least esoteric issues is that trivial-sounding differences in barometric pressure across a portal would cause winds in and around it, potentially of such devastating intensity as to make a hurricane look mild), others which are exaggerated as part of the larger Drakocratic policy of keeping the world economy compartmentalized for existential-risk reasons. Tungsten run doesn't have remotely enough trade volume to cover the costs involved.
>>
No. 119164 ID: 094652

Aaand I got the first critical failure in the Home Team. Whoopee.

How bad is it? I mean, I just had Azure stare at some gravel being shoveled into a bunch of wheelbarrows. Does one of them fall on her? She can heal from that.
>>
No. 119166 ID: 094652

>>119164
whoops

* Replace("home team", "Thread 7");
>>
No. 119170 ID: af6e04

Terrible rolls abound.

>still waiting on a description for those caves Nistamatsin tarot'ed into existence
I haven't forgotten! I just...yeah I don't have a good excuse. I'll figure that out soon.
>>
No. 119177 ID: 3abd97
File 151451039395.png - (622.83KB , 753x997 , Active map.png )
119177

>>/quest/854153
Okay... so trying to match those directions to the map, is this correct?

Did Isaiah follow the same path as Nin, or did he reach the trap pit from the south?

>>119170
I'm pretty okay with Nin failing to bluff Jack into causing a metaphysical deck disaster. :v
>>
No. 119184 ID: d36af7

>>119177
Abandoned barracks are actually in the area where you put the words "Nin's projected path." Previous non-secret door along that path (leading to the area you labeled "abandoned barracks") is sealed shut from the other side, and Tall Jack Rat doesn't know what's in there.

The area you labeled "mining group" is actually the third face of the cave-in, which Nistamatsin discovered while scouting with the archery squad. Mining is happening directly opposite the trapped group, rather than perpendicular. Isaiah and the wheelbarrow have been running back and forth along the first segment of that purple line, between the pit and the first door it passes - the same door which Nin's spear blew off it's hinges, and which leads to the room where the angelic drayage-costs dispute happened.

Technically the giant vermin infestations are striges rather than dire mosquitoes, and leeches rather than slugs, but Rhea wouldn't have any way to know that so don't worry about it too much. Otherwise looks accurate.
>>
No. 119186 ID: af6e04

>I'm pretty okay with Nin failing to bluff Jack into causing a metaphysical deck disaster. :v
Hehe but think of how hilarious it would be. Besides, we have to teach those guys a lesson for stealing from us!

I've been very sick with food poisoning lately and at times like this I really wish I had Vos' aura of health or Ji's healing magic.

Have a good new year everyone. Also hoping Santova returns to join us again soon.
>>
No. 119194 ID: 3abd97
File 151459198097.png - (622.36KB , 753x997 , Active map.png )
119194

>>119184
Map updated based on corrections. The dimensions of the angelic drayage-costs dispute room and the rock collapse are probably inaccurate, but at least we know they're there.

>>119186
Hope you feel better. And yeah, I was gonna wait to try and give Santova / Maru a chance to respond to the wassail, since it's kind of right up our murder-bard's alley.
>>
No. 119196 ID: 20ea96
File 151460127798.png - (109.34KB , 1000x1222 , DimensionalGreenhouse.png )
119196

Alright, here's my submission for the greenhouse design. I tried to map out the space as well as I could while still maintaining a general ability to easily move about inside in any direction.

As for the plants, I went for guised hydroponics over a traditional garden, since we have the technology magic, and it makes it easier to make the space multi-purpose.

I also made the whole space a hexagon, because kome wanted it to be a hexagon.

Please tell me what you think of it.

Main sources:
http://www.doornmore.com/help/what-is-the-standard-size-for-residential-homes.html
http://www.sensiblehouse.org/des_roomsize.htm
http://herbgardening.com/howtogrowherbsinhyrdoponics.htm
https://www.theaquaponicsource.com/blog/grow-bed-depth/
>>
No. 119197 ID: d36af7

>>119194
>The dimensions of the angelic drayage-costs dispute room and the rock collapse are probably inaccurate,
Close enough for casual reference purposes, particularly if you extend the "rocks" segment around in an L shape into the textless right half of the "mining group" box, so it's more clearly a barrier between them and the area Nin scouted.

>>119196
Mostly looks good, but there needs to be more of a tangible structure supporting the Z axis, and fewer infinite sight-lines.

How about keeping the overall hexagon shape, but change it to solid walls on three of the sides, and add foot-thick pillars between them, with 6' wide archways linked up in some odd sequence so that attempting to circle any of the pillars will lead through all the open sides? And just enough persistent fog to obstruct vision by -1 per two yards, as an extra safety feature.
>>
No. 119198 ID: 3abd97
File 151461261970.png - (45.42KB , 855x499 , Alternate tessellation.png )
119198

Neat! I like it.

Since you have border paths running along the 'edges' / touching the wraparounds, they're effectively twice as wide as the interior diagonal paths. If you halve the width of those outer paths / extend the gardens further out, you get more square feet devoted to growing things while keeping all your paths of equal effective width. (The dotted green lines in my edit show the proposed extension).

A cool thing I noticed: the garden is a hexagon if you center your reference frame on the intersection of the diagonals. It's a diamond if you center your reference frame on the statue / airlock.
>>
No. 119199 ID: 20ea96

>>119198
>effectively twice as wide as the interior diagonal paths
I realized this right at the end, which is why I put in the comment that "All paths are the same width", hoping my oversight would be forgiven in light of it all being drawn with the line tools in Paint.net.

>>119197
>enough persistent fog to obstruct vision by -1 per two yards
Sounds good.

>add foot-thick pillars, with 6' wide archways
Easy enough, and would add a nice bit of extra scenery over the pathways

>change it to solid walls on three of the sides
Here's where you lost me. I'm clearly misunderstanding something here, because I can't see how this could possibly be implemented. I don't understand how to replace half of the sides of the hexagon with solid walls while retaining any sort of looping ability. If you make one side solid, the opposite side would necessarily be solid too, since it'd be two sides of the same wall. And wouldn't it be enough to just have the pillars and archways? They can be flat-top archways if necessary, supporting a large segment of the ceiling between them.

>linked up in some odd sequence so that attempting to circle any of the pillars will lead through all the open sides
This sentence doesn't make sense to me semantically. What does it mean to circle a pillar and be lead through all the open sides?

Could you clarify, please?
>>
No. 119210 ID: 3abd97

>which is why I put in the comment that "All paths are the same width", hoping my oversight would be forgiven
Oh, it's fine! I initially missed that comment, then wasn't sure what you considered a single path in a boundary wrapping scenario is all.

>>119199
I think JL's suggesting open arches along (half) the perimeter (facing so they allow travel perpendicular to the perimeter of the hexagon), such that when you walk into arch A, you exit arch B, but when you walk into arch B you exit arch C and so on and so forth. (And arches A, B, C aren't necessarily lined up in a row either).

So if you put your hand on a pillar and started walking around it, it would take rather more than 360 degrees of travel to return to your initial position (walking around a single pillar is the same as walking around every pillar).

Sort of a variant on http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ScoobyDoobyDoors

I'm not sure if JL's proposed design includes pillars along the interior paths (with arches along and over the paths), but that would be another way to add supports and break up sight lines.
>>
No. 119214 ID: d36af7
File 151468833688.png - (7.51KB , 320x400 , hexsymmetry.png )
119214

>>119210
>So if you put your hand on a pillar and started walking around it, it would take rather more than 360 degrees of travel to return to your initial position (walking around a single pillar is the same as walking around every pillar).
Yes.
>when you walk into arch A, you exit arch B, but when you walk into arch B you exit arch C
This wouldn't work, though. Any given portal has to link the same places in both directions, or you run into problems whenever something goes halfway through. That means there have to be an even number of portals, paired up symmetrically.

In the diagram here, if you keep one hand on the pillar you'll make a complete circuit every 720 degrees, whereas if you keep a hand on the wall it'll seem like you're walking around a massive hexagonal pillar with the same dimensions as the room (and the same door on two opposite sides).

That 720-degree cylindrical pillar between the archways is very load-bearing. Just try to picture what would happen if it were broken. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_string#Negative_mass_cosmic_string

For that matter, try to picture the trouble some architects and stonemasons had to go through to cut it from a single solid piece of marble and then haul it into position. Magically creating exodimensional spaces is actually relatively simple, possible in a few very limited ways even with mere 2nd circle magic, http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/rope-trick it's the long-term structural reinforcement that gets expensive.
>>
No. 119216 ID: d36af7

>>119214
Sorry, my mistake, that should be 540 degrees.
>>
No. 119240 ID: 20ea96
File 151476173921.png - (24.29KB , 709x651 , DimensionalGreenhouse_v2.png )
119240

>>119214
Alright. I understand now. Here is an alternate, non-tesselatable design. Is this more satisfactory?

Please forgive minor sizing and alignment mistakes. (You should be able to easily walk around the pillars, for example.)
>>
No. 119242 ID: 094652

I came up with a new idea for a character, but she might be too OP. Let me know if she's legit or not and what changes I need to make.

Sahara
Hedge Witch
SpellThief
Greater Ambition: Become a Master Time Thief
Lesser Ambition: Learn new spells
Innate Power: Copy Spells - Sahara can "steal" spells from her opponent using one of three methods: steal their spellbook, analyze
a spell being used, or even conjure a counterspell through sheer intuition and outright steal the spell charge from the caster, allowing her to immediately re-cast it without materials! However, she cannot use a spell she has stolen unless she has witnessed it being used, and she can only use that spell a limited number of times until she needs to witness it again.
Weakness: Silver
Mutation: Not Finalized
Phobia: Rivers of Blood (phobia only triggers when multiple targets, living or nonliving, are spurting blood. Single entities spurting blood cause her to look away and focus on something else.)

Stats:
STR: Below Average
DEX: Above Average
CON: Average
INT: Above Average
WIS: Above Average
CHA: Above Average

Backstory: Sahara is an unfortunate little girl, and her childhood friends hit spider eyes. After accidentally stumbling their way into a blood sacrifice of cultists (or something, may change this part), Sahara was the sole survivor as her friends exploded into blood and gore around her (not changing this part) - as well as the cultists. She gained supernatural powers, but was shunned by her village and became a wandering thief. As she grew older, she became obsessed with the power of Time Thieves and studied to become one - but she quickly learned something was wrong. While her supernatural power allowed her to learn any spell in mere seconds, her spells only worked a limited number of times before the calculations simply stopped working. Sahara's power causes her to perceive spellcraft differently, making it easy for her to construct a limited-use spell copy, yet near-impossible for her to understand a spell in a way that allows her to cast it indefinitely (for now).
Sahara is impulsive when it comes to stealing spells. If she sees a spell she likes, it becomes a priority for her to learn that spell. She's been known to break into houses and steal only the spellbooks and components, leaving gold and magical artifacts untouched.

Last Name, Race, Mutation, and Starting Equipment are not finalized.

Sahara's meant to be a backup character for Hore, and not Azure / Pog. The thing is, Ivori (and her fellow students) are the ninjas who gave Hore her crippling phobia of ninja assassins. Sahara was one of Azure's hired sorceresses, until an unfortunate coincidence when Azure was drugged with angry powder (don't ask) and Sahara ran out of high-level spells to keep her employer happy. Azure realized that Sahara was a fraud (pretending to be a few levels higher than she actually was) and angrily chased her out of the party. Azure regretted it in the morning and told Hore to explain her forgiveness if they ever crossed paths. So Ivori will freak out Hore if they meet and Sahara still thinks Azure hates her guts.
>>
No. 119245 ID: 3abd97

>>119240
If you still wanted a pagoda statue, you could put it in the center of the garden. Or you could put statues or reliefs where the door isn't on the two other walls.

For aesthetics, you could specify if the pillars and walls appear to be made of a specific material or of a specific color. Or if the pillars are of a specific style, or carved with a specific decoration, or shaped to look like something.

>>119242
I don't know why you bothered to call out physical stats since those are generally abstracted as makes sense from the rest of the character. (And for instance, proficiency with the as of yet undefined equipment carried could inform a lot of those).

Big questions would be the mechanics of the spell theft / copying works (and largely up to JL anyways). What conditions need to be met for it to happen? Is there a range limit, does it require contact or line of sight? Is it limited to structured spells? Does it only work on arcane casting (like a tsochar) or is divine casting valid? Do stolen spells deteriorate over time if they're not spent? How many stolen spells can be held at once? Can a target tell when a spell is being stolen? Can a target attempt to resist? How is a target affected, if at all, by having a spell stolen?

Personally I'd think it would be more interesting if she had a more dynamic or esoteric vulnerability that somehow interacts with her power. If her power is all about drawing in foreign power and making it her own, maybe that open conduit leaves her exposed to other things as well. (Could be anything from malign energies up to an Androsynth and Orz situation).

Mutation could perhaps tie into the power too, as the means by which spells are captured. Say, unusual eyes to trap spells she sees, a deformity that that acts as a magical antenna, strange claws to pluck pieces from the web of magic, frilled ears attuned to the otherworldly music of the ether, etc. (There's a lot of room for thematic flair depending on how the ability is styled).

Lastly, I'd point out you aren't required to have all your characters share a common backstory. Nor are you required to set things up so you eventually have to roleplay conflict with yourself. You can if you want to, though.
>>
No. 119249 ID: d36af7

>>119242
Motivation should be Higher Ambition/Aspiration contrasted with Lower Ambition/Fetish. Superego and id, virtue and vice. Neither is "greater" or "lesser," much as some moralizers or cynics might wish things to be so clear-cut.

Also, the two listed ambitions are about as redundant as, say:
Soldier, specialized in stabbing Higher: get better at stabbing Lower: stab the baddies
Diversify a bit, flesh out the personality.

What you're describing, the whole 'spell thief' concept, should be a class specialty rather than an innate power. You can't think of a mutation because it's NOT a coherent thematic racial template like "elf" or "vampire" or "corrupted princess" or "cutebold," just an esoteric skill-set which almost anyone could pick up with enough training. Drop the silver vulnerability, and expect Nistamatsin to trigger that blood-geyser phobia frequently.

>race
>Str/Dex/Con/Int/Wis/Cha
>backstory
>name
None of those are required fields.

>starting equipment
"Nothing besides clothes, knife, and a day's rations" is suboptimal, but could be attempted.
>>
No. 119250 ID: c5b5f1

>>119249
Okay. How should I expect the Spellthief class progression to work, and is this a viable class or am I setting myself up for 'Hard Mode'?

Also, Happy New Year!
>>
No. 119323 ID: d36af7

>>118791
Thinking about this some more, the regrowth ability seems like a really good fit for Yisheng Ji's themes. Self-reassembly was Doc Manhattan's first big trick, and most creation myths start off with the first gods defining and separating themselves from out of chaos.
>>
No. 119327 ID: 20ea96
File 151499762302.png - (1.42MB , 1247x1000 , DimensionalGreenhouse_v2_with_pics.png )
119327

>>119245
>aesthetics
Alright. In the interest of keeping the garden more natural-looking and alive, I was thinking about the solid walls having the appearance of thick, opaque hedges. The exit door through the airlock would be built into the side of one of the hedges.

As far as the pillars go, since they're all adjacent to each other in lines, I figured they'd be best as the supports for large, stone double archways, connected to hedge on either side. This being Yisheng Ji of course, he will naturally want to style it after his own heart. (For which I have submitted the design of the Heaven-Prestigious Towering Stone Archway in Mount Hua Temple) Despite its appearance more as a decorative, rather than support archway, the same magic that makes the ceiling appear to be sky will easily ensure that the archway is 100% solid and fully supports the ceiling across the entire top. (Same with the hedge walls.)

>>118791
>>119323
>regrowth ability
I'm certainly not going to complain if everyone wants Yisheng Ji to take the self-healing power. I'm just surprised people aren't interested in the power that would allow all of you to take advantage of it as well. I know if Davina was presented with the opportunity to take a power like "create a grand sphere of escher-esque distorted relative space centered on the self, allowing all allies to move in bizarre non-euclidean ways through and around the area", I would absolutely encourage her to take that over something like "access strands of alternate reality to disguise yourself as yourself from an alternate reality where it's not a disguise, granting you a near-perfect ability to alter your own appearance within the range of alternate-timeline possibility, and easily elude detection of your alternate identity based on visible components (like scars)", as the latter only directly benefits herself, and the former benefits everyone else, and I'm kind of selfish like that.
>>
No. 119341 ID: 3abd97

>>119327
Well, I'm pretty solidly of the opinion that if there's one place your view should have sway, it's in your own character's growth and development. You can listen to other people's ideas, but make choices that fit your character, or your chosen themes, and then worry about finding clever applications and opportunities for teamwork afterwards.

After all, "who do I want this person to be" is a decision that's much more personal and more appropriate to be selfish than say "how should the group spend shared money".

There are points where we make compromises in order to be able to work together / not ruin each others fun, but in most cases that line's far afield from skill selection.

I can certainly think of ways magical translation would be a boon (and I'm somewhat curious what would happen if, say, someone tried tried to use that power to learn the language Viste knew without learning in sideways memory >>/quest/824279 ) but there's plenty of ways I can imagine a regenerating medic or a teammate unafraid to risk losing a limb being beneficial to the group as well.
>>
No. 119342 ID: 094652

>>119327
Ultimately, Yisheng Ji is a borderline-suicidal daredevil that makes money when he does crazy stuff. We're supporting the self-heal because it increases the party's overall survival rate by making one of the healers less likely to die spontaneously, without decreasing average profits.

Also he's your character and we understand the concept of maximizing your own character's survival rate.

Also, I liked your first design better. Replacing walls with pillars will make the room seem infinite (better than a house of mirrors, to boot) and a linear loop will generally make the three various door styles less... insane. Seriously, are you planning to have one half of the doorway half-chinese and half european, and the other half of the doorway half-european and half indian and so forth? Because extensive detail to non-euclidian geometry could cause brain damage to anyone who looks at it too long, like the elf who's going to live here for the next two months.

>>119249
Time for a second draft.

Backstory Core: As children, Sahara and friends accidentally stumbled onto doom, Sahara's friends exploded in gore, Sahara gained powers but was shunned from hometown and became a travelling thief.

Sahara is a charlatan "half-mage" who pretends to master spells beyond her school of focus and current level. She gains whatever she needs to [cast limited-use non-scroll spells / pretend she's casting a spell] by stealing from actual wizards. Sahara makes a living doing temp mercenary jobs for rich clients (like Azure) using her charm and grace to trick clients into thinking she's a recently-graduated wizard.

Recent Events (downgrading her to level 1): Sahara has been recently caught as a fraud (again) and her belongings were confiscated. She escaped on her own and her current inventory consists of the leftovers from her escape plans.

Specialization: Time Thief / Spell Thief / Magic Thief whatever

Ambition: Write a magnum opus (spell, poem, or some other literary accomplishment)
Fetish: Deceiving others into thinking she's powerful and sexy (domination fetish)

Innate Power: Blood Destruction - Sahara can destroy her blood cells to maximize the processing power in her brain, giving her a temporary boost to intelligence while also slowing down everything to a crawl - http://no-game-no-life.wikia.com/wiki/Hatsuse_Izuna - This effectively gives her the power to analyze spells and discover how to cast them (still working on how to fit this into ), but if the methods are concealed (like lockpicking and casting in the shadows), she's left in the dark. Ability causes serious fatigue damage and if used for too long may even cause permanent fortitude drain that requires rejuvenation to fix.

Current Inventory: Books. Lots of books and scrolls. She can use the spells from stolen books [a limited number of times OR can only use low-level spells after extensive research and meditation per day]

Wizard's Spellbook (stolen) - False Face, Poisoned Egg , and others she has not attained.
...
Personal Spellbook - None (new book)

Can I make her a higher level if I accept that she has a really bad drain on her ability scores from being imprisoned and malnourished, and needs to see a doctor for a few months?
>>
No. 119344 ID: 3abd97

>>119342
The first design didn't have walls. And there's only one the one door. And the arch refs are for different things (shape, style, ornamentation).

>Time for a second draft.
An innate power requires a phobia, a concealable mutation/parasite, and a supernatural vulnerability.

Presumably she's a townie now, since hedge witches don't get books.
>>
No. 119346 ID: 094652

>>119344
>The first design didn't have walls
That's what I liked about it.

>An innate power requires a phobia, a concealable mutation/parasite, and a supernatural vulnerability.
Later. I haven't even selected her race yet.

>hedge witches don't get books
I didn't know that, guess I'll cross those off then.
>>
No. 119347 ID: d36af7

>>119342
>recently-graduated wizard
Problem here. There are no "magic academies" in this setting, organized places where anybody off the street - or even anybody who passes a standard test - can go in and learn to be a generic wizard.

In the Drakocracy, if you can cast spells, you either learned from your parents (actual dragons and dynastic sorcerers), or spirits to whom you have ongoing obligations (druids and priests), or both. Hedge witches have a mix of deals with petty spirits, apprenticeships, and figuring things out as they go along, but that diffuse approach seldom leads to highly focused power.

Zelkor of the Green Tassels only ever took on the one student, and that was at least as solemn a decision as adopting a child. Deros Frist was some cousin or by-blow of a dynasty focused on elemental earth, personally more interested in academic study than getting ahead in the family business, and far down the line of succession for any important post anyhow. He invented long-range practical teleportation by accident, delving into pure mathematics so deeply that he came out the other side to approach the problem from a completely unfamiliar perspective, testing the theory just as a proof-of-concept, to see what would happen, thinking he'd made an error at some point. Look how that turned out for him. Closest thing he ever had to an heir or apprentice was that tsochar who ate his brain, who's never managed to duplicate more than the crudest early prototype of that spell: two or three orders of magnitude more ritual setup, for maybe a tenth the range.
>>
No. 119350 ID: d36af7

>>119346
>An innate power requires a phobia, a concealable mutation/parasite, and a supernatural vulnerability.
>I haven't even selected her race yet.
Don't just pick the power first and treat the rest as tacked-on. Those four factors together ARE the "race" you're picking.

Honestly you've got most of it there already, just needs to be properly organized. As described, mutation could be a magic-analyzing "third eye" tattoo which glows while in use, supernatural vulnerability could be anemia, and innate power could be speed-reading: slow down subjective time while expanding perception and short-term memory. Doesn't speed up physical reactions, but it's still potentially a major edge in combat, since it lets you make meticulous plans in the time it would take most people to react on instinct, or lets you react at all to threats most people would notice only after it was too late. The main benefit, though, is being able to flip through a book and (temporarily) memorize the whole thing, cover to cover, as if you'd spent months studying it. That just leaves the phobia.

You could take books as a hedge witch, just not books with anything already written in them. Consumable magic items, perhaps bound with the leather and sinew of some thought-stealing beast. Hit somebody in the head with such a book, hard enough to hurt, and afterwards it won't be blank inside anymore. Instead, it's got a copy of part of their mind.

Not very useful by itself, since it's more likely to be the equivalent of rambling stream-of-consciousness diary entries about whatever they had for lunch than any deep dark secret, but with specialized thought-thief training you can aim for specific skills you've seen them use and walk away with a technical manual. With that training, plus the magic-analyzing 'third eye,' you can steal spells. Then, of course, the speed-reading power lets you quickly put the contents of such books to productive use.
>>
No. 119351 ID: af6e04

>>119347
I've always wondered how wizards actually work in the setting, since you've mostly seemed to refer to magic users as sorcerers and magic in general as 'sorcery'. So I assume somebody without any spiritual bloodline or affiliations learning to cast spells just through study rather than by virtue of their supernatural blood is fairly unheard of in the setting?

>Captain Azarthraine was a dynastic sorcerer capable of 8th circle magic.
>Theocratic society didn't actually collapse, though, until certain elves discovered certain basic principles of sorcery

Also while we're on the subject. You've already explained how divine casting works (you pray for the specific benefits you plan on needing throughout the day) but how about arcane casting? Is it just like Vance, where you only have so much room in your brain for spells and have to train your mind to store more? Or did you have another take on it?
>>
No. 119353 ID: 20ea96

>>119346
>The first design didn't have walls
>That's what I liked about it.
I also liked the idea of an infinite sprawling garden. However, I was specifically told to change it to the current non-euclidean walled design on pain of the whole place crashing down on our heads, so we're all going to have to deal with it. 1300 gold only gets you so much, after all. Perhaps someday we'll be rich and/or powerful enough to have our own demiplane and we can do whatever we like there.
>>
No. 119357 ID: d36af7

>>119351
Divine vs. arcane magic is a lot like organic vs. inorganic chemistry. Same underlying physics, but the former starts with a foundation of complex, highly optimized living systems. That makes some things easier, like maintaining or restoring homeostasis and assembling complex things in bulk thanks to elaborate specialized catalysts already in place. That foundation also comes with a lot of potentially troublesome costs and constraints, though. Starting from scratch, nothing but raw materials and clean glassware, makes the high-energy and/or morally dubious stuff easier, but then if you want subtle or complex effects you need to set 'em up the hard way.

Reaching higher circles of magic always involves being initiated into deeper mysteries, how to poke at vast spiritual forces so they respond in increasingly complex and powerful ways, but if divine magic can be thought of as escalating from a hearty handshake to tickling a lover's most sensitive spots, then equivalent mastery of arcane magic moves from exploiting the patellar reflex to hypnosis and high-level programming languages.

>So I assume somebody without any spiritual bloodline or affiliations learning to cast spells just through study [...] is fairly unheard of in the setting?
Not exactly. There are lots of trade guilds with blatantly supernatural secret techniques which anyone can learn and use... at least, anyone who first masters the guild's mundane skill. Grandmasters of the immovable rod syndicate in Overmire usually aren't spellcasters, for example, just engineers and machinists. Such capabilities tend to be extensions of things the mundane skill can do, but in ways that don't make intuitive sense to outsiders - immovable rods, for example, have an elaborate mechanism inside full of hooks and barbs and ratchets fine enough to snag on the fabric of space itself.

Problem is, those approaches don't generalize well into other sorts of magic. http://oglaf.com/overbite/ http://oglaf.com/matter/ Ulman Dark, for example, is neither a dynastic sorcerer nor a priest. He works with alchemy, surgery, and elaborate ceremonial setups, but can't cast any of the combat spells a cleric or necro-spec'd wizard would be able to at 1st level in D&D.

Dynastic sorcerers can and do learn spells from each other, but it tends to involve either hundreds of hours of training, with significant emotional and political commitment, or (less commonly) very expensive enchanted gemstones and relatively quick but risky trepanation. The usual dynamic there is a narrow, deeply personal repertoire, like a magical girl's named attacks or a shonen martial artist's signature moves. Effectively what you're doing by learning that way is building yourself up into a spirit of, well, whatever it is you do, with those internalized spells as your godly powers.

The alternative, more versatile and thus ultimately more powerful in a strategic sense, involves splitting part of the magic off into some sort of external infrastructure. Marijke uses a parrot. If she met someone else from a compatible tradition, their familiars could cuddle up together and both learn several new spells from each other in a single day, with no particular limit on the total number known.

Old Empire wizards had similar techniques, minus the dependence on a fragile animal intermediary. They supposedly also had methods by which any man off the street could learn to cast combat-speed spells in a matter of weeks, though with a significant risk of being driven insane in the process. Sometimes adventurers (such as Geoffrey Vargas) stumble across such a device, though it seldom works the same way twice. Sometimes mad hermits or dangerous beasts develop uncanny powers, perhaps as a result of deliberately seeking out or reinventing those techniques of baleful enlightenment. As with gunpowder, excessively successful attempts attract draconic tracking and cauterizing, quietly when possible.
>>
No. 119358 ID: 3abd97

>>119347
>Look how that turned out for him
Did he attract attention due to the potential usefulness of stealing his long range teleport, or did his experiments accidentally port him someplace alien and hostile?

>>119350
Hmm. The consumable aspect does add a real bottleneck in having to construct or otherwise acquire new tomes for additional mindrip attempts. Also I imagine used tomes aren't exactly the kind of thing one wants to leave lying around. If spell-theft is a learn-able skill, others could also, in theory, make use of the technical manuals copied. That seems like the kind of thing the dracocracy would disprove of.
>>
No. 119362 ID: d36af7

>>119358
> If spell-theft is a learn-able skill, others could also, in theory, make use of the technical manuals copied.
In theory, sure. For someone without super-memorization powers, making effective use of such technical manuals might be as difficult as getting that subterrene up and running has been.

Spell-theft, as in the technique for whacking someone in the thinky-parts with a twelve-pound blank tome such that it captures knowledge of a spell rather than random junk thoughts, is only learnable if you could see what parts of their brain lit up while they were casting the spell. To anyone who's not already a dynastic sorcerer, that presents something of a bootstrap problem.

Finally, this set of powers helps with the acquisition of extant knowledge, but doesn't do as much to encourage or enable real innovation. In fact, overzealous adherents of the technique might well end up seeking out more innovative sages, then bludgeoning them into imbecility and / or an early grave by accident. Overall, it's a risk, but not exactly a nightmare scenario.
>>
No. 119368 ID: 3abd97

>>119362
Ah. I was thinking the super-memorization was just making the skill available on a combat-applicable timetable, not that it was what made the skill viable at all.

>>119357
>Effectively what you're doing by learning that way is building yourself up into a spirit of, well, whatever it is you do, with those internalized spells as your godly powers.
I really like this, this is cool.

>their familiars could cuddle up together and both learn several new spells from each
Interesting, although so far we've seen relatively few casters that employ familiars.
>>
No. 119369 ID: 094652

>>119347
I guess I could change her class from Hedge Witch to Townie. The Sahara's training comes from a line of wizards she trained under, some by deceiving into thinking she's a clumsy-but-experienced wizard, others by revealing her supernatural traits and trading examination privileges for tutelage. Or just one person, but I'm not sure who would be able to stand her kleptomania (for spells) for so long.

>>119350
>Consumable thought-copying books
Cool. How about this: her starting main weapon is a "Battle Podium", a staff that can attach a book and be used like a mace, yet is shaped like a collapsible podium (like the ones an orchestra uses). Its specially designed to be extra sturdy while also being collapsible enough to carry on her back like a one-handed, but its weakness is a very low damage output. It's not vital, just convenient, and can be replaced with a wooden mace or sturdy staff.

>All these things are basically your 'race'
Okay. I like most of what you built.
Innate Power: Magic '3d' tattoo that rotates as you look at her from different angles. It's a tiny anime caricature of herself, written on her left breast. And when she gets seriously hurt or panicked, it turns into a monster indicating the true origin of her supernatural blood transfusion. Can I make it 'animated with her mind'?
Phobia: Spontaneous death, especially of the 'explosion' variety. Basically, if she can't see or understand why someone just died, she gets nervous. So she'll still be in the fight if an archer shot her party member in the face from two hundred yards (arrow penetrating the skull and causing hemorrhaging in the brain is understandable), but if a kobold spontaneously drops dead in the middle of insulting her, and nobody cast any spells and no glowy magic traps were visible in the past hour, she might freak out. If they explode into gore, it's even worse.
>>
No. 119370 ID: 3abd97

>>119369
If the mind-copy-books are a magical consumable you're actually better off as a hedge witch, because you can start with the knowledge of how to make more.

>Or just one person, but I'm not sure who would be able to stand her kleptomania (for spells) for so long.
What if you go the tragic betrayal route? You were someone's apprentice (or even just an ordinary normie working for a caster). Then you figure out how to do spell theft (finally gets the tattoo, figures out how to make those books, or some other breakthrough). Maybe that leads to you being cast out for the threat you've become. Maybe that leads to you betraying your master and draining them for all the spells you can (only to discover to your dismay, and too late, that the stolen spells are impermanent).

The claim of apprenticeship could even be an after the fact lie or justification.
>>
No. 119372 ID: 094652

>>/quest/854766
>>/quest/856225
Why
Why are you doing this strngy
Why
>>
No. 119373 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/856240
So... is that covered by team magic sword's medical plan?
>>
No. 119375 ID: d36af7

>>119373
Only the physical damage is covered. The rest of what just happened there is beyond Lt.Cmdr. Jalkaren's power and/or authority to deal with.
>>
No. 119376 ID: 094652

>>856247
I REALLY think we should attack the fleeing mermaids - their turtle can submerge and then ram the boat faster than the octowasps can warn us.

Putting it to a vote?
>>
No. 119377 ID: d36af7

>>119376
Immediate in-character actions should go in the quest thread.
>>
No. 119381 ID: af6e04

>>119372
>Lower Ambition: Sow sin and discord

Heeheehee
>>
No. 119383 ID: 3d2d5f

>>119375
That's kind of ambiguous to me. So the mutations can't be reversed, the bisection can be repaired, but can the patient be restored to life? I was wondering if being reaped by an avatar of death was harder to undo than a more mundane execution, or if it fell outside our deva's purview (sorry, the reaper was acting within its authority, all relevant paperwork was up to date, and the patient was even made aware of the risks in advance).

>>119381
I'm really curious to see how Nin is going to react to the consequences, and how he'll try and spin what happened to everyone else.
>>
No. 119388 ID: d36af7

>>119383
>ambiguous
Full explanation pending until you bring the body somewhere with a more secure perimeter. Outside the dungeon at the very least, preferably back to the inn. Or, you could spend an OOC question to satisfy your curiosity immediately.
>mutations
What? No, number 10 gives form-fitting magic items. Tattoos, grafts, armor, that sort of thing. Nerys was trans, FTM. Short stature due to estrogen-dominant puberty, chest scars from a crude mastectomy, and periodic >>/questarch/744392
>herbs from Yorgala, in the dark woods
for low-tech hormone therapy, at least until the ogress got eaten by a shark.

His choice for that first draw was a "spear" nearly as wondrous, in it's own way, as what the deck gave to Nistamatsin. Shame he didn't have more time to appreciate it.
>>
No. 119398 ID: af6e04

>>119357
Interesting. But does this mean the regular Pathfinder mechanic of learning/copying spells from a book is out? And what of scroll scribing?
>>
No. 119402 ID: d36af7

>>119398
>learning/copying spells from a book
Possible but uncommon. Imagine trying to learn martial arts from a book that refers to all the major body parts by consistent but unconventional names, and doesn't include any illustrations. "Position your right and left fleen at a 90 degree angle to each other, almost touching, then lower your sponzle..." An instructor could explain most of the 'code' in a matter of minutes, just different terminology for basic concepts any magic-user deals with constantly, the equivalent of "hand" or "strike" or "butt." A few of the words refer to concepts that are fundamental and unique to the style, yet counter-intuitive to anyone outside. Lot of wasted time is just figuring out which is which. "Okay, from context clues in other techniques, I'm pretty sure 'sponzle' refers to either the pelvis, lumbar vertebrae, and associated muscles, or spiritual emanations of intent to inflict harm. So, for this exercise, does that mean I'm supposed to chill out, or squat?"
>scrolls
Those exist, yeah. Valeno Nahesa plundered one already, remember? Golem manuals are another type of scroll. It's one of the ways dynasties and guilds project power without putting their best people at risk (or wasting time and money on secure yet suitably luxurious long-distance transportation), and build up emergency reserves during times of prosperity. Any lowly initiate might have a one-shot grandmaster-level trick up their sleeve, or at least a few extra doses of the usual stock in trade for those times when you can get more than a year's pay for a week's worth of work, but only if you do it all in the span of fifteen minutes. Scrolls are about half the price of equivalent magical potions, bulkier but less fragile, and can be used normally in conditions of extreme cold, but require literacy, the ability to speak aloud, and either familiarity with the tradition which created the scroll, or careful study and a bit of luck.

A "staff" is one of the most basic enchanted items, made from any formerly-living material, internal mystical currents aligned so the wielder can use it as an extension of their own body, for delivering touch effects and so on.

A "wand" is an item with it's own energy reserve and a spell (or small set of related spells) encoded into it, which can power more than three castings in a day and then recover over time, rather than being permanently expended. Construction requirements are much stricter, with shapes and materials that hint at the nature of the wand's capabilities. Wands are NOT cheap, ranging from hundreds of gold for low-end models up through the same range as Named weapons. Giving a dynastic sorcerer a second- or third-circle wand is a strategic investment on the same scale as giving a knight a manor house with associated farms and cottage industries. The kind of gift that says 'You've done my kingdom a significant service, maybe not the greatest, but something that's worth taking at least a day or two out of my busy schedule and a corresponding dent in my budget just to properly acknowledge. I'll be expecting more of the same from you, and your successors, henceforth.'

Some wands can also, incidentally, function as staves. Others don't require a wielder at all, functioning as point-defense turrets around a site of geomantic significance, maybe with a simple intruder-detection program (making them effectively crude, sessile golems) or necrolithographic intelligence (weapons-grade haunted houses).

Most items in either category are approximately cylindrical, no more than 2" in diameter and between one and ten feet in length, but that's far from absolute. Druids have even experimented with putting staff enchantments on clothing or nonmetallic armor, in order to be 'technically naked' for ritual purposes while retaining physical protection, anonymity, buffs from worn magic items, or other benefits of non-bare skin.
>>
No. 119419 ID: 3abd97

>>119388
>A "staff" is one of the most basic enchanted items, made from any formerly-living material, internal mystical currents aligned so the wielder can use it as an extension of their own body, for delivering touch effects and so on.
Hmm. I wonder if it's significant that I've delivered a touch effect with my sword.
>>
No. 119453 ID: 3abd97

>don't take ten
>rolls ten
Okay I laughed.
>>
No. 119496 ID: 094652

Can you confirm the current situation? I mean, which of these events is the one I should have Azure and Pog react to in my next post?

[Nistamatsin and company are carrying Velsano]->[Azure is notified of Velsano's rescue and no further digging is required]->[Team Magic Sword returns to the Inn]
>>
No. 119500 ID: af6e04
File 151570273264.jpg - (30.72KB , 433x568 , DR07ug-VwAAvJAE_jpg large.jpg )
119500

My minion count continues to grow. Why build a pillow fort myself when I can command others to build it for me?
>>
No. 119508 ID: d36af7

>>119500
Keep in mind that the plague-cherub's loyalty is only likely to last until the cinnamon incense wears off, or it receives conflicting orders, whichever comes first. Those orders could potentially come from anyone at all.
>>
No. 119510 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/857736
Yes, evil imps with 50 lb carry-on restrictions on their teleportation do have certain limitations on their usefulness. http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0630.html

What's the Cherub' range, and what restricts where it can teleport?

>>119508
Well, demon binding is a thing.

Nin probably knows something about that (both from firsthand experience, and in that the field of abjuration, as the opposite of summoning, would have some necessary overlap in practical knowledge). Our illustrious patron certainly has no qualms about shanghaing demons into serving the greater good. Between that and the other magic users in the group we could probably cobble together a binding ritual before the incense wears off (I expect direct nasal ingestion and low body mass means a high dose). And with the cherub currently high and compliant (or with Nin's identity theft allowing him to speak for it) we can probably get it to agree to a pretty one-sided arrangement.

>conflicting orders
Can it hear currently, or does the stolen face include the ears?
>>
No. 119516 ID: 094652

Can we hire unused player character designs as NPCs? Basically, we can't control them directly until all our active PCs in the thread are incapacitated or killed, but they give passive bonuses and gain exp.
>>
No. 119519 ID: 094652

>>/quest/858002
... Well, that sucked.

Can someone else have a go at healing Nistamatsin? Geoffrey or Rhea could We'll also need someone to hold him down so he doesn't thrash around and jam the needle in further. I'd recommend Pog, but he's stuck on the other side of the rubble tunnel.

If we're really desperate, we could use one of Kent's healing potions.
>>
No. 119523 ID: 3d2d5f

>>119519
Rhea's got some healing charges, but I got to see what happened to her in the meantime first, and it's possible divine healing might not be the best for demons.

The bigger immediate priority might be making sure Azure (whoes hand is already on fire) doesn't blow up in a small enclosed space with stuff on the ground that's apparently flammable. Or at least that if she does go off, she doesn't take any allies with her.

>>119516
Between all the people we keep recruiting and the PCs whose players go inactive (some more temporarily than others) I'd say we have plenty of npcs already.
>>
No. 119524 ID: af6e04

>>119510
If we do manage to bind this cherub to our will, we'll probably just have a faceless cherub. I wonder how that would effect its teleportation abilities?
>>
No. 119528 ID: 3abd97

>>119524
I wasn't expecting Nin to have the attention span to hold onto a given face for very long.
>>
No. 119534 ID: 094652

This whole hyper-flammable blood weakness has proven itself to be outright crippling, but she has free semi-dependable auto-revives so it balances out. I guess in the long run, Azure will need to find a way to transfer her injuries over to Pog or someone else, much like Nistamatsin does with his statue.

Which brings me to something I've been meaning to ask - shouldn't the statue take a crack in the eye while the needle harmlessly bounces off Nistamatsin's pupil? He might be wearing someone else's face, but I figured the victim's face sort of maps to his face because he can feel pain from it.
>>
No. 119537 ID: d36af7

>>119534
>shouldn't the statue take a crack in the eye while the needle harmlessly bounces off Nistamatsin's pupil?
Transfer works based on the principle of Sympathy: like affects like. Damage to parts of one that don't correspond to parts of the other doesn't get transferred. Superficial wounds, like a scratched palm or cornea, are less transferable than major stuff like, say, a broken neck from falling ten feet and faceplanting into a solid stone floor. Also, merely poking an unprotected eye (particularly with a sharp object covered in contact poison) could be quite painful even without enough force to cause lasting injury.
>>
No. 119543 ID: af6e04

>Can it hear currently, or does the stolen face include the ears?
I always imagined it leaving the ears, but I don't know.

>I wasn't expecting Nin to have the attention span to hold onto a given face for very long.
That's not the issue though, the face is on fire.

>a broken neck from falling ten feet and faceplanting into a solid stone floor
My question is if Nin's capable of denting solid stone, does this mean he weighs as much as the statue too?
>>
No. 119544 ID: d36af7

>>119543
>My question is if Nin's capable of denting solid stone, does this mean he weighs as much as the statue too?
No. Damage transfer does do some weird stuff to the physics of a high-speed collision, a little bit like The Siberian from Worm, though much more difficult to apply in conventional combat since it only applies when you're hitting hard enough to seriously injure yourself. For purposes of Newton's impact depth approximation, Nin's effectively got the same mass and velocity (and thus momentum) as normal, but the density of silver rather than flesh.
>>
No. 119545 ID: 3abd97

>>119534
Well it's not as if all injuries guarantee explosion. I imagine Azure could survive losing a finger if the fire is put out and the bleeding stopped in time.

>>119543
>That's not the issue though, the face is on fire.
Ah whups, missed that.
>>
No. 119546 ID: d36af7

>>119516
Before I even consider that, I'd like you to update the wiki so that it includes all the NPCs mentioned so far in Thread 7, along with any relevant information about them from way back in thread 3, and have someone else go over it to check your work.
>>
No. 119652 ID: d36af7

>>/quest/859016
Were the actions I had Valeno take while you were away adequately consistent with their character?
>>
No. 119653 ID: 3d2d5f

Sorry I've been slow finalizing the anti-pirate battle plan, I've been both sick and busy.

If other players would like to weigh in, I'm still trying to figure out which two people in addition to Cap and Esmeraude would be best to cast flight on, and what the general plan is.

By that I mean we seem sorta decided on boarding at least one ship (flyers come from above, others portal in), but are we wrecking the other ship with Supreme Disintegration / portal fragging / Geometric Atrocity / greek fire at the same time? Are we boarding one then the other? Are we hoping to scare the second ship off? Are we sinking the ship we board by any of the previously mentioned means when we're ready to bail?
>>
No. 119661 ID: 3f5235

>>119653
>Supreme Disintegration
While normally I would recommend blowing Azarthraine's big guns as rapidly as possible so they can't be used against us in an unforeseen turn of alliances, I would like to point out that using Supreme Disintegration on anything makes it pretty redundant (and wasteful) to expend further resources on it. Vaporizing a half-destroyed ship has the same outcome as vaporizing a pristine one, so if you're going to use it, use it right away.

Also, if you decide not to opt for True Strike, his aim isn't all that great. If he stumbles again and vaporizes the 7500 gallons of seawater under Yisheng Ji, causing him to be dropped into a tidal abyss and crushed to death, that last-breath divine death curse is coming down on you! It'll be an extra-grumpy one!

And then, of course, if we're not using them as an opening strike, then I personally recommend saving our trump cards to deal with the enemy's own trump cards, when they break 'em out. A kraken-calling whistle, for example, wouldn't be out of place in piratical hands, and would be largely neutralized by a well-placed deathbolt.

>Regarding objectives
I personally consider repelling/sparing an enemy to be an almost universally poor idea, with a strong tendency to screw you over later on. Capture is almost always the most profitable, and killing is almost always the simplest. While it would be ideal to milk profit from every encounter if we possibly can, we also need to balance personal security. I think it would be very do-able to destroy one ship and capture the other, assuming we're able to neutralize their big guns without taking significant damage ourselves. If we can't possibly take the ships with us (and therefore profit from them) despite capturing them, then I see no reason to bother trying to. Are we able to keep a longboat alongside our merchant vessel? How many unseen servant rowers can our party maintain?
>>
No. 119671 ID: 3abd97

>blowing Azarthraine's big guns as rapidly
That is (at least partially) what got him killed in the dungeon, remember. Blow your big guns too early and you may miss the later.

We could put opt for a Tea Ceremony casting of True Strike rather than flight, but a flying mage who can shoot straight down on targets is probably more dangerous than one who can't miss once. (And even a miss might wreck a ship as water is sucked into the volume where there's nothing displacing it anymore).

>I personally recommend saving our trump cards to deal with the enemy's own trump cards, when they break 'em out
That's not a bad idea, actually. We let the lizard wizard fly so he can pick targets as necessary, and he waits to see what tough spots pop up after the rest of us engage.

Okay so if we go Cap, Esmeraude, Azarthraine as flies... Hore as the last? Main advantage of giving fly to Viste is it lets her portal frag more easily, but we have other more reliable options for sinking a ship I think. Basically everyone else is melee, and a flying plasma shooter seems more of an advantage.

>I think it would be very do-able to destroy one ship and capture the other
I think you have the right of it here. We want the one off our back while we deal with the other. I'm not sure the ship we capture will be in shape to sail away after, or that we'll have the manpower for it, but we could still collect some pirates or their heads for bounties and loot the ship even if we have to leave it.

Targeting trade offs: we have pirate-leader's ship, and artillery-ship. The way I see it, the pirate boss is likely to be the highest level enemy, but might be carrying better loot. The artillery piece is the bigger immediate threat to the merchants. So do we take the risk of fighting the pirate boss, or do we sink their ship? (Although a high level enemy could well survive the sinking, swim over, and join the middle of the battle on the other ship).

>Are we able to keep a longboat alongside our merchant vessel? How many unseen servant rowers can our party maintain?
We probably have more than enough gold to pay for the wages and food for crew for a while, although we'd have to get it to a port where we could hire on a crew large enough and soon enough. (There's some information back here >>/questarch/783564 about our capacity to maintain support staff, but that was overland). Might be easier to do if the pirates surrender or are captured, or if defeating their leader means becoming their leader, etc.

Maintenance and insurance and registration cost might be more significant than wages if we wanted to keep a ship longterm.
>>
No. 119672 ID: af6e04

>keep a ship longterm.
In every campaign, the PCs will inevitably end up becoming pirates
>>
No. 119691 ID: d36af7

The Blood Mire is the simplest, or at least, the most intuitively familiar to RL humans. It's an approximately flat plane adequately described by Cartesian coordinates, infinite in extent along the X and Y axes, with gravity (approximately 10 yards per second squared) oriented along the Z axis. Biospheres get pretty weird if you travel far enough, but massed violence always eventually makes the plants grow, even if leaves and blood alike aren't the color you might expect. Magnetized iron needles point north/south, perpendicular to the track of the sun, while vastly more expensive alchemically-treated silver needles point east/west, parallel to the track of the moon.

The angle between a pair of such needles is usually very close to, but almost never exactly, ninety degrees. Measuring such angles with precision is a keystone of navigation across strategic scales, and relevant to advanced geomancy even in very local applications. For exploration or otherwise drawing new maps that can retain useful accuracy beyond a couple hundred miles, you'll also need a set of gyroscopes, a foucault pendulum, or some other system for tracking absolute orientation (and distance, of course). The optics in ordinary surveying gear can be sufficient, when the horizon includes a mountain range, watchtowers, or some other set of landmarks whose relative positions are known, but doing it that way involves notably more tedious math with corresponding opportunties for error. Across such distances, the apparent direction of the movement of celestial bodies across the sky is not uniform, but rather a swirling vector field, like deep ocean currents or high-altitude prevailing winds, for reasons which will be addressed in more detail below.

The Storm Forge is mainly reached by traveling from the Blood Mire directly against the pull of gravity, or in layman's terms, up. Necessary distance varies considerably by location, time of year, and other factors, averaging 200 feet, and is difficult to identify precisely without magic. At most a hundred miles of straight-line travel in any direction is enough to leave, but "straight-line travel" is harder than it sounds (an uncontrolled fall will almost always work, but might take several hours) because the internal geometry is mostly spherical - that is, large circles have smaller circumference than you'd expect based on their radius. As a result off interface effects (distantly related to the way the surface of water can be transparent or reflective depending on angle), someone looking back down into the Blood Mire after, say, climbing a beanstalk of abnormal size, will see a curved horizon almost exactly as if they were looking at a spherical world of finite size. This also makes extremely high-speed air travel less useful than IRL, since it's a choice between flying low enough to risk crashing into mountains, trees, and waves, or high enough to waste speed going in weird zigzagging loops. Gravity is on average weaker, and much less consistent. You want to have wire-fu duels in an Escheresque cloud palace, this is where to go.

Tiamat (the only Old God referred to by a name that's phonetically consistent across most languages, rather than descriptive titles translated according to their conceptual content) also runs parallel to the Blood Mire, on the opposite side from the Storm Forge, with a similar ambiguous border, and is flat on average but has the highest incidence of topological defects among the Old Gods. Extracting or exploiting the more stable ones is a high-risk, high-reward industry - several different industries, really. Mining, fishing, transcontinental trade through naturally occurring shortcuts, that sort of thing.

The Green Breath has hyperbolic geometry www.roguetemple.com/z/hyper/ which becomes more extreme as you get further from the source plane and closer to the Unbroken Word on the W axis. Conveniently, your position on the W axis is easy to check: the closer you are to the source plane, the more of it is visible as illusions around you. Transetheric communication and scrying effects take advantage of this effect, which is why they're usually limited to observing a 10' radius around the target. Ethereal travel is never a shortcut (unless something seriously weird is going on), in fact under most circumstances it involves crossing at least twice the equivalent distance on the source plane, but has the distinct advantage that what few obstacles are present can almost always be circumvented in some straightforward way. Lots of stuff hides in all that extra space, including the 'back-end machinery' of haunted houses. At least, when it's a real haunting, rather than carbon monoxide poisoning.

The Unbroken Word seems in some respects like it has hyperbolic geometry, but on closer inspection works more like dream logic, or puzzle platforms in Unnatural Selection, or The Wired from Serial Experiments Lain, with locally flat regions connected to each other through vast blackness by links that owe more to conceptual sympathy than spatial proximity. Stars are access points to other planes, and demiplanes sufficiently stable and inhabited to have their own Green Breath. Any given plane forms one star per quarter-million square miles of healthy ecosystem on average. Thin spots or desolate biomes spread regional borders further while dense, complicated areas have them closer together. That, along with the geometry of the Green Breath, is the source of accuracy limitations in cross-planar travel: if you only need to be within a couple hundred miles, aiming for the correct star is sufficient, but anything more specific depends on very fiddly terminal guidance.

Two possible major exceptions to that stars-per-square-mile rule are the sun and moon, though another interpretation would be that they present the expected number of stars, but all clumped together instead of scattered around, corresponding to a stronger conceptual coherence than the other Old Gods, perhaps even a degree of self-awareness. In the cosmos's current configuration, the Horned Queen and the Burning Hate roll along the Unbroken Word's only two consistent horocycles at consistent yet incalculable velocities - literally incalculable, it's one of those infinity-divided-by-zero sorts of problems - which, filtered through the perspective of the Storm Forge, cause the day/night cycle, months, tides, and so on.

Time of day, seasonal weather, and tides vary across the Blood Mire because those are based on the relative position of the sun and/or moon, but the moon phase and apparent position of the City of Brass or other sunspots are everywhere simultaneous, because those depend on the absolute orientation, while the timing of eclipses is also constant (and on a consistent, albeit difficult-to-calculate, schedule) regardless of orientation, because they can only occur at the two points where the solar and lunar horocycles intersect. Some areas see a given eclipse as total, others as partial, again due to relative position - but this is not consistent from one eclipse to the next, though there definitely seems to be a pattern of some sort. Figuring out how to systematically predict the totality distribution of eclipses is an open problem, and there are indications that even the Old Empire muddled along with complex and unreliable epicyclic approximations. Local calendars mostly work the way you'd expect, but occasionally there's an eclipse during, say, the half-moon, which would be absurdly impossible IRL. There are two different types of eclipse, corresponding to the two different intersection points, but the distinction is seldom relevant outside astrology. If you see something that looks like a lunar eclipse, that's either a strictly local phenomenon, such as a giant monster or battlestation occluding part of the night sky, or anomalous activity on the lunar surface. Hiding in the most secure basement available would be a reasonable precaution in either case.

The axioms which define the geometry of the Hollow Pillar contain a contradiction, so everything there is simultaneously possible and impossible.

Serpenthearth has hypergolic geometry, meaning it spontaneously combusts on contact, and accordingly isn't a very popular vacation spot.
>>
No. 119697 ID: d36af7

>>119653
>we seem sorta decided on boarding at least one ship (flyers come from above, others portal in), but are we wrecking the other ship with [...] greek fire at the same time?
If Esmeraude buffs the boarding party with Resist Energy (Fire), you could more-or-less safely throw incendiaries on the same ship you're boarding. You'd still need to worry about smoke inhalation, but a wet scarf or bandana tied over the nose and mouth can help with that even if you don't have a magical fix, while you'd have severe distraction, ongoing area damage, and concealment, all helping to counter the enemy's, hm, 10:1 superior numbers? Something like that. Exact figure depends on how many you bring as the boarding party, I suppose.

If that worked, you could then portal over to the other pirate ship and credibly demand their surrender, the obvious alternative being a repeat performance. Maru Red would be an obvious one to bring along with such a plan, both for the all-nearby-allies flaming weapon effect and maxed intimidation skill, though Hore and Maria would certainly have their own contributions to make in such a scenario. Rather convenient that the company's already called "Fire Hawks."

>>119661
>Also, if you decide not to opt for True Strike, [Azarthraine's] aim isn't all that great.
He's taking some penalties on attack rolls due to shifting deck and new body, true, but as a 15th level wizard, his BAB is only one point less than that of Esmeraude's bodyguard. He really did miss the turtle deliberately, for a warning shot. If violence turned out to be the only option, he had five more SDs ready. Also figured that taking out the merfolk's transport in a barely-provoked first strike might leave them feeling vengeful and/or backed into a corner. Sun Tzu had a few things to say about the enemy's lines of retreat, didn't he?
>dropped into a tidal abyss and crushed to death,
One ten-foot cube isn't much of an abyss, and the surrounding water's going to be collapsing to fill it back in. Since Doc's got always-on Feather Fall, whereas the ocean doesn't, most of the hole would be closed before he got there. Worst plausible outcomes from such a mishap would be along the lines of a normal person stepping off a sidewalk into an unexpectedly deep street-side gutter: brief distraction from embarrassment, soaked socks and damp pantlegs, maybe a shoe lost to suction, some bruising, or a sprained ankle. If you're worried about friendly fire, direct hits would be the main concern, and that's what magical conformal force fields (mage armor, etc.) are for.
>>
No. 119719 ID: 3abd97
File 151632648561.jpg - (53.51KB , 226x226 , schlock20060408 cropped.jpg )
119719

>>119691
Interesting stuff! Lotta stuff that might merit follow up questions by my immediate reactions:

>large circles have smaller circumference than you'd expect based on their radius
I am reminded of a passage from Time's Eye. https://pastebin.com/yZhMjfYD

Also Petey.

>it spontaneously combusts on contact, and accordingly isn't a very popular vacation spot
Rhea: "Really?"

>>119697
>you could more-or-less safely throw incendiaries on the same ship you're boarding
This is a highly entertaining plan and I think we should go with it.

I'll get a final clear plan of action up in the thread (to immediately die as soon as combat hits).

>Exact figure depends on how many you bring as the boarding party
Between portals and flight I was sorta thinking to take everyone. I wasn't sure about the Agates, but you make a good point about Maria and fire. Daniel isn't really specced for doing damaged in combat, but he could always rainbow shield up and bless-buff the whole group at once. Winning asymmetrical fights means stacking lots of advantages.

Seems feasible so long as we're making sure we hit the pirates before they're in range of the merchants.
>>
No. 119720 ID: 094652

>Which ship to destroy
If we sink a ship, then obviously its non-buoyant treasure sinks to the bottom of the ocean. In most pre-industrial settings, that means you can kiss it goodbye, and so the obvious choice would be to target the artillery ship and spare the pirate ship for better loot and to minimize risk to your allied ships.

This is not your typical pre-industrial setting. Technically it IS industrial!

We have Decaro Vos and his team of affectionate octowasps. If we stall the ships while attempting negotiation, Vos and company can steal a few treasure chests from the ship and stow them on the other ship. If the depth at their current position is acceptable for Vos to dive, that's even better.

Meanwhile, the artillery ship has a big gun that's worth a fortune but has a lower value-weight ratio, it's conveniently installed but it needs a gunner to actively use. If we fight them while it's out of range of the trading ship, then we just have a variable time limit, and Hore can focus on sniping any potential gunners. Then we have a gun that might be worth even more than a whole treasure chest of gold, and a technologist with targeting abilities who can maximize its potential, all attached to a ship that was customized to use it.
>>
No. 119721 ID: 3abd97

>>119720
Vos isn't going to make it back from scouting the drownball musicians in time to participate in this fight. It's possible he might be able to salvage some sunk goods afterwards if stuff is lost in the fight.

Also we probably shouldn't assume the pirates don't have any aquatic crew (shark people, eel people, etc) of their own.

That the artillery piece has added value in that Hore might be qualified to use or maintain it is a good point, and not one I considered.

Problems there are twofold. If we leave the artillery ship to second (hoping they surrender with the weapon intact) they're free to try shooting at the merchants or at the ship we're attacking. If we hit the artillery ship first, we can take the weapon out of play quick, but it may not be salvageable after the fire and fighting.
>>
No. 119724 ID: d36af7

>>119719
>Rhea: "Really?"
Planar travel agent: "The Sun, just for comparison, is almost completely full of flames and caustic, unbreathable gases, but some do go there for what could usefully be called tourism because it's possible to build protective suits and shelters which maintain a more hospitable environment within, such as the City of Brass.
"Inside serpenthearth, the shape of space itself IS fire. Formulae describing it accurately enough will combust upon being read and understood; a trick for reproducing them without thought is the basis of Explosive Runes and many other traps. Even if you can figure out a way to defend against or survive that, well... how do you feel about simultaneously drowning and being crushed by a mass of molten rock?"

From a more Doylist standpoint, it's a physical manifestation of the Hedgehog's Dilemma, and a sort of anti-hell: an infinitely wise and (arguably) compassionate being which created mortal life from primal chaos, whose perfection is so harshly absolute that imperfect beings cannot survive it's mere proximity... but which takes the form of a slithering and burning underworld, rather than a sky-father enthroned aboard a crystal-spires-and-togas Borg cube.

The Storm Forge, conversely, is a sort of anti-heaven, with the aesthetic of elegant palaces on clouds populated by white-robed angels, but the conceptual underpinnings of strife and torment fueled by factionalism and hubris, rather than harmonious central planning and faith.

When I was setting all this up, I wanted a degree of moral ambiguity and cosmic horror that's just plain incompatible with designated 'good guy' and 'bad guy' zones in a Planescape-style Great Wheel. ("Wheel of Morality, turn turn turn, tell us the lesson that we must learn...") But I also didn't want it to be too hard to explain from Gygaxian assumptions, and I really didn't want to have to change the cosmology so much that I'd need to rethink every spell and monster which interacts with the ethereal or astral planes in any way. So, I just stirred things around until it all settled into a new stable configuration. Took the Cleric Domains from the Pathfinder core book, cut out the alignments, shuffled the rest into triplets - oops, not evenly divisible by three, I'll say two of 'em get four - balancing concrete and abstract themes where possible, nobody gets more than one elemental portfolio, and so on, swapping things around until cohesive archetypes emerged. I definitely owe some credit to inspiration from the cosmology-creation system in the Silent Legions RPG by Kevin Crawford (now available on drivethrurpg; I backed the kickstarter), though it wasn't exclusively that.
>>
No. 119725 ID: 094652

>All visible faces appear to Valeno to be melting and burning like wax, or rotten with maggots and exposed bone, or otherwise totally obscured by violent and/or supernatural force, something different whenever they look away
Ah. Would this be a good time to cast Remove Fear? It won't cure her illness, but she won't continue to throw her poisoned needles at us.
>>
No. 119757 ID: af6e04

>>119691
Planar travel sounds appropriately confounding and alien.

This excites me more than you might think cause most of the games I've played in haven't actually done much with the different planes.
>>
No. 119781 ID: 3abd97

>>119697
Okay I'm trying to write up the battle plan as a suggestion now and I have a question: how much of a boarding party can Esmeraude support with Resist Energy (Fire)? Not sure how many castings she has, especially if it's single target and not mass. (She's a sorceress, so she's running on IP like Geoffrey, rather than slots, right)?

>They absently remind you "don't go down the well."
I am amused that even the mostly insane, contradictory and corrupted flames Rhea is talking to agree that what the original Fire Hawks did was a Bad Idea.

>>119724
Oh, neat. Sort of an inversion on the idea of the phoenix as primal life force. Flames of creation that cannot be safely touched. (I certainly see ways that kind of organization of gods and themes would be compatible with what budding ideas I have on Greznek theology).

And more generally, yeah, the shuffling to avoid unambiguously clear good and evil is very fun.
>>
No. 119788 ID: d36af7

>>119781
>I am amused that even the mostly insane, contradictory and corrupted flames Rhea is talking to agree that what the original Fire Hawks did was a Bad Idea.
Somebody carved that particular message - or rather, a much larger message of which that is one of the running themes - into the landscape itself, with multilayered semiotics meant to remain readily comprehensible at least as long as the underlying threat was still present. The plan was that small children, folks suffering mental illness or psychotropic drugs so extreme they're barely in touch with reality, starfish aliens, maybe even nonsapient animals, would be able to take it all in from miles away and know at a glance: "This is not a place of honor. Nothing valued is here. The outside may be safe, but you must not disturb any rocks or sealed vessels in the ground below."

Of course, the Church of Orcus never had much use for other people's rules. Something was there long before Orcus arrived, and will remain contained long after he departs - or it would have done so, if it were left undisturbed.

Neither Zelkor nor Azarthraine ever touched, or even really approached, the true root of the problems in and under that place.
>>
No. 119805 ID: 094652

I've given Azure's current spell list some forethought, and I've concluded that getting fool's gold was a bad idea. Azure's on-hand fortunes are now down to merely "above the working class' monthly paycheck", she needs time and discipline to fully take advantage of the charm boost on mid-high level marks (which is basically what they are used for, as ritually sacrificing five gold to convince a mook is easier spent bribing them), and if Azure is currently in the act of giving a gold piece to someone then that someone probably has an advantage of some kind over her.

Conclusion: I want to replace Azure's Fool's Gold spell with Triple Time masterpiece. It's not much, but have you noticed how much WALKING the individual party members have been doing when they frequently split the party over large distances? More importantly, Azure cares for Pog, who is geared for carrying high-weight armor with minimal penalty to speed but is still relatively slow thanks to his large frame. Getting triple time means he gets out of danger and into smashing range quicker.

I'll take some time to consider if I should finalize this decision, but in the meantime are there any conditions to developing masterpieces that I should know about? Santova might also want to know the specific house rules to developing masterpieces for Skalds.
>>
No. 119806 ID: d36af7

>>119805
Problems, in no particular order:
)Azure's not 3rd level yet,
)She seems to be focused on singing and dance rather than drums, strings, or wind instruments,
)I'm not using the 'bardic masterpiece' rules,
)You don't understand how the Fool's Gold spell works.
>ritually sacrificing five gold to convince a mook is easier spent bribing them
See that letter F in the spell description's 'components' line? That stands for "focus," meaning the gold isn't actually consumed. You cast the spell on a set of five or more gold coins, hand the coins over to somebody, and then it weakens their resistance to your other spells. You could, for example, bribe somebody with the cursed gold, follow that up with a Charm Person when the bribe isn't quite enough, and once they're charmed, sweet-talk them into giving you the gold back.
>mook
Given that it's a potentially expensive debuff, you'd presumably be saving it for harder targets than random footsoldiers or peasants.
>>
No. 119825 ID: 094652

>>119806
>I'm not using the 'bardic masterpiece' rules
Aww, I spent last night reading up on them.
>That stands for "focus," meaning the gold isn't actually consumed
I figured that certain Divine Foci needed to be sacrificed, particularly those with an explicit price tag and not just "unknown true worth". Would have used the spell back at town if I had known.

Still, I should re-consider my spell list. Least True Healing is good for cuts and scrapes, which is actually important as Azure's wounds need to be quickly healed or they'll catch fire. Rhea can help with transferring flames to something else, but when she's not around Azure's going to need a long-term strategy for dousing herself without requiring a bath, which could permakill her if she explodes in water and her ashes are wet for 24 hours. I'll look into the spell list on my own time, but if you have any suggestions feel free to explain.
>>
No. 119831 ID: 3abd97

>>119825
I think you might be better served trying to think about how to use what you have well then trying to plan overmuch for when you get new spells.

>Azure's going to need a long-term strategy for dousing herself without requiring a bath
Stop, drop, and roll? Or invest in a fire-blanket.
>>
No. 119839 ID: d36af7

One timeless fire-suppression strategy is to keep a bucket full of water and/or sand. If only a small part of Azure's body is on fire, simply stick it in the bucket. If the situation has escalated further, dump the bucket out over her along with other countermeasures.

A few different kinds of fireproof cloth are available in any major city, and by mail-order at the general store in Zelkor's Ferry. Not usually cheap, though. Azure's original outfit was made mostly of thread spun from amethyst and other semiprecious stones (almost any mineral can be thus processed by a proprietary technique of one of the Youngmason family's business partners) which, apart from being nonflammable right up to it's melting point at around 1650 degrees C, looks gorgeous and is surprisingly durable, but it's super itchy, so she had to have underwear made from less pretty, more comfortable (though still fireproof) materials.
>which could permakill her if she explodes in water and her ashes are wet for 24 hours
Charred remains being merely damp definitely won't stop the respawn. She's probably been murdered, by a snapped neck or poison which causes internal bleeding, with the relatively intact body left in a full bathtub (in hopes of finishing the job and making it look like an accident or suicide) at least once, and simply melted a hole through the tub in the course of coming back to life. For ordinary water to confirm the kill, it'd need to cover her remains completely, at least deep enough that she can't get her nose up into breathable air just by standing on the bottom. A single flake of ash floating on surface tension would be sufficient.

>>119805
>relatively slow thanks to his large frame
Pog's long legs and relentless stamina actually give him a much better theoretical running speed than the average elvenoid. Main thing slowing him down is a habitual hunched-over shuffle from operating underground with low ceilings.
>>
No. 119846 ID: d36af7

Suggestions would, in-setting, be coming from the politically-active citizens of a small and mostly democratic city in the frozen North which has found itself in the path of something they can't hope to defeat by conventional military force, because it's too cute. Lethally cute. Soldiers take one look at it and start squealing like teenage girls at a New Sync Boys concert. Eventually they fall down, then stand back up as venomous zombies, all without any apparent effort on the anathema's part.

I've had stats for that main antagonist ready for some time, from another project, and vague but fruitful ideas for the sorts of people you could go around frantically hiring as mercenaries or cutting regrettable deals with as allies of convenience. Figure I'll leave ally character creation open since you all seem to enjoy it so much.

What I need is a title card image. I'm picturing something like the picture here http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Literature/TheSnowQueen but with a dirigible moored the castle's highest spire, since airships are the Haslanti League's most iconic strategic asset.
>>
No. 119849 ID: af6e04

>>119846
Sounds interesting. I could try to draw something. Do you want to keep the moose too?
>>
No. 119855 ID: d36af7

>>119849
Hm... could go either way on the moose.

If you include a human figure in the foreground, either riding the moose or on foot, that should probably be the Maid of Poison. Her overall look is somewhere between generic Dark Magical Girl, Elsa from Disney's Frozen (post-Let It Go), and 40k Sisters of Battle: all frilly and goth-y and implausibly well-groomed, with purity seals or prayer strips for accessories, but absolutely no sensible outdoorsy winter clothing whatsoever. Her torso armor looks like it's made from jagged crystals held together with spun glass (if you don't want to get bogged down with fine details there, just sketch in vaguely reasonable-shaped set of corselet and pauldrons, then make 'em excessively sparkly), and includes a bracket for holding her only visible weapon - a soulsteel gyroscopic chakram with a hearthstone socketed in it - behind her head like an iron halo. Her face shouldn't be visible, since she's looking at the town rather than the viewer, but she might have a swirl of red runes around one hand like she's starting to cast a spell.

As long as I'm establishing appearance, she's an abyssal exalt, so anima flare and miscellaneous magical energy effects are mostly black - but it's am unnatural sort of darkness which tends to perversely make things more visible rather than less. Her iconic anima is a pair of skeletal serpents entwined in a double helix, and any walking dead she raises will constantly drool a tarry, slow-acting poison.

Main thing is the landscape and airship, though. Foreground figure could be minimal or absent and I wouldn't mind at all.
>>
No. 119857 ID: d36af7

At some point she was captured and interrogated.
Q: Who are you?
A: I am maid of poison.

Q: How did you kill all those people?
A: I am made of poison.

Q: Why? What do you want?
A: I am made for pois...
Q: Forget it, man. That's all we're getting out of her. Can't tell if she really understands our language, or just repeats that one phrase like a parrot.
>>
No. 119861 ID: 3abd97

>>119846
Interesting hook, although the biggest barrier to entry for anything exalted seems to be the amount of infodump needed for the uninitiated (or partially initiated) to wade through. There's less of a common footing than those Gygaxian assumptions.

Using the multiple choice model in Race to the West Pole did help with that.

>>119857
So I assume her interrogators are unable to see her.

>>/quest/860496
>Rhea herself would be nearly ideal as a junior orcish matriarch, apart from the species issue.
My plan for anyone expressing romantic or sexual interest in Rhea had been for her to remain oblivious up until it was drummed over her head (which I suppose 5 orcs proposing to her at once would qualify as). She would be very unlikely to initiate or express such interest herself. Actual preferences are poorly defined at this point and how well she responded would depend on who's making overtures, and the hows and whys of their approach. (Although she does have at least a small positive disposition towards cute monster boys now).

And if it's a flame or fire spirit or similar thing expressing interest it's possible none of what I just said applies at all.

Pointing this out, because if it is in character for the orc hunt-brotherhood to pursue anything here, they're almost certainly going to have to make the first move (or some PC is going to have to try and play matchmaker) and it'll get parsed in-character from there.

I didn't plan on her picking up a harem or orcish warriors, but honestly I don't do much planning at all for Rhea. She's run mostly on audacity and rule of funny.
>>
No. 119874 ID: d36af7

>>119861
>So I assume her interrogators are unable to see her.
They've got her in fancy power-limiter manacles which suppress the effect, and it's not always-on anyway. She could stash her visibly magical equipment somewhere, put on normal clothes, and walk down the street indistinguishable at a glance from any other waif-like teenage girl.

>romantic or sexual interest
They're approaching this more like a religious obligation or business transaction. In Yrthakite culture, romantic love is supposed to be more of an optional bonus, the cherry-on-top of an already healthy and productive marriage, a mystery factor which drives people to seek renewal of the vows every three years rather than moving on to find something new. Yrthakite women can sometimes use the compulsion of their libidos as an excuse for bad decisions, but men... they're allowed to enjoy sex when it happens to them, or express preferences if their wife asks, or pass off the obligation to another of their hunt-brothers when her need is beyond his own ability or immediate willingness to satisfy, but allowing sex drive to influence their thinking much beyond that is shameful. ('Passing the buck' too often, for sex or any other marital duty, could be annoying, but it's not a wife's place to complain of one brother's specialty covering another's weakness, at least not while the work is actually getting done.) A Yrthakite man proactively seeking his own sexual gratification, or admitting that such desire tainted the motives behind some other action, would be considered outright depraved - other than occasional masturbation, which is treated as a gross-but-necessary component of personal hygiene, like brushing teeth or pooping.

Yrthakite marriage almost always involves sex, but it isn't exactly about sex. Under that system, women have a natural right to be secure and make full use of their own minds for long-term planning, while men have a natural right to take risks and make full use of their own bodies to solve immediate problems. For men to sleep indoors, sign binding contracts, or otherwise control more wealth than they can carry, they've got to borrow a woman's rights; for women to endure the physical costs and risks of pregnancy and childbirth, or pursue military actions, they've got to borrow a man's rights. Unmarried women also aren't supposed to light fires or lift heavy things, and unmarried men aren't supposed to gather edible plants or lay traps, but there are a lot of loopholes and rationalizations available for those. Some traps involve far more muscle than brains to set up, block-and-tackle or other mechanical advantage can let a frail young woman move cargo without breaking a sweat, lighting a fire with a lens or parabolic reflector or magic isn't really physical work at all, and so on.
>>
No. 119880 ID: 3d2d5f

>>119874
I suppose it's my own fault for not choosing a significantly broad encompassing label but that's all rather besides the point I was making.

If anyone wants Rhea to think she's in more than an interesting conversation about housing accommodations and customs and cultures and hypotheticals (she asked how their oaths interact with guest-right less because she thought it was a workaround, but more because hospitality is important to her culturally and she was genuinely curious what provision their traditions made) they're going to have to hit her over the head with it.

Between the language speedbump, her naivete, whatever political play firemom had for Rhea being long since dead, and that she sees herself on a pilgrimage of sorts, "oh wait marrying me" is not a thought anyone should be holding their breath for her to have. She's just not used to seeing herself as a valid target for those kinds of affections (or non-affectionate social contracts. Whatever).

Granted the nature of Yrthakite marriage will probably play into how or if things could work out, but they don't really affect how likely she is to cotton on.
>>
No. 119891 ID: 094652

>Evil magical eldritch 'girl' with the power of deadly cuteness
Are you going for the "alien heroine with alien standards meets Earth with horrible but hilarious results" route or the "team of evil magical girls from outer space versus highly trained international army" route? Because adding more characters will decrease the 'lolterror" but gives more sockets for content, backstory, and gameplay. Too little and we get bored, too much and we get frustrated.
>>
No. 119912 ID: d36af7

Battle plan in Thread 6 seems to be mostly hammered out, so I'm waiting on people (other than Tunic) to declare finer-grained individual actions and roll for 'em.

>>119891
>Are you going for the "alien heroine with alien standards meets Earth with horrible but hilarious results" route or the "team of evil magical girls from outer space versus highly trained international army" route?

Closer to the second. She's got a team, but it's more comparable to Maria's animal friends from Castlevania: Symphony of the Night than fellow magical girls. She's not strictly speaking evil; in fact, by straightforward mapping of Exalted-style Virtues to D&D-style alignments, she reads as Lawful Good, with her Conviction (which maps to 'evil,' roughly; it's more about persistence) actually the weakest of the four. She counts as a "Creature of Darkness," but that's more of an ecological/political distinction than a moral judgement. (Easiest way to get tagged as a CoD is getting lost in a desert and eating the wrong kind of bugs.) She's not from outer space, except maybe in such a twisty metaphorical sense that it could mean almost anything, though there are certainly a few useful comparisons to be made to Sailor Galaxia. The army in question is more of an iron-age air force, with relatively few steady international alliances to call on.
>>
No. 119927 ID: 3abd97

>>119912
Ah sorry, I expected the narrative to just jump in like the bandit fight.

That leaves just you Kome, unless Santova happens to get back just now.
>>
No. 119939 ID: aa93c0

Uh... You said 17-18 was a critical fail and not 16, right?
>>
No. 119945 ID: 3d2d5f

Woo the potion didn't lead to disorienting sensory overload.

>Esmeraude has already arranged a subjective hour of private conversation with the artillerist. That'd be more than enough to hammer out any reasonably simple terms of surrender... or alliance.
Unse has effectively exhausted my patience with this brand of paranoia for now.

OOC question: what's Esmeraude's plan / play, and what's motivating the attempt?

>autocorrect has finally started recognizing Esmeraude instead of trying to correct to Esmeralda
If she's betrayed us, it's just as the robots started to trust her. :v

>>119939
Yes, although as I understand it, the cut offs for success, failure and crits can vary with different challenges and in different circumstances.
>>
No. 119947 ID: d36af7

>>119944
>what's Esmeraude's plan / play,
She'll use one of those minor effects which she avoided telling you about to summon sousaphones onto the crew of the intact ship, because apart from their dubious value as musical instruments, they'd be just barely extradimensional enough to trip Daviste's weakness.

With portals thus neutralized, she'd revoke flight spells to demobilize Azarthraine and Hore, then threaten to revoke fire resistance, or scuttle the load of immovable rods with that same ball of water she used on Deros Frist's tower, or both. From that position of strength, she'll ask you to return to the merchant ship and depart in peace, rather than pressing for additional concessions.

>and what's motivating the attempt?
From a practical standpoint, she's trying to recruit the pirates as new minions under her exclusive control, and then go her own way, but without completely cutting ties or irreparably offending the Fire Hawks.

Emotionally, she's needy and impulsive, an indiscriminate and insatiable glutton for physical intimacy and/or affectionate validation (which she considers largely interchangeable). She wants to have a strong power base with no active enemies, and knows in principle what needs to be done to achieve that, but hasn't got enough patience for the hard, slow work of logistics and diplomacy.

She's not really greedy in the conventional sense; she wants a pile of gold to wallow around and sleep on, more than to be able to spend it. She'd probably be happier locked up in a sufficiently gilded cage than as an actual noble with hard decisions to make. Lot of the opportunistic scheming is more habitual than well thought out, because she's been a full-time battle mage and nominal bandit leader since she was ten years old (teenager now, orphaned and exiled during a war which ended six years ago, do the math) and didn't have the best home life even before that.
>>
No. 119948 ID: 3d2d5f

>>119947
Haha, the sousaphones I was not expecting.

Interestingly, I'm not sure this isn't a plan she couldn't have got the players to agree to if she'd raised it for discussion. What to do with a captured pirate ship and how to transport it and any crew was always going to be a thorny issue, and letting the sorceress and possessed fighter we don't really trust take them and get the hell out of our hair and stop being a continuous security threat solves two issues at once.

It's not even a bad outcome for us to let her succeed- biggest losses are loot not taken, and the reputation hit by being outplayed.

Viste could preempt her by killing the person she kissed. Forces Esmeraude to either double down, or abandon this attempt and pretend she wasn't up to anything (basically what happened with the catgirls).

Could try negotiations at sword and dagger point. Pop over, demand a kiss, see what we can agree to in a subjective hour. I'm tempted to let her take the pirate ship, but force concessions from her for it first. So she still gets to leave, but she has to pay us off for the privilege.

Fighting her is a bad option. Even if I kill her in a surprise attack, we would still have to deal with Cap, and he's going to do damage to us or our clients before he goes down. If she mage armored him, we can't go for a cheap kill with Supreme Disintegration either.

Any input, guys? Thanks to the perception potion and portals I think I'm the only character in position to react fast enough but I'll consider other reactions.

>without completely cutting ties or irreparably offending the Fire Hawks
Mmmm. I think she's underestimating how badly Maru and Tunic respond to being crossed, or how violently /quest/ in general reacts to treachery, but a lot of that is OOC to her.
>>
No. 119954 ID: af6e04

>I'm not sure this isn't a plan she couldn't have got the players to agree to if she'd raised it for discussion.
Would have been a hard 'no' from Vos. It makes sense from a utilitarian standpoint, but letting two dangerous criminals who have taken lives, one of which is a demon, run away with their own pirate ship and crew would be something the eel-man would never abide. He's not there right now, so you could cut a deal without him knowing, but Vos' loyalty does have limits if the party starts acting too selfish.

>>119948
Portaling over won't put you in the best tactical position in any case. Cap might just cut Viste down or (more likely) hold her hostage and then the two could complete their plan as intended. Maybe you could quickly try to portal everyone over to the other side of the deck before the tubas come into play and stage an assault from there, though that would be risky too.
>>
No. 119959 ID: 3d2d5f

>>119954
Hey you never know- maybe she'll turn her once-pirate minions into something better, or she can be persuaded to turn them towards more acceptable targets.

I wouldn't be planning on hiding something like this (how would we)? Explaination to Vos would probably be some variation on "we didn't have a better option without doing more harm."

I don't think Cap's right next to Esmeraude, so I think I could open a portal and kill her collaborator, or enact my own hostage situation / negotiation faster than he could intervene. The the portals stay open for a bit, so the ships would be connected, so I wouldn't be immediately cut off from retreat or help if she summoned the sousaphones.
>>
No. 119963 ID: 3abd97

>I don't think Cap's right next to Esmeraude
Ah wait my bad he is right there holding the guy. That does make a direct confrontation trickier.

Still, I think broadly speaking, my options are (1) intervene by killing the artillerist (and force her to back down or double down), (2) intervene and negotiate via kiss-conference, (3) stand back and allow it to happen, or (4) Go right to conflict (which I can't see ending without us having people hurt and the merchants damaged before we put both of them down).

Are you advocating cutting loses and sticking with 3, strgy?
>>
No. 119965 ID: af6e04

>>119963
I think so, probably the only safe way.
>>
No. 119971 ID: 6f75e1

Honestly, I think you should intervene. We met Esmeraude when she was a bandit princess, and she hasn't changed. It's probable that she'll go right back to banditry with a pirate crew. We don't want that. Try talking to her from a distance, get the pirates neutralized and see if a smaller set of survivors will change her mind.
>>
No. 119975 ID: 3abd97

>>119965
True, inaction is probably safer. Still thinking about some form of intervention though. It's awful hard to ignore an opportunity to improve outcomes all together.

>>119971
>We don't want that
Out of curiosity, why? :V

Are you taking a moral stance? (Bandits are bad). Are you arguing it would run counter to our interests? Are you saying you want to get her to grow into a better person?

>Try talking to her from a distance
That won't work (short of a lucky crit). Keeping distance gives her the leeway to finish her plan.
>>
No. 119977 ID: d36af7

As a fifth option, since Esmeraude's plan already hinges on negotiating from what she thinks is a position of strength, you could allow her to go ahead and capture the second pirate ship and crew intact, then have, say, Davina and Maru hammer the sorceress's emotional weak points with a good cop/bad cop routine.

She isn't really willing to part with the Fire Hawks on bad terms, even if she could do so easily and profit in the process, so explaining how this might result in you not being her friend anymore could be a more effective threat than any amount of physical violence. Even if true reconciliation is no longer possible, causing her to grasp at straws or throw a tantrum might be tactically advantageous.
>>
No. 119979 ID: d36af7

>>119948
>Haha, the sousaphones I was not expecting.
Glad to hear that. I do try to be innovative with recombination of simple, familiar elements.
https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2010-08-05
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/summon-instrument Of course, her variant can be applied directly to willing targets, in exchange for other limitations.
>>119954
>before the tubas come into play and stage an assault
Any pirates wearing sousaphones (which are distinct from tubas in that they wrap around behind the user, for a more balanced load while on the march, rather than being a relatively compact bundle carried in front) can't mount an effective counterattack, at least not without first closing to conventional boarding range, because the same feature which makes them safe from close combat with Viste would rend their own flesh if they tried to traverse her portals.

>>119939
In GURPS, 16 on the dice is usually a simple failure, but it's in sort of an interesting position as the highest number you can roll and still succeed (with effective skill 16+), while also being a crit fail for skill is 6 or below.
>>
No. 120001 ID: 094652

>>119975
First up, Hore has very low standards, but allowing the formation of a pirate gang whose leaders were formerly leading a bandit gang to mass-murder an entire village of civilians? Not exactly a high standard.

Second, Esmeraude is power-hungry; if she attains too much power too quickly, she might start viewing her former friends as 'loose ends'. Or at the very least, beg the Fire Hawks the next time her little group gets into trouble, only to forget their existence completely once she has surpassed them in military power.
>>
No. 120004 ID: 3abd97

>>119965
>>119971
>Try talking to her from a distance
>>119977
>a fifth option
You know what I think I'll try something along those lines. Any physical intervention in Cap's vicinity seems chancy at best, while Esmeraude's emotional state is a lot more vulnerable. Plus the likely consequences of a failure are milder and the odds of success look better.

Also acting like this was expected and she disappointed us by failing a test of character is much better optics than appearing surprised by it.

>>120001
Technically she was looking to conquer those civilians, not murder them, which is very different.

>she might start viewing her former friends as 'loose ends'
That would seem to run counter to paid-for insight into her motivations. She's trying to have her cake and eat it to- get out from under our thumb without burning bridges. Preemptively or paranoidly eliminating loose ends would also seem to conflict her need for approval, too.

>be flighty, ask for help, be unreliable providing it in return
Oh you should absolutely expect that so long as she's alive and has any connection to us.
>>
No. 120005 ID: d36af7

>>120001
Where are you getting these ideas?
>mass-murder an entire village of civilians
Esmeraude was by all accounts trying to conquer Eckton and exploit it as a source of income, not exterminate people. Her grasp of Aguinbreke's political philosophy and conventional morality are both, shall we say, less than perfect, but she's puzzled out the common principle that genocide is bad at least clearly enough that she's never found a sufficiently compelling reason to make such an attempt.
>Second, Esmeraude is power-hungry; if she attains too much power too quickly, she might start viewing her former friends as 'loose ends'
I just said almost the exact opposite of this in response to Magey's weekly OOC question.
>>
No. 120010 ID: d36af7

>>120004
Go ahead and post in the IC thread, then.

>>116633
>Should I be announcing a list of what I prepared every in-game day? (Cause I've been enjoying... not having to do that).
Been thinking about this, and reading through GURPS Power-Ups: Divine Favor, along with various Dungeon Fantasy-oriented expansions thereof. Basically, rather than mage-like spells, points go into the Patron advantage and you pray for miraculous interventions, with odds of success strongly influenced by how closely you're sticking to the letter and spirit of the relevant code of conduct, promotion or defense of the patron's interests, how urgent/pivotal the situation is, and whether you'd be able to handle it by other means. You can also spend points on 'pre-approved' miracles which don't require a roll to activate, but praying for a new effect always switches off whichever miracle you currently had active.

Overall, seems like a much better fit for Rhea's relationship with her god-mom, but I'm less confident how to keep it balanced with everybody else's pathfinder-style class progressions.
>>
No. 120015 ID: 3abd97

>>120010
I think on the whole I prefer the whole "narrow, deeply personal repertoire" approach to magic versus the clerical library, but we already have Rhea set up and it seems like a needless slowdown to the game to rebuild or re-balance her now.

Thanks for the consideration, but I don't think we need to do anything really different now.

Balancing how much to reward how well I stick to the code of conduct I'm making up as I go along would get pretty silly.
>>
No. 120016 ID: 20ea96

>>119948
>she's underestimating how badly Maru and Tunic respond to being crossed
While it IS true I dislike being screwed over by npcs, in this case, Esmeraude is simply choosing to remove herself and her man from the party. She hasn't even harmed or killed any of us in the process, nor did she steal anything that actually belonged to us. To be perfectly honest, as far as Sudden But Inevitable Betrayals go, this seems like the best possible resolution we could hope for. I say, let her go. She doesn't cross us, we don't cross her. She removes the entire ship as a threat, and our party has two fewer logistical headaches. Everyone wins here.

>reputation hit by being outplayed
We can easily spin the story such that sending them off to seize the piratical assets was part of a negotiated plan, and she is parting from our company with our blessing. Only our group and hers know the truth, and as long as she doesn't spread dirty rumors, we should be just fine.

If she later turns up as an obstacle to us again, then we destroy her and everything she holds dear with maximum prejudice.
>>
No. 120020 ID: 3abd97

>>120016
Yeah I can't say I disagree with that sentiment.

Part of the problem in handling this is I'm not really sure what end result I want. Letting her plan succeed doesn't actually harm us, resolves some problems, and it's sort of a sticky question what even do with her if we talk her down now that she's demonstrated how untrustworthy she is. And trying to talk her into backing down sort of messes with allowing an amicable separation to happen, even if it seems in character to try something.
>>
No. 120021 ID: af6e04

>We can easily spin the story such that sending them off to seize the piratical assets was part of a negotiated plan, and she is parting from our company with our blessing.
So the official story would be that we intervened to save a town from these vicious bandits, were won over by said bandits, and then decided to let them go right back to bandit-ing with a brand new ship and crew? Honestly that strikes me as the worst way we could spin the situation.
>>
No. 120024 ID: 3abd97

>>120021
We're mercenaries. The easiest way to spin that I think is that we justify things as separate jobs.

-Intervening in Eckton was one job.
-Defending the merchants was a different job.
-Handing over a captured pirate ship to Esmeraude was part of the job she hired us for. (Even if it wasn't, and assuming that actually happens cause it's still up in the air).

In that sense, we aren't responsible if she chooses to do something terrible with her ship later. And it also explains why we worked against Esmeraude in one case and for/with her in another.
>>
No. 120026 ID: af6e04

>>120024
That could work, but then our web of lies grows a lot broader.

Also, even though demonstrating that you're willing to endanger civilian lives for money is probably a fine point on a professional soldier's resume, it's really not something Vos would feel comfortable associating his name or religion with. The act is entirely opposed to his higher ambition and even just claiming he had part in it for the sake of saving face would really rub him the wrong way.
>>
No. 120036 ID: 20ea96

>>120026
>willing to endanger civilian lives for money
See, that's exactly the sort of negative spin we're trying to avoid here. The idea is to make the best of a bad situation. Do you have a better suggestion?

>not something Vos would feel comfortable associating his name or religion with
I wasn't aware the Fire Hawks were officially associated with Tittivila. I feel like identifying ourselves with a portfolio of chaos and excessive passion would reflect more poorly on our professionalism as mercenaries than the idea of taking a job from a less-than-upright individual and following through on our word. If I were a wealthy client, I certainly wouldn't trust a group like those Tittivila-worshipping sirens to carry out a paid task for me unless it was something they would have gladly done without payment.

An individual can be eccentric. An organization needs stability.
>>
No. 120037 ID: 3abd97

>>120026
Claiming you did something on purpose isn't much of a web! And she was a paying client at one point and it's not like anyone outside had access to the details.

Plus we can totally imply it without lying by claiming professionalism.

"Why did you guys hand off that pirate ship?"
"We don't disclose the particulars of arrangements with past clients, I'm sorry."

>The act is entirely opposed to his higher ambition
I dunno taking down a pirate ship and forcing the survivors under the leadership of someone who is only a little evil, or less evil than their previous commander, seems like a mostly good act to me! (Possibly even offers the survivors a chance at redemption depending on what she plans to do with them, or if the door is still open for us to try and influence Esmeraude's behavior in the future). Removing the pirates entirely might be more good, but unfortunately one can't always have everything.

Vos is certainly welcome to not like it, but it's mostly academic until we see what actually happens and his friends get a chance to explain what happened to him.
>>
No. 120041 ID: af6e04

>See, that's exactly the sort of negative spin we're trying to avoid here.
Well, it is two powerful bandits who attacked a town. I can't see any other way to spin "we helped them hijack a pirate ship and sent them on their merry way"

>I wasn't aware the Fire Hawks were officially associated with Tittivila.
Right, but since Vos is a member of the Fire Hawks and part of the group during these supposed negotiations then it means he took part in the decision. And since he's a champion of Tittivila that also means his goddess endorses the act. The Fire Hawks aren't associated with Tittivila, but Tittivila is associated with the Fire Hawks.

>Claiming you did something on purpose isn't much of a web!
I was more referring to the fact that if we claim we were paid to defend Eckton then questions will arise about who actually hired us, since none of the townsfolk did.

>I dunno taking down a pirate ship and forcing the survivors under the leadership of someone who is only a little evil, or less evil than their previous commander, seems like a mostly good act to me!
That seems a lot more like a purely selfish act from which maybe a little good might arise. And it's very debatable to say Esmeraude is less evil than the previous commander. She's really just more charismatic and has had time to win us over.

I'd hate to be that lawful stupid paladin, but Esmeraude has clearly demonstrated that she's perfectly happy and willing to gain power by taking from those who are weaker than her. Consider Vos' higher ambition of 'Protecting the weak' and tell me how to justify going along with a plan like this. Remember how Vos was perfectly ready to kill Esmeraude at our last stop? He was already losing patience with her and he's not eager to let anymore innocents pay the price of his mercy. Of course, the truth isn't that we let her go willingly, but that's the story we plan on telling. For Vos, this would be an extremely weird situation of admitting to a sin he did not commit because his friends think it's less damaging than the truth.

>it's mostly academic until we see what actually happens and his friends get a chance to explain what happened to him.
I'm just trying to explain character conflicts beforehand so everybody doesn't end up confused and regretful. Davina would probably be able to predict how Vos would react to such a situation because of all the time she's spent with him giving her a feel for his personality. It's kinda funny how Vos ended up with the cold professional mercenaries while Nistamatsin ended up on the divine quest to destroy evil. I imagine they'd both be much more comfortable if they switched places. But really, who wants to play a character that's comfortable?
>>
No. 120042 ID: 20ea96

>>120041
Sounds to me like you're giving an ultimatum here, for the party to choose between Vos and Esmeraude. Well, I've always disliked Esmeraude anyway. Time to off the sorceress.
>>
No. 120043 ID: 3abd97

>>120042
>ultimatum
I mean it's sort of not, considering none of our characters will even be aware of Vos' objections until after this is over.

He could arrive, learn what happens and then chastise the party for their moral failings, or try to persuade them to undo their decision somehow, or declare we're all terrible people and leave forever or vow that we need to do better in the future or... who knows.

Ditching his friends because they made a mistake in his absence seems a pretty severe response for what I would expect from Vos tbh.

>>120041
>Remember how Vos was perfectly ready to kill Esmeraude at our last stop?
I remember he was the one who recruited her and thought she might be redeemable, and no I don't remember Vos being willing to kill her in Overmire. Or with the sirens.

>if we claim we were paid to defend Eckton
Technically we were. (The town paid us by giving us custody of Cap).

>Davina would probably be able to predict how Vos would react to such a situation because of all the time she's spent with him giving her a feel for his personality.
Yes I'll just continue to predict everyone's objections and somehow balance Esmeraude's greed, the company's interests, protecting our clients, Vos' moral objections, and Maru's being offended or afraid objections all at once by myself thank you.

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I'm getting being a little frustrated with the expectation that others can draw absolute lines in the sand and me / my character is going to be expected to compromise around them for you.

Realistically, Dav's priority right now is finding a result that protects the company and our clients, and not getting into a violent confrontation with Cap and Esmeraude that will have causalities. Explaining what form that takes to Vos, and maybe counting on existing friendship / social capital to do so, comes later.

If Vos will need a justification that involves the protection of innocents, we have a whole ship full of innocent merchants in the balance right now who we've promised to protect.
>>
No. 120045 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/862536
That kind of depends on Ji having access to the OOC info that wasn't dumped in his head, or divining a heck of a lot pretty quickly from a frantic wave for the flier to land. :v

I figure a SD can sink the pirate ship around them, but I'd eat my hat if Esmeraude isn't mage armored, which means we're not killing them faster than she could make good on her threat to revoke our fire protection or attack the merchants.

But whatever, the dice have been rolled, we'll see what happens.

I would like a straightforward combat situation to just play tactics in without fundamental disagreements looming over it just once.
>>
No. 120046 ID: 094652

Can we use our recent fails to our advantage? Say that Hore takes an injury from falling out of the sky, and Ji half-drowns from Azmaranthine's overweight. Then Maru calls Esmeraude out for putting her impulsive usurpation over her "friends'" well being, and that she has a lot to learn before taking on a higher chain of responsibility.
>>
No. 120047 ID: 3abd97

>>120046
Maybe who knows!

One thing that also occurs to me is Ji wasn't explicitly mentioned anywhere in the last update, and he already rolled for a firebomb, so that might still be coming. :V
>>
No. 120048 ID: 20ea96

>>120045
>>120046
>>120047
I suppose we'll see how it turns out. But just so you know, if you make me choose, I will always pick a PC over an NPC. No question.
>>
No. 120049 ID: d36af7

>>120045
>I would like a straightforward combat situation to just play tactics in without fundamental disagreements looming over it just once.
Problem with this escort mission gig is you're up against random armies you can't take in a fair fight, so you keep needing to play powerful NPCs off against each other. More level-appropriate challenges, at least the ones I've got planned out in detail, are back down south on the frontier near Passholdt.

Fortunately I've got a possible solution to that larger issue in mind, which would also wrap up the more immediate conflict in a favorable way. Santova never actually cashed in that $50 miracle from back in September, and you've been contributing more than the minimum for questions too. Viste is currently in a generally stressful situation (combat, fire, betrayal), under the effects of a potion specifically chosen to overclock her portal-making ability, and aboard a ship which is in the process of suffering severe structural damage, one of the specific examples given for a context where an unstable frame of reference could cause portal mishaps.

She wants to intervene before it's too late, she wants to hold back and see how the situation develops, she wants to attack the remaining pirates, she wants to retreat to the merchant ship, she wants to go back to a home that no longer exists. Patient and direct, obvious and subtle.

My proposal is that she attempts to do all of these things at once, and makes a great big mess in the process. All three ships crash together and splash down inside the Passholdt Port Authority's secure perimeter. Bonuses for early arrival get wiped out by penalties for damage to the ship, Esmeraude and the pirates get dealt with by the same alarmingly competent people who handled Azure, Nick, and Rhea, the Fire Hawks have enough cash in the bank to cover rent for a few months, the company's founder is back in his lab where he can start reinventing high-level spells, and the active PCs can refocus on the room-by-room tactics of dungeon delving.

Sound good?
>>
No. 120052 ID: af6e04

I'm sorry, I didn't mean for this to blow up! Vos can just voice his concerns in-game when everybody meets up again. I didn't mean it as an ultimatum, Vos wouldn't leave you guys just for this one thing.

To be fair though, I drew the "don't be evil" line when I first made the character so you've had plenty of warning.

I'm kinda surprised that the goody-two-shoes paladin archetype would be such a source for party conflict, but on reflection it makes sense that the further you get from standard black and white "slay the orcs!" D&D the less likely you are to see players who want to be stereotypical good guys.

>the active PCs can refocus on the room-by-room tactics of dungeon delving.
I do enjoy the more diplomatic theme to the encounters we've had so far with the thread 6 group. It just seems like we often run into decision paralysis. I've already stated that I prefer dungeon delving, but we already have another group for that so I'm not particularly eager to send this group down the same road.
>>
No. 120060 ID: 3abd97

In general I don't have a problem with diplomatic solutions (in fact I seem to argue for them quite often) it's just we don't get the opportunity to cut lose with violence very often. So it was disappointing to plan up for what looked like a straightforward army fight only for them to crumple and be replaced with an awkward diplomatic situation where we can't agree what a good outcome is.

The escort mission has been a convenient plot device for encounters, but I wouldn't object to getting to choose our battles again. Even if we don't go right back to clearing a dungeon, there are other jobs we could be doing. (Although deciding on the next mission could be decision paralysis again. :v). And Esmeraude getting jailed does stop her being our problem while leaving her as a possible plot hook for later.

I guess my opinion would be I could accept that outcome, but it's something I'd want more than just me to sign off on player side.

If we do go through with some teleportation almost-disaster, how are we not leaving Vos behind, not exploding the magic garden, not leaving an expensive magical mess in the middle of the harbor we'd be billed for cleaning up, and getting around the LOS limitation?

>random armies you can't take in a fair fight, so you keep needing to play powerful NPCs off against each other
It's kind of hard for me to judge that. For instance, I clearly overestimated the level of resistance the pirates would be able to put up, and underestimated Esmeraude's odds of backstabbing us (a combination of giving her the chance to leave in Overmire and her reaffirming a desire to stick around, that I didn't realize how badly she wanted minions, and that a cheap means to deny terrain access completely changes the tactical situation) but it's hard for me to say, for instance, how this fight might have gone if we ambushed the pirates without exploiting fire resistance and flight.

>>120052
I'm fine with running a "good leaning" mercenary company, I was just confused and frustrated with the line of "good" being drawn at "not letting pirates escape under threat of significant consequences if we don't" and "not being allowed to spin a defeat". I can get why Vos wouldn't want to be associated with an immoral act, the bar for that just feels pretty high to me.
>>
No. 120076 ID: d36af7

>>120060
>If we do go through with some teleportation almost-disaster, how are we not leaving Vos behind,
He's already heading for your last known / projected location, could reasonably notice the portal-mess and slip through before it closed.
>not exploding the magic garden,
Sanctums with door-sized entrances are sturdier than extradimensional spaces optimized for portability. It's like the difference between a wooden crate, or even a corrugated steel shipping container, and a mylar balloon. Even then, Bags of Holding can pass through a portal intact, it's mostly dangerous for whoever's carrying them at the time, as Vos demonstrated - though with two or more at once, they're liable to damage each other.
>not leaving an expensive magical mess in the middle of the harbor we'd be billed for cleaning up,
Cleanup costs could also come out of the early-completion bonus, and Azarthraine could put some sweat-equity into the relevant ritual magic since, even without ready-to-cast spells, he knows more about the subject than most. Spatial anomalies out in the open air (and/or water), where moonlight can shine all across and through them, also tend to be naturally resolved much more quickly and smoothly than those which are embedded in the ground, among dense forest, or otherwise under opaque cover, or those which have time to congeal due to forming during a waning-crescent or new moon phase. For best results, you should arrive a little ways above the harbor, though there'd be a delicate balance between damage to the fabric of space and damage to the ship's hull from falling.
>and getting around the LOS limitation?
By someone having OOC paid for a miracle, which is like a cataclysm but tidier. That would also contribute significantly to those other issues.
>>
No. 120081 ID: 3d2d5f

>though with two or more at once, they're liable to damage each other.
Hmm with quiver and door we do have at least two in play. Possibly more if there's any on either pirate ship.

That said I don't see anyone else clamoring in support for this idea and Santova was pretty clear about not wanting to spend that miracle so I guess we're playing this as it lies.

>>/quest/862949
I'd complain about butting in ruining my diplomacy, but poor Hore rolled that before I ever opened my mouth. :v

At least Cap showed restraint with dealing with Hore.

Also Ji's regeneration is going to pay off already!
>>
No. 120108 ID: d36af7

Having survived an essentially one-on-one duel with 'cap,' Hore Wutashi will be level 4 next time she gets a good night's sleep, and as such can take one new utility wild talent of the first or second circle. Doesn't necessarily need to be fire-based, but it does need to have some justification as a technological result of an implanted plasma pistol and/or decrepit medical nanotech. However, having lost said duel, and chosen to submit, she's probably going to be stuck as "Esmeraude's favorite toy" until somebody else intervenes.

As a side note, if/when we use the GURPS Mass Combat rules in more detail, I'll probably be resolving this sort of surprise incendiary bombardment using the rules for chemical weapons: unprotected forces, such as those of lower TL or with inadequate gear, take 40% casualties before the battle starts, including a correspondingly brutal Misfortunes of War roll for any significant characters. Then, disruption imposes a further -2 to strategy rolls. Units with the 'sealed' feature, such as siege-rated golems, never take casualties from chemical warfare because they're designed for routine operation in extremely hostile environments, but a large scale attack can still be disruptive.

Cataclysms will be resolved like nukes: the unprepared target of a unilateral strike is destroyed outright, or at least rendered largely helpless. If both sides of a conflict are hit, units with the Sealed feature take 40% casualties, everybody else loses 90%, including any logistical forces in the area.
>>
No. 120115 ID: 094652

>>120108
Level 4 yaaay
"Esmeraude's Favorite Toy" thing isn't that big a deal, she's suffered the same level of pleasurable indignity from Azure. But Maru had better talk Esmeraude out of it by the end of the mission.

>1st or 2nd circle spell, can be non-fire but must have justification
The two main spells I'm looking into are Living Capacitor and No Breath, but with a few modifications. Let me know if this isn't allowed.

Living Capacitor: Hore's biochemically-powered capacitor was fried by the death ray, and she has been having trouble bringing it back up to speed. But recently, she has had some success with the few cells that were relatively unharmed, and has salvaged her capacitor to perform basic electrical taser attacks. Hore gains the additional effect of slowly building up her personal charge over time, and thanks to her understanding of electricity can apply this safely to any weapon with metal connecting the handle to the part that goes in your enemy, but suffers a significant penalty of a REALLY small maximum capacity and receiving only 1/4th of the charge from electric damage she suffers, due to the capacitor's small size, which will need to be restored with money or time (higher levels).

No Breath: Hore's augmentations aren't all metal and electricity. Something has been growing in her lungs - a re-breather. Hore's version of No Breath only works when her biochemical power supply is active, scrubbing out the carbon dioxide and disposing of it by 'sweating air'. She breathes normally if her augmentations are damaged, and can choose to breathe in healing vapors.
>>
No. 120116 ID: 3abd97

>she's probably going to be stuck as "Esmeraude's favorite toy" until somebody else intervenes
If Esmeraude's going to be sticking around and approval is so important to her, I was thinking Dav was going to have to start keeping her on a shorter leash and offering more positive or negative reinforcement as needed. If there are clearer boundaries and she has opportunities for validation doing things we approve of / that benefit us maybe we can expect less acting out.

Rewarding that last mess with a "toy" might be kind of counter productive to this approach.

>>/quest/863041
Didn't bring this up in-thread because I doubt there's going to be much support for bringing another risky asset into the mix, but Esmeraude has money in-pocket sufficient to hire a longship and crew?
>>
No. 120128 ID: d36af7

>>120115
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/occult-adventures/occult-classes/kineticist/utility-wild-talents/
Air Shroud seems close enough to the second one. Let's say something about having almost been decapitated brought Hore's respirocytes back online, and some rare metals (bought in Overmire and/or absorbed from the blade of that scimitar) enabled repair of electrolytic catalysts. A tiny device connected to Hore's bloodstream can now crack water into hydrogen and oxygen, and store considerable quantities of that oxygen, and thus she now treats lack of breathable air as dehydration rather than suffocation.

She could survive indefinitely under the surface of water, even if it's too deoxygenated or toxic for fish, since she's "drinking (with a filter)" rather than "breathing" it, though excess CO2 and hydrogen will be vented as stealth-defeating bubbles. Reserves and electrolysis of water from her own bloodstream could last for days under a lake of oil, or while lost in an oxygen-free desert, or even allow her to remain alive and partly conscious for hours as a severed head.

This system can be overclocked to extend similar protection to others for a few minutes at a time. Excessively hot or cold water, crushing pressure, hard vacuum, and "drinking" salt water or sufficiently nasty sludge could still cause problems unrelated to air supply. No protection is provided against poisonous gas in breathable air unless you remember to hold your breath.

>>120116
>Rewarding that last mess with a "toy" might be kind of counter productive to this approach.
How are you planning to separate the man in the ochre coat from a captive, one which he took in more-or-less honorable defense of his liege-lady? Traditional options include challenging him to a duel, or some other contest of tactical skill with appropriate stakes, or paying ransom proportionate to the captive's annual income.

>Esmeraude has money in-pocket sufficient to hire a longship and crew?
She's been implying otherwise, as recently as shopping in Overmire, but has never actually given an exact accounting of her finances, nor had her personal effects thoroughly searched. Her captain only got a bungled pat-down from Vos back in Thread 5, so he could easily have a purse tucked away somewhere. Or more top-shelf magical healing potions! Those are worth about ten times their weight in gold, particularly to the sort of people who regularly go on violent adventures far from home without caster support. Or, Esmeraude could be intending to pay with her own magic, or even saying that reflexively in response to mom-voice without any real plan.
>>
No. 120129 ID: 3abd97

>How are you planning to separate the man in the ochre coat from a captive, one which he took in more-or-less honorable defense of his liege-lady? Traditional options include challenging him to a duel, or some other contest of tactical skill with appropriate stakes, or paying ransom proportionate to the captive's annual income.
I mean it's a sort of moot point until we've first passed the hurdle of how we've settled him going anywhere near our clients without either the bindings restored or some other compromise / assurances, but could be possibilities along the line of:

-His liege lady wasn't attacked. She caused a friendly fire incident when she cut off her flight spell and accidentally dropped Hore on herself.
-Chain of command / custody. His prisoner is Esmeraude's is mine.
-Prisoner exchange and/or debt. We bought him out of the clink, and he was very recently our fairly taken prisoner. Allowing him his freedom could be fair for him allowing Hore's.
-Lean on Esmeraude as I probably have stronger leverage through her than on him directly.
>>
No. 120134 ID: 20ea96

>>120116
>If Esmeraude's going to be sticking around
Really wish that weren't the case, though admittedly there's not much I can do about it with everyone else so much in love with these two npcs. I will say, however, that I'm not a big fan of the age-old trope of being betrayed, severely injured, and partially robbed by an "ally" with no real moral structure, and then immediately turning around and forgiving them and welcoming them back aboard the crew as soon as they throw the puppy dog eyes around. She even kidnapped a party member as a sex slave, for god's sake. This sort of nonsense is exactly why I'm of the opinion Good characters are just as difficult to work with as Evil characters. No common sense or self-preservation.

I'm hoping next time she gets a good opportunity to betray us (and naturally, immediately takes it without a second thought), we won't have any ooc questions left to catch it prematurely and she'll actually be able to sail away into the horizon, so we only have to be betrayed twice by the same person instead of three or more times.
>>
No. 120135 ID: af6e04

>everyone else so much in love with these two npcs
Hey, Vos has been ready to dump them for a while too. What I was really trying to get at with that big dumb argument I started is that Esmeraude and Cap have far passed the line where I think we can trust or forgive them. At this point it almost feels like we're just letting them walk all over us.

>At least Cap showed restraint with dealing with Hore.
I would not call that restraint, in fact...

>She even kidnapped a party member as a sex slave
If the eelman were present he would have immediately jumped in and tried to kill cap. In fact, to me it seems like unmitigated gall for the cap to take Hore as a "toy" and refuse to go back into immediate binding and NOT expect a full-on fight. It almost feels like Davina will make just about any concession to keep in good graces with the two.
>>
No. 120138 ID: af6e04

More rants from the peanut gallery, and I know that I've been put on a bus for this encounter, but it's kind of frustrating to see a fellow PC caused injury and humiliation by somebody who only has the freedom he does because of our mercy and goodwill. And being the only one willing to stand up for Hore, I'm not present to do so. I know it's the nature of the game and I'm not ranting about the events unfolding the way they did, I think I just need an outlet for this at the moment. (deep breaths!)
>>
No. 120146 ID: 3abd97

>immediately turning around and forgiving them and welcoming them back aboard the crew as soon as they throw the puppy dog eyes around. She even kidnapped a party member as a sex slave, for god's sake
This is a point I was trying to make. Esmeraude is on thin frigging ice right now, and is going to be on a short leash if she's tolerated at all. Hore wasn't captured in honorable combat- she was grabbed when Esmeraude and Cap dried to desert mid op.

There's few sane commanders that would immediately restore said deserters to previous levels of trust and responsibility right after catching them, and I think none that would allow said deserters to remain custody of their own allies attacked and subdued as part of their desertion attempt. Releasing said prisoners and submitting to the chain of command is a bare minimum requirement of overcoming their attempted desertion. And then there needs to be additional restrictions until they've earned some semblance of trust back. Full Stop.

I'll get to an IC post at some point, it seems like I have at least 3 different things to roll for.

>restraint
I was referring to the fact he didn't just kill her, and I made that particular offhand comment before this latest ridiculous sex-slave scenario was presented OOC.

>It almost feels like Davina will make just about any concession to keep in good graces with the two.
I've got a few pressing in-character concerns, here.

The first is a desire to avoid a violent conflict in this moment because the two of them are high level characters and there's little to no chance we could put them down in a fight before we took some significant causality, or one or both of them was able to damage the merchants we're supposed to be protecting. Preventing them from escaping or inconveniencing us is not worth blowing the entire job.

Second concern. Remember how we were all drawing lines in the sand due to our ambitions? Esmeraude's got what is a one-of-a-kind significant solution to Davina's high and low ambition. So if there's an option to take her alive, or leave her accessible in the world for later, or turn her into a prisoner, versus killing her with excessive force? Boy fucking howdy is it in Davina's interests to let her live. And I'll just point out the other PCs know what Davina's endgame is, and what Esmeraude is offering her. So maybe consider how badly you're willing to fuck over your friend the next time you want to reduce an annoying dragon girl to a fine powder. And how said friend might react if you succeed.

Third concern: this current ridiculous slave scenario is currently OOC in the middle of the burning pirate ship because Dav has no sane reason to expect this patently ridiculous demand.

>Good characters are just as difficult to work with as Evil characters.
If we're going by DnD alignments, I don't think Dav's either. :v
>>
No. 120151 ID: d36af7

>>120146
>the two of them are high-level characters
More like mid-level, by the usual D&D scale. A 9th level fighter (with demonic buffs) and a sorcerer 5 /dragon disciple 3.

Azarthraine is a 15th level wizard - with a limited spell selection at the moment, true, but those few were carefully chosen for their potential utility in capturing people alive and/ or breaking out of such captivity. Transmute Iron to Lead, for example, is incredibly useful for rapid low-temperature fabrication or modification of gates, cages, and other blacksmithing work. Field-expedient shackles: take a piece of iron bar stock, transmute it to lead, tie it in a knot around the prisoner's wrists, and transmute it back to iron.

There are other mid-to-high level NPCs in the setting who could potentially solve this problem for you, particularly if they were being paid to do so, or it presented a threat to their interests in some way that wasn't obviously your fault.

>So if there's an option to take her alive, or leave her accessible in the world for later, or turn her into a prisoner, versus killing her with excessive force?
In a setting with back-from-the-dead magic that's not consistently contingent on the consent of the deceased, killing someone is not the same as rendering their unique knowledge permanently inaccessible.
>ridiculous slave scenario
If I'm taking things too far and making anybody OOC uncomfortable, please let me know. The man in the ochre coat is absolutely meant to be unrepentantly evil.

Even Esmeraude herself doesn't really like him as a person. If it was just down to personal taste, she'd avoid him 'cause he's mean and he smells bad. But he's got skills that she needs, and his loyalty to her is beyond reproach, which has so far been enough to justify the costs of keeping him around, at least in her mind.

>>120138
>put on a bus for this encounter
It would be entirely plausible for Vos to show up at this point, now that the high-speed action is over and mopping up and shouting has begun. https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2001-10-28
>>
No. 120155 ID: 3d2d5f

>death not permanent
Sure, and there's a line where having her dead until I want the info is acceptable, but not having to pay for an expensive res if she can be contained by lesser means is vastly preferable up until she crosses it.

I gave that specific example in light of Ji's disintegration attempt. A complete lack of remains to work with would be particularly pricey to reverse, as I unstand it.

Worse, if she somehow finds an afterlife she's happy with before then.

>other NPCs
If the lizard wizard wants to add his disapproving stare to this acting out and threatening company interests mid-operation he's welcome to.

>If I'm taking things too far and making anybody OOC uncomfortable
Personally I'm not OOC uncomfortable. I'm just flabbergasted that "cease your rebellion and submit to my authority or gtfo" "yes'm!" is being followed by "it's totally cool if we keep your subordinate that tried to stop me as a slave, right?" as somehow logical.

Hore might have yielded to Cap, but his mistress just yielded the field.
>>
No. 120156 ID: 20ea96

>>120155
>Ji's disintegration attempt
Trust me, if Yisheng Ji had the power of Supreme Disintegration at his fingertips instead of having to cajole Azarthraine into using it every time, Cap would not make it to the end of the day, and Esmeraude would, at the very least, cease to have any bargaining chips. Keep her alive if you must, but not as an ally. She cannot be considered an ally after today's events.

>>120146
>Davina's high and low ambition
As long as you're playing that card, I'll remind you Yisheng Ji's high ambition is living forever, and keeping these two around isn't doing anyone any favors on that front.

>>120138
>the only one willing to stand up for Hore
I actually had a plan drafted for holding the ship hostage (threatening to sink it with Azarthraine) in exchange for Hore's safe return, but it seems Davina will be wresting her out of Esmeraude's hands in a minute here anyway, so we'll see how it pans out.
>>
No. 120159 ID: 3d2d5f

>>120156
It's fine to follow your character's motivations, I just felt a frustrating need to make my interests blatantly clear after what feels like a pattern of being expected to accommodate everyone else's needs in company-wide strategic planning, and smooth over conflicts of interest when they arise, while it seemingly goes forgotten that I got a skin in things too.

Especially when Vos' needs went and framed the entire encounter when he wasn't even present. Or with how often people have interests that aren't aligned with getting the job we're being paid for done.

>ally
She was never an ally, she was an asset whose levers were insufficiently understood.
>>
No. 120166 ID: 094652

>>/quest/863576
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oUsEWkAGGU X 10

This isn't good. IC, Hore figures Esmeraude is on the verge of a nuclear meltdown (Hore's dump stat is still Charisma, but she has known Azure and Pog for years and their bond is similar to Esmeraude's and Cap's), and the pirates are now an ace card in Esmeraude's favor. Someone needs to talk her down, and fast, and everyone else still needs to keep the pirates from going back to aggression, especially since one of them nearly got hit with another disintegration ray. OOC is the demon in the snake scimitar now or something?

BTW didn't know Azarthraine could triplecast a 6th-circle disintegration. What is that, Tier 8 magic?
>>
No. 120168 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/863576
Okay, now that was a satisfying resolution!

>Dog-face is one of ours, right?
Um. We might want to make sure the all the new Fire Hawks get enough face time with Azarthraine to avoid any friendly fire incidents in the future.

>>120166
>the pirates are now an ace card
They're pretty much already interested in getting the heck out of here, and after two very impressive displays of violence, I don't think they're going to fight us if we give them a choice in the matter.

>Someone needs to talk her down
Davina already did, and her speaking softly got punctuated by a very big stick. Esmeraude could react with violence or by running now, but she's a lot less of a threat on her own, and she's probably terrified for her life right now.

>is the demon in the snake scimitar now or something?
>>/questarch/805987
>He claims [...] it was a type of earthbound demon called 'raktavarna' which can disguise itself as a bejeweled weapon or art object (in order to infiltrate treasure hoards), secrete memory-stealing poison, and share it's senses with a distant master.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/rakshasa/rakshasa-raktavarna/
We weren't sure if he was bullshitting at the time, but it would appear Cap wasn't lying about his sword. It's possible it might be Esmeraude's familiar too?

>BTW didn't know Azarthraine could triplecast a 6th-circle disintegration. What is that, Tier 8 magic?
We knew he had Supreme Disintegration, I don't think we know exactly how that differs from sourcebook disintegrate. I don't now if the rapid triple cast is just skill or a feat of some kind. Rapid fire certainly does make punching through mage armor much less of a problem if you're willing to burn those high level slots.
>>
No. 120170 ID: 094652

Are we using the "Gain 1 HP or 1 Non-Class Feat Per Level" rule?

If so, I'm wondering if Azure should develop her talents by selecting high-level abnormal charismatic feats, or just increase her HP because every hit point counts for her frail body. I have a list of general feats that Hore and Azure could invest for.
>>
No. 120178 ID: af6e04

Hahaha go Azarthraine!

I apologize magey, I guess I was mistaken and thought you were planning on letting those two off the hook easy again and it ruffled my gills a bit.

>but it would appear Cap wasn't lying about his sword.
Haha well I'll be, there WAS some truth to what the cap said back at Eckton.

>didn't know Azarthraine could triplecast a 6th-circle disintegration
If I could wager a guess I'd say it was just three separate combat rounds. Cap probably didn't retaliate cause he was spending his turn focusing on active defenses per GURPS rules.

Though I like to wonder (I'm sure JamesLeng has already put thought into this) what exactly passing your fortitude save entails such that it reduces the damage so significantly.

Also thought I'd mention while I'm here. I haven't forgotten about your art request and should have time to work on it now. (past week or so has been a flood of insanity involving a broken water heater and literal flooding)
>>
No. 120180 ID: d36af7

>>120178
>Cap probably didn't retaliate cause he was spending his turn focusing on active defenses per GURPS rules.
The concept isn't exactly unique to GURPS https://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat/#TOC-Total-Defense
>(I'm sure JamesLeng has already put thought into this)
Correct.
>what exactly passing your fortitude save entails such that it reduces the damage so significantly.
Supreme Disintegration doesn't cause damage the same way a blade or bullet or laser or caustic chemical does. It's an energy virus, more nearly comparable to a 'core leech' from the Unsounded setting, or Stardestroyer.net's theories on the mechanism behind Star Trek phasers. Passing the save means some aspect of your metaphysical biology thwarted the infection/chain reaction before it got too exponential. Failing the save but somehow surviving anyway means the virus hit it's replication limit and burned out without eating enough of you to cause overall structural failure, most likely meaning you're either powerful enough to be a credible minor god, or massive and sessile enough to qualify as an aid to navigation - or at least, you were. Things which can take a hit like that, right on the chin, and then be ready for another without at least a full day's rest, are rare indeed.

It would be fairly straightforward, in theory, to create a variant without replication limit, capable of taking out entire tectonic plates in one shot. In all of modern recorded history, nobody has ever simultaneously been smart enough to figure out how to do that and stupid enough to actually try it... which is not to say it's never been done, just that experiments were apparently so successful as to effectively excise themselves from the historical record.
>>
No. 120194 ID: 67456a

Uh, hi.

So, it's been... god, half a year now? Something like that?

I'm not gonna sit here and make a bunch of excuses about why I disappeared off the face of the planet. I've been catching up on events while I was gone, though I'm still not 100% sure of the specifics.

And, uh, if you guys would have me back, I'd be pretty thrilled?
>>
No. 120196 ID: 3abd97

>>120194
Hey welcome back!

The party's been doing a merchant-ship based escort mission for a while, and Maria and Daniel are still with them, so it would be pretty easy to just jump right back into things if you were so inclined.

If you want to jump right in on the current encounter, we just lit a bunch of pirates on fire, got the survivors to decide they were quite better off not fighting us, disintegrated one NPC who tried to betray us, and rendered another NPC catatonic at the sight of that.

If you don't have time to read all the backlog, feel free to ask questions, or we can throw together a cliff notes of important stuff that cropped up in your absence.

Also we recently got paid for the first leg of the journey and spent time shopping in a big city. We left it sorta vague what the PCs turned NPCs bought (I think best guess was defensive upgrades and/or gold to xp conversion) so if you wanted to retroactively offer input on what Maria and Daniel might have gone shopping for with 50 gold each you probably can.
>>
No. 120197 ID: 3abd97

>>120178
Yeah, I apologize for being a jerk myself.

Trying to find a balance between killing everyone and compromise / punishment is tricky when the npcs go and take a mile before you even offer them an inch! :v

It also seems I overestimated the pirates and Cap in this encounter. Hmm.
>>
No. 120199 ID: af6e04

>>120194
We've been keeping your spot warm for you in hopes you'd come back! You can jump right in, no need to read all that backlog.

In the other thread Malkov was rescued by Wendy and my newest character Nistamatsin but there were complications...
>>/questarch/806017
>>/questarch/814892
>>/questarch/815229

There was an awesome moment where he saved us all from a vampire mist. I gave him his face back after this.
>>/questarch/823598

Things got a little weird after this point, but we escaped the dungeon and your characters have presumably been hanging out in the town nearby.
>>
No. 120201 ID: 67456a

Honestly, it's funny. I had just kinda come up with this character/deity concept, it got me thinking about this again, and... well, it turns out I REALLY missed playing with you guys.

So, as a peace offering, have a rare piece of footage of Malkov during his Adam's Lament training.

https://youtu.be/6boLnLYmwk4
>>
No. 120204 ID: 3abd97

>>120199
Ah, whups, I forgot about Malkov and Wendy being with the second party!

>>120201
The nice thing about play by post is that people can drift in and out as schedules allow. And if you've got new character ideas, feel free to share them. There's already been more characters planned out than put into play.

>>/quest/863817
Maria is entitled to be super smug, since she raised objections about trusting Cap and Esmeraude in the planning stage of this encounter.

>>/quest/863756
Pfffff. My characters are two for two for ending up unintentionally naked now.
>>
No. 120205 ID: 67456a

>>120204
Well, initially, it was a completely unrelated character who essentially fought cults through infiltrating them, getting in good graces with everyone, figuring out weak links in the organizational chain or vital plans, and then destroying them. They also had the ability to conjure "black ice" as armor that was essentially "externalized sin".

Then I realized that was literally the opposite of Agatia's powerset and way of doing things and I got ideas.
>>
No. 120216 ID: af6e04

Haha, well those are some weird rolls to have back to back
>>
No. 120218 ID: d8c426

Well, I think I've sorta solidified some details about Sin Ice Man.

Known as Rubius, he was actually the twin brother of Agatia back when they were still mortal. They were both deeply religious, and both took to the destruction of Evil in their own ways.

Agatia, as has previously been established, wielded the ability to burn away sins and impurities through her Pearl Flame. Rubius, meanwhile, could externalize his sins as Ebon Frost, essentially a magical substance that happened to share the solidity and cold of real ice.

Unlike his sister's singleminded devotion to burning things to ashes, Rubius took a "strike the roots" approach. He'd infiltrate societies and cults, set about making connections and ingratiating himself, and the moment he was in deep enough he'd wait for a critical opening and strike with surgical precision. Assassinating leaders, sabotaging demon summonings, tipping off the authorities, whatever worked.

Nobody's entirely sure what actually happened to him. It's known he became a god as his sister did, but the details are vague. He has both living descendants and those he's blessed with the ability to command the Ebon Frost, and it doesn't seem like he's dead or anything.

Most members of what are now known as the Ruby bloodline have a... complex relationship with the Agates. Each side treats the other with detached coldness, like an uncle with a drinking problem you refuse to talk about unless prodded into doing so. There's no outright hostilities, of course, but they don't usually get along.

Of course, maybe this is terrible, and there's probably some piece of it or another that defies the setting, but this is what I've got so far.
>>
No. 120248 ID: d36af7

>>120218
>Of course, maybe this is terrible, and there's probably some piece of it or another that defies the setting, but this is what I've got so far.
Looks alright to me, at least initially. Not on my best brain at the moment. Might need to take a day or two to gather my thoughts before further quest updates.

Until then, ponder http://sailormoon.wikia.com/wiki/Rubeus and http://sailormoon.wikia.com/wiki/Esmeraude_(anime) particularly here https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?524702-IWIW-Sailor-Moon-(Part-5!)-R-continues-Hideous-Laughing-Woman-Stri
kes!&p=12578928#post12578928 I'd like to emphasize that this wasn't my sole inspiration for the character, but, just in case the name wasn't enough of a clue, it's certainly been a major factor.
>>
No. 120252 ID: af6e04

>>120218
It seems interesting! Are you planning on making a new character or picking back up with the ones you created in thread 4?
>>
No. 120253 ID: 67456a

>>120252
I'm sticking with my current group, I think. This was more just something I came up with on a whim, really.
>>
No. 120269 ID: 3abd97

>>120253
It could be used as a template for a rival Maria might run into one day. Although if the ice-cousins operate via stealth and infiltration, we're probably most likely to see one if we stumble right into one of their ongoing operations and mess it up with our heavier handed approach.
>>
No. 120291 ID: 094652

>>/quest/864254
Actually, I'm not clear on whether or not the team members on shopping leave have come back. Azure and Pog are ready for another delve, but if they're in town I'd rather focus on buying all the necessary supplies.
>>
No. 120292 ID: 3abd97

>>120291
I think they already came back- that's why we had yurts to sleep in. Hopefully they bought some supplies so Rhea can keep everyone fed too.
>>
No. 120293 ID: 3abd97

>consistent with the sudden-and-possibly-permanent loss of a valued companion
I don't think any of us would be interested in making the attempt, but I assume reviving Cap would be something of a complicated problem, even ignoring the lack of a body to work with.

If he was possessed, I assume that would mean his personality is something of a gestalt? Man and demon influencing and feeding back into each other over years? So to restore him you'd need to revive the man, resummon the same demon, and reapply the same binding or contract was originally used.

I suppose if the demon had fully supplanted the original owner of the body it might take just summoning him to a new host. Or maybe if the spiritual grooves were deep enough you could revive the man without imposing the demon on him. Or the demon wouldn't require the original bindings being reapplied.
>>
No. 120305 ID: 094652

>>/quest/864449
Just when I think I should make a damn roll instead of letting Azure sit in the back like a background NPC and not gain exp... oh well.

Incidentally, assuming we always maximize skill ranks for whatever we're using, at what levels will a high roll be a success because the corresponding skill for that roll is that high?

... Actually, what skill point system are we using? GURPS, Pathfinder, or something else entirely? I just acted like we were using Pathfinder rules for stats and GURPS rules for dice rolls.
>>
No. 120334 ID: d36af7

>>120305
Azure's action was... sort of a vague "me too" thing, though. Jalkaren doesn't have any directly useful information about the subterrene which she hasn't already shared, and the rest of it was just generically checking Nin's work. You didn't even express any preference among the various options Nin and Rhea raised for what to do next.
>at what levels will a high roll be a success because the corresponding skill for that roll is that high?
Effective skill is modified according to circumstance, and the difficulty of the task being attempted. Even at first level, there can be tasks where a roll of 16 or less succeeds, but I still want you to roll because of time pressure or something important at stake.
>>
No. 120390 ID: 094652

... Could I have Hore enroll in Finishing School?

Okay but seriously, what can I have Hore do in her spare time while the only party members who aren't disgusted with her in some way are busy helping Esmeraude shape up?

If I install the Air Bubble wild talent (with a special mod to survive decapitation for a few hours), Hore could babysit the octowasps and search for treasure. Or I could install the electric discharge wild talent and Hore could work on fixing her broken capacitor cells. The former seems more plausible and enticing for finding loot.
>>
No. 120392 ID: d36af7

https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/perspective-3
This reminded me. That discussion about the geometry and interconnection of the Old Gods? They haven't always been laid out the same way. In my timeline notes, there are multiple events where the whole layout got dramatically shuffled around. There's a nearby NPC who could describe three of those events from a perspective of firsthand knowledge, and might be willing to do so in gratitude for rescue from a current predicament, or, if you're feeling less benevolent, under threat of violence. One of the Thread 7 PCs has already been advised to investigate the predicament in question, and everybody in Zelkor's Ferry knows most of the relevant facts, though none have yet recognized one half of the trap as relevant to the other.
>>
No. 120394 ID: d36af7

>>120390
>what can I have Hore do
The company's actual paying job, standing watch to guard the ship? There's going to be lots more random encounters on the way back, I've just been stalling on figuring out the next one.
>>
No. 120402 ID: 3abd97

>>120390
>... Could I have Hore enroll in Finishing School?
If you mean "can Hore contribute to the reform / groom / therapy-ize Esmeraude", maybe? Depends on what you want to try and how. OOC, it doesn't really seem to me like Hore has the best skillset for it, and IC you'd have to get around Davina. Who's basically decided a soft approach isn't working and she needs to take control of the situation if she wants Esmeraude alive long enough to be useful to her. Sorry to shut you out there, just trying to play my character being aggressive in looking after her own interests.

Dav's opinion of Hore has improved since the first thread, but as she doesn't come from a background where any of Hore's technobabble makes sense, and plans Hore suggest generally come across as nonsensical to her, she pretty much thinks Hore's a lunatic. A loyal one, who stands by her allies and can be surprisingly useful at time, but still a crazy person.

If you mean "could Hore attempt to educate herself or change her behavior to be less off putting to certain people", well you could. OOC I wouldn't really recommend trying to drastically change your character to impress mine, but it's up to you to decide how Hore grows!

>spare time
>The company's actual paying job, standing watch to guard the ship?
Well in between actual mission related stuff (keeping watch, scouting, scanning, keeping gear maintained, etc), there's probably offscreen relationship building with PCs and NPCs, working on personal projects, relaxing in or helping out with the magic garden.

Honestly part of the reason Dav can even consider devoting a lot of time on a side project is (a) making an asset trustworthy / reliable is sort of security important and (b) she has enough allies assisting with the actual job that she can afford the time.

>>120392
Oh, are you talking about the lake the Gug advised Rhea to look into? How far is that from our new base of operations?
>>
No. 120405 ID: af6e04

>what can I have Hore do in her spare time while the only party members who aren't disgusted with her in some way are busy helping Esmeraude shape up?
Vos is still probably going to have a lot of free time to hang out with Hore. I mean, we literally have nothing else to do but sit around and make sure the ship doesn't sink.
>>
No. 120573 ID: 094652

So how long should we wait for the next update?
>>
No. 120579 ID: 3d2d5f

>>120573
As long as it takes?

Maybe take a look at this to tide you over? >>/quest/865044 Exalted has a lot less in the way of limits and your frenetic style of character creation might have room to soar.
>>
No. 120618 ID: 094652

>>120579
I thought JL was doing a Homestuck parody!

I posted one of my custom characters for PDN[T]TO, she wasn't going to take to the field any time soon.
>>
No. 120635 ID: d36af7

>>120618
>Homestuck parody
I apologize, again, for the limitations of my visual-art resources. I can't remember where I originally found that picture, it's just there as an illustration of the fan-invented GSP caste marks which I prefer over the canonical ones.

Also, I don't think it's really possible to parody Homestuck. Andrew Hussie did that too well already.

>>120579
>>120573
Planning to update Pdn[T]tO thread 6 with the next random encounter next. Maybe tomorrow? Had an unpleasantly busy day today.
>>
No. 120637 ID: 3abd97

>>120635
No pressure on the update, looking forward to it when you're up to it.
>>
No. 120641 ID: d36af7

>>120637
While you're all waiting, maybe update the wiki? Lot of red 'TODO' headings there and at least one new PC missing.
>>
No. 120702 ID: d36af7

Current housing situation seems to have entered the 'accelerated final collapse' phase. Yelling and lawyers and so on. Might not have to leave for a month or two yet, but we definitely can't stay. Wife and I have an adequate amount of money in the bank for cross-country bus fare, hotels, hell maybe even a mortgage down payment, plus her SSD income, but we haven't quite got a new place lined up. Might be somewhere available for us near Seattle, HUD subsidized, in spring or summer, but that's not guaranteed.

Is Santova still around, and is that offer still open? Do I have any other fans in the continental US or southern Canada who could spare a room? My wife and I are very quiet, we clean up after ourselves, don't use drugs, and always pay rent on time, no excuses. The one occasion it's ever been late was some sort of internal error with the bank's direct deposit system, sorted out the same day I learned of it.

Obviously I won't have much time or energy for quest updates until I have somewhere to live.
>>
No. 120706 ID: af6e04

>>120702
I'm really sorry to hear that. I would absolutely help if I could, but I'm living in a trashy little studio apartment with barely enough room for myself. I sincerely hope everything works out okay for you.
>>
No. 120737 ID: 3abd97

>>120702
I regret I don't have anything to offer you but well wishes. Absolutely put your own well being ahead of the game, and I hope you land on your feet.

>>120641
I'll try and make some progress on this while you're distracted.
>>
No. 120738 ID: fc3fc0

Hey guys. Obviously haven't posted in a while. Probably won't reply for a while longer. Feel free to take whatever liberties you want with my characters. If I can come back to the game in the future, I can always make new characters. You have my full permission to do whatever the fuck you'd like on that front.

JamesLeng and I are currently discussing housing stuff. It's a private matter, so I don't want to divulge any details, but the hope is that the current situation will transition into something better soon. If JamesLeng wants to elaborate on they matter, that's his prerogative. I have nothing to hide, I simply don't want to give away other's life details.

If it counts, as long as I still get questions from monthly donations (and can still afford to donate an amount that awards them), I bequeath them to Magey. Haven't been using them anyways.

Uh, also, it's like not anyones fault in the thread that I'm not currently participating. If I come back I'll be happy to play with you guys more. Thanks for making memories with me and all that jazz. Best wishes, stay well, have fun. Also, from a cursory glance, it seems like you didn't use the miracle. I wouldn't be terribly upset, but I appreciate you all respecting my previous decision, as it was intended to be a gift rather than a purchase. So thanks for bein cool.

If anyone gets the urge to contact me outside the game, let me know and I can give out contact info.
>>
No. 120739 ID: 094652

>>120702
Well, I hope you transition smoothly. Checking up on these games is pretty much a part of my daily routine now. So thanks for a whole year of entertainment.

Guess I'll go back to video games for the moment, but do you expect this hiatus to be less than a month or don't-hold-your-breath freaking long?
>>
No. 120750 ID: fc3fc0

I don't speak for jamesLeng, and can't say with any kind of veracity backing it up, but I would guess it's a "don't hold your breath" deal.
>>
No. 120751 ID: fc3fc0

I don't speak for jamesLeng, and can't say with any kind of veracity backing it up, but I would guess it's a "don't hold your breath" deal.
>>
No. 120755 ID: af6e04

>>120738
I'm glad to hear from you again Santova! I hope you're doing alright.

I'm sad to see things come to a halt like this. You're all a good group and I'd rather not lose contact with any of you. You can get hold of me at maplerosy at gmail and I have a tumblr and discord if anybody wants to add me there.
>>
No. 120756 ID: d36af7

>>120739
I'm not sure exactly how long this housing thing will take to settle. Two months seems plausible? I might have enough spare time and energy to post useful content before then, either simple stuff I can do without juggling a lot of variables, or by constructing incrementally with meticulous notes, but don't expect particularly quick turnaround or elaborate new plot twists until I sound the all-clear. I love this stuff, it's a big part of how I relax, so I won't be disappearing completely.

Speaking of meticulous notes, your new additions to the wiki seem mostly reasonable apart from the description of the Bloodmist Labyrinth itself, which contains numerous errors. "Moss dogs" were discussed previously. Mordnaissants don't even have properly developed eyes, and instead fire death rays from their umbilical cords. There's more than one wandering monster which could be described as a blob, of which the largest types so far encountered were all much smaller than anything that could reasonably be described as a house, except for Empty Sweepers, which at a thousand cubic feet are comparable to a modest single-room dwelling, but one of those can't usefully be referred to as "bloody" when it's usually the only non-blood-colored thing in a given hall or room. The chessboard puzzle is simply one room among many, not close to any actual entrance or exit. It served as the starting point for new PCs because it's an obvious point where someone who was lost would need to slow down and think, rather than simply picking a door and continuing to move forward, and for reasons noted here >>108578 but IC you'd all been wandering through foggy crimson halls for some time before reaching it.
>>
No. 120773 ID: 3abd97

>>120738
Hey, it's good to hear from you! I was starting to get a little concerned.

Don't worry about the game, your own stuff comes first. As far as I'm concerned, you're more than welcome to jump back in if and when you're able to, if you still want to.

I enjoyed playing with you, even if we did get into a few dumb arguments. You come up with solutions I never would have, as well as creative and interesting contributions to brainstorming and char-gen. It's been fun.

>>120756
>for reasons noted here >>108578
That post is out of date in that if I were faced with the Chess puzzle again, I would totally burn an OOC question to bypass to the reward and spend it on the Plato's Cave sword mastery as described in the post immediately following it.

>>/quest/868376
I'm a little confused and concerned as to what's being offered here. It sounds like conditioning or brainwashing via Pentacle Rex, but inviting Viste to participate rather than Dav is... concerning. Suggests this is more in her sphere as an action of violence. Or maybe that's just Prisoner reaching out to its fellow alien.

(Not completely relevant here, but sticking the tsochar in Esmeraude was one fallback plan I considered but hadn't felt the situation was dire enough to deploy. It checks one NPC of uncertain loyalty with another. And if it was necessary to leave her brain intact for information, I'm not confident she couldn't eventually strike a batter deal than I was offering and subvert her would-be control mechanism).
>>
No. 120794 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/868422
The hard part for me here is "sex is a Davina thing" has been pretty basic in the persona division. I'm going to need a think on how she'll even react to having something like that challenged.

>not necessarily good for her over the longer term
Sorta confused how this is different than the course of action Ji and Dav just rejected (besides the partners involved), then.
>>
No. 120969 ID: d36af7

In response to an e-mail from Santova:
> I've been thinking about giant bees a lot and I want to know more about how yours work in your setting. 3 main questions:
>How do they breath? Magic? Or are they just built differently than traditional bees?
Mechanically speaking, they're mundane insects. Antimagic Fields or mana-vacuum environments won't mess them up (contrasted with true dragons and various magical beasts, which sicken and eventually die under such conditions). They've got different physiology than IRL bees, probably including the equivalent of lungs and kidneys and other sophisticated metabolic-exchange surfaces. Their wings would not be sufficient for them to fly under real-life earthlike conditions, but somehow work fine under fantasy physics without technically involving magic.
>Why and how to they make so much honey? Where do they get all the nectar for all that honey? Is this just a thing that works?
From giant flowers of course. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/plants/alraune Thanks to the symbiotic benefits of pollination, various species of giant bee have come to mutually agreeable arrangements with various otherwise-carnivorous (and often ambulatory) flora. The drakocracy maintains patches of 'wild' environment even inside mostly civilized lands, both for personal privacy and as part of their strategic hedging of bets. Safe, routine trade is routed around such areas, http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20141117 but many strange and precious things grow inside, harvested from time to time by bold adventurers or careful specialists. Bees are specialists in sugar, which can be a big enough deal as an addiction that it was the real driving force behind the golden age of piracy. Come for the long-shot of scoring a Spanish ship full of stolen Aztec gold, stay for the rum and other sugarcane derivatives.
>What about other products? Are they farmed for fur, chitin, or wax at all?
Yep. TBH I'm using productivity-per-acre numbers for sheep and goats straight out of GURPS Low-Tech 3: Daily Life And Economics. Chitin instead of leather, etc.

>>120794
I may have made a terrible mistake here, so I won't be committing to anything further on the Esmeraude issue until I'm sure I'm thinking clearly. March 10th at the earliest.
>>
No. 121181 ID: 3abd97

I present this representation of our current random encounter

http://www.awkwardzombie.com/index.php?page=0&comic=012615
>>
No. 121276 ID: d22dc0

Thanks for the kind words everyone!

Bee stuff sounds cool! I was mostly curious about how the work with how insects breath and fly and all that. Thinking about the ecology and quizine of different groups of people in my games, and bees were an important facet.

Gonna stay at arms length with the whole sexytime punishment re-conditioning thing. Totally makes sense in the game, but personally I'm a little squicked out by the idea of possibly inflicting or exploiting sexual tramua.
>>
No. 121292 ID: d1248b

>>121276
>squicked out
Yep.
>>120969
>I [...] made a terrible mistake here,
>>
No. 121299 ID: d22dc0

>>121292
I wasn't trying to imply that you had done something wrong by including it; it makes sense as to why this is a foreground plot point with the need for character input. I think it's justified as an occurrence, I just personally wasn't planning on addressing it in character.
>>
No. 121429 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/873073
Well that's a horrifying origin story and intriguing current modus operandi / disposition for mimics.

>>/quest/873082
>Pog has a little song in his head about stomping on ants. It consists of three words chosen at random.
I just wanna say I enjoy Pog getting some flavor text / roleplaying in. I was kinda sad he stopped saying basically anything for a while.

>>/quest/872332
I forget, how much was the rest of the group aware of Maru's plans? Are the other characters largely in the dark why she's withdrawn and grumpy?
>>
No. 121437 ID: fc3fc0

>>121429
I don't think it was explicitly roledplayed in the thread, but I think anyone who was with her during the shopping or other similar activities would pick up on her intentions pretty easily- she's not exactly a subtle person. I think it makes sense to assume a level of knowledge directly proportional to how much attention your character would spend on Maru.

Indirectly, she's also become a bit of a chore to play; her constantly being at odds with at least one person means that whenever I play her I'm trying to get into that angry, indignant headspace, and I just don't have the energy for that kind of mental tax right now. Originally she was supposed to be a "leap into the burning building to save a friend" kind of character, but it feels like I'm playing a petulant child (which isn't too far off honestly, she's probably in the 19-21 age range) who's had a bad day and is subsequently mad about everything, all the time. At the same time, I don't like being disingenuous, or arbitrary, so I've managed to inflict a little self imposed burden into my fun rpg game. C'est la vie, right? I pretty much based Kent around the way strngy plays, to have a more fun and impulsive character that can hopefully be at least half as endearing as Vos. Apparently I just can't stop myself from leaning on the childhood trauma crutch no matter what character I make. I'm a little sad I rolled so low to proposition the orcs, I thought that would have been a really fun turn in the story honestly, but then again that's what writing books is for, right?

On that note, I'm actually a little nervous about stepping into the whole gender territory, because I feel like I'm very close to being disrespectful or reductive. On one hand, I've got the scenario of "character raised by a snake was never socialized with any context regarding gender, and is now presented with what appears to be a checklist for things you must do to be considered a woman"

On the other hand, the idea of roleplaying as someone going "Oh, okay, so I just do this and become a woman, right?" is a little icky for me, just because I don't like portraying the idea of "womanhood can only be done one correct way, and deviations are invalid" OR the idea that being trans is just a choice that can be made for the sake of something as transactional as more convenient sleeping arrangements. So like, yay, fantasy world, we don't have to emulate the shitty rules of our society, but also this is media within our society, and some things like representation and the messages we choose to put out there matter a great deal. Since I haven't lived that life experience, I don't really want to step into and be callous or dismissive, you know?

On a different note, I'm a bit worried we haven't seen Strngy around for a bit, or Tunic for that matter. Hope everything turns out alright with whatever's going on in their lives.

So, to answer your question, maybe, kinda up to you, but it wouldn't be hard for anyone to figure out why really.
>>
No. 121440 ID: ab7dcc

>>121437
Yrthakite gender roles are very strict in some ways, but ultimately pragmatic: the correct way to do it is the way that works, so if your way gets useful results, that must mean you're doing something right. As far as these particular orc bandits are concerned, there's no gender essentialism, it's just a matter of skills - but since marriage is a fairly long-term commitment, they want to make sure all the key skills are actually present, same as you'd want to double-check the training and reputation of an auto mechanic or surgeon or lawyer before betting your life on their professional competence.

If Kent could figure out how to grow a fetus in a jar using medical alchemy, that would be a perfectly adequate, albeit unconventional, answer to the child-bearing question.

The "ritual" of candles and maps and so on actually refers to military strategy meetings. Basic principles behind that sort of work could be memorized in an afternoon, finer nuances could be productively studied for a lifetime.
>>
No. 121454 ID: fc3fc0

My concern is not "Can I do it in game", but rather "Is this trivializing and dismissing the important, real life struggles people go through in our society outside the game". I

I did get the bit about military strategy meetings though, I just figured Kent would take such a statement at face value. Overall, given my roll and Kent's current inability to create life, at least biologically, I imagine it'll be a moot point, and I won't have to worry about the issue of representation and respectful portrayals. Not because it's no longer important, but because it's no longer relevant to what we're doing in game, if that makes sense.
>>
No. 121507 ID: 3abd97

>>121437
Hmm, okay, I was mostly thinking of how possible approaches to cheer her up from other PCs might go.

If you're not having fun with Maru, I'd say there's room for her to grow or adapt without betraying who she's supposed to be. For instance, once she's over her funk, she could decide even if it was frustrating not to exact her personal revenge, she approves of having a team leader who takes decisive and devastating action to leap to the defense of one of their own. Needs of the family come before what she wants. Or, a lot of of the butting heads could down to a matter of trust. She doesn't trust other party members to make good decisions when her own gut is saying something is a bad idea. If her trust in her ally's capabilities and decision making grows, she might be less inclined to throw herself on the fires of other people's actions. Or maybe she could bond with Oadric over a cultural connection and that gives her something more familiar and and a reason to be a little less high strung. These are just some brainstormed examples, and it's likely none of them are a perfect fit for how you see your character, but the time-lapse of the escort mission does sort of provide a convenient framework for growth or change over time if you want to do so.

Personally, I was thinking of having Viste loosen up a little. The contradiction of a serious character in a silly magical girl transformation is one I like, but I didn't anticipate how often I'd be operating openly in her persona, and I think I might have overdone it.

>marriage stuff
One thing that's been bugging me- don't they need the dowry already taken care of to marry anyone? I suppose the gold in the barrel is enough to cover that (and a conversion to silver could be arranged) but I wasn't sure that money was at the orc brotherhood's disposal.
>>
No. 121528 ID: d09514

I appreciate the brainstorming! I think I’ll do something along those lines, and have her come around soon enough. The whole “consumed by vengeance” flaw is kinda integral to the character, given it’s the basis for her powers, but I think that I can have her do a 180 and realize that this means she doesn’t have quite so much pressure when it comes to planning and executing her revenge. I think she can also learn a lesson from caps escape, the real ignition point for her grudge, and realize that if she’s so easily manipulated she’s only going to get made a fool of again. Maybe she can approach viste, try to get some coaching on the ways of temperance and stoicism, and in turn, spending time with Maru will give Viste a good catalyst to show more individuality.

I was assuming the gold held by the former bandits was going to be used as the Dowery, but I suppose there’s no real reason to assume they have the authority to requisition such a considerable sum- it’s likely everyone would be understanding though, given that Kent wouldn’t intend to withhold it or use it for selfish reasons. Kent was more interested in the companionship and dedicated assistants part, not so much “this is a good way to make a quick buck”
>>
No. 121530 ID: fc3fc0

This link is not at all relevant to the conversation, but I was entertained by it none the less.

http://80sanime.tumblr.com/post/171708742265/how-do-i-unlock-the-cat-player-job-class

It’s a 2 minute clip from some obscure 90s anime called orurorane the cat player, and it’s got a wizard seeming to orchestrate cats to form a beautiful 3 part song that I hope people enjoy as much as I did.
>>
No. 121559 ID: d22dc0

Might wanna get valeno to look at those wounds if we’re dealing with poison, since that’s kinda the emphasis of the character.
>>
No. 121592 ID: 3f5235

>>121437
>haven't seen Tunic around for a bit
Nothing for me to interact with or do. Thread 6 is the only thread I'm playing in, and it's also apparently the only thread on hiatus. We've re-wound to before the merfolk situation, and I've already given Yisheng Ji's input on the Esmeraude situation. There isn't anything going on in thread 6 currently that's waiting on me.

Considering every thread I have had a character in now has deteriorated into being put on indefinite hiatus, it'd be unfair to everyone else if I joined in on the currently active Thread 7 or the XALT quest. I was hoping we could work past this whole thing, but I've gotten kind of tired, and JL clearly is too, so I'm not going to force the issue anymore. If you want to see me back, feel free to revive Thread 6, and I'll keep playing Yisheng Ji. If not, don't worry about it.
>>
No. 121603 ID: fc3fc0

>>121592
I think you're reading the situation incorrectly; I don't want to share JamesLeng's business, so if he wants to elaborate that's up to him, but I will say I think it is a bit out of line to assume it's your fault the threads are on hiatus. He even made a character for you, in case you wanted to join the exalted quest when you returned. I would say a good guideline for any situation like this is to ask for clarification, and then believe what other people have to say. I'm sure if, for instance, you had asked "is the thread on hiatus because of me?" JamesLeng would have given you a straight answer, as has been the case in the past. It seems you have a leaning to assume hostility from others, so it might behoove you to fight against your natural instincts so you don't cut yourself off needlessly. I hope to see you in the games, provided they're activities you can enjoy yourself in. It may be difficult to convey over text, but I think we are happy to have you as a player, provided you are happy to be one.
>>
No. 121611 ID: ab7dcc

>>121592
>is the thread on hiatus because of me?
No.

It's on hiatus because I'm still in the process of moving across the country, and because the more I think about implications of Esmeraude's situation and backstory, the more it all makes the temple of final sacrament's guardian of seed (the "roofie room") seem mild and innocuous by comparison. She's already so deeply entangled with the course of on-screen events, though, that I can't just sweep the issue away. I've got to think through how I'm going to handle that, which is going to require at least a full day of my undivided attention. I haven't had that much to spare, because I'm busy making decisions about completely unrelated problems, many of which involve thousands of IRL dollars and/or where I'm going to live for the next few years. When I have spoons for quest stuff, it goes to smaller, more easily manageable cognitive tasks, things I can handle almost effortlessly or with just a few minutes of concentration, such as basic database lookups for room-to-room dungeon crawls, or incremental character creation - and even that kind of thing hasn't been measuring up to my usual standard of speed or quality lately.

You, personally, have had little or nothing to do with the current problem. Can't reasonably be expected to solve it, certainly did not cause it. Not everything is about you, though this >>121068 absolutely was meant as a minimally ambiguous invitation to participate in the XALT game, an invitation which remains open.

>every thread I have had a character in now has deteriorated into being put on indefinite hiatus
Threads 1, 2, 4, and 5 all wrapped up properly, so that's demonstrably false for values of "every" higher than 1/3. Unless you're talking about 'threads' in the sense of multi-thread plot arcs? Check my author page on the wiki, I've literally never managed to bring one of those to a full conclusion, regardless of any given player's involvement. In fact, it's a safe bet that the majority of quest authors haven't, just on the basis that there are far more entries here https://tgchan.org/wiki/Category:Quest_Authors than here https://tgchan.org/wiki/Major_Completed_Quests
>>
No. 121618 ID: 3f5235

>>121603
>>121611
Oh, alright. Then, I have to apologize for jumping to hostile conclusions. I incorrectly assumed that since I caused the Act 1 party plotline to become a joyless chore ( >>105531 ), that the same must have happened to the Act 2 Thread 6 party plotline, since Thread 6 wasn't updating and the other two threads were. I'll admit that's my own paranoid anxiety-sprouted mistake, though in this case I don't think it's that irrational of a conclusion, given a precedent exists.

>made a character for me in XALT
>>121068
I'll be honest, I never even saw it until now. I only read the opening posts of XALT and then didn't watch the thread after that for the same reason I haven't been keeping up with Thread 7. I've only been regularly checking Thread 6 and this disthread, and never even realized there was an exalted disthread. I'm genuinely surprised so much work was put into a character for me, considering my current tenuous position, even if it was just an idle thought experiment. In fact, this is actually a first for me, as far as tabletop-style games go. I've always pretty much been left on my own for character creation in every other game I've participated in, not counting feedback to fix errors and make fiat-based adjustments. I did go and read some character creation guides and templates for Exalted out of curiosity after seeing the XALT splash page, but wasn't able to wrap my head around some of the more complex systems. I eventually just ended up giving up on the idea after a couple days, as I wasn't able to conclusively figure out if my hypothetical character concept was even possible to construct.

Since XALT is still in chargen stages and it seems I've already got a completed character for it, (and my presence isn't a *Mr. Gibbs voice* Black Spot) I suppose I may as well participate in it, if you'll have me. The character looks fantastic btw, at least as far as my amateur eye can judge. I don't fully understand what everything means, but I'm really impressed you even accounted for the four arts of the Chinese scholar. As far as questions go, I'm interested in where the name Ledaal comes from / what it means. Also, do the mentor or henchman have names? (I'm not sure if you've read ISSTH, but I'm amused by your choice of henchman. Should I be worried about a Lord Fifth expy?)
>>
No. 121628 ID: 3abd97

I was under the impression the reason Arc I stopped was mostly momentum loss, compounded by too many players dropping out.
>>
No. 121654 ID: ab7dcc

>>121618
Mostly answered here: >>121645
>completed character
No intimacies defined yet, and if there's anything you don't think is a good fit, it can be adjusted.
>>
No. 122218 ID: afa838

Shower thought occurred to me today, about armor and stuff. Can you enchant something of mundane protective material, or other perhaps better crafting goods, to be transparent, to solve the visibility/protection trade-off problem?
>>
No. 122260 ID: 094652

I had a dream last night that one of you did fanart of Hore.
>>
No. 122263 ID: 5c3123

>>122218
Armor-grade metal can be made permanently invisible, but ultimately it's not much cheaper than an equivalent magic force field, and carries some other significant disadvantages. Invisibility isn't quite perfect, so spherical and chromatic aberration and other low-quality-optics problems will cause eyestrain. If the magic fails, then you need to either get the visor completely out of the way (probably leaving you more vulnerable than a conventional vision slit) or you're blind - and all kinds of things might mess it up at inconvenient times, from low-mana areas to normally harmless friendly effects like https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/i/invisibility-purge/
>>
No. 122284 ID: 5739e6

>>122263
Any harder to dispel or sort of disrupt than a magic force field? Based on those flaws you listed it seems like it would be a less than wise way to invest money, so I’m wondering if there’s any up sides compared to other magic investments. Seems like a magic force field on top of a suit of armor would be a good bet comparatively
>>
No. 122285 ID: 5739e6

Unrelated, but I was thinking about some of the parallels between Riv and our wayward sorceress. Both seem to have been deeply affected by a negative upbringing, both joined up as a result of the chaos caused by the main party attacking, both were providing skilled services to mageys character, both seemed interested in subservience to their perceived superior, while simultaneously looking for an opportunity to grab power by whatever means necessary. Thought it was an interesting set of similarities, as well as interesting in the ways they diverge. I dont know if we can prove that Esmeraude was planning on executing a coup, but she wouldn’t be able to win the loyalty of most of our crew if she did- likewise, had it not been for Tunics character, Riv would likely have wanted to orchestrate some plan to kill and replace Marjike; the venerable Paladin would never defect though (Riv was under the impression Letkra would have sided with her, although I doubt she’d stand for such a classic video game betrayal). Dav seems bent on keeping the sorceress around though, whereas I imagine Riv was on pretty thin ice even without direct subordination, given her condescending nature and me professing her desire for disloyalty in the dis thread. No real point here, I was just thinking about it earlier and I wanted to share.
>>
No. 122296 ID: 3abd97

>Riv would likely have wanted to orchestrate some plan to kill and replace Marjike
>whereas I imagine Riv was on pretty thin ice even without direct subordination
If Marijke hadn't been trying to be a good person, there's a good chance she would have lit Riv on fire or sicced the giant octopus on her already. Although as a PC, I gave Riv more leeway than I might have otherwise.

>Dav seems bent on keeping the sorceress around though
Well, there's a few reasons for that.

-Esmeraude's background and circumstances share similarities with Davina's. This makes her something of a peer, and easier to sympathize with.
-On the mercenary angle, Esmeraude is still on the hook for specialist knowledge and casting skills she offered to pay for services rendered with. Professional conduct and maintaining rep means not letting her off that hook till she's paid.
-Said specialist knowledge is directly relevant to solving problems for Dav's high and low ambitions so you've got a complicated knot of emotions and motivations pushing for that.
-After that last encounter, Dav's of the opinion Esmeraude will get herself killed if left to her own devices (self-defeating impulses, no discipline and too smart for her own good). What's good for Esmeraude and for Dav means not letting that happen (for now).

So yeah, a combination a self-serving and more compassionate motives. If push comes to shove, Dav will put her own agenda and long term interests ahead of compassion, but for the moment, they lie in the same direction.
>>
No. 122298 ID: 5739e6

>>122296
>Riv would be gone
For sure- likewise, had I not wanted to respect you as a player, I might have been a little more ruthless with her. I don’t really remember if Marjike was one for gambling, but if she’s was a more conservative business woman, Riv was clearly not stable, and would likely be better served as a specialist they could hire if they ever needed to Analyze alien chemistry and what not. If she was a bigger risk taker, I think it would totally make sense to take her on, then realize Riv would have done whatever was necessary to sait her desires, and probably killed her during a bungled coup or something similar.

>reasons for keeping the sorceress around
Oh yeah, I feel as though you’re playing true to character- the double ambition whammy is hard to beat. Personally my OOC and IC judgement are a little hard to separate- she seems like too much of a threat to be worth keeping around, but I don’t like gambling, and IC it makes sense that Davs ambitions would tip the scales. I’m a little surprised by the peerage and sympathy aspects, just because Davina doesn’t seem like someone who would spare you the knife after she begged for mercy, stabbed you in the back, begged again, and very nearly got away with murder a second time. Didn’t take her for a third chances kinda noblewoman, but that’s not to say it doesn’t make sense to why she’s still keeping her around. Should be a lot less dangerous without her second in command.
>>
No. 122327 ID: 5c3123

>>122284
That's right, transparent aluminum metal isn't usually the best option for armor. It does exist, and there are some good applications for it, mainly where opacity actually is the more preferred failure state. For example, greenhouse portion of the POW camp where Azure was being kept, or display cases in fancy jewelry stores. http://www.talesofmu.com/other/an-internal-matter
>“Well, to begin with, do you see this glass?” the dwarf asked, tapping the top of the counter.
>“Yes.”
>“No, you don’t. What you see is metal that has been rendered ninety-nine percent invisible.”

Most people who want heavy armor, and have enough budget for the best do, as you say, get some mix of magically-enhanced conventional armor, along with a force field or hardened skin or some other trick to cover the gaps.
>>
No. 122347 ID: 3abd97

>>122298
>I’m a little surprised by the peerage and sympathy aspects
By itself, that wouldn't be enough reason to keep anyone around, but it does color how Dav sees Esmeraude.

Last daughter of a noble house brought low, trying to reestablish herself, influenced by alien forces she never had a choice in? Dav can't help but see something of herself in that. Sort of "that could have been me... if my family had been wildly irresponsible and undisciplined." Okay sympathy with some superiority.

>Davina doesn’t seem like someone who would spare you the knife after she begged for mercy, stabbed you in the back, begged again, and very nearly got away with murder a second time. Didn’t take her for a third chances kinda noblewoman
By my count there was one significant betrayal, followed by swift retribution and a reevaluation of her role.

Ekton doesn't count: Esmeraude was on the opposite side of a conflict we chose to enter, and was quite reasonable about things when the Green Tide redrew lines. In strike-city, Cap slipping loose can't reasonably be considered a betrayal (prisoners are obligated to attempt escape, and his status as a prisoner-slash-client was murky at best). Esmeraude "halping" with the cat-architects isn't great... but it's not the first time members of the group have got in each other's way either.

There's also an important in-character separation bit. Davina doesn't know who the PCs are! She's surrounded by people who could be dangerous to keep around but useful if she can keep them friendly and/or pointed in the right direction. Being an adventurer at all is something of a calculated risk.
>>
No. 122349 ID: 3dc0e0

>>122347
>Davina doesn't know who the PCs are!
Good point! I often "suspension of disbelief" that part, just to make it more fun and convenient, but honestly it's a character decision that I respect and somewhat evny; like I as saying, I can't always do a great job of separating my OOC and my IC thoughts. On that note...

>Esmeraude "halping" with the cat-architects isn't great...
This was actually the one big betrayal I was counting, with the recent ship debacle being a light second since I wasn't actively playing and wasn't sure exactly if she had betrayed people, or if things just looked bad due to circumstance. Ecton obviously doesn't count. But this sort of indicate how my involvement colors my perception of the prison break incident being a blatant betrayal. Like I said, I can't say for certain, but I was under the impression they were coordinating, and if she endorsed Cap attacking crew and fleeing detainment, then that's at least breaking the rules, if not "betrayal".

One might suggest Maru taking a swing at Ji fall under the same category, since it was non-lethal pacification in both circumstances, but in my mind, intention plays a big part in differentiating the occurrences; Maru thought Ji was being influenced by malignant forces, directly after Ji chose to split from the party, whilst escaping from a deadly threat, after talking about hearing voice, after triggering several near deadly traps on the torture device designed by a death god. She attacked him in hopes of freeing him from malicious influence and ensuring he would have what she deemed a higher chance of survival.

Cap, on the other hand, provoked Maru, intending to do psychological harm, before attacking her with the intent to hurt her enough that he could escape, sure, violence might be the same as saying hello for him, but even if he had clipped Maru's nails in an attempt to escape, he had hostile intent, whereas Maru was actively trying to do hat she thought would lead to the best things for everyone.

As for other similar incidents, none come to mind. What exactly were you referencing with:
>not the first time members of the group have got in each other's way

I can't think about other times party members attacked each other because they couldn't get their way. Vos sometimes runs off the rails but it's hardly the same kind infraction.
>>
No. 122351 ID: 3abd97

>>122349
>I was under the impression they were coordinating [...] then that's at least breaking the rules
What rules? Not to be glib, but it seems like you're holding people in an unclear situation to a standard they never agreed to, nor was clearly laid out for them.

>ship debacle a "light" betrayal
Attempted desertion and turning on allies in the middle of an active military operation? From a position of command, as a noble and a mercenary captain, there's nothing light about that at all.

And on a personal level, before we left Overmire, Dav had asked Esmeraude what her intentions were, and gave her the chance to get out. Who then reaffirmed she wanted to stick with the group... only to turn on us in the very next encounter.

So yeah, that's the betrayal Dav cares about.

>What exactly were you referencing with
I was trying to avoid rehashing every time party members have worked at cross purposes because it's unproductive and tends to spiral. But basically, any time someone has tried to help and either made things worse, or were unintentionally a nuisance to the person they were trying to help. https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Halping

>attacked each other
See, that's the big difference. Maru saw a personal attack and responded with rancor. Dav, at the end of the day, had an annoying mess between assets and allies to clean up, caused by scheming and personality clashes. That's how managing a ragtag band goes.
>>
No. 122355 ID: 410b20

>>122351
>what rules
>Doesn’t care about people attacking each other

Huh, didn’t expect that to be a distinction that failed to be important- intention is normally important in social-fu. I figured prison break and attacking people was at least against the spirit, if not the letter, or the agreement about transporting them to overmire. Even if we didn’t outline it explicitly, we have societal rules that are understood- anything that would be illegal, such as attacking people, is generally understood to be “against the rules” as a whole. Maru obviously isn’t interested in societal norms obviously, but I thought Dav was more beholden to them.

>they told us how they would act, and acted differently
To be fair, we had an agreement before we left for overmire as well- infractions are no less offensive on the leg there than the leg back.

>halping is bad
Huh, again, I thought intention counted for more. Accidentally bungling things isn’t great, but it’s not nearly as offensive as outright attacking someone, which isn’t as bad as attacking someone with malicious intent. I don’t know if I’m misinterpreting what you were saying, but those priorities as I understand them are surprising to me.
>>
No. 122358 ID: 5c3123

>>122355
>anything that would be illegal, such as attacking people
Between this, and the taking-risks-for-money issue, it seems like Maru's been rather unclear on the overall "mercenary company" concept.
https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2003-01-16
>>122351
>halping
I've also heard it referred to as "hlep," though that has connotations more of deeply misguided emotional support than physical incompetence.
>>
No. 122361 ID: f3e670

>>122358
>Maru doesn’t know what being a mercenary means
I did say Mary doesn’t have a problem attacking people. But yeah, she’s not really interested in the mercenary thing, which I don’t think I’ve made false pretenses about. Nothing wrong with doing the things mercs do, mostly just the underlying motivations. Protecting your cargo ship, and getting into a fight because your friend is in too deep? Solid stuff. Being HIRED to protect someone’s ship, and making decisions based on your employers interests, rather than your own? Doesn’t jive- even if the results are the same, or even better with an employer, Maru doesn’t like working for people, or under contract. No rules, no boss, just right. She’s fine with davina being in charge, because she seems naturally suited for taking charge and keeping food on the table. She can say “hey, you’re my friend, I trust you to look out for me and make decisions with me in mind”. There’s no contracts- it’s a voluntary and fluid arrangement. A quick and non-nuanced take would be “shes chaotic neutral”. She doesn’t like rules, society, or the accepted ways of doing things. Merc work is an extension of that social system, and just has slightly different things you do to get the money. All bosses are the same, doesn’t matter the kind of work or job.

One of the points of contention with the whole “risks for money” was Ji jumping down the tunnel

Again, Maru was dead to rights convinced he would die. It wasn’t about money, it was about everyone’s blatant resistance to even THINK about other options IC or explore potential ways around the problem- Ji said “I’ll jump in the deadly tunnel” Maru said “no you’ll die” and everyone else said “how could you insult him like that, we’re fine letting him risk his life.” Personally, OOC? I still don’t understand why her position was so surprising to everyone. This was after the experience in the labyrinth, by the way, a pretty negative influence on her mental state, in addition to the already super stressful of almost killed in a raid and then transported to disease dungeon, similar to the death labyrinth. I can understand in hindsight how saying “I think you’ll die” could be interpreted as “I think you’re inept” but the motivation was still positive, and to give an example, if Ji said “I’m going to attack the bronze dragon coming to inspect us, don’t help me” and the same conversation happening.
>>
No. 122448 ID: 094652

There's a distinct problem with Azure and Pog's playstyle - their exp gain.

Pog is suited for combat and Azure is suited for seduction. Those are both methods that JamesLeng has authorized to gain exp, surviving danger and sensual indulgences.

The problem is, Azure has rolled around with a few dozen workers, goblins, and other nobodies, performed some dollar-saving bargaining, and we've learned that the drawback of her overpowered resurrection powers that is a single scratch can lead to brutal, pain-wreaking explosion and loss of expensive gear.

Pog, on the other hand, had his torso caved in, managed to kill some horrid flesh creature in the dark with said torso wound, and barely survived an axe to the brain (which I used as in-character justification for the radical personality shift and slight intelligence spike).

At this point, it's obvious who's closer to level 3. And that disparity in levels is going to keep getting higher - Pog isn't charging ahead, Azure's falling behind.

If I send her back to camp, it's in character and can net her a little exp for tending to the wounded and stuff, but Pog stands to gain a huge chunk in the dungeon. I'm not opting to bring Pog back where he can also lag behind the others, but I'm still looking for a way to synchronize their exp gains.

Thoughts?
>>
No. 122449 ID: a85d66

>>122448
My thought is pretty much “don’t worry about them synching up”. Do what makes sense in character, and whatever happens from them is a natural result in the story we’re weaving. Does azure like to relax, play hooky and not get into dangerous situations? If so, she probably won’t learn as much as someone who’s actively applying and exerting themselves. If the scenario were flipped- we were in a high class brothel, then azure would perhaps be preforming more regularly then pog, and since she’s doing more, naturally she’s learning more. If there is an xp difference, it make sense as a natural consequence of the narrative and stuff. It also offers a good incentive for why azure might want to leave the dungeon and go back to town once she’s outrun the law- if she’s better suited to another environment, rather than trying to game the system, play the game. Without having all the rules and such at hand though, I can’t say if that’s good advice, that’s just my take on the situation. Pinch of salt and all that.
>>
No. 122521 ID: 2007b6

>>120702
Have a real place to live now. Repairs and renovations are still underway, so it may be a little while before I'm back at 100% quest productivity, but situation seems to be facing lasting improvements rather than deterioration for the first time in years.

Worked out broad strokes of a solution for the problem over which I was kicking myself about Esmeraude, but still chewing on exact details of implementation.
>>
No. 122523 ID: fc3fc0

>>122521
Congrats! Take your time!
>>
No. 122526 ID: 3abd97

>>122449
I'd second this. Do what makes sense to you, worry about xp later. The Fire Hawks are scattered from levels 2-4 and it doesn't really hurt anything (the range is even more pronounced, counting the npcs). And a single decision or small part of the action can have big effects on xp, so it's not worth worrying about where a character is standing at all times (for instance, Hore technically survived single combat with Cap in the last encounter, something you didn't plan on).

>>122521
Hey, that's great to hear! Good luck getting all the repairs and such completed. Again, no pressure on quest stuff.

>>122355
>I thought intention counted for more
It does. That's what differentiates 'halping' from malicious sabotage. Or deliberate betrayal.

>I don’t know if I’m misinterpreting what you were saying, but those priorities as I understand them are surprising to me.
I think the problem is you're starting from the perspective of "how to I justify or explain Dav being okay with stuff that upset Maru". That's sort of got one character's bias or slant on events built in to the inputs before you start, so of course the outputs won't make sense.
>>
No. 122528 ID: d22dc0

>>122526
You know, I hadn’t really thought about it that way but I suppose you’re right. I’ve also realized, perhaps a bit too little too late, that I’m getting a bit overly defensive with pretty much everything having to do with Maru. Some combination of involentarily intrepreting IC problems as OOC disapproval of me and emotional projection is impacting my ability to treat this like a game instead of some serious affront. It probably adds to the roleplay elements of the whole “righteous anger for being reprimanded after trying to help” but I think it’ll be more enjoyable overall if I can try to take it down a notch or two and not get so invested.
>>
No. 122568 ID: d22dc0

Well shit, looks like we're going to be out of a wheelbarrow and shovel. Reminds me of Riv destroying her surveying equipment while trying to map the room whos geometry I desperately didn't understand.
>>
No. 122620 ID: add037

>>122521
I'm glad things are getting better!

This glue room is quickly turning into another hilarious disaster
>>
No. 122624 ID: 2007b6

A little side note, which is arguably OOC knowledge, but on the other hand Azarthraine might have casually mentioned in the course of catching up on events and sharing arcane lore...

Viste's arson-investigation deputy badge has a permanent https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/symbol-of-scrying built into it. Any time someone reads the symbol, presumably as part of having the credentials presented to them, the Minister of Punctuality can personally observe what happens in that badge's immediate vicinity over the next two hours or so.
>>
No. 122628 ID: d22dc0

>>122624
Huh. Did Vos, or other people with mage sight pick up on its magical nature and we just missed it? Or is this something we’d have to specifically guess at and roll for to figure out without OOC info or friendly NPCs pointing it out to us?
>>
No. 122635 ID: 5f3f48

>>122624
Oh. Well, Viste flashing the badge at the bordello and Davina showing up at the cat architects' mansion sure seemed less than 2 hours appart, although the medium is abstract enough it's hard to be sure. So unless the transformation interrupts the effect I guess he's possibly the first person to know about the double identity.

A symbol of your authority whose use you can always keep tabs on is clever, as is giving adventurers a useful tool that doubles as a way to keep tabs on them.
>>
No. 122690 ID: 2007b6

>Temperature Tolerance
>1 point/level
>Every character has a temperature “comfort zone” within which he suffers no ill effects (such as FP or HP loss) due to heat or cold. For ordinary humans, this zone is 55° wide and falls between 35° and 90°. For nonhumans, the zone can be centered anywhere, but this is a 0-point feature for a zone no larger than 55°. A larger zone is an advantage. Each level of Temperature Tolerance adds HT degrees to your comfort zone, distributed in any way you wish between the “cold” and “hot” ends of the zone.

>Intense Heat: Human skin starts to burn at 160°; see Flame (p. 433) for damage. Even if no damage penetrates your DR, you will rapidly over-heat if the ambient temperature is more than 6 ¥ your comfort zone’s width over your comfort zone (e.g., in a fire). After 3 ¥ DR seconds, make a HT roll every second. On a failure, you lose 1 FP. Your DR provides its usual protection against burning damage, but it has no effect on this FP loss.

Just doing some math on the GURPS Temperature Tolerance advantage. Most organic matter (under ideal conditions) burns at about 1950° F, so I wanted to see what it would take to be sure she's not suffering rapid heatstroke even under prolonged exposure to those temperatures. The threshold where FP starts to be lost per second rather than per 30 minutes is based on the width of the temperature tolerance range, though, which is based partly on the Health/Constitution attribute. Once you've got at least (current HT score) points in Temperature Tolerance, it actually becomes cheaper to buy additional HT, even aside from the numerous other benefits of increasing an attribute which feeds into various derived stats, than to buy Temperature Tolerance directly.

So I got to thinking about that, and the rules for Resistant/Susceptible, and the myth of Achilles, the idea that "mortality" is a substance which could be boiled out of somebody. Resistant and Susceptible are basically exact opposites, one providing a bonus to relevant HT rolls and the other a penalty, but they've got different definitions of what constitutes a "very common" hazard. For Resistant, that top tier could cover 'metabolic hazards,' meaning more or less all the sorrows that flesh is heir to. Susceptible says that 'poison' is a valid Very Common, though, where Resistant calls it regular-Common, a mere subset of metabolic hazards. Extrapolating a bit, that means being Susceptible to a category as broad as 'all metabolic hazards' would be -8 per level, to a maximum of -40 for five levels.

Let's say Rhea has HT 18 [80], Basic Speed -2.00 [-40], Damage Resistance (Force field, only vs. fire) 5 [20], Increased Consumption x2 (Oxygen only) [-20], Susceptible to Metabolic Hazards -5 [-40], Very Unfit [-15], and Temperature Tolerance 20 [20], at a net cost of only five points. For purposes of most resistance rolls, she'd be rolling as if she had HT 11 - basically average. Basic Speed reduction means her reflexes and running speed are also in that same range. She's nominally got a deeper reserve of fatigue points, but Increased Oxygen Consumption and Very Unfit means she burns through 'em twice as fast, or 4x when lack of air is a factor, and takes longer to recover as well. But all her HT-based skills (stuff like Hiking, Lifting, Running, Sex Appeal, Singing, and most notably Breath Control which can help with the fatigue-management problems) can get incredibly high, at least once she's had a little bit of training to make conscious use of that divine spark, while her "comfort zone" in air extends all the way from 35°F to 450°. In water, she can tolerate up to 265°, well above the boiling point unless it's also under significant pressure. Threshold where she'd start taking FP per second from excess heat would then be 2940°F, which is far beyond any ordinary open-air fire, or even typical magma, up into the sort of temperatures you seldom see outside the heart of a blast furnace.
>>
No. 122695 ID: d22dc0

>>122690
Most of this goes over my head but the explaination of Rheas tolerance levels at the end makes sense; can I ask why she’s considered very unfit? Extra consumption makes sense with the flames floating around her at all times, but I’m also not sure where the metabolic weakness comes in.
>>
No. 122698 ID: 2007b6

>>122695
Cardiovascular fitness seems more like a 'mortal flesh' thing rather than a 'spirit' thing, and it's a good way to help represent those super drowning skills. With HT 18 and Very Unfit, she'd be making HT checks that don't involve "metabolic hazards" (a category which notably includes surviving while deep in negative HP, recovery from crippled limbs or body parts short of amputation, and deterioration in old age, all of which Exaltation automatically improves) at effective skill 16, the level where further bonuses are redundant except to offset penalties. My thinking is, Rhea has more raw divine power sloshing around in her system than, say, Yisheng Ji does (at a given level), but it's not as smoothly integrated with her mortal physiology. She's keeping it mostly stable, unlike Azure, but the effort involved in doing so means that if Rhea ever works herself to exhaustion, it'll take her notably longer to completely recover afterward.

Let's say Rhea and an average human peasant both hike for three hours with no chance to rest while carrying medium encumbrance. Regardless of how much ground they cover, this would normally cost 3 FP per hour. The peasant loses 9 FP, has one remaining. Rhea's Very Unfit disadvantage means she loses 18 FP and has none remaining. Then they sit down and rest for an hour and twenty minutes while eating a meal. The peasant recovers one FP per 10 minutes, plus one for the meal, and thus is back to full, ready to get moving again. Rhea's recovering one FP per 20 minutes thanks to Very Unfit, so she's only back up to 5/18 FP; her heart's still pounding, theo-geothermal power is churning in her guts, and she's struggling so hard to contain it all that she can barely spare enough strength to lift her pack and stand, much less resume the march.

Let's say both of them spend a semester studying breathing exercises, putting one point in the Breath Control skill. The peasant now has skill 8, and thus can recover a fatigue point in 2 minutes instead of 10... but only about one time in four, for an average of just slightly under 8 minutes per FP recovered. Rhea has skill 16, and is now recovering an average of one FP per four minutes, seven seconds, whenever she's conscious and doing the breathing exercises properly. A three hour march with a medium load will still wipe her out, but now she's back on her feet and rarin' to go in an hour and fourteen minutes (on average) even without a snack.
>>
No. 122710 ID: d22dc0

>>122698
Thats a really interesting system, which makes sense as a mechanic- Rhea is sub-par currently, but with the right training can learn to outclass others in areas she was once weak. Reminds me of the wizard/fighter paradigm in early D&D editions;

however interesting the explanation though, I was more curious about why she was considered unfit, rather than how that impacted her. Is it just an example for a thought experiment, or is there something underlying about her character that means shes not in the best shape? I kinda assumed most PCs were at least in average condition or better unless stated otherwise, given the strenuous nature of adventuring. I never got the impression she was ill suited to things like hiking given her long trek through the various underground lands and other various journeys.
>>
No. 122748 ID: 2007b6

>>122710
HT 18 + Very Unfit + Breath Control at HT-2 (16) actually works out to roughly average physical stamina, as I just showed, but absolutely incredible magical stamina. FP costs of spells or rituals or whatnot aren't modified by cardiovascular fitness.
>>
No. 122770 ID: 3abd97

Good Breath Control seems an odd given the Super Drowning Skills, although here I guess that's represented by the Increased Oxygen Consumption?
>>
No. 122771 ID: 094652

>>122698
I'd say that Azure is feeble and wimpy, but not unfit. She's very dedicated to practicing her dancing routine, and most of her movement outside of towns is flapping around Pog. Problem is, she doesn't do anything else. No breathing exercises, no jogging, and no weight lifting beyond practicing with her crossbow. Running will tire her out significantly more than flying, and pulling her weight can cause her to tire out in minutes. So she was tired out completely when the ex-bandits pushed her to do a single wheelbarrow run.

As Pog gains levels, I'm planning to invest primarily in movement-based skills, secondary in defense, and anything else goes into strength. His main function as a Phoenix Bodyguard isn't to keep his mistress unscathed, but to grab her ashes and run for the hills when she inevitably dies. This also applies to his abilities as a miner, which have so far worked well as a pseudo-sub-class as a Dungeon Miner, destroying walls to open up new options for retreat where others would see impassable limitations. Having the stamina to break those walls down seems to be more important than the strength required to break them with sheer force, as Azure can guide Pog on what weak points to focus on, and purchase upgrades for his mining equipment.
>>
No. 122783 ID: 3abd97

>>122355
Trying to give the "what rules" thing a more detailed explanation:

We took Cap prisoner in Ekton, but then surrendered him to local authorities pretty quickly, so he wasn't in our custody. Next, we got hired by Esmeraude to extract her and Cap from the area, which included talking the locals into surrendering Cap back to us, instead of holding him. This is where the "what rules" starts to get messy.

In one sense, after being captured and subject to a series of prisoner transfers, and being kept restrained, Cap was our prisoner. As prisoners are expected to attempt escape (if not obligated to https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2004-09-19 ), it's hard to hold an escape attempt against Cap, especially when he used non-lethal means to do so, and did no lasting damage to company assets or agents. As a prisoner, this universe's equivalents of the Geneva convention would also apply, which makes executing him when recapture is readily possible less than acceptable.

In another sense, after we accepted the contract to escort Cap and Esmeraude to safety, and got Cap out of jail, he was our client. In which case our leaving restraints on him was questionable at best, our treatment was less than hospitable and we certainly shouldn't have been stopping him from disembarking at port (not that we ever told him he wasn't allowed to do that, either), nor trying to kill him.

We left Cap in this sort of murky grey area between prisoner and client, and never made clear what the boundaries and limitations were (as he himself complained about in the sewer- he didn't understand what we wanted or expected from him). We went from ambushing him and trying to kill him to then tying him up and trying to be polite and tiptoeing around the issue. We really can't be surprised that he tested those boundaries.

Plus, killing someone we were being paid to protect or transport is probably a breach of contract. Maxim 49 ("Every client is one missed payment away from becoming a target and every target is one bribe away from becoming a client") stands, but it's bad for business to apply it for too small an offense (or bribe).

For Dav, in terms of social norms, that mess of obligations (professional, social, military) jump ahead of the eye-for-an-eye (or more accurately, painful death for an insult or assault) you-laid-hand-(head)-on-one-of-us thinking Maru's appealing to.
>>
No. 122795 ID: 2007b6

>>/quest/881913
Archivist, strngy, Tunic, do any of you want to weigh in on this issue?
>>
No. 122801 ID: add037

>weigh in on this issue?
I'm going to respond to what's been said in the quest thread here too.

>Frankly I'd prefer the latter, but rushing ahead without consulting the players goes against this whole site's core ethos.
Honestly I've been enjoying the escort mission and don't have any particular desire to skip over it. Though it's important that this doesn't become a slog for you to run, so if that's the case I'm fine with a time skip.

Only thing that's frustrated me a bit about our current circumstances is a couple actions/hooks just kinda going up in smoke, like Vos trying to proselytize to the sirens and that noble he rescued and fucked all up with mutations.

>I got the impression I was the only one who really had fun getting into the nitty gritty of the big shopping trip
I actually did enjoy the shopping trip and definitely wouldn't mind doing it again. It ended up being a little weird for Vos though. He's not a materialistic eel so I thought it made sense to do the money for XP trade but the other PCs were kinda discouraging it. So I figured Vos could pitch in on something that another PC might want but the JATO hammer ended up not working out. So I ended up just getting a fairly mundane weapon upgrade instead. Not a particularly bad time but Vos just didn't really have so many options.

>I'm not sure running around the dungeon qualifies as picking your battles (too much information disparity and being at the mercy of the encounter table for that)
Well, we DID successfully run away from like 90% of the encounters in the bloodmist labyrinth. Solving the information disparity is kind of the whole fun of dungeon delving, I think. (That's the entire reason I rolled up Helen)

>>122783
I think the problem was that none of us were on the same page for how to handle the cap. Vos was kinda sketchy on the whole 'aiding and transporting a demon' thing so just kinda tried to distance himself from the situation until things got crazy (ie freaking out when he thought cap had killed Davina). More communication between PCs might be good going forward. My weird habit of starting up OOC arguments over issues that end up not even being issues probably contributed to the confusion. Recognized and I'll try not to do that again.
>>
No. 122803 ID: d22dc0

>>122783
For a long time I felt like talking about the subject was just a somewhat frustrating experience of butting heads- I feel like over the last few posts on the matter though, I’m beginning to get a better understanding for the disconnect between my/Marus perception of events, and how you’ve been going through them. That is to say, I think I’m finally starting to get where you’re coming from. We are indeed approaching it from two different angles but now that I understand the assumptions and givens you’ve had in this scenario, the reasoning makes more sense. One major difference is that Maru wasn’t considering Cap his own person, as callous as that is, but rather an extension of Esmeraude; we had an agreement with her, not with Her and Cap; if she wanted better conditions for him, shoulda set that up when we got on the boat. And a few months in a jail cell seems better than the execution we were hauling their asses out of. Second sort of disparity is that she also didn’t accept “prisoners should try to escape” as a rule of conduct. In her head, the rules were “stay put and don’t give us a reason to regret this” rather than “okay, everyone be vigilant because we need to catch and subdue them before any escape attempts get out of hand”

Add in the personal offense, the fear of cap, and her feeling attacked and dismissed in the escape from ectons new tourist trap, and it was just a bad time all around.

Speaking of, did you want to do any inter-character roll play? We had mentioned a couple things- Viste wanting to unwind, Maru possibly going to Viste for help, etc. wasn’t sure if you wanted to do a scene or two in there, or if you want to just do some OOC talk about it.

>>122801
A good way to use money might be charitable or religious purchases, if you have trouble thinking of what else to do. I don’t know how much it costs, but I would hope $200,000 could buy some sort of small property and edifice. On that note, I was kicking around the idea of Maru trying to open a bar. If she doesn’t have the money, maybe asking for a favor from the Firehawks, dedicating the space to them so anyone in the company Maru doesn’t have an issue with can freely use the space.

On a side note, you mentioned starting OOC arguments as a habit, but I never picked up on it, so if it’s something you’re worried about I just want you to know it’s not something I ever noticed or thought about. If anything I’d say I’ve started the most arguements now, or at least the most drawn out ones, as evidenced by us still talking about some of them. I tend to get very invested, and try really hard to make sure people understand where I was coming from and what I was thinking, so I am loath to drop a subject where I don’t feel like I’ve been understood.
>>
No. 122814 ID: 2007b6

>>122803
>I don’t know how much it costs, but I would hope $200,000 could buy some sort of small property and edifice.
$180,000 is a good ballpark estimate for the endowment you'd need to invest in order to support a shrine maiden's cost of living indefinitely; exact value will vary considerably based on the skill of whoever's managing the investment portfolio, and what rates of return are possible in the larger economic environment. A stone building with one big 450 sqft room 12' high (which GURPS Low-Tech Companion 1: Philosophers and Kings describes as "suitable for the sole church in a small town or as a minor center of worship in a larger settlement") costs a little over $40,000... not counting the value of the land, and difficulties involved in importing stone suitable for construction.
>>
No. 122834 ID: 3abd97

>>122801
>whole fun of dungeon delving, I think
Yeah, I didn't mean dungeons and exploring the known aren't fun. More that what delving and the escort mission have in common is they're both reactive- you're responding to what gets thrown at you. I'm looking forward to when we show up to ruin someone's (or something's) day on purpose.

>that noble he rescued and fucked all up with mutations.
Hmmm. Assuming the pirate prince Vos turned into a partial fish person stayed with the ship we spared... that might be the whole reason they're in conflict with a bunch of merfolk right now. Mutant critically failed diplomacy with his new aquatic peers? He swam through sovereign or sacred mer-territroy (they don't usually care about boats)? Some mermaids tried to make off with him? The merfolk critically failed diplomacy with the bandit who's very unhappy with his new body?

>I think the problem was that none of us were on the same page for how to handle the cap.
Yeah, this format makes it somewhat slower to discus and agree on things before doing them, and I think we all suffered for that in this case. Not having an objective we agreed on was unfun. Hopefully we're in a place where that's less of a problem now.

Can't say I'm particularly thrilled by how I handled all of it, either, so sorry for that.

>>122803
>“prisoners should try to escape” as a rule of conduct
Yeah, that's a weird one to wrap one's head around. Most jailers don't want their prisoners to escape, after all. You don't want to encourage it either! But most people don't want to be held, and in different circumstance you'd be trying to get away yourself. Gets into sort of a prisoner's dilemma sort of broader social contract as to how harshly you're willing to punish prisoners who do attempt escape, and how the escape is conducted factors into that.

>did you want to do any inter-character roll play?
Maybe? I don't think the current moment / encounter in-game is the best time to try to handle that, so it would depend what happens next.

>Maru trying to open a bar
That might be a fun idea, if we're going to be operating closer to Passholdt from now on.

>>122814
>support a shrine maiden's cost of living indefinitely
"Welcome to Tittivila's service! Here's the information on your trust fund, why don't you look those over while I get started on your complimentary mutations?"
>>
No. 122836 ID: d22dc0

>>122834
>bar is fun

Would also eliminate the need for housing costs, and could be symbolic of Maru actively trying to mature and fit in better as opposed to butting heads with everyone- nothing says “sorry for being an asshole” like free booze. I thinks it’s an interesting in character dilemma as well, because she actively pushes against the establishment and things like investing or banking, but she also has been out of the street most of her life. She doesn’t want to play society’s game, but she wants to have security and creature comforts. It’s a weird sorta juxtaposition I think, but if she can realize that ideal with the money she earns on the keg back I think she can find a good way to have her cake and piss off the people in charge.

>when do we get to go on the offensive
To be fair, that’s pretty much what we did in Ecton; of course, there’s that cave all those griffin knights died attacking. Who KNOWS what that could be all about.
>>
No. 122837 ID: 20ea96

>>/quest/881913
>>122795
>weigh in on this issue
>play out the rest of the random encounters on the escort mission or just let Azarthraine handle most of that, simply fast-forwarding back to the frontier
>rushing ahead without consulting the players goes against this whole site's core ethos
Worth noting, you did throw out the entire Act I quest, along with the characters we as players put our own time and effort into, just because you didn't feel like running it anymore. As the quest author, you have the veto vote, and the only one that matters. Even if everyone voted for a specific course of action, if it's a slog to you, it'll just be a miserable experience all around. A player can leave with no real repurcussions, but when the DM packs it up, it's over. For example, you deciding to take a break from this thread for a few months means everyone else also necessarily had to take a break. Therefore, I'm just gonna go ahead and vote with you, to skip ahead. It's the only sensible option from a quality-of-life perspective. Voting otherwise is the same as voting to reduce the quality and lifespan of the quest as a whole. I'm not intending this as a criticism, just an explanation for why I think a player vote only has meaning when the DM doesn't have a stake in it.

Plus, I originally voted not to take on the escort mission in the first place, as I wanted to visit the dream realm instead, so it's no skin off my back if we skip it. When we first took it on, I honestly thought this escort mission would be two or three encounters at most, not the entire rest of the act.

>>/quest/881984
>I'm not sure letting Azarthraine do all the heavy lifting is the best idea
In my opinion, this is an absurd notion, because the alternate option usually involves running for our lives. The majority of this campaign has been mostly the party facing off against much, much stronger enemies, and occasionally coming out with a profit through either diplomacy, running away, or, (and this is a relatively new development), letting the high-level npc allies take care of it for us. The fighters have to make use of every trick in the book and the fullest extent of their abilities, plus a hefty dose of luck, just to barely survive a 1v1 duel (e.g. the bandit fight in the village, the Cap fight on the ship, etc.), hoping to scrape together enough experience from just remaining alive to hopefully put on a better show the next time. Yisheng Ji, a healer-main, is no match for the types of injuries our party is regularly expected to sustain, including, but not limited to: having our souls attacked, bodies hollowed out, god-curses, etc. He can barely put an arm in a cast. For the first time, we actually have some of the myriad overpowered DMPCs on our side, so I think we should absolutely make full use of them every chance we can, before we eventually can't anymore. We're gritty, low-power characters in a high-level fantasy world. Becoming cohorts for someone else's Leadership feat is the best thing that could ever happen to us.
>>
No. 122843 ID: 3abd97

>>122836
I think the bar would be part of the housing costs, at least initially. You probably don't make a profit right away, and there would be start-up costs.

>To be fair, that’s pretty much what we did in Ecton;
I'd say Ekton was more action-movie charging into a situation half-cocked and coming out on top than heist-movie hitting a target the heroes prepared for that wasn't ready for them.

Dealing with the neogi who chewed up the griffins could be either, if we take that mission, depending on how we prepare, how much information we can get in advance, and if we're actually capable of dealing with it. From what little information we have, I was still rating them as too sticky target, but I might be undervaluing Azarthraine too much again. Although I was wondering if we might be able to pull off that mission by talking to them. Viste or Prisoner might give us an in as fellow aliens.

>>122837
>visit the dream realm
I wonder if that one is still available, wasn't there a lot of prep time involved? They needed 150 people and 3 months for... something. >>/questarch/782970

>Becoming cohorts for someone else's Leadership feat is the best thing that could ever happen to us.
I certainly don't disagree with the advantages you laid out. The point I was trying to make was that I felt like it would reflect poorly on us if we were content to be dead weight cohorts.

As JL responded in >>/quest/882021 , we'd still be helping out, just offscreen, so that objection of mine has already been laid to rest.
>>
No. 122846 ID: d22dc0

>>122843
>Bar is part of the cost

I'm not sure what this means- I was implying Maru puts her money into getting a bar, then we can stay in the bar free of charge. She wouldn't be charging the fire hawks room and board, and also wouldn't be trying to profit if she can afford the space outright; I don't think she would want to deal with the hassle of rent and upkeep, so maybe somewhere in the city won't work since they probably don't just let you buy land. The point isn't to establish a business, but rather to have her own space. Never having to worry about other peoples rules, making money to eat, etc, is an appealing prospect, perhaps moreso if you've never had that kind of security, or if you're looking to regain it after having experienced loss.
>>
No. 122849 ID: 2007b6

>>122846
How about Maru, Vos, and anyone else feeling disenchanted with the mercenary lifestyle cash out their shares and set up a little frontier outpost/caravan resupply point, similar to Zelkor's Ferry? Could even try resettling Rook's Vineyard. To run a truly independent settlement, you'd need at least a thousand gold worth of appropriate supplies, and ten people who can be trusted to make important decisions eight hours a day, one week a month.
1)Somebody to be in charge overall,
2)somebody to represent commoner interests and plan parties,
3)somebody to command the military,
4)somebody to handle the more diplomatic side of foreign policy,
5)somebody in charge of religion,
6)somebody to keep records,
7)a spymaster,
8)a tax collector,
9)chief of police, and
10)sheriff/border patrol.
There are a few other optional roles, but don't worry about those yet, it'll probably be hard enough keeping the main ones filled. They don't have to all be PCs, and it IS possible to hold down such a job while still going on adventurers during those other three weeks in the month, but it'd be sensible to have a second-in-command ready when taking significant risks, so the place doesn't fall apart due to vacancy penalties if you're captured or incapacitated.

>>122837
>Worth noting, you did throw out the entire Act I quest, along with the characters we as players put our own time and effort into,
Want to bring those characters back? Maru might be more comfortable as the one running some part of Marijke's secret pirate cove peaceful, legitimate, politically-neutral, and completely uninteresting lakeside town - possibly organized along the lines of her old tribe. (A democracy, commune, or large family still needs some administration, however limited the leaders' formal authority might be, just to function at any scale beyond a dozen people or so and avoid tearing itself apart with internal disputes.)
>>
No. 122850 ID: d22dc0

>>122849
Ultimately I think I would enjoy doing that, but not Maru- not really much of a society builder, at least not at this point in her life. More of a rockstar looking to own a penthouse suit so she can party 24/7 and not worry about the groceries instead of someone looking to settle down; I'd like to try to refine her into a more fun character for no. On that note, Riv was one of my all time favs, and would definitely be into building a town that she can power trip over while pursing her alchemical goals, although I don't really need to play 4 characters presently. I also seemed to be one of the outliers whos interested in town building and management.
>>
No. 122856 ID: 2007b6

>>122850
Well, if she's willing to spend only about 75% of the time partying, the remainder reserved for planning future festivities and having various screaming arguments about potential dangers to her new family, that could fit the 'counselor' role (#2 on that list). Fiddly paperwork stuff can be delegated, the really important parts of any leadership role are strategic decisionmaking and social maintenance.
>>
No. 122859 ID: 3abd97

>>122846
I meant a bar would have recurring costs (rent and/or mortgage, repairs and maintenance, supplies, payroll, taxes, insurance, licenses, bribing health inspectors, etc), much the same as the Fire Hawks have a monthly upkeep cost to keep the company running. (Which could possibly all be rolled into one upkeep cost, if the company owned the bar, or not, if Maru set it up separately). Ideally the bar makes money too, but I wouldn't expect it to pay for itself right out of the gate.

I assume it would mostly abstract out to "is my bar making money this month" and either collecting the profits or paying off the differences, possibly making decisions or taking actions to try and help it along (deciding how to deal with the random encounters a small business attracts. Flour's price went up! The tourist season went bust! The teetotalers are gaining influence! What do?).

On the broader subject of PCs settling down and making places, I'd say such goals are probably consistent with what Dav's trying to do. She'll need holdings somewhere eventually, and friends and allies would be a good thing to have on one's turf (or at least established). Granted, I was planning on working on building up wealth and influence adventuring for a while first, but vague plans can get revised fast depending on what opportunities we stumble across.

>>122849
I wouldn't object if you used Marijke for background filling or world building in that way (settling down in gaudy luxury after enough adventuring success, or in between campaigns, would suit her just fine. Every pirate's cove needs a governor's mansion, right?), but I'm not really interested in playing through it myself in detail while I've got Dav, Rhea and Lute going.
>>
No. 122881 ID: 20ea96

>>122849
>Want to bring those characters back?
I believe "Sir" Garaile has been largely supplanted, (and I never had much fun playing him anyway), so I'm fine with letting the paladin remain as Marijke's hired muscle. I didn't know what kind of campaign it would be when I created him, and honestly, he was probably always more suited to being a background character.

That said, I would certainly still be interested in bringing Ravenous Llyr back into the fray. I put a lot of thought into that shark man and was very sorry to see him go. It was very liberating to step into his head and enjoy being intentionally careless and airheaded for a change.
>>
No. 122882 ID: 094652

I'm going to retroactively claim that Hore used her money and time to build portable ladders and bulwarks. The ladder has a set of hinges with Dracocracy-approved screwing mechanisms, which hold it in place at the bottom and can be kicked down at the top. Great for escaping from hordes with an intelligence of 3 or less. She only made two bulwarks, and gave them to other party members due to their weight, but she also got them enchanted with basic defenses, with an emphasis on partial resistance to death spells. The enchantments lightly cover past the bulwark, so they can shoot flashing lights out to scare off the D.R.B.s without worrying about an instakill death ray. Any remaining time Hore had was dedicated towards science research. And fapping.

>>122849
Hore's a mercenary, through and through. The only thing that could distract her from a life of violence is a way out of this universe. Any money she makes is used primarily for scientific research instead of investments - partially because a certain harpy girl does the investing for her whenever they meet, mostly because of her low wisdom stat. However, time with the Fire Hawks has given her some understanding of how important an investment can be, beyond monetary gain, so she's willing to invest early if it means she'll get more science done in the long run. She'll leave it to Maru and the others.
>>
No. 122885 ID: d22dc0

We're here now, but I seem to have misunderstood the nature of the time skip because I was expecting to jump straight to the front office and have a team meeting of what to do next; I'll probably want to play catch up on important story and finance details in the disc thread since it' more malleable and less play-by-play. Important points, off the top of my head are

- Company earnings and personal dividens. In that vein, Maru blew a hefty chunk of money on nice adventuring clothes; maybe pinning down exactly what that means would be helpful for me.

- Potential character changes: I've already been over some of my thoughts and feelings on where Maru is at vs where I want her to be in terms of character/personality. Might be nice to flesh that out. Feels like she's running against the grain here so I'd either like to push her towards fitting in with the crew better or something more drastic possibly.

- Resolving the situation with the sorceress. This is probably more important to at least clarify, since on the outside extra spell casting NPCs are valuable for a dungeon raid, even though I don't think she's made the rank of Fire Hawk. Got important stuff to address with Dav there as well- if there's no promised reward, then all the drama IC and OOC revolving around her takes on a important evolution.

- I don't recall how to spell either the name or the military ranking, but the other firehawk who's a struggling Orc currently seems important to address, given that their performance in the dungeon will likely be impacted by their mental state.

- There was a mixed bag of opinions on bringing back the boss, so sorting out how he feels and how we're being treated back home is important.

- Overhead costs- it's about time to pay out again, and we don't have any more blood rubies to work with. Gotta do something about that.

Other stuff will come up as we play I'm sure, but I think these things should be addressed sooner rather than later.

On that topic, it's sounding like the idea of a company bar is actually appealing to some people- if it's the firehawks, and not just Maru's then that changes things up a bit, but depending on how exacting people are being over costs and shares, that could still be something Maru wants to throw money behind. If it's mainly Maru though, she might want to save up a bit and go for something more expensive- same bar, but out in some wilderness no one owns yet, with a teleportation option nearby to go conveniently between the Firehawks HQ and her home base. That way she doesn't really have to worry about property tax and land ownership, she can just claim the bar as her own outright. I don't remember anyone else being Particularly motivated to pursue this, but I really like the options JamesLeng presented for going into the woods and claiming territory. Think it would be nice to actually do something with them.
>>
No. 122888 ID: 3abd97

>>122881
Oh, that could be cool. Off the top of my head, seeing Llyr interact with Vos or Nin could be very entertaining.

>Intervening events, including resupply issues such as selling the Efficient Quiver or Ji's follow-up on the dreamscape expedition, can be addressed as flashbacks.
>>122885
Yeah, I've got a list of things to work out if we've already passed Passholdt, that largely overlaps with yours.

Payout: money from the escort mission, liquidating the quiver, and the immovable rod (assuming we earned the bonus on the second leg). Relatively simple to automate, or to roll for the sales.

Division of funds: A little messier. We can divide that payout (1) into company coffers (to cover rent and upkeep for the next several months, in case we don't get back quick, and/or to have money set aside for reincarnations), (2) into buying supplies for this trip, (3) payout to party members to do with as they wish. We could automate this / leave it to Azarthraine, but it would be nice to know our budget if anyone wants to have bought new toys for dungeon delving.

Follow up to 2 and 3 would be saying what we brought / bought, but that's relatively simple to do retroactively.

Are we bringing Esmeraude to the dungeon? Or Prisoner? If so, we've moved beyond either providing labor or favors in exchange transportation, and they probably would deserve (probationary?) membership or sub-contractor status. Unless you're a slave, that's the kind of thing you get paid for.

I'd like to finally use Renown, and tie to the area near our home base, although that assumes we spent at least a week in Passholdt.

It seems reasonable we would have tried to look up Eric (very mission relevant), Helen (missing teammate who's supposed to be in the area) and Deros Frist / Yikk Tasst (also in the area, potentially an enemy, a spy, and someone worth keeping aware of at least).

Would be nice to know if Oldaric was able to afford anything to help their situation.
>>
No. 122893 ID: d22dc0

>>122888
If it matters at all, Maru doesn't really like or trust the sorceress. An equal mix of thinking her untrustworthy, combined with her keeping company with "bad people", topped off with a bit of jealousy over her seeming to get all the action and attention, despite her "obvious flaws". Not really jealous of the specific people, but rather, Maru's perceived lack of any sort of fulfilling side activities. "Everyone's giving the unstable magic dynast time when all I get I yelled at" kinda deal. Which, upon typing that, is exactly the kind of stuff I ant to move away from in the future. It occurs to me that perhaps my OOC character inability to handle certain things well is informing my IC problems instead of the other way around. Gonna have to think about how I want to address that.
>>
No. 122894 ID: 2007b6

>>122859
>I'm not really interested in playing through it myself in detail
Kingdom rules are pretty granular. Smallest unit of time is a month, smallest unit of area is a couple hundred people living and working in a 750' wide square, and any asset worth less than a thousand gold is liable to be lost in rounding error. It's meant to be handled as a background activity between adventures, or occasional source of new hooks, boiling down the leadership and development into a handful of key stats (economy, loyalty, stability, unrest) and large-scale decisions. If you're starting out with very limited assets, those decisions are even simpler because there's hardly anything on that scale you can actually afford without saving up for several months.
>>122881
>That said, I would certainly still be interested in bringing Ravenous Llyr back into the fray. I put a lot of thought into that shark man and was very sorry to see him go. It was very liberating to step into his head and enjoy being intentionally careless and airheaded for a change.
Maybe he shows up as a laborer on the cargo ship, helping haul stuff through Viste's portals, then sticks around after overhearing the prospect of violence?
>>122888
>Are we bringing Esmeraude to the dungeon?
Rumor has it the Tenebrous Bandersnatch is allied to some extent with goblins in a cave connected to the Bloodmist Labyrinth. She'd be able to identify usable bandersnatch quills on sight, and one of those is the last ingredient she needs to be able to construct that item she promised you.
>Or Prisoner?
For about three thousand gold, you could acquire an off-the-shelf https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/rings/ring-of-sustenance and then have Esmeraude and Filo work together to modify it, adding something similar to the functions of a https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/rings/dungeon-ring and some very minor acid resistance. Give that to Prisoner in exchange for a formal oath of fealty, and when he crawls inside somebody, they'll gain the food and sleep benefits too. Esmeraude would be willing, even eager, to accept such a parasite if it meant the hole in her heart would be filled with round-the-clock cuddling.

>Would be nice to know if Oldaric was able to afford anything to help their situation.
Once you're back in Passholdt local subsidies (along with the company's mandatory Tragic Miscellany Insurance) cover the cost of a pair of sturdy gauntlets, transformative effects of which mitigate the sergeant's dysphoria to a tolerable level http://ctenophorae.com/post/44921681537/
>>
No. 122909 ID: 3abd97

>>122893
>Maru's perceived lack of any sort of fulfilling side activities
This might sound dumb but you sorta gotta come up with a fun side activity, or bite the hook for one, if you want one to happen.

>>122894
>Kingdom rules...
Uh, well maybe then? If you really wanna flesh that out. I still feel like I left Marijke in a fairly good break point (the end of one arc, with a nice open ended sailing off to adventure) and like I have enough going on.

>She'd be able to identify usable bandersnatch quills on sight
I'll admit my concerns are less could she be useful and more persistent PC distrust >>122893 , the fact that someone really should be paid for participation in this kind of expedition (along with expected PC reluctance to doing so), and dragging someone who doesn't seem entirely fit to make her own decisions into that kind of danger.

>For about three thousand gold[...]
That sounds pretty cool, actually, and manages to leash two potentially problematic but useful npcs at once. But that's a fair chunk of cash coming out of the company coffers at once, and spent on npcs. I don't see that flying with the group.
>>
No. 122911 ID: d22dc0

As long as Maru gets enough Money to stay fed, drunk, and dry, she won't really complain if you're spending big on NPCs. It's not hard to view wit as investing in assets, especially when said assets are turned from consistent danger into reliable team members.

As for perusing plot hooks, it feels to me like I consistently give two or three side activities I want to pursuing, and don't often hear back. Pretty much every stop Maru makes some effort to get in contact with her family, and the drinking partying gambling charity options I regularly go with seem like just as much an invitation for side hooks as Davina going out on the town looking for someone to share her bed. It's certainly possible my memory is being selective, and I really don't want this to be a critique of anyone or anything; rather, I guess I'm just trying to defend myself and say that I've given it my best shot.
>>
No. 122913 ID: 2007b6

>>122911
>don't often hear back
Yeah, I haven't been following up on that as well as I should be. I tend to slip into thinking of carousing as more of a "cash goes in, XP comes out" transaction rather than a minigame in it's own right, though, and there's only so much I can do with looking for rumors of a particular orcish bandit group in areas where there aren't any significant numbers of bandits or orcs.
>>
No. 122919 ID: d22dc0

>>122913
Like I said, that wasn't a criticism, I think you're doing a fantastic job thus far and I'm pleased as punch. That was more meant to be emblematic of Maru focusing on the negatives and feeling like the odd one out. She doesn't understand why she gets "berated for trying to help" when the sorceress, who we professed had a proverbial knife to our throat during the cargo run, isn't "treated accordingly". If her very presence is a threat to lives and livelihood, why would you want to keep her on while those of us who are loyal and express goodwill aren't treated nearly so warmly.

Obviously its a skewed perspective, and we can fudge the numbers and bit and say things have happened during the final leg back, but without any character growth hooks to latch onto I'm still playing Maru in the post-betrayal mindset.

If we have time, should we get started on that list of topics to address? What was our promised payment? $1,000 bucks and an immovable rod? What do we need to roll to negotiate getting our full cut? I'm assuming this is Davinas territory.
>>
No. 122927 ID: e9490d

>>122919
*gold pieces, not dollars.
>>
No. 122929 ID: 3abd97

>>122919
>What was our promised payment?
We started the trip with 200 gold on hand, some of which will have been spent on travel expenses.

~650 gold direct payment from the shipping company, but the exact value might fluctuate. If I remember right it scaled per the number of defenders and we added people. They might also try to dock us for something.

1 immovable rod (~5000 gold resale vale), assuming we earned the bonus over the timeskip.

800 gold worth of bounds. (Not a new payment, but there might be a good chance to sell them in Pasholdt).

The Efficient Quiver needs to be sold in the black market (~1500 gold).

We also have a bunch of extra Q-rations, since the shipping company agreed to feed Dav and Viste, but she's only been eating for 1. Although some of those spares have gone to feeding Prisoner since he was picked up. (Probably easier to just hold onto those than to try and sell them).

Several of those things will probably need people rolling on them and/or playing flashbacks to determine how good a deal we get. (If you want Viste-Maru bonding time, want to come along to the black market meet for the Quiver? Viste was point of contact with the guy, but she can't touch the quiver, and with a bandit background, Maru may have dealt in that kind of world before).

Fire Hawks company rent / upkeep is 140 gold a month, if you want to worry about budgeting money to leave behind.

Oh, and the exchange rate is about 1 gold to $400, since we throw both units around a lot.
>>
No. 122930 ID: d22dc0

Okay so not as much gold on hand as I was expecting, but still reasonable if we can get a fair price for everything. All in all that would be a little over 8000 gold on a flat rate- if we low ball it, I think us getting less than 7000 for our troubles is unlikely. From there we have, in no particular order:

Company
Big A
Sad Orc
Acolyte
Maru
Davina
Hore
Vos
Viste
Ji
The agate
The second agate
Esmeraude?

There’s a precedent for giving out even shares to everyone involved. We could either give the company coffers it’s own share, or like 5-10% off the top; other options are available but those are what stick out to me. So rough ballpark gives us at least 525 to work with, closing in on 600+ if we give less to the company and roll better for our loot.

And, since I’m thinking about it, the agates would probably either do work at home base or go out and find a good use for their money since no one is actively controlling them right now- extra assests are great and if their PC ever wants to come back I’m sure it would be easy to re-introduce them, but it’ll be easier to parse it down if we give them their earned pay and let them roam free for a bit.

Even at the lowest rate the company still has enough money for rent + the medical treatments needed, but not for the sorceress alien surgery. Could pay out at a stand rate instead of shares, giving company members an hourly wage basically, and keep the majority of the money in the company coffers, but that’s not a great option for people like Ji who are legitimately interested in making big bucks. Something like a 500 gold annual salary for active duty would still be within the realms of middle class wealth- enough that you never have to worry about food and shelter, but could still be rendered homeless by poor planning, and clearly not comparable with the wealth of the rich. Also means that dry times hit the company harder since there’s a baseline obligation instead of a percentage system. We could parse down the list if we decide to go against Esmeralde and Davina either claims to pay Viste out of her personal fund for services rendered, or some other explanation for why she doesn’t need two shares. Could even frame it as a charitable donation to the company if you want to gain favor. I as a PC don’t care if you take two shares, it just seems likely to me that Davs nature will be discovered at some point (not really sure how it hasn’t been already) so that could be a complication later down the road. Even though she’s not particularly interested in accounting, Maru wouldn’t be excited to find out that Davina had been lying to everyone to take advantage of them. Does anyone else have thoughts on the money breakdown? None of this is concrete until we roll for the details but it’ll speed things along for when we get our real numbers.

I’m happy to send Maru to the backroom deal with viste, does Ji want to accompany Davina to sort out the payment and bonus, given how instrumental he was in negotiating with the Bosun?

And, tacked on as an afterthought, I as a PC don’t have a problem with keeping the sorceress on- if we want her involved, I’ll just say Maru got over herself in Thebes last two months and isn’t going to be a total pain over it.
>>
No. 122932 ID: 3abd97

>>122930
Oh I forgot to consider Acolyte Galanodel's share, good point. Hers might be larger since she wasn't there to get her share in Overmire, or at a lower rate since she's not taking the same kinds of risks. I'll just assume the company already has a policy as to how much non-field agents get.

Could possibly add Prisoner to that list if we do recruit it for dungeon delving, although for the escort mission the arrangement seems to be transportation / witness protection in exchange for spilling information on its former bosses, without other payment. (Plus a healthy side of exciting adventure).

Helen might also be owed some back pay for the short while she was with the group, and for recovering Azarthraine's remains.

>as a PC don’t care if you take two shares, it just seems likely to me that Davs nature will be discovered at some point (not really sure how it hasn’t been already) so that could be a complication later down the road.
That's much of the reason she made sure to avoid double billing the last time we divided spoils, yeah. She's maintaining the dual personas for personal reasons, not to rip off her allies.

At least no one seems to think Filo needs a share the way the pirate party thought Eadric deserved one. That'd be triple dipping- or quadruple if payroll counted Filo's millipede Dav-form and flying and glowing Viste-form as separate creatures.

>Viste out of her personal fund for services rendered, or some other explanation for why she doesn’t need two shares
Mysterious personal arrangement neither is willing to share the details of, I was thinking. Between oaths of service and magical bindings there's probably plenty of incorrect assumptions people can draw there.

>the agates would probably either do work at home base or go out and find a good use for their money since no one is actively controlling them right now
Maybe not leave the Agates out of it- Archivist did come back right before JL was forced to put the thread on hiatus.
>>
No. 122933 ID: fc3fc0

>>122932
Good point about prisoner, for some reason I wasn't thinking about them as a potential, despite their obvious person-hood. A little yikes on my part. As for filo, well, Riv wasn't there for the Familiar earns pay discussion, but she'd happily let Marjike take two if it meant Riv would get double as well. Personally though it does seem as if familiars are an extension and expression of self.

Yeah the goal is not to exclude archivist, but rather to cut down on the extra managing and also cut company costs- a short sabbatical of undefined length would make it easy for the twins to jump back in when archivist is available.

Helen could certainly earn some pay, although since we're out in the field it would be inconvenient to do so now. Maybe leave it up to strngy to have her ask for something in game before we make a move? Helen seems less Ascetic than Vos- although I would swear theres a word that applies to money specifically, not just pleasures in general. Any help on that? It's bugging me not being able to find the term I want to use since Ascetic isn't really fitting in this instant.

500g + would hopefully be enough to open up a property though, so that something I can defiantly consider. While e're making these rolls and drawing up a company charter, does anyone else want in on the "bar"? Might not be a reality quite yet, but if we get another big payout from the dunegon that'd be enough to cement this a legitimate option for Maru.
>>
No. 122934 ID: 20ea96

>>122930
>does Ji want to accompany Davina to sort out the payment and bonus
Yes, not necessarily because of the bosun, but because he considers it important to ensure he is being paid sufficiently. He absolutely won't settle for anything less than an even share relative to the other party members. That means he expects to be paid the same as the person on the team receiving the highest pay. Give him any less than that without a reason he'll accept, and he'll quit the Fire Hawks for good and turn his back on anyone still a member, considering himself cheated out of his valuable services. It is important enough to be his low ambition after all. If you want a party member you can easily cheat with a lopsided share, pick up Ravenous Llyr.
>>
No. 122935 ID: d22dc0

I don’t think anyone was intending to cheat Ji and/or you- is there a particular reason you’re worried about that? Or was that more of a “just in case” info dump like the kinds I’ve been giving? I would also question if, in the instance not everyone got equal shares, it could categorically be considered cheating Ji, although in this particular trip Ji has done a tremendous amount of legwork so I can’t think of a reason he’d earn less off the top of my head. We’re currently looking at 7-8 thousand gold split between 10-14 parties so Ji can expect at least 500 gold payout from our gig, and if we skim on company funds and get lucky, close to 700+ so it’s a fair sum. Like magey said, with the dollar coversion that’s more than the average American doctor could expect to make in a year at the low guess, and maybe time and a half if we end up on the high payout, so that’s a good use of four months I’d imagine.

We might also want to put away some money for the Sage who’s house we were explicitly involved in the destruction of, although I doubt we could afford to replace that library even with our sum total pay. There’s also the matter of the Ochre coat, did we recover that? The sword was tragically never found but that would have been worth a significant sum I’m sure, so if Esmeraude has any way to track it down that might be a worthwhile investment. Even if it’s just a +1, which I assume is lowballing it, that’s still nothing to scoff at.
>>
No. 122936 ID: 2007b6

>>122930
>Something like a 500 gold annual salary for active duty would still be within the realms of middle class wealth
Looking at the GURPS cost of living rules, forty gold per year is enough for Status 1, the upper end of 'middle class.' Five hundred gold per year is enough for Status 3, up there with landed knights and guildmasters or the mayor of a major modern city, one step (and about a factor of four or five in income) below the lower ranks of nobility. In fact, cost of living at that level would only be 360 gold per annum, so you could be building up investments and contingency plans, too... or indulging some very expensive vice, or some other substantial costs above and beyond 'keeping up appearances.'

Status three means you live in something that could usefully be described as a mansion, with enough servants that you probably don't know them all personally, and routinely have the finest food, drink, clothing, etc. that money can usefully buy. 'Upper class' goes a lot further up, in order-of-magnitude increments, but at that point you've definitely got your foot in the door.

And that's if 500 gold is your annual income. Somebody who can bring in that much every couple months is doing better than the average Baron. Eighteen thousand gold per annum, or 1,500 per month, is enough to support Status 5, the range of big-shot nobles like counts, marchessas, and dukes. Typical feudal income distribution with that much money coming in would be the boss is Status 5, and top henchmen are Status 3 knights. This is sort of an unusual situation, though, where Azarthraine's trying to dig himself out of a hole, rebuild the company, and rescue various lost allies rather than pursue purely personal glory, so how about everybody gets a personal dividend/expense account of, say, twenty gold per month (four is enough to maintain Status 1, or 7.5 for Status 2, leaving plenty of slack for adventuring gear and even minor magic items), the remainder going into company-wide expenses, such as shared expedition supplies and raising the dead? Anybody can propose uses for the pool, but something big or highly personalized (such as tailored, and thus non-interchangeable, plate armor) should be put to a vote.

>>122935
>There’s also the matter of the Ochre coat, did we recover that? The sword was
Esmeraude recovered all of her retainer's personal effects. Leaving them with someone trustworthy for safekeeping or nondestructive analysis might be tolerable, but if you want to throw that stuff in with pooled company assets or auction it off, you'd probably have to kill her first, or bamboozle her so thoroughly with bardic fast-talk that she'd be equally willing to chop off both of her own arms.
>>
No. 122939 ID: fc3fc0

>>122936
In terms of upper class I was making the connection between our income brackets and the resulting quantity of gold, but I suppose its a bit of a false equivalent here given that its two different societies. 500g or $200,000, a little above the average pay for an american doctor, was what I was putting at the sort of "top" of the middle class; As mentioned, it's enough that you never have to want for food care or shelter, but if you're careless a single natural disaster could leave you destitute. This would be difficult though, as almost anyone would have some sort of savings and investments at this level of capital.

As for 20 gold a month, Maru would be fine with it but honestly as a PC I find it a little boring. What exactly does Azarthraine and/or the company need thousands of gold in the bank for? Not saying its a bad idea, saving up is definitely wiser than splurging, I'm just curious if the lizard wizard has planned investments or if we're just playing things safe by not buring 3 million dollars as soon as we get on shore leave.
>>
No. 122943 ID: 2007b6

>>122939
>What exactly does Azarthraine and/or the company need thousands of gold in the bank for?
Dead teammates isn't reason enough? A thousand gold per head is the 'bargain bin' option there, with significant risk of complications.

Reusable magic items with significant military or industrial applications tend to cost at least that much, might want to buy some of those at some point. Probably other stuff.
>>
No. 122949 ID: 3abd97

>>122934
Pretty sure we're agreed on equal shares for party members. The big question is more how much of the funds we put in the "Company Assets and Operations" pot, and how much in the "Payout to Party Members" pot.

>>122935
>We might also want to put away some money for the Sage who’s house we were explicitly involved in the destruction of
Okay my position here is best summarized as "lolno".

Helen had Deros Frist's permission to attempt to open that dangerous lock, he understood the possible consequences of failure, and we made every reasonable effort to mitigate the damage. We don't accept liability for that. Plus I don't feel a need to fund a spy who's supposedly not friendly to my interests. Yikk Tasst already made good on that exchange anyways when he got wish-ported to the past and right next to Passholdt.

>What exactly does Azarthraine and/or the company need thousands of gold in the bank for?
>>122943
4 (most likely) dead Fire Hawks still need rezs, buffer for medical costs if anything happens to us, certainty we're not going to fail to pay our bills if we're late getting back, and, buying stuff to make sure missions go right.

>>122936
>everybody gets a personal dividend/expense account of, say, twenty gold per month [...], the remainder going into company-wide expenses, such as shared expedition supplies and raising the dead? Anybody can propose uses for the pool, but something big or highly personalized (such as tailored, and thus non-interchangeable, plate armor) should be put to a vote.
I'm fine with that in the short term, and that's close enough to how we handled things in Overmire. (Everyone got 50 gold, and we agreed to spend company funds on the druid's rez and recommendation deal, and the magic garden).

Also if we handed out 500 gold to everyone right now I feel like figuring out how to best invest an order of magnitude more funds than I did before in gear upgrades and personal expenses would take me a while.

Longer term, I would hope eventually we'd be able to start pulling in more.

>Selling off Esmeraude's retainer's personal effects.
Yeah you're getting a hard no from Dav there. Ripping off highly personal keepsakes / valuables from someone ostensibly in our care isn't acceptable. (To say nothing of the fact it would be completely counterproductive to trying to turn her into an asset instead of an inconvenience).
>>
No. 122950 ID: fc3fc0

>>122949
The only real problem I have with a standard monthly pay is that a precedent is set for standard rates even if we end up taking lucrative jobs.

What about an agreement to live on salaried pay until the point that we have enough money to cover resurrection of all party members at X standard rate of resurrection expense, + 3 years rent? Means that for the foreseeable future, while we rebuild the company, we save most of our money, but after we build up enough of a cushion we then switch to a share model, and either give the company share(s), or a percentage off the top, with people not involved in actually earning the money still receiving the minimum stipend.

I'd also suggest 25 gold standard rate, so that way we're not earning less after the boss comes back. 50 gold for the first two months and 50 gold for the second two.

And I had thought Ji got the garden- is it company space? Because if so Maru would like to utilize it.
>>
No. 122951 ID: 3abd97

>>122950
>And I had thought Ji got the garden- is it company space? Because if so Maru would like to utilize it.
We paid for the space with group funds (since we thought of several benefits of having it, and Ji couldn't afford it on his own) but Ji's in charge of the space and managing his garden.

Several party members expressed interest in spending time in the garden, or helping tend to it, for recreational or therapeutic purposes.
>>
No. 122957 ID: d22dc0

Does anyone have strong feelings on a discord for discussing in game ideas that might not be relevant for new-comers, like arguments over how to interpret character actions as I've engaged in many times before, or this current argument that I'm sure is about to start over whether or not we've been supportive of Yisheng Ji? Feels to me like the ability to IM might make disputes faster and easier to work through since we can clarify on the fly and proceed in real time.
>>
No. 122962 ID: 3abd97

>>122957
I'm at least idling on irc most the time if anyone wants to talk to me, not really into discord. I don't see any problem with plays talking among themselves if they want to, but any significant decisions should probable be mirrored in the threads for other people's benefit.

>>/quest/884011
I don't have the will or the time to attempt to rebut this by listing every time every person who wasn't Ji contributed to getting the group out of the dungeon alive, contributing to Ji's survival in ways he wouldn't have been capable of by himself. Frankly, that's a thankless exercise.

I feel like I spent the whole escort mission herding cats and trying to convince PCs to stick with the mission and I'm sick of it. Tunic, I like playing with you, but if you can't think of a reason for Ji to be there or work with the others, that's your call. I hope you have fun with Ji either in the group or going solo, and/or with Llyr.
>>
No. 122965 ID: d22dc0

I’ve had several character ideas pass through me but I wanted to note one down. The major idea was a mutation that turned the character into another being with the change between sunlight and moonlight, and a power that went with the changes. During the daytime, they could take something real and turn it fake, crystallizing the realism into a small delicate object. If the crystal is destroy, then whatever realism it had stored would be released. The alter ego can do the reverse during the night, and turn fake things real. Some examples off the top of my head included turning a stab wound into a fake wound, or a toy sword into a real one, that sort of thing. As for class, I was thinking some sort of super natural detective, with a love for the forest. Didn’t wanna draw up any details without getting a run down on any changes that need to be made, but overall I was inspired by stereotypical traveling fortune tellers, that one storyline in oglaf, and Duck Newton from TAZ: Ammesty.
>>
No. 122983 ID: 3abd97

>>/quest/884141
>And in any case, I certainly haven't seen this level of protest when Maru decided to run off and become a bartender. A bit of a double standard, no?
Not at all. Santova didn't make a recent series of confrontational posts listing his every past grievance with the party, real, imagined or exaggerated, demanding the others give him reason to participate in spite of them. So I didn't see the need to protest that behavior.

I don't know if the persecution complex here is IC or OCC, but in any event, I'm not interested in assuaging it. You're welcome to play with us if you want to. But I'm not going to spend my time trying to talk you into it over your litany of complaints.

>It's that he wants solid confirmation the team has put any sort of thought at all into the expedition before throwing themselves into certain mortal danger, rather than simply winging it
As I said before
>Any suggestions you might have on specific preparations to counter known dangers are certainly welcome.
I'd be a lot more interested in listening to your suggestions on how to improve things than trying to satisfy outraged demands we be prepared.


I'll bottom line it here- playing a scenario is fun. Trying to convince a frustrated player to participate in the scenario? Not fun. Also not my job.

So stop trying to put the burden of your participation on us. It's not our job to give you reason to participate.
>>
No. 122984 ID: add037

No longer feeling gun shy about abusing my OOC questions. What happened during that month while Helen was interfacing with the subterrene?

Also totally off-subject, but I read Forsaken and it's pretty great. Thanks for the recommendation magey
>>
No. 122987 ID: 20ea96

>>122983
>Santova didn't make a recent series of confrontational posts listing his every past grievance
No, but he did demand one from me, to which I complied. (See >>/quest/883869 ) I certainly wouldn't have done so otherwise.

>>122983
>playing a scenario is fun
But why does the scenerio have to be "throw ourselves into the pit with no plan and hope for the best"? I'd be happy to participate in the scenario, I was just hoping to participate intelligently in the scenario, with an actual IC discussion beforehand, befitting rational individuals. I don't want to just roll dice, add +3 to damage, "today we play the labyrinth module" like a boardgame. I want to treat my character as an actual character, with real thoughts and feelings. I just don't understand why only my character is concerned about danger or strategy? Shouldn't everyone be involved with that? Realistically, none of the party members should delight in suicidally throwing themselves into a place they already barely escaped once without so much as a hint of doing anything differently than the first time through. Why is that so strange of a request?
>>
No. 122988 ID: d22dc0

>>122987
I'm sorry, I didn't intend to demand anything from you, I struggle oftentimes conveying myself online. That's my bad, and had I known that it made you feel as though you were being forced I would have tried to be more considerate, and chosen my words more carefully. Any tips or tricks to avoid that kind of situation again in the future would go a long way towards making that good intent into something useful, with meaningful ramifications.

>why only my character is concerned about danger or strategy
He's not. Obviously Lizard Wizard, Davina, and Maru are, and I can't speak for other characters but I'd assume so as well. If your concern is that we haven't done enough prep work, then everyone would just walk home and plan it out before walking back. Why not skip the leg work, avoid doubling back, and just assumed it already happened? Let's make a plan here, then hash it out with JamesLeng and move forward in game.

Also, did everyone assume I'm a guy?
>>
No. 122989 ID: add037

>"throw ourselves into the pit with no plan and hope for the best"
We are in the planning stage right now, at this moment. Still haven't decided which room we're going to excavate our way into.
>>
No. 122998 ID: 2007b6

>>122984
>What happened during that month while Helen was interfacing with the subterrene?
Activated some sort of distress call or auto-return function, got captured by derro/molemen. Honestly hadn't worked out the details myself yet. Basic "alien abduction" premise is a versatile hook for future developments, and it amuses me to have Helen's unstuck-from-history curse mean she's bouncing between the two threads even though they're not synchronized.

>>122987
Playing through all the planning sessions and other preparations in exact chronological order would be tedious and inefficient. That's what the flashback-scene option is for, to cut people some slack on IC retaining and processing information (and making decisions on that basis, including but not limited to acquiring tools for solving specific known problems) that they've OOC forgotten, or never learned in the first place because they didn't grow up in this world.
>I'd be happy to participate in the scenario
Go ahead and do so, then. I chose the words
>>/quest/883006
>Everyone who's still a full-time Fire Hawk
very carefully, such that anyone could say, for example, "Back to the Bloodmist Labyrinth? Nope, not worth it. I'm not going there. Pay out my shares, I quit."
>>
No. 123001 ID: 3abd97

>>122987
I will gladly welcome proactive, constructive planning to increase our odds of success or survival any day of the week.

However, the stuff I'm objecting to I would qualify more as unproductive and confrontational. You immediately declared the effort a suicide mission, announced you would be holding your participation hostage contingent on demands being met, and followed up with a list of grievances and an explanation as to why you character cannot trust ours, presumably unless we talk or bribe him out of it.

OOC, that's aggravating, because you're making demands of the group ("plan the mission in more detail for me, and find a way to make Ji happy while you're at it!") rather than helping plan or figure things out. IC, explaining in detail why you don't trust the others and consider your association with them a net loss is not going to result in anything particularly positive, to put it mildly.
>>
No. 123028 ID: d22dc0

>>123001
Speaking of, we should probably make a shopping list.

So, if we go for the dangers we encountered on the way out, we know there’s magical traps like the chessboard, there’s creatures that’ll deceive us like floating lights or mimicking creatures, there’s undead that are at least semi-intelligent and capable of regeneration as well as floating, there’s large chasms and restrictions to vision, there’s the empty sweeper, still no exact confirmation on what that is or how to deal with it, there’s vision impairments and Death Ray Babies, temporal inconsistencies when separated and lack of directions, there’s an acid pool if I remember correctly and some threats already listed in the thread. Oh also vampires and blood sucking mist which may or may not be related, as well as the potential to run into goblins and burrowing creatures. Possibly massive snakes?

So I guess we should start brainstorming effective counters. A specialist to identify and disable magic traps like the chessboard, and whatever supplies they need would be a good start. And if they die we might get our investment back, so double bonus. Some quick and easy way to identify each other like a call and response would be useful, or better yet, magical communication. A way to detect invisible things and/or see through illusions. Not sure we can afford supplies to counter undead since that’s usually magic items or personal abilities, but if we know of any ways to stop regeneration it might be worth a shot. Lots of pitons and rope for climbing, magical and mundane lighting as well as equipment to mark our passage and alert us if anything passes like noisemakers or magical alarms. Whatever works against vampires, and of course typical food water and bribery goods. If anyone can draw up a list of potentially useful tools and gear that aren’t specific to countering those threats we probably don’t wanna get tunnel vision on just countering what we know. For instance that incense for warding off demons might be helpful, or the clay that makes heat etc.
>>
No. 123032 ID: d22dc0

>>123028
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KAbfDjrCkRkoKCSGJ1qFbrQSpE6KKJdELIBpQMCx5Aw/edit?usp=sharing

The second page is irrelevant but the table includes some of the items I prioritized when creating my pathfinder character Riv, of whom the famous alchemist was a re-imagining of. If anyone's curious I think this list, while perhaps difficult to parse given its items directly from a different system, may have some good dungeoneering supplies.
>>
No. 123033 ID: 3abd97

>>122984
You're welcome!

>>122988
I guess I did? Sorry about that.

>>123028
I think broadly, preparations would break down into:

-Finding solutions for things we don't already have an answer for
-Eliminating single points of failure in what we already have
-Whenever possible, get things with multiple applications / that can apply to different problems

>Some quick and easy way to identify each other like a call and response would be useful, or better yet, magical communication
Call and response signals, or other codewords https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2002-01-03 are easily established, the company would just have to come up with, agree to, and memorize them offscreen. Pretty easy to retroactively define as needed.

As for magical communication: if we decide we can trust and/or control her, Esmeraude has a communication theme. Think we confirmed she has Whisper Web and Sending too.

>there’s the empty sweeper, still no exact confirmation on what that is or how to deal with it
It seems to be a large, mobile gelatinous cube or similar. We know Supreme Disintegration can remove one, but that's an expensive solution. They're transparent, so portaling past them works, if there's sufficient space. They can also be outrun, but then you risk bumping into other threats. Any way to (temporarily?) seal a passage or rapidly deploy a barrier might also be effective, and might be generally useful against other threats as well.

Biggest risk is probably walking into one unawares, but distortions in light can give them away, as can the Bloodmist Labyrinth's namesake effect.

>Not sure we can afford supplies to counter undead since that’s usually magic items or personal abilities [...] Whatever works against vampires
Hmm. Yeah, with the bone eaters around there's a renewable source of flesh puppets, Orcusites in general seem inclined towards necromancy, we know there's a band of vampires down there, plus death babies. As long as we have her, Maria is an anti-undead flamethrower, but we should have some other anti-undead options.

>pitons and rope for climbing
Good to not have the party trapped if the portal maker is down or disabled, yeah. In the same vein, we should probably ask how the original team got down that 400 ft shaft. I suspect the Orcus cultist don't climb it either.

>A specialist to identify and disable magic traps like the chessboard
I suspect hiring a specialist magic trap engineer with tools might reach the point where they're more expensive to employ than they're actually worth or we can afford.

Just being able to identify magic traps might be enough to work around them? Ji has detect magic if he sticks around, and Vos has aura sight.

>Divination
Tunic's point, but we could potentially pay for useful information, although that's a game of "what's the right question to ask at the right cost". Might be worth trying to brainstorm what questions we would really want answered before committing to that.

>goblins / gug
We might also want to consider options for dealing with, communicating with, or avoiding conflict with the local populations. (Poaching Rhea from Team Magic Sword might help there, but that's both OOC and not an option I'm overly fond of as a player).

There's probably other things to consider, but that's enough things to cram in one post.
>>
No. 123040 ID: d22dc0

>>123033
I think that Esmeraude and Prisoner would make good assets, provided we do the treatment to bond them in hopes of making her more stable- at the current moment and time, it seems like if she were given an opportunity to gain power at our expense, say by turning us over to Orcusites in return for a concubine and/or status and resources to rebuild her fallen status, then she'd take it. Let me know what your thoughts are though because I don't think I have an objective view point. Seems like we can neutralize the risk of her betraying us though it'll be worth the cost. And an enslaved master alchemist was like 250 gold working in good conditions, but even in dangerous conditions we might be able to find some kind of subject expert for a one time job for somewhere in that price range. Much more dangerous, but also a one time job with free will etc.

As for the right question, well, we can start by narrowing down our subject; with limited resources we'll probably want limited divination, so focusing our questions on who to target, where to target them, etc. Queen Aaphia might be a good person to divine- would she be worth targeting, what do we need to watch out for, etc. We could also burn OOC questions on these subjects.
>>
No. 123073 ID: d22dc0

>>/quest/884795

Good to have you with us. One thing worth mentioning is that Maru doesn't have a perfect memory- Ji might have no problem remembering 6 code words but upon writing this post I'm already having trouble remembering them all. Other than that, I think your structure and layers are good precautions.
>>
No. 123076 ID: 3abd97

>>123032
Looking over that list quick:
-I don't think ordinary compasses would be reliable in the Bloodmist Labyrinth (space warping and material deposits could mess up the reading).
-Dav/Viste has a feat with roughly the effect of a tanglefoot bag, a cheaper and renewable alternative. Although the item has the advantage in that anyone could use one.

>>123040
>Esmeraude and Prisoner [...] Let me know what your thoughts are though because I don't think I have an objective view point.
I'm wouldn't have expected anyone to call my perspective here objective, but yes, I do think the idea posed >>122894 could be a good one. We some kind of binding oath of service from someone who appears earnest in wanting to work with us but whose nature and former allegiance make it hard to trust, and a check on someone who needs to work on regaining trust / being rehabilitated. It neatly solves two problems, secures two allies, has a lot of possible useful applications, and has the same ballpark price as gaining two new npcs via reincarnations.

>an enslaved master alchemist was like 250 gold working in good conditions
I'm not sure that was entirely legal or market value, and I don't think that includes the necessary specialist tools for working on a magical trap / engineering project of the chess board's complexity. (Also Vos and possibly other party members are going object to buying slaves I think).

>We could also burn OOC questions on these subjects.
If we get anywhere close to the chessboard again my OOC question is probably going to be about how where I need to go / what tile(s) to teleport to in order to grab a wish. :v

>>/quest/884795
>a little taste of power now for eventual horrible transformation and mental slavery later
Given that body horror is a theme of this setting, that's not an unreasonable expectation.

But I'd point out that "here's a taste of power, but I can take it away if you ever cross me" is also an effective way to control people, and it poses an interesting question players may struggle with. Do you really want your freedom, or do you want to keep cool powers?
>>
No. 123083 ID: 2007b6

I'm on Discord, now, by the way. I'd rather stick to discussing Pdn[T]tO related issues here where everyone can see, but it'd be a useful option for other subjects.
>>
No. 123117 ID: d22dc0

I'm curious as to the division of cost of living in this world. If it's $600 bucks a month for food and housing, is there any concrete distribution for that money? My rent is coming up and it was making me think about how my costs are dived up and I got curious to see how the breakdown differs in this setting.
>>
No. 123157 ID: add037

Sorry again about my recent absence.

>discord
Mind if I add you both?
>>
No. 123168 ID: 094652

I made that recent post because the party acted like it was convincing itself through flame wars into blindly marching into the dungeon through the deathtrap path as slowly and dangerously as possible, when there was a profitable and simple
opportunity due to sheer luck. The lack of posts also worried me.

And now Helen demands we stay away, instead of ensuring the subterrene is stable and returned to its owner for a finder's fee.

I know Hore has a bad Charisma but that seems ridiculous.
>>
No. 123170 ID: 3abd97

>>123168
The subterrene is kind of at a weird place for me. Sure, it's potentially a useful asset and plot hook, but it's also absurdly dangerous, and seems like it will take an adventure (or several) worth of technological preparation from a whole crew of characters to use with any kind of safety or predictability.

And neither of my characters are really going to be drawn to that kind of build-up. So I've mostly been content to stand clear and let Nin / Helen / Kent kick it.

>blindly marching into the dungeon through the deathtrap path as slowly and dangerously as possible, when there was a profitable and simple opportunity due to sheer luck.
Profiting from the subterrene comes back to transporting it, which comes back to rolling the dice on ridiculous catastrophe. Personally, I'd rate planning our way around traps we've already largely mapped to be a lot safer.

>And now Helen demands we stay away, instead of ensuring the subterrene is stable and returned to its owner for a finder's fee.
In Helen's defense, if you borrowed friend A's car, went to visit friend B, and then friend B immediately began planning to sell the car back to friend A, I think you'd be upset and start questioning just who your friends were, too.
>>
No. 123172 ID: 094652

>>123170
Except it isn't just a car. To put it in perspective, let's say you meet your friend on the side of the road, and right next to them is the time machine car their wacky professor boss made.

And it is crashed on top of a tree.

And they totally stole it for a joyride.

And the damaged flux capacitor might explode.

And that's Hore's understanding of the situation in a nutshell. At this point, Helen does not have ownership rights of the subterrene she is guarding, and the party could easily overpower her and strip the vehicle for parts, claiming they were reclaiming stolen goods. Hore doesn't want to do that, she wants to learn more about the subterrene, make sure it doesn't go nuclear on Helen, then either keep the subterrene and Helen away from her pissed off boss, or return it to her adventuring party in safe and working condition for a small finder's fee, and try to keep a good word in for Helen so she's forgiven for her expensive joyride, while also earning favors for the Fire Hawks from a boss who is wealthy enough to own this thing in the first place.
>>
No. 123174 ID: 3abd97

>>123172
I can't find any mention of a crash or damage in-thread. It seems to have parked normally (for a subterrene anyways), possibly after Helen exhausted the air supply ( >>/quest/883385 "the cabin tasted like breathing seltzer water" ) although maybe that taste was a side effect of the control system jammed in her brain.

>>/quest/884234
>Only part of the subterrene which holds any possibility of exploding is the power core, a tormented earth elemental. Bindings seem to be stable for the time being.
As for exploding, Hore's own examination found it to be stable!

>strip the vehicle for parts
Break down a complicated volatile magical artifact we don't understand? That sounds even more dangerous than trying to move it.
>>
No. 123179 ID: add037

>>123172
Indeed, the subterrene isn't damaged and if Hore was trying to make some sort of offer of goodwill she did a very terrible job of conveying it.

With her wording it sounded more like she was plotting to take the subterrene and ransom it back. You can't blame Helen for freaking out.
>>
No. 123190 ID: d22dc0

>>/quest/885767
Huh. Not really the reaction I was expecting. Is there an OOC problem I can work towards amending with you Tunic? Or am I reading too much into things?
>>
No. 123192 ID: 3abd97

It was a non-rolled action, which means Maru was effectively phoning it in, and it should have little real chance of messing up an action that was rolled for (and got a good result).

I personally interpreted that as... lazy sarcasm? Like "oh yeah, look out for that" when it was already too late, rather than a real attempt to interfere.
>>
No. 123194 ID: 20ea96

>>123192
>a non-rolled action
A non-rolled action only means you're not putting significant effort into it. It's still an action with consequences. For example, if you sneak into an enemy base at night, and then shout for everyone to wake up, you don't need a roll for that to have a meaningful (and very negative) effect.

>and got a good result
10 is an average result for 3d6. It's right in the middle. Helen rolled better than I did. I really didn't want additional penalties on top of that.

>>123190
I read >>/quest/883135 as you looking for a legitimate IC reason to not have Maru participate in the expedition. Considering you decided to alert the enemy to my sneak attack before a result occurred, possibly costing the company any profit derived from or use of subterrene and/or the lives of our personnel as Helen could detonate it in our faces, I considered that a very legitimate IC reason to have Yisheng Ji complain about you to Davina. So, here's your reason.
>>
No. 123196 ID: d22dc0

>>123192
That was mostly my intent yeah; I saw an opportunity for what I thought was a fun call back >>/questarch/769251 and I took it.

>>123194
>Looking for a legitimate reason for Maru to not participate
Actually I'm hoping for the opposite; JamesLeng already gave us a good out if I wanted to take it, but I decided to just fudge it a little and say Maru came along, for whatever reason. Something something need to earn a bigger paycheck to get my bar built. I'm hoping to keep playing and adventuring.

>you decided to alert the enemy to my sneak attack before a result occurred
Didn't know Helen counted as an enemy, but given my no roll, the intent was not to interfere with your results. I also waited a bit in hopes of making sure they weren't considered simultaneous actions. You already rolled everything relevant before I chimed in. Thought that would mean I wasn't in danger of sabotaging Ji.

>possibly costing the company any profit derived from or use of subterrene and/or the lives of our personnel as Helen could detonate it in our faces
We were just discussing paying Helen, seems a bit rude to rob her, especially given that she's being controlled by an active PC. Hostile workplace environment and all that. Also figured she was bluffing, given her relative disorientation, the fact that she was in a vulnerable position and being threatened.

I also generally just like to give other PCs some wiggle room to smooth things over. Strngy wanted Helen to join us, so I'm willing to look the other way if there's no big conflicts with her joining the party. Personally it just seems like the nice thing to do.

>here's your reason
So, as I understand it, your reason is that you thought I didn't want Maru to participate, so you were helping create a scenario where that's more easily explained in fiction? If that's the case, I appreciate the assist, or the good will or whatever we want to call it. It might help in the future if we can talk that sort of thing out beforehand so that everyone has their ducks in a row.

That doesn't actually answer my question though: Is there an OOC problem I can address or make steps towards rectifying? I feel as though there is sometimes hostility directed towards me but it's entirely possible I'm misreading things, even probable if my prior track record is anything to go by.
>>
No. 123354 ID: d22dc0

>>123196
I want everyone to have a good time, but without a distinct response I'll be mostly operating under the same rules. If, for instance, it's something like "OOC I don't like Maru and am not enjoying playing the game with her in it" I can retire her and try to make someone more palatable. I want everyone to enjoy their time, so if I'm ruining the experience for other people I'd like to be able to do something about it.
>>
No. 123365 ID: add037

Santova, if you want to have Maru leave the Fire Hawks then Vos will probably go with. I'm actually pretty fascinated with the whole plot hook in Rook's Vineyard and would like to check it out but my characters are all tied up in obligations. This'll give the two less mercenary characters a chance to run off and be heroes, and they'll still be pretty close to the main group so could meet up with them if we decide to reunite. Also will solve the current conundrum of giving the survey team somebody to run to for help if nobody returns from the trip into the Bloodmist Labyrinth.
>>
No. 123373 ID: d22dc0

>>123365
I'll keep that in mind as an option! I'm not particularly itchy to split, but I feel like I've upset Tunic, and I'm not sure what specifically I might have done. Given the reactions to her actions, one guess was that the way I played Maru was making the game less fun for Tunic to play, and if that's the case i'll probably remove her ASAP. Otherwise, assuming no one else feels like their game is worse off for her in it, I'll probably keep her with the firehawks for right now, just for the sake of convenience
>>
No. 123385 ID: d10e29

JamesLeng and I were having a discussion of horror and related genres, and eventually wound up talking about white elves. After a bit, I realized that we were discussing game stuff which might benifit from being posted here, so this is mostly copy pasting information relevant to the game- sorry if it doesn't flow super well, I'm trying to editorialize to leave out most of my boring retorts and other unimportant info.

>James Leng:
More generally, I took the opposite tack from Exalted with regard to lethality: there's no way to kill someone so it really, absolutely sticks. Worst case, you can always throw Wishes at the problem. This was established at some length in one of the discussion threads, I think. Part of how the Drakocracy solves problems. So, with the right way of thinking about it, that brings all the horror stuff right back around: When somebody really wants to stop you, assassination isn't good enough. They need to ruin you politically first, destroy your alliances and reputation, crush your legacy, so all those people won't want to bring you right back. "Fates worse than death." Somebody doesn't even necessarily need to be motivated by cruelty and spite to start laying down curses and bindings and torment, it could just be a cold tactical calculation. "What will it take to ensure this enemy of mine actually goes down, and stays down?" Of course, there's also the option of making them your friend, but that kind of thinking might run up against irreconcilable ideological differences. Green elves vs. white elves, for example. I worked pretty hard to make the drow expys morally ambiguous and internally consistent, rather than the more typical fetishistic wickedness, vaguely justified or otherwise.

>Santova:
From the outset the only different we really note is the food differences and the effects that has- reminds me of ideological differences in Christianity, where they seem meaningless or even non-existent to an outsider, but are critical to the professionals within

>James Leng:
Thing is, most of the usual drow aesthetics and behaviors still fall under "food differences and the effects that has." Driders? That's what you get feeding elf kids nothing but q-rations from birth. Living in caves? No need for farmland when you're just conjuring what you need to eat. Sadism, assassination, generally nasty political scene? "Poor impulse control." And all that behavior can be part of a functional society because it's a well-known and understood disability, rather than a religious thing for it's own sake. Somebody can go apeshit with a whip on one of their maids, or have a rival murdered, then afterward say "I'm sorry, I just got so angry, and you know my mom could never afford imported food when I was growing up" and everyone just says "yeah, that sucks, cough up some reparations and we'll move on." And they're doing everything with magic anyway, so putting the pieces back together by magical healing isn't a big deal, it's equivalent to IRL property damage. The usual thing with having cruelty motivated by patronage from the Demon Queen of Spiders just wouldn't work. You know Avatar: the Last Airbender? Imagine a whole city of Azulas. Eventually it would get to the point where most of them are as much of a wreck as Firelord Azula. Then, who's doing the maintenance work on the sewers? That's no way to run a civilization. With the white elven philosophy, the larger goal is something sorta like "let's try building a better world than the one that evolved on it's own, without letting spirits dictate terms to us." So, infrastructure maintenance work might be physically unpleasant, but it doesn't have a social stigma on top of that. They don't equate physical cleanliness with moral worthiness. That sewer's not going to clean itself, unless somebody invents a spell to make it do so. I could probably dig up an appropriate Freefall comic, but honestly it's a recurring theme there. That magic might have undesirable side effects of it's own, though. Situation I'm picturing for the white elven thing is, basically, some magistrate says "alright, you murdered three people. That's not cool. Here's how much that'll cost to fix, here's how much their families are asking for in lost wages, pain and suffering, etc. Have you got that much cash? No? Well, then, community service. Wastewater treatment in sector 7-G has been overworked lately, so I'm sending you to help them out." Then you've got to unclog pipes until they figure you've done enough work to be worth the money. Scrub by hand, throw magic at the problem, whatever, it's the results that count. But if those results include making even more of a mess, that gets added to the bill.

What prompted this was a question I had basically asking for more details on the white elves penitentiary system, and I'm still curious if you don't mind weighing in James Leng.
>>
No. 123386 ID: fc3fc0

Invite link to the official Pdn[T]tO discord server https://discord.gg/ZuGRZKD
>>
No. 123387 ID: 2007b6

>>123385
>a question I had basically asking for more details on the white elves penitentiary system,
The actual question was whether it was similar to the American prison system, and the short answer to that is no. It's important to remember that White elves and Green elves are ethnic/religious groups spread out across what is in many ways a preindustrial world, rather than the two categories corresponding neatly to cohesive modern nation-states.

Insofar as white elven philosophies influence political thought in general and criminal law in particular, long-term imprisonment seldom makes sense. You made a mess? Clean it up, by your own hand or by hiring someone with the necessary skills and doing some other necessary work to cover the cost. Anyone who absolutely can't, or won't even bother trying, to pay the weregild, pull their own weight, and generally contribute somehow as a productive member of society, gets either left behind or broken up for parts. Crimes of passion or necessity often get off relatively easy, but premeditated emotional abuse, embezzlement or other 'white-collar' crimes, even some stuff that we wouldn't consider a crime at all, is regarded as being in the same category with bombing a hospital. Seizing the mechanisms that make life amid such desolation possible at all, in order to twist them into weapons against the people they're supposed to be supporting, for petty personal gain, is an unthinkable atrocity. If somebody who's accused of something like that gets put in a box, it's not as punishment; it's to keep them from being dismembered by an angry mob before the facts of the matter can be established.
>>
No. 123389 ID: d22dc0

>>123387
Redefined it to get closer to the information I actually wanted to know, within the context of the media conveying that information. But that answer does a good job of scratching that itch. I was curious if there was any sort of crime based segregation, and if it was focused more on rehabilitation and re-integration or as a deterrent/"protection" for those in society. You mentioning establishing the facts makes me think of a court system with trials and such- is this common place? Or does that piece of evidence actually point to a different conclusion?
>>
No. 123390 ID: 2007b6

>>123389
>You mentioning establishing the facts makes me think of a court system with trials and such- is this common place?
Well, for a serious offense, something involving premeditation and conspiracy and whatnot, there'd have to be some amount of investigation just to make sure the whole problem was found and identified. Some places have a system, but low population densities don't easily support full-time professional investigators, so among, say, that tribe of owl-riders out in the desert, they'd probably just put a generally respected elder in charge, with assistance from otherwise-uninvolved specialists in whatever fields became relevant. It might resemble an episode of Matlock more than any modern real-world criminal investigation procedures.

More commonly, the offender turns themselves in after they calm down, there's no substantial dispute of the facts, and everyone involved wants the proceedings to be over with so they can get back to work. So, you end up with either something like this https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2015-12-06 or this http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff3000/fc02920.htm (follow-up here: http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff3100/fc03031.htm )

Another notable facet is, there's no exception for self-defense. If there's a fight, doesn't matter who started it, the winner gets stuck with the cleanup bill. Anyone who doesn't enjoy that responsibility is advised to escalate less and surrender more, or else find ways to win that are profitable instead of messy.
>>
No. 123392 ID: 2007b6

>>122837
>myriad overpowered DMPCs
I find your ongoing insinuations about my GMing style deeply insulting. It's true that Azarthraine of Hollowfall is in some ways far more powerful than any of the current player characters, and nominally outranks them, but they pulled his fat out of the fire after he fucked up and died, so he's going to stand back and let the people with demonstrably better judgement make the important decisions.

The pacing here has been slower than I'd prefer, lately, and I'm starting to think that's your fault for taking every random potential threat in a horror game so damn personally. When Yisheng Ji runs off into an unexplored hallway and falls down a spiked pit trap, emotional labor spent on OOC reassurance (and restraining the urge to mocking laughter at that tactical blunder) comes out of the same budget I need for simulating a weird little imaginary world, or keeping everyone else excited and engaged.

>>/quest/887037
>Do we have plans
[dadvoice]I don't know, DO you?[/dadvoice]

The Fire Hawks have the initiative right now, strategically speaking. Start acting like it. Do something decisively proactive, and roll the dice to see how it turns out.
>>
No. 123399 ID: 3abd97

>>123373
I can't speak for Tunic, but if he were upset, I don't think he'd shy away from saying so.

Conversely, if you need a good reason for Maru to stick around: this whole mission is a rescue, and all about not leaving allies behind. Even if Maru's doesn't personally count Fire Hawks she's never met as part of her clan, she might be motivated to see Azarthraine and Oldaric rescue their friends.

>white elf stuff
Interesting. As a society of immortals, paying or working off debts incurred by transgressions also seems a lot more appropriate and/or feasible way of dealing with things. Although if you're trying to make up for the death or loss of future income/contributions from other immortals, that might go on for a long while.

>>123392
>[dadvoice]I don't know, DO you?[/dadvoice]
Mmm, sorry about that. Trying to plan what to do with those guys depends on what they're already contracted or being paid or expected to do, which gets a little interesting when we're defining everything retroactively. Having surveyors involved in dungeon delving has some rather obvious potential benefits, although their personal risks and what they're charging almost certainly go up.

>The Fire Hawks have the initiative right now, strategically speaking. Start acting like it. Do something decisively proactive, and roll the dice to see how it turns out.
I'll work on that. Sorry, the less proactive stance has actually been a little deliberate. I want to give other players a chance to weigh in on how we're doing things, but let's see if we can wrap up the tunneling prep.
>>
No. 123401 ID: d22dc0

>>123399
I know it's not super fair to you magey, but I'm most comfortable with leaving you in charge- the strategy and planning gigs seem to be much more in your wheelhouse. If anything comes to mind I'll speak up, but I'm happy to let you lead, both OOC, and as a PC in the game. I also feel like I've contributed all the stuff I've already thought of to the discussion, and just need to hear back on things like our flashback stuff and further developments for IC input.
>>
No. 123402 ID: 3abd97

>>123401
That's okay. I can make calls on stuff, but questing is all about collaborating, so I like to give that a chance.

Shooting for more stuff like the pre-battle planning before Ekton, and less stuff like me agreeing to escort Cap and Esmeraude without anyone else.
>>
No. 123404 ID: fc3fc0

>>123402
From an IC standpoint it's somewhat vexing, but OOC things like Vos impulsively charging headlong into moral decisions has led to some pretty fun stuff. If people are okay with it OOC, might be fun to throw some more impulse decisions around, just let whatever happens take us forward. When we start the game we're absolutely on the back foot, but risks and danger are all the more exhilarating when you haven't done the meticulous planning before hand; when stuff goes wrong after you've spent hours hashing it out, if feels like the blame is on us for not thinking ahead or for making the wrong call. When the same thing happens without the advent of planning, I often feel more pleased to be able to scrape by and make it out of things alive. Not 100% about that sentiment though, I might just be wearing rosy glasses. Seems like not taking the opportunity to plan when you should have is even worse than some miscalculation or oversight in the master scheme.
>>
No. 123410 ID: 094652

Can you post an updated picture of the revealed map for Team Magic Sword? I've lost track and it's hurting my tactical thinking for Azure and Pog.
>>
No. 123411 ID: d22dc0

>>123410
Until I or someone else can, blank spaces labeld 2 and 3 were glossed over because the bandits said they were empty. Blanks space 4 has pools of water, with the stirge nest in a little off shoot, with a secret door adjoining them perhaps?
>>
No. 123486 ID: add037

Important question that slipped my mind somehow. Is Vos still carrying his eelbee children? Are his octowasp friends still around?
>>
No. 123493 ID: 2007b6

>>123486
They're mature enough to live outside the pouch by now, but exact disposition is one of those things flashbacks could handle.
>>
No. 123503 ID: 094652

My basic plan is to have Azure dust herself in rubble and sand from the nearby mountain of rubble that we were digging out for a week of real-time, and NOT jumping into the green flames where they might do something permanent to her. Thoughts?
>>
No. 123504 ID: d22dc0

>>123503
I'd suggest making her position known so her ashes can be protected, then moving her possessions elsewhere for safekeeping. She has a minute or so left, which seems like plenty of time given a little luck.
>>
No. 123520 ID: 3abd97

>>123486
If we're doing an adorafying flashback with eel-bee babies, I so want Dav in on that.

>>123503
Hmmm. If Azure was going to die anyways (of course that isn't certain), it might have been more useful to commit to fighting the giant leeches, since the explosion might have cleared the room of hostiles even if you lost. Suicide bombing her enemies is a valid, reusable, tactic for Azure. (If limited to a per day use and with an opportunity cost of anything else you could do until respawn).

The Green Flame room isn't the worst place to leave your remains to be recovered, though. If nothing else, the green flames should be able to report witnessing Azure's death to Rhea if the party stops by.

Santova's advice sounds right, though. If Azure can't treat herself, priority is protecting your stuff and marking your location for recovery. (Although the noise and scorch marks might accomplish the second for you).
>>
No. 123525 ID: d22dc0

>>123520
Suicide bombing isn't a bad tactical approach, at least when you've got enemies who could be hurt and aren't liable to do anything to your ashes, but over all it's a pretty dark idea, emotionally at least. Seems like valuing your own life, even at the cost of tactical advantages for other people, isn't at all a bad road to take. The idea of zerg rushing the enemy down, but YOU'RE the zerg, dying over and over for the good of the hive... shudders
>>
No. 123543 ID: 094652

Yay exp! But seriously, I forgot to play in character and Azure suffered, should have brought Pog along to keep her from birdbraining her way into the leech room.

>>/quest/888354
Can Azure use up her cure light wounds on herself? Because flying is VERY important to her survival and if she has to regrow them she'll be out of the game for a while.

The tunnel seems like the best bet, but if it collapses on her it could kill her for good. We saw from the deck incident that Jalkaren's resurrection capabilities aren't omnipotent, and she can be barred by powers greater than hers. What if Azure's resurrection power and limitations is one of those barriers?

So I'm stumped, because my current options are:
- Azure takes a nap. She could get diseased by the leeches and take permanent brain damage.
- Azure cries for help. The leeches swarm to her before her allies can, if they even hear her.
- Azure crawls through the hole. There is a chance it will collapse on her. She desperately drinks from the fountain labeled water. It is labeled incorrectly. Azure permanently mutates and could even lose her powers.
- Azure burns herself to death with the green flames after luring the leech horde in. The flames die, they might do something permanent to Azure, and Jalkaren is pissed at Azure for destroying an elemental artifact pair.
- Azure gets to high ground so the leeches can't kill her. Azure wants to take a nap. The leeches can pile up to get to her anyway.
- Azure somehow pushes a 2-ton brazier containing a green flame to the entrance to scare away the leeches. It might burn her, it would certainly tire her. The leeches are blind and don't care about death by fire.
>>
No. 123544 ID: d22dc0

>>123543
Good call on the possible resurrection barriers. Azure has probably made enough noise to attract allies over to her position, so I think it's just a matter of time before assistance comes; I'd just try to relax and not expose her to any more undo stress until she can get proper care. Of course I don't really have an understanding of where the leeches, her gear, and she all are in relation to each other currently, mostly because I haven't put in the effort to actually figure it out, so that could be faulty advice.
>>
No. 123545 ID: 094652

... Actually, I should say something important.

I like playing this game, but recently I feel like I'm not playing the way I want to. I want Hore to fight, Azure to sing, and Pog to dig.

Hore opened her big yap because the party started arguing at the entrance instead of dungeoneering, which got them into trouble with someone who was formerly cooperative and chock-full of valuable information, and now they're splitting the party further to talk with bug-fae about a giant monster. I expect the party will agree to perform a series of recon missions and trap layabouts and NOT direct combat. Hore is a mercenary combat engineer, not a diplomat/scout/planner/negotiator/fae-frolicker

Azure took a bad turn due to my forgetfulness, and she's getting pushed more and more into survival when she's a social / roguish creature. She can't fly or talk her way out of this one, which feels bad - making her focus on combat or survival isn't what she was rolled up for

Pog is guarding the other party members and unable to dig shortcuts because the hospital needs to be FIXED not DEMOLISHED. Pog's role in combat is the tank and his role out of combat is the pioneer, but he's not getting where he needs to be either

And while I still have fun playing, I feel like a fifth wheel because of this inefficiency of not doing or playing how I want and should.
>>
No. 123548 ID: d22dc0

>>123545
>I want my characters to do certain things, fill certain roles
Categorically, this is a horror game. People being pushed out of of their comfort zones and struggling against inevitable failure is part of the experience.

>Argument outside the dungeon
The argument included Hore, Helen, Ji and Maru- Hore can't take sole responsibility if everyone else decided to get involved too. Takes two to tango, yanno? Basically, don't beat yourself up too much. Stuff happens, it's alright.

>Hore's a combat engineer
Sounds like that's the perfect person to help stop and destroy a construct wreaking havoc on a diverse landscape. Seems like she should be back in her element shortly. We're playing catch up currently, to position our starting position back in our favor, so we'd be prancing around the fae wilds regardless of any arguments or such that happened. Need to get our ducks in a row now since we didn't have the chance to do it before.

>Azure is in a survival situation
See point A. Characters are going to have their lives endangered; can't really complain about your character not being suited for that, it's a constant of the game. One wrong turn is all it takes, in theory.

>Pog should be tanking and digging, instead he's... guarding and not digging?
Pog has already done some digging, and I'm not sure what the difference is between guarding people and tanking. If you're worried about him not specifically being attacked right now, seems like a good chance when the tank can heal, he's still recovering from his other injuries. If you're unhappy that he's not with Azure currently then... send him to Azure?

>I'm feeling like I'm not contributing enough
That means that you're hearts in the right place then- I'm feeling similarly, at least with Maru, but I think that sort of self criticism is just gonna make things more dour for everyone. Try not to be so hard on yourself, and just enjoy the game instead of worrying about being good enough.
>>
No. 123549 ID: 3abd97

>>123525
Arguably, a phoenix-blooded ancestry might come with something of an alien mindset that would help cope with that kind of trauma, or a lifetime of deaths might have already desensitized her somewhat. Although going by what Azure's actually said on the subject before, that doesn't seem to be the case.

But yeah that was 100% cold tactical OOC analysis. There's certainly nothing wrong with having a character who's freaked out by, or reluctant to use, some of their own powers.

>>123545
Personally, I would say it's one of the main hallmarks of this game that lateral thinking is required, and one can't get away applying a character's best strength or preferred tactic to everything. I like it, honestly. Makes things feel more alive.

And sometimes, the lateral thinking is in how a character can apply their skills to a situation. How would a combat engineer attempt diplomacy/scouting/planning/negotiation/fae-frolicking? Can they find a way to succeed? I'd say the discussion about the subterrene qualifies as trying to put a problem in engineering and mercenary terms. Perhaps not the most successful socially, but the attempt was made. But I wouldn't sweat that. Disagreement between player characters, it happens.

I also wouldn't get too worked up about making a tactical error with Azure. It happens, and she's got more leeway to recover from fatal mistakes than most.

As for Pog, if you want him to tank... he could engage those things attacking Nin. I was assuming the rest of the group was following him. Or maybe you could make some attempt for him to catch up with Azure, or bring the rest of the group her way.

>I expect the party will agree to perform a series of recon missions and trap layabouts and NOT direct combat
Personally, I was thinking a quick find the monster, kill it, and report back sidequest. We're not planning to be away from the rest of the group for long, after all. All we're looking for here is friendly neighbors while we're working in the area. So they're willing to look after our npcs (or us) if thing go wrong for us, or maybe send word if they become aware of something we want to know (oh look, there's a bunch of cultists marching towards those people who helped us).

Assuming we can find the thing in short order, we could use Viste's spacial-snare feat on the rolling wheel to trip it up and take away it's ability to flee or run us down, and then quickly fall on it with plasma shots and burning Maru-buffed blades.
>>
No. 123551 ID: 2007b6

>>123545
>She can't fly or talk her way out of this one,
Can't fly, sure, but being underground limits the utility of flight in general. She could, however, absolutely use her social / performance skills to solve the current problem by simply closing a door between herself and the dire leeches, then singing loud enough for other PCs to hear. That strategy would trigger another wandering monster roll, but it's an option.
>>
No. 123552 ID: 2007b6

>>123549
>Personally, I would say it's one of the main hallmarks of this game that lateral thinking is required, and one can't get away applying a character's best strength or preferred tactic to everything. I like it, honestly. Makes things feel more alive.
Why aren't you on the Discord channel saying stuff like that which cheers me up so much?
>>
No. 123558 ID: 094652

>>123549
>Why doesn't Azure cope with the trauma?
As I said, her body performs a full restoration each time she dies. That includes the nerves which would normally die off permanently in reaction to severe burns and blunt trauma, which means every time she dies it feels as horrible as the first time. Also, the first time she died was due to an accident as a child, so dying means she has to re-live her second-earliest childhood trauma (first was shivering cold and naked in untamed underground as an infant) literally to death. On the plus side, this means her body's wear and tear from her nymphomania resets after a respawn, though her mind is somewhat jaded.

>Pog can defend
Thanks for the reminder, I'll have him do that.

>>123551
Sounds good. Can I claim Azure has prepared a specific "bird call" that seems like something a wandering bluejay would sing, but Pog knows it's a help signal? She'd have years to come up with it.

>>123552
Strangely, I think your discord channel is moving SLOWER than the quest threads. You're the admin, come up with a public topic!
>>
No. 123631 ID: 2007b6

>>123558
>Can I claim Azure has prepared a specific "bird call" that seems like something a wandering bluejay would sing, but Pog knows it's a help signal?
Yeah. In fact, for something like that, it's probably simpler to just declare exposition as part of IC actions like you usually do.
>>
No. 123633 ID: 4f1cbc

>>/quest/888984
>She identifies herself as Sister Goris
In case anyone has forgotten (or wasn't in the game back then), Goris was one of the three Orcus cultists that joined the pirate party way back in the first thread. Last we saw her was on the ship after the whole group sailed off searching for riches after consulting with the coastal coven.

Here's a quick recap of some stuff we know about her:

>Goris is a younger woman, sluggish and taciturn as if stumbling through life half-asleep, kept her hood up the whole time, but performed her part in the group prayer with meticulous precision

>Acolyte Goris's belt improves muscle tone across her entire body, but it's hard to get a good look; there's some kind of interference.

>Dimitry Nicola and Acolyte Goris have become adorably inseparable, so both of them come along. Goris has prepared three applications of these-aren't-the-brains-you're-looking-for, two portable fogs, one shadow, and two techniques for dealing with sentries: a relatively weak fear effect usable at range, and physical paralysis which requires a touch to apply.

>Rixxil Kas mentions, telepathically, that Goris seems notably more inclined than the other acolytes to take initiative, act without (or against) instructions. It's worked out well so far, but... maybe keep an eye on her.

>Acolyte Goris, after she's asked whether the Church of Orcus is sending assassins after herself and her friends (answer: not in the forseeable future)
>>
No. 123649 ID: 2007b6

>>123633
There's also this:
>>/questarch/731101
At some point when she was young enough to be considered comparable to a kindergartener, a standard knight-in-shining-armor paladin tried to rescue her, and she expressed her feelings on the matter by stabbing him in the back of the knee (a common weak spot in rigid armor) during parley. Her friends and coworkers considered that a notably meritorious accomplishment, hard to surpass, but she eventually managed.
>>
No. 123652 ID: d22dc0

>>123633
>>123649
Heh, I thought that was her name. Glad to know we're up against a bad ass who's powers we have more information on, and who's more inclined towards mercenary work for third parties when her current gigs go south.
>>
No. 123656 ID: 094652

>>888405
>>889129
Wow. An approximately 1/46,656 chance of this. Are you sure the RNG is using an actual pseudorandom generator?
>>
No. 123657 ID: 7fad5d

>>123656
Every single outcome has a 1/46,656 chance of occurring.
>>
No. 123658 ID: 4f1cbc

>>123652
The thing that occurs to me is Dimitry "the White Snake" Nicola specialized in stealth, assassination and thievery, and might still be working with her, and could be somewhere undetected nearby.

Also less sure she'd be willing to work for our current batch of PCs. We don't have that whole authority from killing her direct superior this time.

>>123656
What, two given 3d6 rolls being a 15? They weren't even consecutive.

There's a 4.62% of a given 3d6 roll coming up 15. Square that, the chance of two separate 3d6 rolls coming up 15 is 0.21%. That's about 1 in 500.

You're certainly welcome to go to /tg/ and roll a few hundred or thousand d6es in a single post and confirm for yourself that the statistical distribution looks right. But it's just confirmation bias and limited sample sizes making it look funny to you.
>>
No. 123669 ID: d22dc0

>>123658
I think kome's referencing the fact that they were both made by triple fives.
>>
No. 123696 ID: 4f1cbc

>>/quest/889150
>the Reformed Mithraists who gave weekly sermons and organized midsummer festivals and archery contests back in Davina's hometown
So based off of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraism , although I'm curious what reforms they underwent rather than dying out.

Little backstory filling in details like this make me happy. Davina's vaguely European style nobility (her name's English, family name is still tbd, Viste and Filo are from Italian) and I hadn't put much thought into the surrounding culture, but this seems to fit.

>Only male names appear in surviving inscribed membership lists. Historians including Cumont and Richard Gordon have concluded that the cult was for men only.
>Few, if any, initiates came from leading aristocratic or senatorial families until the 'pagan revival' of the mid-4th century
If those bits stayed true even in the reformed cult, that would probably have limited direct influence on Dav or her family, even if she was exposed to some sermons or participated in some festivals. Probably would have been a political connection or relationship of some kind though.
>>
No. 123704 ID: 2007b6

>>123696
My thinking is that something like the Mithraic Mysteries (mixed with Freemasonry, and some other stuff) grew and changed until it was as far from it's origins as medieval Roman Catholicism was from zeroth-century Judea.
>>
No. 123705 ID: 2007b6

Hallways ten feet wide and eight to ten feet high are actually incredibly, luxuriously airy and spacious by the standards of realistic pre-industrial underground construction. There are modern parking garages with less elbow room. Might have trouble maneuvering a typical car around any 90-degree corners, or up and down steep stairs, much less over the pit traps, but on the straightaways it would definitely fit. Rooms more than about 20' wide need to have carefully arched ceilings, support pillars, or more likely both, to avoid collapsing under the weight of the stone above - and even with a good solid design there are risks. Narrower passages are inherently more structurally sound... and then there's the small matter of hauling away all that rock which is being removed!

Partly it's a genre conceit of dungeon fantasy, and a tactical concession so tunnel fighting has any real chance to involve gloriously chivalric swords and shields and polearms and bows and maybe even whips instead of being all grim WWI-style trench spikes and poison gas, but in a setting with some thought put into the history and economics, it's worth remembering that even a room which is fairly small by typical dungeon standards must have involved quite a lot of hard work with picks and shovels at some point, or else an equivalently valuable exertion of magic.
>>
No. 123709 ID: 5f3f48

>>123704
Makes sense. So what are the basic tenants or positions of the modern faith? Don't have to get into too much detail, since I don't think we have any active worshippers in the group, but a cliff notes of associated themes or domains would be interesting.

Oaths of purity of some kind for the priesthood fits Abrahamic expectations (well, more than that, really. I'm not sure I have a term broad enough), midsummer festivals mean some significance around the summer solstice survived (although what a solstice is may be changed by this setting's cosmology), and fostering those archery competitions could be turned to differing philosophical or symbolic approaches (a veneration of skill or mastery, or personal excellence, or community preparedness, or the hunt, etc). It would appear to reference back to the water miracle, and maybe the hunting of the bull, but I can think of a lot of different permutations on the actual message associated.
>>
No. 123726 ID: 2007b6

>>123709
Cleric of Mithras probably chooses domains from Travel, Sun, or a version of the Caves subdomain which replaces Elemental Body with a souped-up variant Hero's Feast. Dunno about the nominal theology, but the practical day to day stuff probably involves a lot of high-frequency, low-intensity rituals, prosocial community outreach, and providing stable, respectable careers for folks who don't have an inheritance lined up.
>>
No. 123732 ID: 094652

Santova, can you have Isiah rescue Azure? Methinks whatever disease is in that room might infect anyone with a biological constitution.
>>
No. 123747 ID: 2007b6

I'm thinking about starting another thread with a fresh group of first-level characters lost in the dungeon. Not a reboot, exactly, but a chance to focus on smaller scale stuff with less continuity to juggle.
>>
No. 123748 ID: 5f3f48

>>123747
Personally, I'm more interested in developing the existing characters than opening up another parallel path (despite how engaging the character creation process can be), but you do you.
>>
No. 123749 ID: 094652

That might be effective at revitalizing our campaign; a chance to give new players a fresh start while letting old players add new characters. However, too many threads and not enough GM preparation time make for a slow overall game. Doesn't help that you haven't updated the Exalted thread for a while.

If I may make a suggestion: discuss which thread/s you wish to 'freeze' - update them far less (like once a month, to prevent complete graveyard status), but give the PCs in those frozen threads a passive exp and gold boost over time to represent them taking on low-risk low-reward adventures while you focus on writing up the new third team's session.
>>
No. 123750 ID: d10e29

From what I understand, JamesLeng enjoys running the initial crew through the dungeon, as it's much livelier and pretty fast/straightforward to run. Might also be looking for some cover art for threads, which I'm possibly going to get done, but I've not been well this month so it's a toos up of when it'll actually get started and finished
>>
No. 123756 ID: 2007b6

>>123749
>passive exp and gold boost over time
No.
>>
No. 123774 ID: 2007b6

Marijke and the pirates from before the reboot are now back in play in thread 6.
>>
No. 123775 ID: 094652

>>123756
okay. In retrospect, that idea sounded like something from a pay-to-win mobile game.

>>123774
Excuse me while I binge watch threads 1-3.
>>
No. 123777 ID: 23b7bd

>>123774
Might want to do some finagling of my characters- assuming Alphious is out of play, having only had a couple lines of dialog; That leaves Stone and Riv. Gonna do some creative editing with Riv, try to make her less homicidal, and might want to send Stone the way of Tall Jack Rat? Don't know how well he would fit in in either case though, might have him wander off for the time being, we'll have to see. Don't want him to have left his promise to the bandits unfulfilled. Interested in seeing how Marjike and Davina will play together, doubt either one will want to sign on with each other. Are the characters going to have gained any experiences, or maybe some inventory changes? Seems weird to have done so little of consequence in the past few months that they've not changed, but it also seems out of form to have everyone get free stuff outside of play.
>>
No. 123778 ID: 2007b6

>>123777
>inventory changes?
Describe what you'd like to have retroactively acquired in terms of loot, a secret hideout, etc. I'll veto anything totally unreasonable or add curses/complications to borderline stuff.
>>
No. 123780 ID: add037

>>123747
It would be a good point for new players to jump in, which I think is important. I probably never would have joined if it weren't for the last reboot.
>>
No. 123781 ID: 4f1cbc

>Interested in seeing how Marjike and Davina will play together, doubt either one will want to sign on with each other.
Sorry to disappoint, but assuming the two groups interact more directly than through Goris as intermediary, I don't see much more exciting than opposed rolls to negotiate terms. Maybe Dav makes a pass and Marijke gets confused, but that would be a lower probability outcome.

But no, I don't see the pirates signing on to team mercenary or vice versa. Possibly a temporary collaboration or arrangement of some kind (if we sell the pirates the Guardian of Skin, or if they provide transportation, or we collaborate on raiding Talon North, that kind of thing).


Also while I'm cool using Marijke and the pirate crew as a plot device here, I'm not really interested in bringing her back as fully fledged PC beyond that? If that distinction makes sense. She sailed off into the sunset once, she was kind of a poorly thought out mess from the beginning, she doesn't fit with the other parties (nor would it make sense IC for her to leave her current gig), her crew/party is almost entirely npcs by this point (and we have more than enough of those to manage already), and the players for most the PCs she had established relationships with have dropped out.

So background or cameo character? Sure. Joining one of the active groups, or leading the pirate crew on adventures? Eeeeeeeh.
>>
No. 123787 ID: 23b7bd

>>123781
I think I can get on board with that. Maybe have stone run an errand for the Tall Jack Rat crew and wander into the sunset
>>
No. 123788 ID: 23b7bd

>>123781
I think I can get on board with that. Maybe have stone run an errand for the Tall Jack Rat crew and wander into the sunset
>>
No. 123793 ID: 2007b6

Alright, overcame my procrastination and made some crap art for myself. https://tgchan.org/kusaba/quest/res/890020.html
>>
No. 123798 ID: 5f3f48

>>123787
I'm certainly not expecting anyone else make their characters stick to that! (Especially not characters who joined later in the game and had less play than mine). There's ways individual characters could be brought into current events, or even the whole ship if that was wanted.
>>
No. 123805 ID: d10e29

>>/quest/890093
Welcome to the game friend
>>
No. 123821 ID: 094652

I think I still need to re-distribute Ivori's inventory and stuff. Maybe replace the hood and rope with more books or poisons, and she's covered head-to-toe in black robes / bandages; they won't serve as armor but they do make her harder to see. What do you think?

Honor might not be the best term to describe Ivori's higher ambition - point is, she wants to save her sister, find out what happened to her, and figure out what she wants to do now that the master she dedicated her existence to has shown his true colors and declared her anathema. I dunno how to describe that.

I've also got Ivori's backstory fleshed out more; the House of Goodhall is officially "a lowbred infestation of honorary nobles that were thrown a bone during the war", while in truth they were one of the most influential criminal families in the region with lofty ambitions to indirectly rule the entire kingdom. I say 'were', because their shadow empire has been crushed by their rivals, using a combination of experimental rituals and an army of assassins. Ivori, Embri, and their fellow ninja were captured and used as sacrifices for one of these rituals, but whatever makes the twins special as Huldra mutts allowed them to survive (as opposed to their colleagues who were imploded to pulp) and gain new powers. Ivori got the mind-control parasites and Embri... Embri isn't in Passholdt anymore. Ivori barely managed to use her new power to get one of the casters to kill the others and then do something suicidal but not to the parasite, then passed out and suffered heavy amnesia. Ivori went back to her master in a daze, only to find that her beloved Count Goodhall demanded she commit seppuku for crimes he refused to specify. When he subtly implied that her sister should show herself and the twins ought to mutually murder each other, she fled like hell. On the surface, the town was almost completely normal with the exception of a girl in black rags crying herself out. Ivori saw the signs of new management here, some missing bar patrons there, toasts in the noble houses signifying genuine happiness instead of feigned ignorance for the first time in years. The Goodhall criminal empire is broken, and its only major impact on our tale is the possibility of other ninja hunting Ivori down. If they even still serve the fallen Count, and if they don't they may even negotiate terms for joining up with their former vice-captain.
>>
No. 123825 ID: d22dc0

>>123821
I for one am nervous about you and Strngy changing your inventory- I was going to bring rope and mapping supplies until I saw that they were covered. Not a compelling reason for you to bring stuff that's OOC, but I do think those are bases worth covering, we've used/needed those items in the dungeon before. Everything has a use, but certain things have a wider general applicability.
>>
No. 123836 ID: 094652

If you need rope, I'll bring rope. I just worry that Ivori's going in without enough poison. So someone else may want to bring poison vials since Ivori brought the poison encyclopedia. Since she's a townie, can she buy more books and poison materials later? Guess so.
>>
No. 123837 ID: d22dc0

>>123836
I think anyone can buy poison later, a townie is the only one who can have them in their starting equipment though. If you wanna swap stuff out for poison you don't have to hold back on my accord, I just think rope is useful to have. Up to you what's most important for your character to bring though
>>
No. 123845 ID: add037

I'm fine with swapping out the manacles for writing kit but now that I think about it, it doesn't really make sense for Mizer to bring a writing kit and no light source
>>
No. 123853 ID: 2007b6

>>123845
Apart from the heat lance itself, companions may be carrying their own lights, or you could've had a supply of candles or torches which were expended and/or discarded earlier in the disaster.
>>
No. 123854 ID: 5f3f48

I ask if anyone does make last minute changes to character loadout (assuming JL approves), please post an updated initial build. It makes keeping track of things a lot easier.
>>
No. 123867 ID: 2007b6

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasipha%C3%AB
>>123854
>(assuming JL approves)
Tweaking something in accordance with my own recommendation is fine. Other retcons are also most likely acceptable, so long as the detail to be altered hasn't become tactically relevant.
>>123837
This is correct. However, starting equipment may also imply some things about your character's skills: any tool you considered important enough not to leave behind, even in an emergency where a few fewer pounds of encumbrance or an extra day's rations might be a matter of life and death, was likely a tool you considered yourself adequately proficient in the proper use of.
>>
No. 123921 ID: 094652

>>123867
Technically I wanted the rope to be a grappling hook but that's beyond Ivori's current budget.

The one poison vial she currently has hidden in her wooden statuette is just wide enough to dip her arrows or the tip of her knives in, and contains a poison designed for debilitating opponents; the non-lethal aspect is a negative, but Ivori needed something cheaper than freaking omni-poison. If the target won't go down from an arrow to the brain / neck, you can expect them to be a long-lasting boss battle, so the poison will make the ensuing fight far easier.

The shinobi hood is basically a black blanket. It doesn't do much, but Ivori has gymnophobia - fear of being naked in public. This helps.

Also I forgot to mention she has fox ears.

And finally, those tools for lockpicking and surgery are mostly for lockpicking.
>>
No. 123932 ID: d22dc0

>>123921
>Fox ears

I'm curious as to how "Kitsune troll" works to be honest
>>
No. 123933 ID: 4f1cbc

>>123921
>Technically I wanted the rope to be a grappling hook but that's beyond Ivori's current budget.
Could be a grappling hook minus the grapple. Your starting gear is supposed to represent what you have left after Things Went Wrong, after all.
>>
No. 123935 ID: d22dc0

>>123933
Could have also gone with rich bastard and have a cool grappling hook, but yeah, most of this stuff is whatever was close or important enough to risk death to grab, at least canonically. The start in the dungeon is pretty tough so I generally try to cover bases, then imagine retroactively why my character wanted that stuff.

>>123932
Whoops, hope I haven't been posting under the wrong name this whole time, that'd be confusing
>>
No. 123936 ID: 4f1cbc

>I'm curious as to how "Kitsune troll" works to be honest
Well, here's what little about them that's come up in-game, what I can find on the mythology, and what pathfinder has to say. Less kitsune, more weird forest critter that can pass for human so long as her clothes stay on and you don't notice the tail.

>>108846
>Troll-kin include huldras, who make no damn sense physiologically: they could be mistaken for elvenoids, apart from the fox tails, but instead of a spinal column they've got a gaping hole, and instead of a normal array of vital organs, the inside of a huldra's torso looks like a hollow rotten log.

http://www.succubus.net/wiki/Huldra

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/bestiary4/huldra.html (Although this calls them fey, which I don't think is true in our setting).
>>
No. 123939 ID: 2007b6

>>123936
>(Although this calls them fey, which I don't think is true in our setting).
Yeah, I've messed around a lot with what sorts of things count as which creature type, fey in particular. Didn't really have a good slot for a primordial chaos/narrative-dominated otherworld in the setting, so metaphysically most of the classic woodland fey count as elemental spirits, roughly comparable to genies. Huldra fell in with troll-kin instead, well... ultimately due to association with trolls in folklore, but Pathfinder stats make the link fairly direct.
>>
No. 123943 ID: 4f1cbc

>>/quest/889926
>>/quest/889930
Did anyone else want to weigh in on this? I thought Vos at least would have an opinion on kill vs capture.

>>123939
There are still fey of some kind aren't there? I remember Deros Frist mistook Viste for one.
>>
No. 123946 ID: 094652

>>123933
Sounds about right. Once this quest is over, I'm having Ivori upgrade the rope back to a grappling hook.

>>123935
Rich Bastard would not describe a servant who was recently branded a traitor. Even if she managed to steal a fortune while fleeing from a dozen other well-trained ninja, that would just give Count Goodhall an excuse to post an official bounty on a thief holding / spending a sack of gold (under a court of law using truth spells), and not his former loyal assassin who he tried to murder for no apparent reason. More importantly, laundering such wealth requires the black market, and with most of the local underworld celebrating their victory over the Goodhall yakuza, while the remaining loyalists have been sent a bounty for the traitor, Ivori is going to need to wait a few months for new blood to carve out a spot and do business with someone they've never met from a faction they've never fought.

Speaking of which, Ivori's former connections with the black market are severed, but she knows the terrain and can give out pointers on how to deal without getting scammed too much.

>>123932
Ivori will occasionally play fear pranks on others. Mostly the enemy, but if she's bored she'll resort to her friends. Or just set up traps and imagine someone else getting a fist full of confetti in their face.

It's meant to be a sensual indulgence thing. In town, she can spend her money on big pranks and mess up entire festivals for a laugh.
>>
No. 123947 ID: d22dc0

>>123943
Didn't even realize I wrote agatha instead of Aaphia, whoops
>>
No. 123951 ID: 094652

How does damage scale as Player Characters find and equip higher-quality weapons? As in, what is the cost:damage ratio? For instance, say someone has a [sword] that deals [1d6, expected value 3.5] damage, but then they find a better [sword] that deals over 50% more damage on average [1d10, expected value 5.5], but with the same weight, same size and mostly same shape, same compatibility with current feats, etc. How much more would it be worth than the old sword? How does this go for 100% damage, 200%, etc.?
>>
No. 123954 ID: 2007b6

>>123951
Melee Weapon Quality Muscle-powered melee and thrown weapons come in several quality grades, described below. Quality influences the odds of breakage when you parry a very heavy weapon; see Parrying Heavy Weapons (p. 376). The prices listed on the weapon tables buy good-quality weapons at TL6 or less, fine-quality ones at TL7+. Cheap: A cheap weapon is +2 to break – and if it can be thrown, it has -1 Acc. It costs 40% of list price at TL6 or less, or 20% of list price at TL7+. The mass-produced swords issued to ordinary soldiers are often of cheap quality. Good: A good weapon has no breakage modifier. This is the standard quality through TL6. At TL7+, good-quality weapons cost 40% of list price. Fine: Any fine weapon is -1 to break. A fine blade (cutting or impaling weapon) also gets +1 to cutting and impaling damage. At TL6 or less, a fine-quality fencing- or sword-class weapon of any type costs 4 times list price. (Katanas are often fine!) Other weapon types cost 3 times list price if they do only crushing or impaling damage (e.g., a mace or spear), or 10 times list price if they can do cutting damage (e.g., an axe or halberd). At TL7+, all weapons are “fine” at no extra cost. Very Fine: Only fencing weapons and swords can be very fine. A very fine weapon is -2 to break and gets +2 to cutting and impaling damage. At TL6 or less, very fine weapons cost 20 times list price; at TL7+, they cost only 4 times list price. Presentation weapons (decorated, bejeweled, gilded, etc.) are also available. This will further increase cost (and resale value) by 5-20 times.
Further incremental improvements are possible with magic, but exponentially more expensive.
>>
No. 123959 ID: 2007b6

>>/quest/890627
For future reference, optimal animation involves about a pound of tellerauthelot wasps per eight pounds of corpse. Not enough causes clumsiness or partial paralysis; too many and extras crowd the body's cavities, maybe even start wandering off. "Edgar" in the first MIB movie had similar problems. A pound of bugs spread out in a single layer is about five square feet, so four pounds is enough to cover a typical elvenoid from head to toe. Minimum swarm capable of any noticeable degree of collective consciousness and planning is about half a pound, basic language and tool use requires about three pounds. Breeding a truly massive swarm and concentrating it tightly together might result in further enhancements to intellect, but the logistical challenge of food, water, air, and heat dissipation associated with the metabolic equivalent of four people sharing a coffin has proven challenging on previous attempts, anything solidly superhuman may require hundreds or even thousands of pounds.
>>
No. 123960 ID: 2007b6

>>123943
Well, keep in mind three things we're fairly certain of, about the larger context around that reference:
A) he was factually incorrect, Viste is not and never has been knowingly affiliated with anything called the Court of Valorous Pearls (and Vos started out as an eel-man, not a naga),
B) the real Deros Frist's brain had already been eaten by some sort of alien parasite at that point,
C) knowledge transfer through that process was imperfect, as evidenced by degradation in teleportation range and convenience.

In the real world, back at tech level 4, even well-educated people had some fairly bizarre beliefs about distant cultures or supernatural creatures which they'd never quite encountered personally, yet nonetheless regarded as plain facts from trustworthy sources. The drakocracy encourages rigorous competence in many fields, but the international spread of peer-reviewed research into a more comprehensive taxonomy of spirits, thereby progressively banishing false rumors thereof, is one of the main pillars of what it was created to prevent.
>>
No. 123961 ID: 094652

I have an idea for a character, but they're mostly just speculation at this point.

Class: Rich bitch
Specialization: Gunslinger
Seriously Expensive Item: Gun Bracer (set of dozens of pistols)
Higher Ambition: Escape from this doomed world / kill all Titans (yeah, right!)
Lower Ambition: Science!

Phobia: Cosmic (any mention of the Titans, Old Gods, or rulers of the Outsiders causes terror)
Mutation: Entire body is an octopus-based eldritch being with healing blood, multiple limbs, and a hive mind with poor social skills. Uses the skeletons and skins of elvenoids to pass as human.
Vulnerability: All physical damage CAUSES BRAIN DAMAGE. No exceptions. Level of amnesia, insanity, and other mental debilitations dependent on severity of damage.
Innate Power: Healing Blood - in small doses heals wounds and illnesses, but can negatively mutate in medium or large doses.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Webcomic/DeepRise
She's a planeshifted Noble who barely escaped from a universe ruled by Royals, Titans that are the size of (and shaped like) mountains that blow themselves up to rid the universe of sentient life. She has kept a low profile for decades, living an uneventful life as an alchemist... and then one day she found proof that there are Royal Titans in Serpenthearth. Now she's on a panicked mission to get off this plane of existence before they burrow out of the Old Gods, smack the silly out of the Drakocracy like a flamethrower to flies, and blow up everything ever.
>>
No. 123962 ID: 2007b6

>>123961
>ambition: start a fight I can't possibly finish
>equipment: license to piss off every dragon
>phobia: knowing which plane I'm on
>concealable mutation: no elvenoid, eohippoid, or goblinoid characteristics whatsoever
>vulnerability: excuse to behave even more erratically than normal, particularly in combat

No. Not allowing this.
>>
No. 123964 ID: 5153d6

>>123962
>>123961
First thing that comes to mind is a tesseract squid, old enough to have witnessed time before some of the current divine pantheon, maybe dried out and reconstituted only to find the world is a strange and busy place now. Big intellect and alien mindset fits into the science and banned gadgets angle, surprising new God’s fits the “kill the titans” angle... brain damage seems harder to adapt, maybe instead some sort of pre-existing condition that’s made them delusional? Fear of the cosmic could relate more specifically to the past/present changes, maybe they don’t like others of their kind and are scared of them or something like that. Or maybe they just have existential dread brought on by the inner workings of certain theologies or scientific ideas like the heat death of the universe and stuff. Mentions of the planes aren’t scary, but talking in depth about the mechanics behind them might set off a panic attack
>>
No. 123970 ID: 2007b6

I kinda want more people to mess around with the Deck of Many Things. Nobody's even seen card #22 yet. That one's effect seems kinda silly and weak at first glance, but might be absurdly powerful if you think about it crookedly enough.
>>
No. 123971 ID: d22dc0
File 153053919464.gif - (1.92MB , 268x295 , CFF3D43F-107E-4764-B9DA-B240A48DD949.gif )
123971

>>123970
My characters are, unfortunately in this case, somewhat interested in living. Plus, the cards have thus far been kind to us- doesn’t seem smart to keep gambling while we’re ahead.
>>
No. 123973 ID: 5f3f48

>>123970
>>123971
Yeah. There are frankly too many outcomes I'd rate as terminally unfun or character ending in that deck to give drawing any serious consideration.

I can say if Rhea drew the death card she'd try to challenge it to a bake off instead of trial by combat (after all, in a duel, you're supposed to get to pick weapons). And probably get cut down anyways when refused, but hey, that's one of the less scary possible outcomes as we can get it reversed by our Trumpet Archon patron.
>>
No. 123974 ID: 094652

>>123970
Pog already had a turn, and Azure has too much to lose. I think the deck is meant for loaning out to the destitute, and receiving a fraction of the earnings in exchange. However, some of our party (Isiah) might object to leaving the unlucky reaper targets to die.
>>
No. 123975 ID: d22dc0

>>123974
Isaiah, Son of Elohim, Prophet of Hanspur, who's domains cover water, travel, trade and death? As long as everyone is making their own choices, death is not something Isaiah objects to.
>>
No. 123976 ID: 4f1cbc

>>123974
I plumb forgot Pog took a pull, actually. It kind of got overshadowed by Nin's mess.
>>
No. 123977 ID: add037

>>123970
Nin keeps throwing the deck at everyone but nobody's biting! What's wrong with you mortals?
>>
No. 123980 ID: 4f1cbc

I think these are all the cards we've identified so far: https://pastebin.com/GKyYAJaQ

Surprisingly, I'd only rate a few as outright deal breakers (3, 8 and the soul sealing for sure, 2 probably for anyone who is less for the lulz evil than Nin, 4 if you didn't have angel rez on speed dial, maaaaybe 20- those extra lives might manifest in some way that's worse than a regular rez). Still a lot of blanks, though.
>>
No. 123983 ID: d22dc0

So yeah, not super interested in a 15%+ chance of randomly shutting down a character. Maybe if we were bumming around with a less interesting set of goals and items to work with, but team magic sword is plenty interesting as it is, that whole gambling while you're ahead philosophy still stands
>>
No. 123986 ID: 2007b6

>>123973
Hitting Death in the face with a pie, as a way to end the attack, fits into the "just crazy enough it might work" category, but at the very least you'd need to have that pie ready in advance. http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20070119 Or some supernatural capability to produce pies on combat timescales.

The "soul-sealing" effect is something you can potentially recover from under your own power, but it might take months or years, IC knowledge of geography/cosmology is a major factor, and you'll want somebody doing medical maintenance on your comatose body in the meantime.
>>
No. 123993 ID: 094652

>>/quest/890979
In that case, I'm wondering why Lizzy stayed behind in the first place.
>>
No. 123995 ID: 5f3f48

>>123986
The timeframe to be rescued or recover from the soul effect is the entire reason it made my list of disqualifying cards. Removing a character for what could easily be a year of OOC play or more (barring convenient time skips) is as good as doing away with them permanently.

Not my intent to complain or criticize the contents of the deck, though. It is supposed to be wonder paired with horror, as I understand it. But so long as there are outcomes I would consider unacceptable, the cost-benefit will never be in favor of my drawing outside of desperation.
>>
No. 123999 ID: 40a1d2

That is almost exactly what I expected. Wasn’t sure on the details but I was hedging my bets on physical transformation.

As for why Lizzy didn’t follow down the cooridor, there were some characters who hadn’t stated actions yet, and I figured that exploring the cool magic chair would be a fun diversion while everyone lined up and got ready to move out. Didn’t wanna go “oh a magic throne, probably turns you into something, whatever bye.” No one else seemed interested, so I gave it a spin. Wonder how I’m gonna do being scared of the dark without most of my lights. Good thing I lit a candle before I got up.
>>
No. 124000 ID: d22dc0

>>123999
Whoops, I actually read that wrong, thought it occurred when I got up not when I sat down.
>>
No. 124005 ID: 54e0e2

I am planning on joining the game. Seemed interesting. However, question:
Can I make up a race or do I have to use a pre-existing one?
>>
No. 124007 ID: 50975b

>>124005
Racial bonuses don’t really affect the game, so if you’re making a custom race, use the fear/mutation/vulnerability/power to describe it; otherwise, as long as JamesLeng gives the thumbs up afterwards, you can make something custom. Key word is that is has to be concealable, so we don’t have too much trouble in town if we make it out. If you have more questions, you should check out the discord, the link to join is posted further up.
>>
No. 124008 ID: d9acdc

>>124005
I love the encyclopedia of rocks, that's fantastic.
>>
No. 124014 ID: add037

>>124005
New PCs are pouring in! We're really glad to have you
>>
No. 124088 ID: 094652

Name: Robert Cornelius
Race: Human
Class: Soldier
Specialization: Grey Paladin (Neutral Good)
Greater Ambition: Break The CyberCurse
Lower Ambition: Drug Addict
Mutation: Cybernetic Infection (patches of plastic across the entire body, ugly looking and miscolored, but acts as minor armor)
Phobia: Molysmophobia (Fear of infection, will attempt to sterilize any wound out of combat and will panic if unable to do so for an extended period of time)
Weakness: Water causes skin bleeding, especially around the plastic patches.
Innate Power: Various Cybernetic Implants (less than Hore), plus CereberOS, a Cybernetic AI warped by learning the path of righteousness from a Paladin, as opposed to its regular protocol of learning from a customer and convincing them to buy more products. This AI currently has little use, but will gain more skill as it learns from Robert and other party members.
Inventory:
Left Shoulder: Spear
Right Shoulder: Zweihander
Left Hip: Jug of Fortified Wine
Right Hip: Soap
Chest: Chain Armor
Head: Plate Armor
Somewhere Uncomfortable: Iron Statuette (Saint Agatia)

Robert used to be a bland, insufferable stereotype of Paladins: lastborn son of a higher noble, got a job as a squire, survived to see knighthood in the local church of Saint Agatia, rose up the ranks, and finally reached Paladinhood with a faint sense of pride and a greater duty to bring order and prosperity to the world around him.

Then one day, he literally stomped on a metal spike during combat. He didn't think much about it beyond "ow ow ow NO pain is immaterial worry about the miserable orc bandit about to murder that merchant ow", but weeks after he got it pulled out and healed, a strange substance began to grow on his foot. When it got near his ankles, he decided to amputate the whole thing, get it regrown, and forget about it. About a month later, the strange substance reappeared and spread throughout his body. To his horror, he learned he was possessed by a demon that called itself CereberOS, and his vision was interlaced with strange charts and colored bars. Robert quickly ran for help to get his body exorcised of the demon, only for its powers to accidentally reveal high corruption in the high priest he begged for salvation. The priest declared him anathema and ordered the execution of Robert, who fled. Robert spent the better part of a season trying to keep to the Paladin code, but the demon in his head kept showing him the plight of the downtrodden in ways that the church refused to address. Realizing he could never be a true paladin again after knowing the suffering that order refuses to address, but also afraid that the demon may one day overtake his mind and turn him into a plastic monstrosity, Robert has vowed to rid himself of the demon and become a true hero of justice and righteousness, without begging the church or demons for constant aid.

Unfortunately, the faulty nanite cyberware has also injected him with multiple combat stims, and he is now a drug addict. Kind of mellowed him out.

(The nanotech comes from the same catastrophe that brought Ms. Wutashi into the Blood Mire, though Robert has never met Hore in his life.)

Dunno if I really want to implement this character instead of Sahara first, but I'm posting him for editing.
>>
No. 124091 ID: 4f1cbc

>>/quest/891899
Here's some details on the effect Eira's power would produce with her starting owl-hug statuette, reposted from a chat, and split up to prevent my initial character creation post from getting huge.

>How about it makes clouds of floating, glowing feathers, which stick to anyone who passes through and provide a mixed bag of status conditions?

>Weak levitation, entanglement, heightened hearing and vision to the point of overstimulation being a risk, don't make as much noise but it's hard to hide the glow.
>Something like that. Could be a benefit to allies, hindrance to enemies, or field-control depending on context.

>On consideration I think I'll go with a little of both light and darkness. Feathers glow white when they're loose, but radiate candle-level dark once they've adhered to someone's aura. Visual effect for someone inside is like a combination of welding goggles, good modern binoculars, and a decent microscope: impaired night vision, flash protection, and extreme magnification at short or long distances.
>Tactile effect is somewhere between swimming and wrestling against tentacles. It's like the air's viscosity has increased, so you can move upward but any movement at all is a struggle.

>So we've symbolically got light and dark, enhanced and reduced perception, vulnerability, a kind of embrace or restraint. Ties back into the owl-hug image, and the mirror stuff.

>I figure, loose feathers settle out in a few minutes normally, faster in high winds, but if you stack up enough of them as a barricade it could last for hours or days.

>Feathers ON somebody last almost indefinitely if they're cowering in dark crevices, can get 'burned off' by blunt impacts, energy weapons, or the wearer screaming and/or deliberately trying to scrape it off, but not by stabbing.
>>
No. 124094 ID: 2007b6

>>124088
Mutation should be a specific cybernetic system. Given that the slippery slope started with stepping on a rusty nail, how about digitigrade legs made from plainly unnatural materials, like the Ivory Stalker here? https://www.webtoons.com/en/fantasy/sword-interval/ep-124-witchmoot/viewer?title_no=486&episode_no=133 Could be concealed under a floor-length skirt, allows marginally superhuman running or jumping, bloodless, sturdy as plate armor, but totally incompatible with standard shoes and trousers. Bit of inspiration from District 9, too.

Vulnerability would be to electricity. Half again as much damage, and even weak hits often cause temporary paralysis, seizures, or partial amnesia, so counting on his photographic memory for mapping purposes is risky.

Innate power would be laser eye removal. A broad array of powers, effectively, though individually somewhat weak. He can read books and perfectly memorize the text as fast as pages can be turned, though true comprehension takes the normal amount of time. He can do the work of a full team of master surveyors, mathematicians, astronomers, or accountants, without any tools, 60x as fast and sometimes even in his sleep - though he doesn't know the professional jargon of those fields, and thus would have a hard time explaining the reasoning behind his results, or finding gainful employment on such a basis anywhere within the influence of relevant trade guilds. He's got uncanny accuracy with ranged weapons, given a target that's not magically concealed, enough time to aim, maybe an initial shot to figure out the wind. He can temporarily blind anyone with visible eyes, or fill their field of vision with pictures or text as fast as he can think of it, from hundreds of yards away - given line of sight. He can give himself arbitrary tattoos, again just by visualizing the desired result, and any removed skin retains the design. That's the only way to 'print out' a permanent copy of a memorized map with perfect fidelity, though infection risks associated with being flayed would constitute a phobic trigger at a -3 penalty even under ideal conditions, -6 or worse outside a well-run hospital or shrine.

At higher levels, he'll grow more eyeballs on various non-face parts of his body, then learn how to extrude them as semi-autonomous scout drones, or even single-use assassins.

For a traditional sort of paladin, high ambition should be something along the lines of "protect the innocent by bringing the wicked to justice." Self-centered desire for purity and escape from the 'curse' fits better as a low ambition. Addiction to something that can be supplied internally doesn't make much sense.

Equipment is fine apart from one detail: swap the greatsword for a wooden shield. Blade of honor was lost while fleeing the death sentence, have to make do with a lance (but no horse).
>>
No. 124095 ID: 094652

>>/quest/891928
>Jade Amulet
It's a jade coin/band. She found it after she survived the bloodied ritual that killed her friends, and it signifies her will to keep living.

>Scimitar too expensive
Her build is meant for knives anyway

>Backpack Inventory
>Prehensile Tail Mutation
>Vulnerability to sonic-based attacks / abilities / noise
>Fear of Bloody Ritual involving Bathing
Looks good. Still want that tail dong though, good place to put the jade coin/band.

>Innate power: Chainsaw Claws
That just screams mundane. And obsolete in the long run.

I really want to keep the phase power. It's cumbersome, but the main focus is utility and tactics over added DPS. It weakens and slows her when she uses it, so in a straight fight it would outright kill her. This is not a game about straight fights, it is a game about (1) surviving, (2) completing mission objectives, and (3) mentally surviving. As Sahara develops her blade dance, she'll invent new and creative ways of using her double, which she passes through completely - of which include the ability to take a step back and stab through yourself for one hell of a legitimate FRONTAL sneak attack, or slice a blade through her other self's arm harmlessly to hit a target her other self was blocking. How it works is that a partially-transparent copy of herself does something different from what she's currently doing, so she might spontaneously grow a blurry arm or a whole ghost of herself might step out of a standing position, while the original stands still. Neither of them can interact with the other, and any damage the blurrier self takes is inflicted back on the original.

In the current situation with a rampaging Lizzy, it's really effective: her duplicate can move a step to the left, insult the Minotaur Queen, and phase out of existence by moving her tail out of the way of her original before the blow connects.

This innate power is also interconnected with her Time Thief specialization: She is instinctively shedding time frames and phase-shifting them a split-microsecond forward. Schrodinger's Cat, eat your heart out.

If I can't use this innate power, something other than supernaturally sharp claws would be nice.
>>
No. 124096 ID: 094652

>>124094
More like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBdFXXV9hwY

Other than that, awesome.
>>
No. 124099 ID: 2007b6

>>124095
>I really want to keep the phase power. It's cumbersome,
I'm having a hard time picturing how that power would actually work, which is the level of 'cumbersome' where it potentially crashes the physics engine and ruins everyone's fun.
>one hell of a legitimate FRONTAL sneak attack,
The 'claws' power was in no small part balanced against Maru Red's axe. Summonable melee weapon, doubles as a mundane tool. Difference being, where the axe is all about rage and blood and bringing the noise, this one is SO concealable that it can even be concealed while in active use. The claw-blades are potentially as big as swords, but invisible and unnaturally silent.
>obsolete in the long run.
At higher levels, imagine waving your hand in someone's general direction, not even close enough to actually touch, and then they fall to the floor as a heap of meat-cubes.
>Time Thief specialization
I don't remember approving that. Time control is not a particularly plausible skill set among academics, street-level criminals, or any normal sort of trade guild.
*checks the quest thread*
Yeah, no, you didn't include a specialty at all.
>>
No. 124100 ID: 556258

>At higher levels, imagine waving your hand in someone's general direction, not even close enough to actually touch, and then they fall to the floor as a heap of meat-cubes.
This is anime levels of bull!
>>
No. 124104 ID: 094652

>>124099
>Time control is not a particularly plausible skill set among academics, street-level criminals, or any normal sort of trade guild.
She got her powers from one of the underworld blood rituals I talked about. Barely survived, used her new innate power to kill the cultist while he was lording over her, and is recently discovering her new class.

Okay, if Time Thief is out, I think Swashbuckler will work. Fighter (Dancing Blade) as a second choice.

>Claws are actually OP
Okay, but I'm selecting Weapon Finesse / Deadly Agility to max this out. Sahara is dexterity-based.
>>
No. 124127 ID: 2007b6

>>124104
Post an updated version with the changes, so I can approve it and the game can proceed.
>>
No. 124132 ID: 094652

>NO GODMODDING
Sorry about that, I just wanted to get some roleplay in for an unfinished character before the turn was over. Didn't mean to break any rules.

Alright, I guess Sahara is ready:

Name: Sahara
Race: Catfolk
Class: Townie
Specialization: Blade Dancer
Higher Ambition: Treasure Huntress
Lower Ambition: Bibliophile
Mutation: semi-prehensile tail improves balance (though not to the point of supernatural perfection) and allows touch-range communication of complex concepts using Gesture skill http://www.prequeladventure.com/2011/06/463/ but can get caught in things or grabbed by enemies much like a trailing cloak
Vulnerability: heightened senses including high-frequency hearing with excellent directional discrimination and near-IR vision, but easily overstimulated or hypnotized, particularly by fire. Lizzy's magical lights are safe.
Phobia: rituals involving blood and/or bathing, even in a purely symbolic capacity. Dark sacrifices, life-saving surgeries, butcher shops, baptisms, necromancy, communion wine, whatever. Deliberately bathing IN actual blood (ala Countess Bathory) would be the absolute worst, but incidental exposure to battlefield gore or traversing a body of water for some purely secular purpose is usually fine. Combing/scraping, licking, ecstatic dancing while naked in the rain, or meditating in direct sunlight (preferably with quiet, improvisational music in the background), are the only tolerable ways to become clean.
Innate Power: Claws. Looks like normal elvenoid fingers, grips cliffsides like best mundane climbing gear, rends wood and flesh like a chainsaw, but quietly.
Inventory:
Shoulders/Hips: Portable Library; backpack containing a few books (Combat Manual, Medical Manual, a novel, and a stolen wizard's book)
Head: Hammock (bedroll)
Neck: Coin Purse tucked between tits
Somewhere Uncomfortable: Jade Amulet (Coin shaped with a hole in the middle)
>>
No. 124153 ID: 2007b6

>>124100
High-level characters are supposed to be basically godlike. Getting there takes a while, and in the meantime, watch out for any NPCs who might have a head start.
>>124132
This is fine.
>>
No. 124157 ID: d22dc0

The art style in that example of gesture looks familiar, but I don’t recognize that source material. Does the author/artist run a quest on here?
>>
No. 124162 ID: 556258

>>124157
Maybe because the style is verily similar to Homestuck.
>>
No. 124164 ID: 4f1cbc

>>124157
Prequel has been around a while, but to my knowledge Kazerad hasn't done anything here.

(One could have a lively debate if Prequel counts as a quest by tgchan's standards, weighing audience participation and railroading. It's not guilty of false advertising though- that subtitle on the page header is an accurate mission statement).

>>124100
>This is anime levels of bull!
We have a PC who is a literal magical girl with transformation sequence. And that's hardly the only example, the anime boat sailed a while ago. :v
>>
No. 124200 ID: d22dc0

>>124164
>>124162
I know why I recognize it. There's a thread in the general dis with some of the art as it's thumbnail, so I recognized it but didn't remember why
>>
No. 124580 ID: 23b7bd

I think it’s funny that the new fire hawks couldn’t wait to get out of the dungeon but the current crew is completely focused on science and art and treasure and such, seemingly no interest in leaving.
>>
No. 124582 ID: 4f1cbc

>>124580
Eira's sure been pretty lucky at walking right into things that make her high ambition happy, so far.
>>
No. 124869 ID: 2007b6

Might not know this in-character, but then again maybe you could. If Greznek's overall military readiness is a major obstacle to your plans, King Kazleth might be exactly the man you need to talk to. Whoever makes Greznek's strategic decisions is clearly terrified of him, based on their willingness to devote unique resources to a highly specialized defense-in-depth along his most likely line of approach. Signs of Kazleth mobilizing to attack may seize their attention, delaying effective response to simultaneous but seemingly unrelated problems - particularly something subtle, like a quiet outpost along a different approach missing a scheduled check-in.

Minoan ox-men are more generally famous for their spatial reasoning skills. Temperament and size make them ill-suited as wilderness guides in most cases, but when sufficiently motivated (or mind-controlled in ways that don't impair their judgement) they excel at navigating mazes.
>>
No. 124879 ID: 6785a6

>>124869
>ox men are renowned for their spacial reasoning
>I am playing an Ox Man

This feels like it'll be a recreation of me being in charge of mapping as Riv again.
>>
No. 124894 ID: 4f1cbc

>>124869
Although if whoever makes Greznek's strategic decisions is justifiably terrified of King Kazleth, that really makes me wonder if talking to him or trying to manipulate his actions is a great idea. (And I think we've got several party members who would object if a plan to bluff or distract a city with a real threat accidentally stopped being a bluff).

Ideal outcome to engineer would be the output reporting everything's still normal.
>>
No. 124898 ID: 6785a6

>>124894
It's almost like we're little fish in a big big pond, plotting on how to take down a... I don't know maybe a shark or a bird or something, while trying to keep the lion seal from noticing.

Still think that if we can reason with the lion seal we stand to gain an upper hand, or at least remove a potential obstacle. Of course the downside is that we might just get eaten ourselves, or give our quarry forewarning.
>>
No. 124972 ID: 2007b6

For Decaro Vos's eelbee babies, once they grow up I'm considering adapting pixie stats from GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3: The Next Level, but instead of fairy magic they're automatically shrine maidens devoted to Tittivila, and need to spend six hours per week (in one solid block, not an hour every day) within appropriately holy locations to avoid having their unnatural hybrid metabolisms start to collapse.

Accordingly, any sort of extended adventure they go on would more or less require bringing along an appropriate portable shrine: eight pounds, one gold, takes a minute or two and a Religious Ritual roll to set up. Could stretch out the ceremony to as much as half an hour for a bonus on the roll, or speed it up by taking a penalty, but the sanctified area's radius is limited according to the officiating priest's level - one yard per spell circle they're capable of, with the basic model. A non-empowered priest can sanctify a permanent temple just fine, but counting on them for a portable setup means only someone actually touching the shrine benefits from the improved sanctity. Better quality portable shrines can multiply radius of effect, but are also more expensive, and often heavier, more fragile, and bulky, such that efficient transport involves a pair of long poles and a small team of appropriately devout porters.

Note that increasing local sanctity for one god means reducing it for any opposed powers, which would impair the divinely-granted capabilities of priests or champions devoted to those powers accordingly. Furthermore, divine casters often rely on context clues rather than having an innate, reflexive sense for sanctity the way mages do for ambient mana.
>>
No. 125007 ID: 6785a6

>>124972
If having a shrine to one god makes followers of other gods weaker, does that mean the eel babies would be risking deterioration at a faster rate if they... walk? Swim? Fly? into, say, a shrine to Tiamat or something like that?
>>
No. 125009 ID: add037

Sounds good to me. We don't have any other religious types among the Fire Hawks IIRC, though this might cause conflict with Team Magic Sword.
>>
No. 125011 ID: 4f1cbc

>>125009
There's the Agates, thought they're npcs at this point.

Might depend on where you draw the line for opposing powers. Do they have to be antagonistic, or just different? Tsathoggua is for sure opposed to Tittivila. But Firemom and Tittivila and Agatia would all agree, for example, that undead aren't good.
>>
No. 125013 ID: 2007b6

>>125007
Probably wouldn't accelerate deterioration, but they likely won't be eager to stick around long enough to find out. Definitely would impair Tittivila-granted healing spells that might otherwise be used to patch up the damage.
> if they... walk? Swim? Fly?
All of the above.
>>125011
>Might depend on where you draw the line for opposing powers. Do they have to be antagonistic, or just different?
Ambient energy levels in GURPS, whether that's free mana or divine power, are measured on a six-point scale.
Very high: anyone can cast spells one or more circles above their usual limit. Using spells you'd be capable of normally gives a full refund of the FP cost. Excess power is unstable, so all failures are treated as critical failures.
High: the uninitiated can sometimes cast low-circle spells. For sanctity, prayers are more likely to be heard.
Normal: default rules.
Low: Spells are cast at -5 to skill, but critical failures are treated as ordinary failures. Not enough juice for a backfire.
Very low: Spells are cast at -10 to skill. Difficult to distinguish from 'none' for most practical purposes.
None: Relevant type of magic cannot function.

Inherently magical creatures often require constant exposure to at least low mana to survive. In an environment of very low or no mana, they take a point of injury per minute. Eelbee shrine maidens require high sanctity for long-term survival, but they're fine for a week and then take damage only every six hours.

Very high sanctity is rare, generally limited to the god's immediate presence or unique holy sites. High sanctity is shrines, temples, sites where the god made a relatively minor but well-remembered personal appearance, that sort of thing. Could include temples of very closely allied gods. Normal sanctity is most of the world - or 'the parts of the world that matter,' for gods with a narrow geographic focus such as patronage of a single city. (Such mural-crowned tutelaries are notable in the default Dungeon Fantasy setting insofar as their holy warriors, the Invincible Town Guards, are more than capable of dealing with rowdy adventurers at home, but cannot upstage our heroes or short-circuit the plot by projecting any significant military force into the surrounding wilderness.) Low sanctity represents areas the relevant god finds unpleasant, or where their influence is being actively contested. Very low/none means areas the god has deliberately forsaken, or been successfully expelled from.

Loosely allied divinities - those with mutual interests, or forced together by common enemies, but who also have significant disagreement or mistrust between them, such as Tittivila and Agatia - might have normal sanctity at each others' shrines, low in major temples and high holy places. Opposed powers, such as Tittivila and Tsathogua, have low sanctity at each others' shrines or in regions where the majority of the population goes to weekly services, none in hostile permanent temples and high holy places.

An open assault on the temple of an opposed power, involving at minimum a) kicking in the door or otherwise destructively disrespecting the temple's perimeter, b) unambiguous display of challenge, such as a battle cry or banner with the intruding patron's symbol and c) some sort of desecration applied directly to the central altar, potentially as little as a thrown piece of rotten fruit, raises the sanctity level for the intruding power from "none" to "very low" within the violated temple until attackers are driven off and the mess is cleaned up.

Ritual exorcism to shut a hostile temple down completely, so it'd need to be re-consecrated from scratch, takes four hours per attempt. Even a lay priest, or certain non-cleric specialists, could do this; it's a skill check, not a spell. In fact, any conventional spellcasting, regardless of source, within line of sight of the ritual in progress automatically ruins the attempt. There are various ways to make the process faster and/or more reliable, mostly by throwing raw power at it. https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/c/consecrate https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/remove-curse https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/h/hallow
>>
No. 125015 ID: 4f1cbc

At least Vos will have something to spend his money on in the future besides charity: buying stuff for his kids!
>>
No. 125147 ID: 2007b6

Problem I just thought of for 3oS - how exactly do you go about setting a card as normal/inverted when you're *throwing* it at somebody?
>>
No. 125153 ID: 6e171f

>>125147
Same way a skilled knife thrower hits with the pointy side instead of the blunt one, only it’s probably more of a metaphysical distinction than an actual physical orientation. Perhaps a little of both? Big thing though is that I think there both intention and mundane skill involved, and that fouling either would probably result in unintended consequences
>>
No. 125378 ID: 2007b6

Alright, Orange, since Green Redford was (at least temporarily) incapacitated, if you'd like you can generate a new character to start off back in the throne room, and play both of them at once.
>>
No. 125493 ID: ee5804

Here's my new char.

Name: Gale Fuentes
Class: Hedge Witch
Higher Ambition: Knowing his past, purpose, and place in the universe
Lower Ambition: Fashion.
Specialization: Botanomancy, magicks related to plants.
Mutation: Gale stands at a few inches less than the average man. He has a pelt of short fine bluish grey fur. He has a head in the shape of a dragon's but much rounder, friendlier-looking, and furrier. He has some white teeth and claws of steel. His eyes are pretty much circular holes on his head covered by thick black glass. He has no ability to close them, but he can cover them.
Gale is yet to realize, but under his hide of skin and fur, he's mostly mechanical. His skeleton is made of rods of bronze, and his innards are of brass gears constantly spin to keep him moving. He still has to breathe in oxygen and eat food to keep his gears a-turning, his greasy blood flowing, and his lubricating fluids fluid. His black blood circulates through his body to distribute heat.
Phobia: Theophobia - Deathly afraid of gods
Vulnerability: High voltage electricity can literally shut him down.
Innate Power: Metalloception - Gale is perceptive to any metal in his surroundings.

Left Hip: Dried bread
Right Hip: Throw-and-Grow Beans
Left Shoulder: Spear
Right Shoulder: Kindling
Neck: Clean cloth, hooked needles, & thread
Head: Iron Spikes
Somewhere uncomfortable: Bronze Statuette of a lizard holding a pole with a lantern.
>>
No. 125502 ID: 2007b6

>>125493
Approved.
>>
No. 125570 ID: 2007b6

The Fire Hawks, Team Magic Sword, and any other group which has reached the surface or otherwise made commercial contact with civilization sufficient to plausibly hire new retainers, can add more playable characters without existing PCs needing to be incapacitated - but only if such new characters do NOT take the "all three and an innate power" option.
>>
No. 125585 ID: 2007b6

>>/quest/902355
It's coffee cake. Because Polo, mashed up with "Casper the Friendly Ghost."
>>
No. 125592 ID: 094652

Name: Joseph Strudelbaker
Class: Soldier
Race: Tiefling
Higher Ambition: Achieve a great destiny
Lower Ambition: Gourmand
Mutation: Head is covered in spikes protruding from his skull, which are mostly covered by his hair
Equipment:
Scimitar
Heater Shield
Chainmail Tunic (borrowed from the Fire Hawks)
Leather Armor
Basic Pistol
Bullets and Gunpowder
Pouch of Salt and Pepper

Battle-hardened yet suicidally overconfident, Joseph is an ex-military mercenary seeking his destiny. After hearing of Hore's exploits in the Passholdt arena, he waited for months just to reconnect with his old war buddy and follow her on the path to greatness.

Hore thinks he'll get himself killed if he's left alone to charge into a horde (again), and so she has recommended him as a new inductee into the Fire Hawks.

Joseph has a weak spot in wisdom, but his other five stats are equally balanced and high. He salvaged the gun from an enemy during his war days, but didn't turn it in; Hore's plasma beams inspired him to believe that having a gun is part of being a successful hero. How true that is usually depends on the state of the gun, as he has been disguising it as a smoking pipe.
>>
No. 125601 ID: afdebc

>>125585
Pfffff-hahaha. Well, the orc brotherhood has successfully wooed me, at least.
>>
No. 125615 ID: 2007b6

>>125592
>Basic Pistol
>Bullets and Gunpowder
No. We've been over this.
>>
No. 125624 ID: afdebc

>>125592
>>125615
Swap those out for crossbow and bolts, or bow and arrows, and you got a character who looks pretty similar.

I don't think the Fire Hawks are lacking in melee dudes, although suicidal overconfidence does give Vos a bud to charge immediately into danger with (Joe will probably end up picking up some mutant healing before too long). Mundane ranged attacks is an area less well covered (we have Hore's blaster, thrown weapons, and spells), and Esmeraude does have some spells that buff or synergize with that kind of thing.
>>
No. 125647 ID: 094652

I thought that "the ability to mass-produce superweapons" was the actual ban, and finding advanced technology you have no hope of understanding was still legal, hence the airplane jet as a makeshift hammer. Oh well.

How about a hand crossbow that curses bolts it fires to make really loud screaming noises until they hit something?
>>
No. 125649 ID: afdebc

>>125647
Pretty sure if you wanted a one-off piece of forgotten tech (like the rocket hammer, or Mizer's cutting torch) in your starting equipment, you'd have to be a Rich Bastard and take that as your very expensive thing, not a soldier.

>How about a hand crossbow that curses bolts it fires to make really loud screaming noises until they hit something?
That would be a magic item of some kind, so again, Rich Bastard. Or maybe a Hedge Witch with screaming arrows as their consumable. (Or somebody with an active power that created the effect, but the whole point here is making some characters with less than maximum weirdness).
>>
No. 125651 ID: add037

So, would something like this be allowed?

Agatha Spires
Class: Townie
Ambitions: Giving things back to their rightful owners / candied apples
Phobia: Thunderstorms
left hip: lantern
right hip: coin purse
left shoulder: Azarthraine's spellbook. How fortuitous!
right shoulder: dried fruit
chest/neck: chain armor
top of head: helmet
somewhere uncomfortable: jade amulet
>>
No. 125652 ID: 2007b6

>>125651
Yeah, that's fine.
>>
No. 125662 ID: 094652

From Azure's mentors:

"The core aspect of modern dancing is the consistent fact that it is a physical art recorded by the concept of vision. As you move, you concentrate the focus of the vision of your audience in the corresponding direction of your force. Do not, under any circumstances, discard this force. If you must be the center of attraction, balance every outward motion with an accompanying inward one. If your show and its producers demand a sacrifice of attention towards the scenery (read: other dancers), be sure to move the force towards the ones that have been demanded in turn to return it back to you once their meager display is complete. And finally, understand the limits and tendencies of your audience. Though we are unable to truly comprehend the scope and range of vision itself, we can say with certainty that those who live in the Blood Mire have a certain tendency: when they crane their heads upward, they get a crick in their necks and feel the compulsion to re-align them back. What goes up must come down, so to speak. Thus, usually you can perform an upward show of hands as your flourish and expect the focus to come back down relatively quickly. Just be sure to catch it."
>>
No. 126081 ID: 2007b6

Now that Azarthraine has his spellbook back, I can't keep playing him as an NPC. Who's going to take over being the lizard wizard?
>>
No. 126083 ID: afdebc

>>126081
I'm juggling less characters than Santova, Kome and Strgy, and I'm already ostensibly in-charge of the Fire Hawks through Dav, so my taking over the other leadership character might make sense.

I'm really not at all confident about being able to manage the resources an nth level caster provides, though (good gods the spell per day preparation), and it feels pretty weird having a PC 10+ levels higher than everyone else.

Any reason why he doesn't work as an npc? I get not wanting one very powerful npc to overshadow player agency, but I sort of thought his position was going to be advice, artillery, logistical support, getting us jobs, crafting spirit sanctums and stuff in exchange for divine or magical favors / resources, etc.

Also I sort of liked having a character in a position to refine plans and rein us in when we come up with plans that don't make sense in-setting, or badly use resources we don't understand well.
[Return] [Entire Thread] [Last 50 posts] [Last 100 posts]

Delete post []
Password  
Report post
Reason