NSFW content is a topic for another thread. We're discussing the name, folks. Stay focused!

This whole this has been very worrisome to me. It's difficult to express all my thoughts on the matter.

>>130258
>That's an incorrect presumption.
It's a shorthand for someone who respects you enough to potentially listen to website recommendations. It applies anyone who's willing to have a casual conversation, not just a person's closest friends.

>then those people are much more likely to be dismissive, and may dismiss the person talking about us as well.
Yes, it's possible that the mention of "the chan" will cause someone to suddenly hate the person they're talking to when they were holding a perfectly good conversation beforehand, and refuse to listen to anything you have to say that contradicts their preconceptions. That's certainly something that can happen, but if a stranger is prone to turning against people for something as small as the mention of a hobby, then it's no big loss if they don't come here.

>Essentially, it's embarrassing to be associated with other -chan sites
I get that some people are embarrassed to be associated with us, not because of anything we actually do but because of obnoxious things that happen on other chan sites due to people that those sites are also embarrassed to be associated with.

It's true. Most of the stuff people hate about 4chan is actually against the rules. It still happens because of the site's massive userbase and lax moderation, but it almost never happens without someone telling them off for their edgy bullshit. Most of the users are as unenthused about them as anyone else.

Back on topic. I understand that, as unfair and prejudiced as it is, people are having trouble convincing others to give us a chance and don't like associating with us because of our name, and I get that they want something to make us look better so that they can feel better about being seen in public with us. But those are external problems that happen on other sites. We shouldn't have to make a personal, internal change to our identity just to accomodate people who don't understand us, especially something as special as our name.

We've all heard how horrible "the chan" is, and how it's associated with the worst of all worsts and we should be ashamed of them. But TGChan doesn't mean any of those awful things. TGChan means us.

TGChan isn't just a set of letters. It's who we are. It's been who we are since the beginning. Its meaning is this site, the people who use it, and the things we've made here. We've made TGChan Radio. We've made TGChan Secret Santa. We've made the TGChan Caravan. We've even made TGChan Strip Poker. We've made hundreds, likely thousands of works of art as TGChan,

If we have to look back on all that, and be told "that's wrong now, we're not TGChan anymore and it was bad of us to be TGChan", then it would honestly be tragic. It would feel like we'd lost something important that we could never get back.

That's why I don't want TGChan taken away from us.

Changing the name doesn't erase tgchan's history.

Questden is lookin' pretty popular from the poll and what people have said. I can dig it.

>>130317

I'm down for it.

>>130316
bro this is a lot of overwrought emotionality where it’s not really necessary. you’re pulling assumptions abt other people’s motivations out of thin air when nobody here has expressed the Tragic Sentiments you’re complaining about. we’re not talking abt a name change bc we’re ashamed of ourselves or our content or bc we’re trying to distance ourselves from what we do here. we’re talking abt a name change bc we love this site and think that what we do here is really cool and we want to be able to grow what we do without being burdened by shit that doesn’t reflect on us. being realistic abt optics is not, like, plunging a dagger into the still-beating heart of tgchan

>>130339

Exactly. For the umpteenth time, we're not going away, we're distancing ourselves from a site that has become overrun with racists, bigots, and general assholes.

taking a quick break from wiping my daughter's ass to support a name change

>>130345
Yo brom weve missed you. I hope dad times are treating you well.
>>130316
4chan kicked us out like a decade ago and missed out on an amazing form of storytelling that the community here has been fostering. Fuck em. The name tgchan doesnt define us, the artists and writers and active members of the community are what define us. And most of them are saying its time for a change

>>130317
TGChan's history defines our name. That's why I'm so sad to see it go.

>>130339
I remember what you've been saying. I'm trying to explain why I feel the way I do; I realize you don't think of it as giving in to prejudice to appease the prejudiced, but that's still what it looks like to me. I think TGChan means us, our community, and every work of art we make here, but other people think "chan" means the evil people who are currently causing grief to the people on 4chan and making strangers hate us by association. I get why you have a problem with this.

What I don't get is why people want to make the "TG" part of our name go away too. I have no idea why associating us with tabletop games would be controversial. For one thing, they haven't been a target of prejudice since before our site was born, and for another, they're still a strong part of our site's identity. If no one's willing to budge on the issue of us losing our name, then we might as well use TGQuest as our new name; it's short, memorable, and gets the point of our site across at least as well as any other name could.

That aside... well, I realize that pretty much no one is going to care about what I'm about to say, but I don't want it to go unsaid.

The problem people are having is that outsiders refuse to give us a chance just because of our name (and possibly because of general internet apathy towards trying new things, but they blame the name).

If the problem is that they refuse to come here because of the name they see, then a redirect to TGChan would solve things just as effectively as a name change. The problem is that outsiders see a name they don't like and hate us unfairly, and the solution is that outsiders see a different name and don't judge us before seeing what we really are. We don't need to remind each other that we're "not like that", and if someone's interested enough to click a link to an unfamiliar website then they're already giving us a chance. Plus, it would avoid any confusion that could arise when people find references to "TGChan" on a website with a seemingly unrelated name.

>>129896
I like pretty much all of these more than the current leading contender.

questden sounds poopy and I dun like it.

>>130352

"What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet."

>>130348
Yeah dude I slept like 4 hours last night and there was a little piece of poop on my shirt this morning but the baby rules. Also I am here to claim credit for Talehole

Out of curiosity: for those who dislike linking to your work due to the name/URL, why is the existing thatquestsite.org URL insufficient?

For example, if you link to a board or thread directly using that URL (rather than to the homepage) right now, the word 'TGchan' does not ever appear in either the body or header. And if you visit https://thatquestsite.org/kusaba/ (rather than https://thatquestsite.org/ which straight redirects to tgchan.org) even the menu header uses thatquestsite, leaving a grand total of one string at the top of the homepage to swap out.

>>130375
Even if the issues of a rival URL are ignored, the wiki links tgchan and has tgchan in the top left, and is generally the best way to be giving out a link, especially if the quest has ITQs.

>>130376
Ah, I'd completely forgotten the wiki.

I have to say, "questden" makes me think of late 90s/early 00s web 1.0 sites where people posted their generic fantasy fiction and roleplayed talking animal characters and everyone on there was clearly a furry but were all so naive and innocent that they equally clearly had no clue that's what they were or even what a furry was, and the whole site would have some forest motif with crudely anti-aliased navigation buttons and maybe a pixelly picture of some mountains or the moon or something. And probably somewhere someone would have put a link to DMFA.

So, whoever originally came up with the name: you're responsible for my suffering.

Regular lurker since about 2009 here.

Jesus Christ, this is a level of idiocy I haven't seen in a while.

>ID: 972422

Are you legitimately austistic or just really, really stupid? Your posts sound unbelievably clueless, as if you're expecting the outside world to operate exactly as you imagine it in your head and can't fathom how or why it wouldn't be like that.

>But keep in mind that all "chan" means is that we're an image board. The negative stigma is mostly just stereotypes that unfairly associate us with trolls and various other unpleasant people who tend to drift around any site with lax moderation (and are generally disliked by the site's other users).
I've been on 4chan from 2006 to 2010 nearly every day and occasionally after that. Back in the day I thought every board turning into /b/ was the worst 4chan would get, but time proved me wrong.
Before /pol/ became the most popular board, 4chan and imageboards in general were commonly associated with no-holds-barred trolling, and if you had actually been to 4chan, that's fairly accurate for the popular boards. You needed serious troll resistance back in the day and you need far more today.

To claim that the reputation of imageboards is somehow undeserved, or that you're a "victim" of "prejudice" is pure bullshit. (It actually brings to mind the old "fursecution" meme.)

The imageboard format is the only thing connecting this site to 4chan and has been for a long time. Remember, when this site came into existence, 4chan's furry hate memes were more relevant, and this site has been full of furries from the earliest days. TGchan hasn't been representative of "4chan culture" for well over a decade, and if you think the site's layout will keep undesirable users away, you haven't been to actual 4chan in the last ~five years. Whether tgchan will be overrun by shitheads after a relaunch will be entirely up to the staff and the userbase, not a nondescriptive name and two decades old software.

>a small minority ruins 4chan for everyone
>4chan's bad rep is a recent phenomenon linked to politics
More transparent bullshit. No one with any sense at all would recommend 4chan to random people and that has always been true. You'd tell a friend about the site if you knew they'd be able to handle 4chan. You wouldn't drop someone expecting normal behavior into it.

The imageboard association is a harsh filter, even if it's not factual for tgchan in particular.

>the name makes sense
This site doesn't tolerate the kind of attitude you'd have seen on e.g. 2008 /v/ and it definitely doesn't tolerate the attitude of present-day 4chan.

I have never seen anyone refer to tabletop games as "TG" outside of the 4chan board name itself. That claim of yours is nonsense. How or why could you believe that it'd be descriptive to outsiders?


tl;dr you're full of shit and you're either a moron or literally incapable of processing reality

>>130386
You'd think "Don't call each other names" would be an easy thing to do but here we are. Don't do this.

If people are up-tight about a name I really don't care if they come here. As confrontational as the question may be, do you feel quests will be taken down or altered by the moderation staff if they're deemed offensive by these new users too? You can't please everyone and you shouldn't try to, you're a lovely group and I wish you would keep doing what you've been doing as that's what brought me here nearly a decade ago.

I'd feel a bigger issue to dedicate time to would be knowing which quests updated without IRC, It's why I sage my suggestions but a slight color change would be nice if the quest OP posts since you last viewed the thread.

>>130462
>do you feel quests will be taken down or altered by the moderation staff if they're deemed offensive by these new users too?
There is no reason to believe this would happen to any quests. The name change is something favored by many current quest authors, removing current quests would presumably not be favored by current quest authors.
The people that are making fat stacks on questing are making some of them there furry fuckin' quests, y'all ain't gotta worry about the furry fuckin' going away on TaleHole.

Even if scaring off normies is considered a good thing, the site's contents will already do that. We don't need collateral damage of scaring off weirdos that just don't want to bother taking a chance on a *chan, and the people that are enticed by a *chan name in 2019 are people that are unlikely to be good members of the community.

>>130348
To be specific, we were driven off 4chan during one particular period of overly aggressive moderation towards any sort of quest thread and much of /tg/'s creativity and worldbuilding content, and the moderators (believed to be) responsible for it were highly unpopular with the site's other users for precisely that reason. That period of time has been over for a long while now; creative content is a regular part of /tg/ again, and the site has a whole board dedicated to quests now. In fact, some of our authors came directly from there, simply because our board was slower and our threads last longer.

To put it succinctly, we weren't "kicked out" by 4chan. We were forced apart.

I sympathize with the "if they reject us and miss out, then they brought it on themselves" sentiment, but it's not fair to aim it at all of 4chan. Most of them had nothing to do with that incident and didn't like it at all. In fact, our content has some popularity in some of the site's threads, particularly ones that involve cute kobolds, sexy aliens, and other special interests which are very much like our own. The ones who are actually rejecting us are the people who take one look at us and decide that we're not worth learning anything more about just because we're a chan site. If some people refuse to associate with us and end up missing out on our stories, then that's up to them; we've gotten along just fine without them in the past, and we'll continue to grow without them in the future.

I can understand wanting to share our community with more people, but it's not a good idea to tell ourselves "if they won't accept us, to hell with them" and then change our name in hopes of attracting those specific individuals.

>>130464
I agree with this dude. While I'm not terribly fond of 4chan's edgelord cultural baseline, I also feel like trying to overly restrict that attitude on the website beyond standard "don't be a douche" standards is going to stifle new users AND creativity. Let's avoid that.

>>130464

Out of curiosity, do you run a quest?

I feel there's a point I should make if it hasn't been made already: We're changing the name. You can't change our minds on that. That discussion is over.

Tgchan.org will still lead you to the site for as long as Dylan feels like hosting the mirror, but the site's official name is gonna be something else.

Tgchan split from 4chan ten years ago. Very little that was true of the community in 2009 is true in 2019. We've grown and matured, and I was here almost the whole time to see that. This place was less of a cesspool than 4chan, but I always had to explain to people why tgchan isn't terrible when linking it, and some of my original Tezakia suggestors were put off by the community.

I really want the day to come that I can link to this site with pride, not a hundred asterisks. I don't want to have to temper years of work and thousands of images, hundreds of days worrying over what would make a good story, all for someone to go 'nah, looks too much like 4chan'.

I'm lucky in that Tezakia itself is a separate entity that, despite its age and growing pains, works well as a starting point for my stuff.

Other people don't have that.

If you prefer 2009 TGchan, then I'm sorry, but it's gone. The people are nicer, and the mods actually step in if you act like an asshole. We're working to make the site design catch up to that.

I spent 10 years explaining to people that acting like a jerk is a bad thing, and if you think otherwise then this place simply isn't for you anymore.

If everything about old TGchan was such a complete cesspool that you constantly seem to hate, why did you even stay? It seems like everytime you and some others speak of it, everyone was simply hateful, and it was a lawless land that nobody liked.

>>130478
For some people old tgchan's attitude was tolerable because of the unique content, but a lot of people were actually also part of that attitude at that time and then grew up and matured. It's been ten years.

>>130478
I almost didn't join. The site very much scared me away with its community and 4-chan look.

I ran tezakia, hoping I would get experience enough to not make a fool of myself and become victim to the extremely cruel way poor questers were treated back then (remember vyt?).

What ended up happening is TGchan, or specifically some kind people from it, found me in the 11th hour of Tezakia.

Their kindness is what made me go ahead and join the community in full. And I stayed because I believed in Questing as a format for telling unique stories, and over time I would make attempts to improve things (often failing due to intense pushback)

But the thing is, I never ended up changing things-- things changed on their own!

Had I found tgchan today, I might not have been scared away as much... but if the site also doesn't look like 4chan, I imagine a me that discovered it today would happily have run tezakia here instead of a dead 2008-era social media platform.

>>130482
>4-chan look
Changing the name is going to do jack shit to stop that. So long as it's an imageboard with anonymous posting, it will be blatantly obvious it's chan derived.

If you're all that determined to cleanse the site, make a new one and let TGChan die with dignity, instead of gutting it and parading its corpse around.

hello yes rename site to questdan in honor and glory of me

>>130483
people and things change over time my man, this is not dying

like i disagree with you but i still get how you feel about things not being like the old times you enjoyed anymore, i feel you there, but you gotta appreciate the old times for what they were and move on so you can enjoy current times for what they are

>>130483

Oh yeah changing the layout a little bit is totally gutting the site~

>>130483
We're not "cleansing" the site. Moderation will not change overnight. Why are you so mad about a name change? It's a new coat of paint, the internals will be the same. So like, the opposite of what you're freaking out about.

Changing the layout (well, major changes anyway) is a different issue, which afaik isn't supported by the mod team. They're more interested in adding features like post editing and a working watched threads feature.

>>130475
>The people are nicer, and the mods actually step in if you act like an asshole. We're working to make the site design catch up to that.
Sure, you really stepped up to the plate when I got called a cocksucker in my own thread, by the author of this one. Truly outstanding work. >>114587
And all the assorted prejudice and profiling of people here from the chans has been very enlightened. Maybe we should count 3/5 of their votes, too?

I'm not buying it.

>>130491
I don't know how to tell you this but NotDog is, in fact, not LawyerDog.

>>130491
my bro are you comparing people disagreeing with you to being a slave

>>130491
Did.. did you really equate the general distaste for 4chan with the historical plight of black people in America? Like.. did you really do that?

>>130491
hey dude not all people with dog in their name are the same person, quit with the prejudice and profiling

>>130495
The general distaste for anyone leads us down a dark road, was my point. Better to judge them fairly.

>>130497
i understand your point but please consider using better examples to support your arguments, like even putting aside how absolutely buck wild it was the 3/5ths mention immediately shifts focus to that bit rather than the point you were making

and if you feel like people have specifically been discriminated against please say so more specifically, so far other than some dudes who were told to stop posting insults I mostly see people saying they didn't like the general site culture

it's that moderation ignores the odd number of people who prefer the old ways that gets me in this thread most, I think.

Why do you downplay the viewpoints of those that disagree with this? it seems mean-spirited to do this this way.

>>130483
you cannot pretend this man's anxieties are unfounded given the tones being taken towards the culture that was around at the founding of the site.
There's been enough change in the irc especially that pretending he or she is ridiculous for this fear isn't great.

>>130491
>>130493
that's from 2017, shortly before irc's chat sanitization efforts really started in earnest. Probably not productive to try and highlight that.

>>130499
>it's that moderation ignores the odd number of people who prefer the old ways that gets me in this thread most, I think.

>Why do you downplay the viewpoints of those that disagree with this? it seems mean-spirited to do this this way.
can you elaborate on this I don't understand what you mean

>you cannot pretend this man's anxieties are unfounded given the tones being taken towards the culture that was around at the founding of the site.
the people who dislike the culture at the time of founding have been explicit about their dislike and have explained why they dislike it, it may help if you explain why you disagree instead of just saying that you do

you posted about stifling creativity and that sure would be a bad thing to do but i still don't understand how exactly the things you are concerned about lead to stifling creativity

>>130502
I'll accept that, though the date of those reforms seems to wildly fluctuate.

>>130505
You also need to report posts that you have issues with. That linked post is very clearly a joke post (and to be very clear, not posted by me!! https://tgchan.org/wiki/NotDog), nothing being done about an unreported joke is not a big deal.

>>130502
see some of these responses:
>>129883
>>129959
>>130122
>>129980
>>129987
>>130006
>>130014

and many more of similarly varying levels of civility throughout the thread, this is a long one and I don't feel like cherry-picking every single anti-chan culture comment here.

While I agree that distancing us from some of the *chan discourse is good for both civility and bringing in new users, we're also built on a certain measure of shitposty "degeneracy" that originates from this same culture and some of that has to be maintained for the content to remain tgchan's unique flavor (that being vaguely savory with a hint of fur and weird spices.)

But concerns about these potential changes are, essentially, getting glossed over or swept under the rug because people believe distance from these folks will necessarily breathe life into the site anew.

I, and many people in this thread, don't believe this is the case.

>>130507
If you agree that the name change is likely to bring in new users then the remaining issue seems to be possible censorship of "degenerate" quests. Considering how many modern quests heavily feature unusual sexual elements like Kaktus or Cirr's works, or quests that do a good job handling very unusual perspectives like TVRN or ringor mortis' works, or even just the overall board culture still being very distinct from mainstream sites, I don't see any cause for concern on that specific front.

Moreover, even if we accept that the anti-chan sentiment you're concerned about is going to ruin tgchan's board culture, I don't see how preventing a name change would stop it. The name of the site being tgchan doesn't stop staff from implementing whatever policies they would like. Even with the given premise I don't understand why you're specifically worried about the name change.

>>130387
Alright.
I don't believe that tolerating blatant bullshit but also insisting on civil treatment for the bullshitters is a good idea, but I'm not making the rules. If you want to give propagandists and trolls who deliberately insult the intelligence of everyone who isn't them a shield to hide behind, that's your decision.

>>130464
>>130478
>>130483
>>130491
>>130497
>>130501
>>130507
More obvious bullshit. Amazing how those concerned citizens who are all about muh imageboard culture suddenly start crying about "prejudice" when they are judged for being associated with the culture they ostensibly want to represent. You really think everyone but you is stupid, do you?

The core of imageboard culture is basically anarchy. That's a double-edged sword and anyone who accepts imageboard culture understands that. The price of freedom and honesty is that assholes are not silenced.

Whining about outsiders treating you "unfairly" because they don't want to deal with assholes running free (and thus avoid your community) is hypocritical, and I'm sure you know that.

>>130462
Not every site that isn't an imageboard will censor itself over some angry newcomers; see AO3.

>>130512

Why did you even grab my post for such an example. I was asking a general question for why they remained if they felt so strongly about it beforehand and now I'm a propagandist.. What? Just.. What?

>>130512
You know it'd be a lot easier to understand whatever you're going on able if you stopped with dismissing things as "obvious bullshit" and started explaining things, cause I have zero clue as to whatever you're going on about.

How is this connected to website names anyway?

>>130515
>You know it'd be a lot easier to understand whatever you're going on able if you stopped with dismissing things as "obvious bullshit" and started explaining things, cause I have zero clue as to whatever you're going on about.
4chan has never had a good reputation. Before /pol/ became its face, it was /b/. 4chan used to be "that site full of nasty trolls who got banned from normal forums".
That reputation is entirely deserved, as is obvious to anyone who has actually been to 4chan for a while. Yes, even in the "good old days".

The good parts of imageboard culture require you to weather the storm. You will encounter trolls, weirdoes and assholes. That has always been the case. Generally, people who don't want to have to deal with the troll horde to get to the gold can, should, and do choose to avoid imageboards.

The obvious bullshit I'm talking about is people acting as if imageboard culture and the association with it doesn't scare off people, and acting as if people being scared off by it are "prejudiced", "treating the community unfairly", or other such hypocritical whining.

Imageboard culture being difficult to access is a FACT. Imageboards frequently take pride in that. When outsiders are scared away by the chan reputation, that means it is working as intended.
Re-framing these facts as some sort of evil bias akin to persecution is bullshit, bullshit, bullshit.

Concerned citizens crying about normies just not wanting to give imageboards a "fair chance" because they're "prejudiced" are crying crocodile tears, and I refuse to believe they're not aware of what they're doing.

>>130517
I don't want to see the board awash with dipshits again like what happened when Fractal's tumblr cult first arrived.

catering to 4chan's need to be an anti-pc offensive dickhole to the extreme will bring dipshits.

catering to twitter's pc hugbox bullying will bring dipshits.

make the only not retarded decision, ban people for personal attacks and actual racism shit instead of politics and how they talk.

also, thatquestsite and questden are both awful names, hard no from me.

(This user has been banned for personal attacks.)

This thread has served its purpose of generating ideas for a new name for tgchan and is rapidly degenerating into the third coming of the Big Dumb Arguments thread, so that's all folks.

Be good to each other!